Augie Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 WEO... I'll put you in the genius vote, So feel free to move on.Reminder flamers, I asked a question. Obviously early returns are yes he's a genius. So if he is such a genius why didn't he ever find the players or coach to get us over the top in the 4 sb's? I bet answer will be Ralph was cheap If by "early returns" you mean HOF votes, then yes. Sorry but yes, I can find some less than perfect items to rag on, but the record speaks for itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 Maybe if the players concentrated more on the game then the bars at the Super Bowl things may have been different. This thread is if he was a genius, not about the players which by the way I agree about. But want to push the envelop ask the thread who hired the coach that let that go on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QCity Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 His teams have a 229 - 138 win/loss record -- an astounding 62% win rate. He's taken over losing teams and turned them into contenders for a championship. In his 23 years, his teams have put up double digit wins in 15 of those seasons. That's a pretty long lucky streak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 WEO... I'll put you in the genius vote, So feel free to move on. Reminder flamers, I asked a question. Obviously early returns are yes he's a genius. So if he is such a genius why didn't he ever find the players or coach to get us over the top in the 4 sb's? I bet answer will be Ralph was cheap IMHO Levy was out-prepared and out-coached in at least 2 of the Superbowls. Levy was also not helped by the player's behavior eg getting filthy drunk before the games and not being at their best, hi-jinx with helmets etc, worrying about endorsements, but keeping control of your players and locker-room is part of coaching preparation from one perspective. In two of the Superbowls, we were simply overpowered physically on both lines. For that, Polian bears some share of blame since he built the lines that were overpowered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 IMHO Levy was out-prepared and out-coached in at least 2 of the Superbowls. Levy was also not helped by the player's behavior eg getting filthy drunk before the games and not being at their best, hi-jinx with helmets etc, worrying about endorsements, but keeping control of your players and locker-room is part of coaching preparation from one perspective. In two of the Superbowls, we were simply overpowered physically on both lines. For that, Polian bears some share of blame since he built the lines that were overpowered. That's hard to argue with. Instead of blaming him for the shortcomings, I'll give him credit for getting there, and, along with the rest of his body of work, I'll stay with genius. The Panthers job may have actually been the highlight of his career, despite not getting to the SB. That was an amazing feat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Not only did Polian build 2 dynasties, but he did it THE RIGHT WAY with quality character guys. He wouldn't have gone for the knuckleheads Whaley seems to be ok with and then we pay for it when they get suspended Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 Not only did Polian build 2 dynasties, but he did it THE RIGHT WAY with quality character guys. He wouldn't have gone for the knuckleheads Whaley seems to be ok with and then we pay for it when they get suspended Ummm.. how many players got suspended during that era? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dulles Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Maybe if the players concentrated more on the game then the bars at the Super Bowl things may have been different.Or the defensive coach who insulted the Washington lineman... Or the parity-shattering trade that culminated in the Dallas dynasty... I'm sure he should have done something to stop that Herschel Walker trade from happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Genius, maybe... maybe not. He had a formula that produced 1 playoff contender out of thin air (panthers) and two sustained super bowl contenders. It dealt with at which positions he drafted early and spent more, and where you backfill with marginal players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talley56 Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 You can always second guess guys but I look at: -Bills turned out with a great team and we haven't been the same since Polian's guys left for other teams or retired. -He then went to Carolina to build an expansion franchise and they got to the NFC championship game in only their 2nd year of existence -While he did have the benefit of having Peyton in Indy I think he also gave them the talent Peyton needed to win a championship. They had been a mostly terrible franchise before Polian/Manning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jms62 Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Or the defensive coach who insulted the Washington lineman... Or the parity-shattering trade that culminated in the Dallas dynasty... I'm sure he should have done something to stop that Herschel Walker trade from happening. Getting back to Walt Corey. I am still shaking my head and dissapointed in Marv for dismantling the K-Gun because of Corey's excuse that it scored too quickly and his defense got tired. Oh the good ole days.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty McFly Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Off topic question. Who fleeced Jerry Hughes in that trade from the Colts? That was a hell of a move. 2nd top defensive player we fleeced from the Colts in recent Bills history.No, seriously, whose handy work was that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfladave Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) WEO... I'll put you in the genius vote, So feel free to move on. Reminder flamers, I asked a question. Obviously early returns are yes he's a genius. So if he is such a genius why didn't he ever find the players or coach to get us over the top in the 4 sb's? I bet answer will be Ralph was cheap While I will not be a Polian apologist, I personally thought he did a great job as GM until he dissed Mary and was shown exit stage left by Ralph afterwards. I cannot EVER blame the 4 SB losses on him for not putting together a team that could win the SB! He put together the team that did make it to an unprecedented 4 in a row! The players and the coaches let him down during that run! Most people I come across with this opinion of him have no touch of reality with the game of football then or were in grade school or not even born yet when he was GM. BTW Ralph was only pseudo cheap during the SB years! Cheap did apply to most positins on the team though which makes Polians accomplishments even greater. Buffalo fans didn't have social media then for us to armchair GM! We had to vcr games and rewind that tape to review anything. There was no replay, no internet (outside of Stanford). Noone played fantasy football then, or at least to the extent they do now. People clamour for better times but most are too young to remember for those SB years that we really sucked for years before the SB run. 2 2-14 tears in a row. Ralph was accused of being cheap BECAUSE he was especially with coaches and support staff! Edited October 8, 2016 by sfladave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 polian is a genius. built a winner 3 times in a row with 3 different franchises ...Buf, Car, Indy 6 time NFL Executive of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Players during the Bills rise in the 80's already on the roster pre Polian GM also include Jim Richter, Darryl Talley, Joe Devlin. The best trade he made, actually didn't receive a ton of press, was trading the '85 1st overall Supplemental Pick to Cleveland for their '85 and '86 #1's. Not arguing that trading for Biscuit was not a great move, but the trade certainly was not a fleecing. We gave up our fair share of picks for sure, I 2 #1's, #2, and maybe a 3rd. Former Bills guard, Jim Ritcher: Charles Francis Richter, co-developer of the Richter magnitude scale: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 He's a front office football person...I don't think genius is a term that should be used in football.....having said that , he was an excellent GM....the Bills used to regularly find great players from small colleges....drafting Howard Ballard was a great move....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jms62 Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 This thread is if he was a genius, not about the players which by the way I agree about. But want to push the envelop ask the thread who hired the coach that let that go on? Sorry my inference was lost on you. Yes he is a genius and arguably the greatest GM in the history of the game. To have been able to do this for 3 different teams should be enough for even the most cynical to accept him as the GOAT. Comparing Doug Whaley to him is akin to comparing EJ Manual to Jim Kelly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreezeMafia Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Former Bills guard, Jim Ritcher: Charles Francis Richter, co-developer of the Richter magnitude scale: Android spell check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Polian: Arguably one of the best General Managers in the history of the NFL. da Vinci, Newton, Einstein, Curie, Hawking: Geniuses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilarian Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Sorry my inference was lost on you. Yes he is a genius and arguably the greatest GM in the history of the game. To have been able to do this for 3 different teams should be enough for even the most cynical to accept him as the GOAT. Comparing Doug Whaley to him is akin to comparing EJ Manual to Jim Kelly. Has any other GM in the history of the NFL been able to build three teams into playoff teams in as little as three years or less? It really isn't about inheriting a great QB or drafting one as it's more about building that championship team around that QB. One top QB and DE isn't going to build a WR corps, O-line, run game, defense and special teams and all of those are needed to get to the playoffs. Buffalo, Dec 30th, 1985 named GM, so 1986 was his first season as GM. 1988 the Bills are in the AFC Championship game. Carolina, as an expansion team named GM in 1995. In playoffs in 1996! Indy, Hired in 1998, in playoffs 1999. The man knows talent at every NFL position on both sides of the ball! More importantly, knows the difference between a great QB and a bum! Knows who to hire as his head coach to build a playoff team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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