RD 1, Pick 19: DE Shaq Lawson, Clemson University

[CommonCents]

Pretty sure the last thing he said to Ralph was "turn your head and cough, mother@$%^er!" so you tell me?

Haha +1

[3rdand12]

Not sure about the jewels, but there is that silver samovar I've been keeping my eye on for a couple of centuries.

we are aware

[3rdand12]

Shaq can't shoulder Mario's heartless workload, we need a Medical Czar ASAP. Can Polian do physicals?

It's about the fridge.

someone left it there and now...well it is just ugly. Ragland has already asked why the water bottles are not as cold.

and another anonymous coming just now.... Somehow has written in the showers. "will not drop into zone" with Mr bubble bath foam.

not pretty a OBD. Brandon looks sleepless.

[boyst]

Shaquanna set the record at Sports Science for most recorded force on the test dummy, he hits harder than Aaron Donald.

She.

 

after therapy, she.

[26CornerBlitz]

Considering Shaq went on the city tour today, he didn't have surgery. Is it supposed to happen soon, and if so, why didn't he have it right after being drafted?

 

So we're running with this thing as fact? Surprised they would cut Wynn if Shaq will be out for a significant amount of time.

Edited May 13, 2016 by 26CornerBlitz

[Doc]

So we're running with this thing as fact?

 

Given eMoulds' cred, I'd say we can't dismiss it entirely.

[boyst]

 

Given eMoulds' cred, I'd say we can't dismiss it entirely.

agreed.

 

i would take this to mean it's more of an issue than non issue.

[BADOLBILZ]

I don't care whether eMoulds is right or not...it's still pretty crappy to do a "drive by" on a fan message board and then not have the decency to elaborate.

 

 

Man you literally do not understand the term "don't shoot the messenger".

 

This is probably just a case of mis-evaluating a medical pre-draft and now they are going to pay for it...........but when you draft for need.......specifically with the idea of finding a "starter" instead of getting the best player.........well mistakes like that get made.....and more needs usually ensue.

 

See Kujo.....or as they call him on Buffalo's west side....Culo.

 

When you find yourself just counting starting positions as filled by draft picks and saying things like "the kid's gonna' be alright" about players with question marks about their ability to be an impact player...... then it's time to tamp down expectations.

 

The first three rounds of this draft had A LOT of that.

 

They did better relative to the rest of the league in UDFA than during it.

 

As I said before.......the best thing about this draft is that they came out of it with Tyrod Taylor at QB.

[BarleyNY]

But he already stated he will miss time...can't that get back to the team?

Some poster (even a very credible one) on a message board stating something vague is not likely to get picked up by the general media. Something specific might at least lead to media people asking questions about the specific. Something specific could also get him pinpointed. That's when crap could hit the fan for him specifically.

Edited May 13, 2016 by BarleyNY

[BarleyNY]

 

I'd like to add that if Lawson has a medical issue it sure would explain why he was available at 19. I really didn't think he'd make it there.

[Doc]

Man you literally do not understand the term "don't shoot the messenger".

 

This is probably just a case of mis-evaluating a medical pre-draft and now they are going to pay for it...........but when you draft for need.......specifically with the idea of finding a "starter" instead of getting the best player.........well mistakes like that get made.....and more needs usually ensue.

 

See Kujo.....or as they call him on Buffalo's west side....Culo.

 

When you find yourself just counting starting positions as filled by draft picks and saying things like "the kid's gonna' be alright" about players with question marks about their ability to be an impact player...... then it's time to tamp down expectations.

 

The first three rounds of this draft had A LOT of that.

 

They did better relative to the rest of the league in UDFA than during it.

 

As I said before.......the best thing about this draft is that they came out of it with Tyrod Taylor at QB.

 

Wait, by what metric was Shaq Lawson not the BPA at 19? Or Ragland at 41? Or Washington at 80?

[Beerball]

My GOD people, move along already.

[DrDawkinstein]

 

 

Man you literally do not understand the term "don't shoot the messenger".

 

This is probably just a case of mis-evaluating a medical pre-draft and now they are going to pay for it...........but when you draft for need.......specifically with the idea of finding a "starter" instead of getting the best player.........well mistakes like that get made.....and more needs usually ensue.

 

See Kujo.....or as they call him on Buffalo's west side....Culo.

 

When you find yourself just counting starting positions as filled by draft picks and saying things like "the kid's gonna' be alright" about players with question marks about their ability to be an impact player...... then it's time to tamp down expectations.

 

The first three rounds of this draft had A LOT of that.

 

They did better relative to the rest of the league in UDFA than during it.

 

As I said before.......the best thing about this draft is that they came out of it with Tyrod Taylor at QB.

 

 

Who were your BPAs at 19 and 41? Honestly curious since I recall you werent around much during the draft to express opinions in real time.

 

Edit: I just went back through the thread and saw you had Paxton Lynch as your pick at 19. Is that really the BPA, or would that be a pick based on need as well? Not sure I'd say the BPA at #19 overall is someone that needs to sit for a couple years to maybe develop (aka EJ v2.0). And if that's really your argument, I dont see how a player who wont be ready for a couple of seasons is more valuable right now than a guy who might miss 4 games (if the rumors are true). Also still curious as to your BPA at 41.

Edited May 14, 2016 by DrDareustein

[Doc]

Lynch as BPA at 19?

[BADOLBILZ]

 

 

Who were your BPAs at 19 and 41? Honestly curious since I recall you werent around much during the draft to express opinions in real time.

 

Edit: I just went back through the thread and saw you had Paxton Lynch as your pick at 19. Is that really the BPA, or would that be a pick based on need as well? Not sure I'd say the BPA at #19 overall is someone that needs to sit for a couple years to maybe develop (aka EJ v2.0). And if that's really your argument, I dont see how a player who wont be ready for a couple of seasons is more valuable right now than a guy who might miss 4 games (if the rumors are true). Also still curious as to your BPA at 41.

 

I would always pick the best available QB prospect first. I've expressed that opinion repeatedly for years on TSW.

 

If a QB pans out he's worth a fortune to your franchise. I've pointed out the LaDanian Tomlinson/Drew Brees analogy many times......20 years of a HOF QB keeping a team in contention versus getting 10 years of a HOF RB.......the difference in value is a CHASM.

 

And if a QB pans out you can tank many-a-draft and still contend.......see the Patriots.

 

Hence my point about Tyrod.......the book isn't written on him yet but the fact that he shows promise as a franchise QB is huge. If he pans out the impact is more than booming on 5 first round picks at other positions. So whether they tanked this draft or not they may come out fine.

 

But if you are determined not to pick a QB in round 1......then just pick the player most likely to become a superstar/impact player at a key, big dollar position.

 

In this case, that was Myles Jack or William Jackson, the best corner in the draft IMO. Jack may show up as an inside LB but he can play all over the field on defense, making him a really rare talent.....possibly a much better version on defense of what people thought Percy Harvin could be on offense.....a guy who could conceivably one day be worth the top defensive salary in the NFL.

 

With the injury....the extent of which I have no idea......then maybe Jackson was the safer pick.....Jackson is a tremendously gifted corner without the limitations at his position that Shaq has.

 

The early part of the draft should be about getting the players who can make the biggest impact on your franchise........not about getting a starting quality base DE/edge setting OLB type or making a modest upgrade over Preston Brown at a position that has been devalued.

 

And Washington was basically the John McCargo of the Ohio State defense.....just like McCargo played between Mario and Manny Lawson at NC State and failed to play up to his perceived talent level, Washington disappointed at Ohio State with a lot of talent around him.

 

Maybe I am wrong and these guys will pan out......but when you draft for need mis-evaluations are made precisely because you NEED and IMO, these guys all have notable limitations.......shoulder questions aside, Shaq is not a twitchy/bendy pass rusher and he tends to lean on blockers......Ragnuts is a limited athlete in space and perhaps not even better than the Brown or Bradham, who are dime-a-dozen talents if on the free agent market........and Adolphus is kind of a turd with some talent but perhaps not the determination to contribute on run defense(not an Urban Meyer favorite).

 

So people ask who was the BPA over Washington.......well, like McCargo, there is probably going to prove to be a pretty long list. It's just funny how we get told at certain points things like.......if you want Chris Cash you are going to have to take him in the second round........and then the guys falls out of the draft entirely.......so why people think that draftnik ratings are necessarily a true reflection of value is perplexing. Take what you see and make your own evaluation. To me, I wasn't real interested in Shaq/Ragnuts or Washington in the first 3 rounds. Not what I'm looking for and especially not with the knowledge that this may be the last go for Rex and Whaley and a new coaching staff might not have much use at all for these rather use-specific ponies.

 

I think the best decisions are made when you AREN'T drafting to get immediate starters to fill your on-paper roster. When you treat the draft like an ongoing process of roster building rather than an annual event where current needs can be addressed you tend to be "luckier" with your selections. See Ron Darby. Last year, needs were addressed in a big way in free agency and the Bills had all options open on draft day. That's when you make good decisions. The Bills didn't have a lot of money in free agency but they may regret not finding a way to jump on some of the very talented, cheap, proven inside LB's they passed on and instead trading up to get Ragnuts and the same can be said at OLB/NT etc.. They didn't have to break the bank.

 

But I will say this......in the long run......if Tyrod pans out and they use money saved to keep him and his offense together maybe it will be fine if the early picks don't pan out. The 2013 draft was a waste and yet, aside from QB, the Bills roster has been playoff caliber for years now. If you have a QB you can do a lot wrong and still come out looking right.

[DrDawkinstein]

 

I would always pick the best available QB prospect first. I've expressed that opinion repeatedly for years on TSW.

 

If a QB pans out he's worth a fortune to your franchise. I've pointed out the LaDanian Tomlinson/Drew Brees analogy many times......20 years of a HOF QB keeping a team in contention versus getting 10 years of a HOF RB.......the difference in value is a CHASM.

 

And if a QB pans out you can tank many-a-draft and still contend.......see the Patriots.

 

Hence my point about Tyrod.......the book isn't written on him yet but the fact that he shows promise as a franchise QB is huge. If he pans out the impact is more than booming on 5 first round picks at other positions. So whether they tanked this draft or not they may come out fine.

 

But if you are determined not to pick a QB in round 1......then just pick the player most likely to become a superstar/impact player at a key, big dollar position.

 

In this case, that was Myles Jack or William Jackson, the best corner in the draft IMO. Jack may show up as an inside LB but he can play all over the field on defense, making him a really rare talent.....possibly a much better version on defense of what people thought Percy Harvin could be on offense.....a guy who could conceivably one day be worth the top defensive salary in the NFL.

 

With the injury....the extent of which I have no idea......then maybe Jackson was the safer pick.....Jackson is a tremendously gifted corner without the limitations at his position that Shaq has.

 

The early part of the draft should be about getting the players who can make the biggest impact on your franchise........not about getting a starting quality base DE/edge setting OLB type or making a modest upgrade over Preston Brown at a position that has been devalued.

 

And Washington was basically the John McCargo of the Ohio State defense.....just like McCargo played between Mario and Manny Lawson at NC State and failed to play up to his perceived talent level, Washington disappointed at Ohio State with a lot of talent around him.

 

Maybe I am wrong and these guys will pan out......but when you draft for need mis-evaluations are made precisely because you NEED and IMO, these guys all have notable limitations.......shoulder questions aside, Shaq is not a twitchy/bendy pass rusher and he tends to lean on blockers......Ragnuts is a limited athlete in space and perhaps not even better than the Brown or Bradham, who are dime-a-dozen talents if on the free agent market........and Adolphus is kind of a turd with some talent but perhaps not the determination to contribute on run defense(not an Urban Meyer favorite).

 

So people ask who was the BPA over Washington.......well, like McCargo, there is probably going to prove to be a pretty long list. It's just funny how we get told at certain points things like.......if you want Chris Cash you are going to have to take him in the second round........and then the guys falls out of the draft entirely.......so why people think that draftnik ratings are necessarily a true reflection of value is perplexing. Take what you see and make your own evaluation. To me, I wasn't real interested in Shaq/Ragnuts or Washington in the first 3 rounds. Not what I'm looking for and especially not with the knowledge that this may be the last go for Rex and Whaley and a new coaching staff might not have much use at all for these rather use-specific ponies.

 

I think the best decisions are made when you AREN'T drafting to get immediate starters to fill your on-paper roster. When you treat the draft like an ongoing process of roster building rather than an annual event where current needs can be addressed you tend to be "luckier" with your selections. See Ron Darby. Last year, needs were addressed in a big way in free agency and the Bills had all options open on draft day. That's when you make good decisions. The Bills didn't have a lot of money in free agency but they may regret not finding a way to jump on some of the very talented, cheap, proven inside LB's they passed on and instead trading up to get Ragnuts and the same can be said at OLB/NT etc.. They didn't have to break the bank.

 

But I will say this......in the long run......if Tyrod pans out and they use money saved to keep him and his offense together maybe it will be fine if the early picks don't pan out. The 2013 draft was a waste and yet, aside from QB, the Bills roster has been playoff caliber for years now. If you have a QB you can do a lot wrong and still come out looking right.

 

I'll give you that QBs are a different category, but it's still a longshot, developmental prospect we're talking about here.

As far as your BPA at 19 goes, maybe a healthy Jack, but certainly not in his current state. And anyone could easily argue that they had reached for an injured player of need just to fill a LB spot.

 

And I didnt ask who your BPA was over Washington. By the time you get to the 3rd round, its a crap shoot. I would have preferred Miller even, but Im fine with Washington.

 

I asked who your BPA was over Ragland.

 

While we're at it, who were these ILBs in FA you wanted?

 

I see a lot of naysaying, but not a concise and simple answer as to what you would have done differently.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

I'll give you that QBs are a different category, but it's still a longshot, developmental prospect we're talking about here.

As far as your BPA at 19 goes, maybe a healthy Jack, but certainly not in his current state. And anyone could easily argue that they had reached for an injured player of need just to fill a LB spot.

 

And I didnt ask who your BPA was over Washington. By the time you get to the 3rd round, its a crap shoot. I would have preferred Miller even, but Im fine with Washington.

 

I asked who your BPA was over Ragland.

 

While we're at it, who were these ILBs in FA you wanted?

 

I see a lot of naysaying, but not a concise and simple answer as to what you would have done differently.

 

Did you not follow free agency?

 

Rolando McClain......a far better talent at Alabama than Ragnuts......signed a one year $5M deal with Dallas. Karlos Dansby was released just weeks before the draft after playing extraordinarily well in Pettine's defense. And there were other options........and Zach Brown WAS signed........ and probably would have served fine to address a need at a position that isn't actually going to need 4 LB's on the field all that often......let alone two base run defenders like Brown and Ragnuts. Hell, sign Calvin Pace to play some outside snaps and let Manny play inside when you need 2 ILB's. He handled it extraordinarily well late last season.

 

The Bills traded up to 42 to get Ragland.......so I don't really know who would have been available at 49 but there were many players I would have selected over Ragland.

 

So having selected Jackson at #19...........if he was still there early in round 2 I would have been working hard to get up near the top of the second to get Myles Jack........I gladly trade the third round pick and even the the 4th if necessary to get there.

 

So for the sake of argument let's say I end up with both of my top rated positional players at #19 in my first 3 rounds(plus the pick in round 4 they threw in to get RR).

 

But I get it............. if I'm Doug Whaley I just came out of that with possibly NO starters this year.........when Doug probably thinks he got 3 guys who will start this year.

 

In 2013 DW got 3 immediate starters in the first 2 rounds........how has that worked out?

 

Get the best talent......not the perceived best options where you need immediate starting help.

 

I liked the Cardale Jones, Williams and Listenbee picks a lot. Williams should be able to join the other 5th round RB and street FA in exposing the lack of foresight the organization had wrt doling out a $40M contract to McCoy and the other two are lottery tickets that the Bills have often eschewed for taking value-free street free-agent value special teams types.

 

If they'd addressed the early part of the draft the way that they did the latter and UDFA then I'd like the draft a whole lot better.

Edited May 14, 2016 by #BADOL

[John from Riverside]

 

I would always pick the best available QB prospect first. I've expressed that opinion repeatedly for years on TSW.

 

First let me start off by saying I respect the hell out of your post whether I agree with all of it or not. We have too many offering opinions on this board that are not even attempting to quantify them or dont feel they need to.

 

If a QB pans out he's worth a fortune to your franchise. I've pointed out the LaDanian Tomlinson/Drew Brees analogy many times......20 years of a HOF QB keeping a team in contention versus getting 10 years of a HOF RB.......the difference in value is a CHASM.

 

This is true......but I think it also needs to be weighed against what the strength of the draft is.....when your best shot at getting a QB is someone who played at a small school but has the physical make up this tells me its not a great year to go all in on a QB....thankfully for us we have a incombant starter and had the luxery of not doing that this year. I thought the C. Jones pick was perfect because he has the highest ceiling of the draft (but probably also the lowest floor) and we used a 4th round comp pick.

 

And if a QB pans out you can tank many-a-draft and still contend.......see the Patriots.

 

Who hit on a late round QB

 

Hence my point about Tyrod.......the book isn't written on him yet but the fact that he shows promise as a franchise QB is huge. If he pans out the impact is more than booming on 5 first round picks at other positions. So whether they tanked this draft or not they may come out fine.

 

Everyone knows I am high on Taylor.....if he can just improve his 3rd down completion percentage a little bit they should beg him to take our money.

 

But if you are determined not to pick a QB in round 1......then just pick the player most likely to become a superstar/impact player at a key, big dollar position.

 

In this case, that was Myles Jack or William Jackson, the best corner in the draft IMO. Jack may show up as an inside LB but he can play all over the field on defense, making him a really rare talent.....possibly a much better version on defense of what people thought Percy Harvin could be on offense.....a guy who could conceivably one day be worth the top defensive salary in the NFL.

 

I would have been fine with Jack....but are you not concerned about his medical questions? Star talent....but his body might not hold up? I found it really interesting that the bills were considering Ragland at 19......this was totally a Rex pick and probably a perfect fit for this defense......we did in fact address the LB position which we needed to do and did not do it in the 1st round.

 

With the injury....the extent of which I have no idea......then maybe Jackson was the safer pick.....Jackson is a tremendously gifted corner without the limitations at his position that Shaq has.

 

The early part of the draft should be about getting the players who can make the biggest impact on your franchise........not about getting a starting quality base DE/edge setting OLB type or making a modest upgrade over Preston Brown at a position that has been devalued.

 

I understand your point of view.....but I also understand why the bills did what they did. Mario was a huge dissapointment......the bills dropped 15 spots in defensive rankings....Rex Ryan is a defensive coach.....and Rex probably thinks the Gilmore contract is gonna happen.....if Darby does not kill it in his first year we are probably taking a corner with that first pick.

 

And Washington was basically the John McCargo of the Ohio State defense.....just like McCargo played between Mario and Manny Lawson at NC State and failed to play up to his perceived talent level, Washington disappointed at Ohio State with a lot of talent around him.

 

Sadly.....I see this too unless the bills can coach Washington up on his run stop. I know the bills see a DL pass rusher and I know Kyle is probably gone next year.......I hope I am wrong here

 

Maybe I am wrong and these guys will pan out......but when you draft for need mis-evaluations are made precisely because you NEED and IMO, these guys all have notable limitations.......shoulder questions aside, Shaq is not a twitchy/bendy pass rusher and he tends to lean on blockers......Ragnuts is a limited athlete in space and perhaps not even better than the Brown or Bradham, who are dime-a-dozen talents if on the free agent market........and Adolphus is kind of a turd with some talent but perhaps not the determination to contribute on run defense(not an Urban Meyer favorite).

 

In all honestly....I just love Ragland and I love it more that we didnt take him in the first.....I disagree with him being limited in space IF its limited space....he is not gonna turn and run with guys but he gives this D toughness.....guys that go over the middle know they are gonna pay for it.....he finds the ball in the run game......he is a HUGE MLB who when he tackles players they feel it.

 

Shaq Lawson? He should not have even been there for us to pick hence I got no problem with that pick......he will do everything for Rex Ryan that Mario REFUSED to do.......and that really is the whole idea....Schwartz is gone......that top 5 D of his is gone with him......so now it is time to give RR the players to run HIS scheme well.

 

So people ask who was the BPA over Washington.......well, like McCargo, there is probably going to prove to be a pretty long list. It's just funny how we get told at certain points things like.......if you want Chris Cash you are going to have to take him in the second round........and then the guys falls out of the draft entirely.......so why people think that draftnik ratings are necessarily a true reflection of value is perplexing. Take what you see and make your own evaluation. To me, I wasn't real interested in Shaq/Ragnuts or Washington in the first 3 rounds. Not what I'm looking for and especially not with the knowledge that this may be the last go for Rex and Whaley and a new coaching staff might not have much use at all for these rather use-specific ponies.

 

Somewhere in there I would have liked to see a OT drafted......because now it looks like the bills are hoping someone gets cut that can still play....BUT its a plus minus thing. Staying true to their board is what allows the bills to draft that RB Williams who has stud written all over him.

 

I think the best decisions are made when you AREN'T drafting to get immediate starters to fill your on-paper roster. When you treat the draft like an ongoing process of roster building rather than an annual event where current needs can be addressed you tend to be "luckier" with your selections. See Ron Darby. Last year, needs were addressed in a big way in free agency and the Bills had all options open on draft day. That's when you make good decisions. The Bills didn't have a lot of money in free agency but they may regret not finding a way to jump on some of the very talented, cheap, proven inside LB's they passed on and instead trading up to get Ragnuts and the same can be said at OLB/NT etc.. They didn't have to break the bank.

 

But I will say this......in the long run......if Tyrod pans out and they use money saved to keep him and his offense together maybe it will be fine if the early picks don't pan out. The 2013 draft was a waste and yet, aside from QB, the Bills roster has been playoff caliber for years now. If you have a QB you can do a lot wrong and still come out looking right.

 

In my mind I know that not every player in this draft is gonna work out.....so I look at it more as a percentage. If 75 percent of the draft turns into either a starter or a contributing player it was a SUCCESS.......to me this was a boring...safe...BPA draft.

 

Did you not follow free agency?

 

Rolando McClain......a far better talent at Alabama than Ragnuts......signed a one year $5M deal with Dallas. Karlos Dansby was released just weeks before the draft after playing extraordinarily well in Pettine's defense. And there were other options........and Zach Brown WAS signed........ and probably would have served fine to address a need at a position that isn't actually going to need 4 LB's on the field all that often......let alone two base run defenders like Brown and Ragnuts. Hell, sign Calvin Pace to play some outside snaps and let Manny play inside when you need 2 ILB's. He handled it extraordinarily well late last season.

 

The Bills traded up to 42 to get Ragland.......so I don't really know who would have been available at 49 but there were many players I would have selected over Ragland.

 

So having selected Jackson at #19...........if he was still there early in round 2 I would have been working hard to get up near the top of the second to get Myles Jack........I gladly trade the third round pick and even the the 4th if necessary to get there.

 

So for the sake of argument let's say I end up with both of my top rated positional players at #19 in my first 3 rounds(plus the pick in round 4 they threw in to get RR).

 

But I get it............. if I'm Doug Whaley I just came out of that with possibly NO starters this year.........when Doug probably thinks he got 3 guys who will start this year.

 

In 2013 DW got 3 immediate starters in the first 2 rounds........how has that worked out?

 

Get the best talent......not the perceived best options where you need immediate starting help.

 

I liked the Cardale Jones, Williams and Listenbee picks a lot. Williams should be able to join the other 5th round RB and street FA in exposing the lack of foresight the organization had wrt doling out a $40M contract to McCoy and the other two are lottery tickets that the Bills have often eschewed for taking value-free street free-agent value special teams types.

 

If they'd addressed the early part of the draft the way that they did the latter and UDFA then I'd like the draft a whole lot better.

I liked McClain as well......perhaps he preferred to go to Dallas?

 

I think you undervalue Ragland......McClain is more athletic but Ragland has a nose for that ball man

[BADOLBILZ]

I liked McClain as well......perhaps he preferred to go to Dallas?

 

I think you undervalue Ragland......McClain is more athletic but Ragland has a nose for that ball man

 

Yeah he's a much bigger, rangier talent than RR but the best thing about McClain is that he is very smart.

 

Ragland is reportedly NOT very smart.

 

It's kind of a slam dunk difference between the two.

 

McClain has had his issues but he's a proven commodity and I figured a 3 year deal was going to get him out of Dallas and there is no reason to believe it would not have.

 

The position simply is not valued.......asked Dansby.

 

If pass rushers of that talent level became teams would be forking out the dough.

 

And that's part of the equation........is this a guy who's going to be a big difference maker long term and warrant a big second contract?

 

Probably not in the case of RR. Rex will try to prop him up but I will be surprised if he's still viewed as a "special" player in a couple years.

 

The Bills have become notorious for these type of need picks with their second and third overall picks in a draft.

 

Take Robert Woods........people were happy because he could be a "starter" but after a while you realize that quality doesn't end at "starter".

 

High ceilings are important in early rounds.

 

IMO Shaq's ceiling is not high.........I want a pass rusher with a good set of elite physical traits that will translate to the NFL with development.......I want a Justin Houston type opposite Hughes.......not a guy whose max falls somewhere between Courtney Upshaw and Melvin Ingram.

 

I've mentioned the Ingram comparison and he had something of a breakout year last year but even though he and Shaq are very similar in size and athletic numbers, Ingram is a guy who can really drop and can also play inside if necessary. He's a little better athlete.

 

If Shaq doesn't turn into a double digit sack guy he's going to become a journeyman like Upshaw. Teams just don't settle for a lack of pass rush very often.

 

I hope I am wrong and his attitude and hustle translates but I see a guy who is slow off the ball and has to kinda' negotiate his way to the QB.

[boyst]

over or under:

5 Sacks.

 

take your bet, state your claim.