YoloinOhio Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 (edited) I thought this ESPN article was thought-provoking concerning the roster and salary cap. http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/18451/doug-whaley-bills-middle-class-could-get-squeezed-out "By replacing part of the "middle class" of their roster with cheaper draft selections, the Bills could knock down their cap number and maintain their financial health over the coming seasons. Who is part of the Bills' middle class? I would point to three players in particular: running back Fred Jackson, linebacker Manny Lawson and cornerback Leodis McKelvin." I know some of you boycott Rodak and espn so I pointed it out in the topic and in the thread. No need to click if you don't want to. Edited April 23, 2015 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPS Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I certainly found that analogy interesting when I heard him say it on the draft video. Whaley is fomenting class conflict.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I thought this ESPN article was thought-provoking concerning the roster and salary cap. http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/18451/doug-whaley-bills-middle-class-could-get-squeezed-out "By replacing part of the "middle class" of their roster with cheaper draft selections, the Bills could knock down their cap number and maintain their financial health over the coming seasons. Who is part of the Bills' middle class? I would point to three players in particular: running back Fred Jackson, linebacker Manny Lawson and cornerback Leodis McKelvin." I know some of you boycott Rodak and espn so I pointed it out in the topic and in the thread. No need to click if you don't want to. Isn't that what most teams do? This doesn't sound like ground breaking info. Players get released every year. (Not against you, Yolo) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 thank you for the synopsis. it will save me from having to click on the link. i don't want to give that clown anymore clicks than we have to. i think Whaley is chomping at the bit to get rid of Fred. I found it interesting that he said he wants Kyle and Mario to retire as Bills but he forgot to mention Fred. he views Bryce Brown as his 4th round draft pick this year (since we don't have one he wants to pretend like Bryce was our pick). so he wants Fred out of the way so that his trade last year doesn't look bad. i wish we could get rid of McLovin but decent CB's in this league are hard to find unfortunately. McLovin is definitely what i would refer to as "serviceable" where he's not too bad that he will cost you games but at the same time he's not that good either. that would be great to get a CB in the draft that would make him replaceable and maybe we could even trade him for a pick next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 Isn't that what most teams do? This doesn't sound like ground breaking info. Players get released every year. (Not against you, Yolo)most teams? I don't know... I do think the good teams do. That's why I could see mckelvin getting traded or Lawson cut - some may get upset about us losing depth but the fact is that because of all the big time contracts the Bills are going to have (which is not a bad thing, it means they finally have big time players), they are going to have to really push up the cheap rookie contract guys. I know I've seen people scared about a Duke Williams or Ross Cockrell out there because they are "unproven" and we should have kept guys like Searcy, but Searcy would fall into that middle class. those dollars can be applied elsewhere to re-sign core guys while you lift up a guy like Duke Williams and trust that you have scouted well and developed well. That is just an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I would throw Bryce Brown into that as well...... This is the first piece Rodent has done that I can actually read without wanting to claw my own eyes out..... Personally I think that this process has already began - I think Manny Lawson could go and be replaced by Randel Johnson.....Randel Johnson started off slow.....but seemed to get better every week and really could fly around the field.....he had some injury problems in his first year - McKelvin replaced by Ross Cockrell.......McKelvin is a excellent ST's returner...but we appear to have that covered....Cockrell has that size, physical that you look for in a corner - You also have guys like Robey....who flat out make plays....and releasing McKelvin opens the door for more playing time for Robey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 No need to click if you don't want to. So in other words...we're becoming a better team. Isn't that bar-bell salary structure typical of any long-term playoff calibre team, where the 'stars' are retained / re-signed (like in the case of Hughes, Dareus, etc.) and the draft is used to fill out the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I thought this ESPN article was thought-provoking concerning the roster and salary cap. http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/18451/doug-whaley-bills-middle-class-could-get-squeezed-out "By replacing part of the "middle class" of their roster with cheaper draft selections, the Bills could knock down their cap number and maintain their financial health over the coming seasons. Who is part of the Bills' middle class? I would point to three players in particular: running back Fred Jackson, linebacker Manny Lawson and cornerback Leodis McKelvin." I know some of you boycott Rodak and espn so I pointed it out in the topic and in the thread. No need to click if you don't want to. Hey, they are just copying America; small elite, no middle class, everyone else indentured servants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 most teams? I don't know... I do think the good teams do. That's why I could see mckelvin getting traded or Lawson cut - some may get upset about us losing depth but the fact is that because of all the big time contracts the Bills are going to have (which is not a bad thing, it means they finally have big time players), they are going to have to really push up the cheap rookie contract guys. I know I've seen people scared about a Duke Williams or Ross Cockrell out there because they are "unproven" and we should have kept guys like Searcy, but Searcy would fall into that middle class. those dollars can be applied elsewhere to re-sign core guys while you lift up a guy like Duke Williams and trust that you have scouted well and developed well. That is just an example. You're right....good teams....plus these 2 will be good players . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 So in other words...we're becoming a better team. Isn't that bar-bell salary structure typical of any long-term playoff calibre team, where the 'stars' are retained / re-signed (like in the case of Hughes, Dareus, etc.) and the draft is used to fill out the roster. yes. I think in the past decade or so it has been mostly "middle class" players and contracts. The rookie wage scale certainly helps too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 It's part of the life cycle of team building. When Buddy and Whaley came in our talent level was among the very worst in the league. We didn't have players worth what guys like Mario, McCoy, Kyle, Dareus or Gilmore are worth, so the first step was getting our talent up to par which necessitated feasting on the middle class good teams can't afford to retain. Now that we have hit on draft picks and are building our core, we'll hopefully have guys good enough to cover for young guys in other spots. Teams like the Packers and Pats don't have the mid level guys like Lawson on their roster. They've built their talent base up to the point they are able to identify the guys in house worth keeping, spend their money on maintaining that core then keep churning the bottom of the roster with fresh (cheap) young guys. It's a huge benefit of not having your hand forced to fill needs through the draft and instead using the BPA approach. When you are paying a QB as much as the contenders are paying them, you are going to lose that middle class. The only "good" team that's consistently making splashes through FA or by trade is the Seahawks, who are still enjoying the benefits of Wilson's rookie deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kota Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 All three of those players could go and i wouldn't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 It's part of the life cycle of team building. When Buddy and Whaley came in our talent level was among the very worst in the league. We didn't have players worth what guys like Mario, McCoy, Kyle, Dareus or Gilmore are worth, so the first step was getting our talent up to par which necessitated feasting on the middle class good teams can't afford to retain. Now that we have hit on draft picks and are building our core, we'll hopefully have guys good enough to cover for young guys in other spots. Teams like the Packers and Pats don't have the mid level guys like Lawson on their roster. They've built their talent base up to the point they are able to identify the guys in house worth keeping, spend their money on maintaining that core then keep churning the bottom of the roster with fresh (cheap) young guys. It's a huge benefit of not having your hand forced to fill needs through the draft and instead using the BPA approach. When you are paying a QB as much as the contenders are paying them, you are going to lose that middle class. The only "good" team that's consistently making splashes through FA or by trade is the Seahawks, who are still enjoying the benefits of Wilson's rookie deal. Colts too. Imagine what that roster will look like after Luck is paid. Their drafts have been crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 This happens to most teams most years, named "cap casualties" in the off/pre season. I'd hate to lose FredEx, or McKelvin, but if it means it helps us win more games for a long period of time, then it's a sacrifice I'm willing to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 This happens to most teams most years, named "cap casualties" in the off/pre season. I'd hate to lose FredEx, or McKelvin, but if it means it helps us win more games for a long period of time, then it's a sacrifice I'm willing to deal with.i agree it is typical but teams that have been lacking big time players/contracts don't do it as much because they don't have to. I think that's where the Bills have been stuck until recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 McKelvin is as middle class as you can get. I'm with the GM on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 OR... still under the cap, we could sign a couple more for vet minimum and keep them all except Chris Williams. Just sayin.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Admittedly I'm not going to click on Rodak's article, but does anyone else get the vibe he tries really hard to spin every positive into a negative. There not being salary cap room for guys like Freddie, Lawson or McKelvin is not a negative thing if the money is going to perennial Pro Bowlers. (If he didn't take this spin, I apologize for my ignorance, but I'm just done with him always taking the glass half empty approach with this franchise and the only way he's going away is if we don't click). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 Admittedly I'm not going to click on Rodak's article, but does anyone else get the vibe he tries really hard to spin every positive into a negative. There not being salary cap room for guys like Freddie, Lawson or McKelvin is not a negative thing if the money is going to perennial Pro Bowlers. (If he didn't take this spin, I apologize for my ignorance, but I'm just done with him always taking the glass half empty approach with this franchise and the only way he's going away is if we don't click). he seemed to angle it toward the bills becoming "top heavy" (Whaley's words) and therefore the money will need to go to the "upper class" so to speak and the lower class (of contracts) needing to step up. Very dependent on having good drafts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 (edited) he seemed to angle it toward the bills becoming "top heavy" (Whaley's words) and therefore the money will need to go to the "upper class" so to speak and the lower class (of contracts) needing to step up. Very dependent on having good drafts. So like I figured earlier, exactly like every other good team in the league. Edited April 23, 2015 by Chuck Wagon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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