Bill from NYC Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 That's correct. He will sign the tender. Worst case, he does so and then shows up halfway thru the season to get his playing time credit but more than likely he would show up in September like Peters so as not to lose the paychecks. I fully agree. To take it a step further, the Bills have leverage imo. Btw, what do you think he would be worth in a Peerless Price type trade? Do you think he could be traded for a 1st round pick? I for one do not. He is young (and the young free agents did the best in this offseason) but he isn't a dominant player imo. And, the team who trades away a pick for him gives up the option of a cheap draft pick (because of the new CBA). Byrd will cost money. I think that if the Bills can get more than a 3rd for him they would be doing well, considering the amount of money a team would have to pay to sign him. What is your take? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Why do you clowns care if the Bills overpay him by $1M a season? They overpaid Fitz and Mario and are still well under the cap. It ain't your money. It's not like they're gonna spend up to the cap. This team is devoid of playmakers. Is it just an embeded Buffalo blue collar thriftiness? I don't get the logic. He is one of the top three or four safeties in the league now that Palomalu and Reed are past their primes. He is one of the only blue chip players on this roster. Pay the man and don't look back. Are so many of you just naturally cheap? Edited June 9, 2013 by Coach Tuesday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Why do you clowns care if the Bills overpay him by $1M a season? They overpaid Fitz and Mario and are still well under the cap. It ain't your money. It's not like they're gonna spend up to the cap. This team is devoid of playmakers. Is it just an embeded Buffalo blue collar thriftiness? I don't get the logic. He is one of the top three or four safeties in the league now that Palomalu and Reed are past their primes. He is one of the only blue chip players on this roster. Pay the man and don't look back. Are so many of you just naturally cheap? despite my willingness to trade him for extra draft picks, I agree with you. I'd rather have the man on our roster and have already stated that I feel he's worthy of the highest paid salary for a safety in the league. I just don't think it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I fully agree. To take it a step further, the Bills have leverage imo. Btw, what do you think he would be worth in a Peerless Price type trade? Do you think he could be traded for a 1st round pick? I for one do not. He is young (and the young free agents did the best in this offseason) but he isn't a dominant player imo. And, the team who trades away a pick for him gives up the option of a cheap draft pick (because of the new CBA). Byrd will cost money. I think that if the Bills can get more than a 3rd for him they would be doing well, considering the amount of money a team would have to pay to sign him. What is your take? I think he would be valued greatly in free agency but I don't know of a team that is desperate enough for safety help to trade a first round pick for him and then pay him more than Goldson. In Peerless' case, the Falcons were desperate for a WR. The Clements case was the same, there were teams that were desperate for a cb and would have gladly traded a high pick for Clements. That said, I think the Bills owe it to the fans to get something done with Byrd and retain him. Losing him is a step back and there is not time for that. This staff needs to get off on the right foot. This is the bed you make when you use premium draft picks on positions that you do not value as premium as an organization. You end up with a situation where it is easy to justify not paying them when their contracts come up. Same issue with RB's and CB's. We have seen this over and over. Draft a RB, trade him for much less than the value used to draft him. Draft a CB, let him walk in free agency. Then use high picks to replace them. The Bills aren't the Patriots or the Steelers, they don't have the luxury of letting key players walk because they don't have the strong foundation those teams have that allows them to endure personnel losses and continue winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Why do you clowns care if the Bills overpay him by $1M a season? They overpaid Fitz and Mario and are still well under the cap. It ain't your money. It's not like they're gonna spend up to the cap. This team is devoid of playmakers. Is it just an embeded Buffalo blue collar thriftiness? I don't get the logic. He is one of the top three or four safeties in the league now that Palomalu and Reed are past their primes. He is one of the only blue chip players on this roster. Pay the man and don't look back. Are so many of you just naturally cheap? Bills fans are very passionate and there is a very strong tendency to get emotionally offended over perceived slights or disrespect. You may not have noticed this. Unfortunately, it seems that Ralph Wilson has acted the same way for the past half century. He has had that same "we can finish last without him" cut-off-nose-to-spite-face attitude as a lot of overzealous fans. Ralph is not cheap, he just ran his team like it was his hobby instead of a business that needed to win to survive. Byrd needs to be retained. It is possible that they could find a much cheaper, effective replacement but when you use high picks on players and they pan out you.......and you have the cap space.......you really have no excuse for not getting them back under contract. If you don't like paying safeties then don't draft them high and learn to draft better later in the draft. Is it the sign of a winning team when your two highest ranking players by position relative to the rest of the league are a safety and a RB? No. Those aren't the prime positions. But when you draft those positions in round 1 and 2 that's to be expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Why do you clowns care if the Bills overpay him by $1M a season? They overpaid Fitz and Mario and are still well under the cap. It ain't your money. It's not like they're gonna spend up to the cap. This team is devoid of playmakers. Is it just an embeded Buffalo blue collar thriftiness? I don't get the logic. He is one of the top three or four safeties in the league now that Palomalu and Reed are past their primes. He is one of the only blue chip players on this roster. Pay the man and don't look back. Are so many of you just naturally cheap? Not sure which clowns you're referring to but just to be clear, I don't give a rat's ass how much they pay Byrd or anybody else for that matter. I think players should get as much as they can while they can. I also know that teams need to do certain things within their salary structures both currently and in the future that make it impossible to retain all of their players, especially great ones. You don't "get" the logic because you can't see any farther than what your emotional attachment to a good player and your disdain for the team allows. The Bills obviously value Byrd or they wouldn't have tagged him. But there are legitimate reasons why they may not be willing to make him the highest paid safety in the league at the moment. Fitz and Williams have no bearing on anything with regard to the Byrd situation. GO BILLS!!! Edited June 9, 2013 by K-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Not sure which clowns you're referring to but just to be clear, I don't give a rat's ass how much they pay Byrd or anybody else for that matter. I think players should get as much as they can while they can. I also know that teams need to do certain things within their salary structures both currently and in the future that make it impossible to retain all of their players, especially great ones. You don't "get" the logic because you can't see any farther than what your emotional attachment to a good player and your disdain for the team allows. The Bills obviously value Byrd or they wouldn't have tagged him. But there are legitimate reasons why they may not be willing to make him the highest paid safety in the league at the moment. Fitz and Williams have no bearing on anything with regard to the Byrd situation. GO BILLS!!! When the Bills as an organization actually get near the point where they have to let good players walk because of financial overcommitments, that argument may have some appeal. But right now, it's a total fiction, a red herring. The fact that a hypothetical A+ organization wouldn't overpay for a free safety has no bearing on this issue. The Bills aren't one of those, and it's not like they need to save money on Byrd in order to reinvest it elsewhere. Please. I don't give a rats ass what price point Littman and Overdorf (or the self-regarded cap specialists on this borad) decided was Byrd's limit. Frankly I am sick and tired of that kind of thinking. The parties are reportedly bickering over a million or two per season. The Bills should close the gap, because they can afford to, and because they can't afford not to. Edited June 9, 2013 by Coach Tuesday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) It's not our money. Some do get caught up that. I think it's historical that Ralph has not paid the right players when the time comes. I think we have seen that trend the other way the last 2-3 years . Those guys that push pencil and crunch #s do what they do and god bless em all. But this aint about whether he is good enough to pay top safety salary is it / Its how much do the Bills value Byrds position . They appear not to value it as much as his agent does . My understanding of this eugene is that he sets a price and does not move from it . Now will the bills pay Byrd that number ? Seems like a no at this point I bet they are getting a feel for A williams D williams D searcy M silva and keeping eyes peeled . Analytics might suggest Bills could make better use of the draft picks. Now all that malarkey being said , i have concerns that Byrd really has no heart for the Bills. Shame if he misses our Dynasty run because he is at the right age to enjoy the next ten years as the newfound leaders of the AFC east ps forgot Meeks Edited June 9, 2013 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) When the Bills as an organization actually get near the point where they have to let good players walk because of financial overcommitments, that argument may have some appeal. But right now, it's a total fiction, a red herring. The fact that a hypothetical A+ organization wouldn't overpay for a free safety has no bearing on this issue. The Bills aren't one of those, and it's not like they need to save money on Byrd in order to reinvest it elsewhere. Please. I don't give a rats ass what price point Littman and Overdorf (or the self-regarded cap specialists on this borad) decided was Byrd's limit. Frankly I am sick and tired of that kind of thinking. The parties are reportedly bickering over a million or two per season. The Bills should close the gap, because they can afford to, and because they can't afford not to. Can you think of ANY reasons why the Bills may not want to do as you suggest? Just one? Come back when your objectivity isn't clouded. And the fact that a hypthetical organization would be willing to make Byrd the highest paid S in the league DOES have bearing on the argument that the Bills should trade him for whatever they can get so they don't risk losing him for nothing, as was suggested up thread. That certainly has more bearing than the weak "they overpaid Fitz and Mario Williams" reference. But it's interesting that you use the phrase "overpay" to describe Byrd's appeal to the hypothetical organization. Why is it overpaying when you feel he is genuinely the best player at his position? I think the Bills think he's good and that's why they tagged him. But there are legit reasons why he may not be considered the best in their minds. Hell, I make him the third or fourth best in team history alone. GO BILLS!!! Edited June 9, 2013 by K-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Can you think of ANY reasons why the Bills may not want to do as you suggest? Just one? Come back when your objectivity isn't clouded. And the fact that a hypthetical organization would be willing to make Byrd the highest paid S in the league DOES have bearing on the argument that the Bills should trade him for whatever they can get so they don't risk losing him for nothing, as was suggested up thread. That certainly has more bearing than the weak "they overpaid Fitz and Mario Williams" reference. But it's interesting that you use the phrase "overpay" to describe Byrd's appeal to the hypothetical organization. Why is it overpaying when you feel he is genuinely the best player at his position? I think the Bills think he's good and that's why they tagged him. But there are legit reasons why he may not be considered the best in their minds. Hell, I make him the third or fourth best in team history alone. GO BILLS!!! Yes I can think of one reason: the Bills as an organization stick to the mantra that good teams stick to their value board. They are correct about that. However, the Bills are not a good team. They are a pile of crap with 2 or 3 good players on it. Byrd is one of them, and they should be doing everything possible to keep him in the building. Levitre was another, but hey, We don't overpay for guards around here - good teams don't do that, right? The Bills are excellent at aping good teams in every category except talent acquisition and winning games. But it seems to suit roto-capologists like you just fine. And I find it amusing that you keep questioning my objectivity, as though I must have a hard-on for Byrd. I have no strong feeling about him as a player. I think there aren't any elite safeties left in the league, which helps his cause. You can't compare him to Ed Reed circa 2009 and use it as a basis for paying Byrd less than that. Byrd is now one of the top players at his position in the league; it doesn't matter that the position as a whole has gotten weaker. It doesn't work that way. You pay based on comparative value at the time. Edited June 9, 2013 by Coach Tuesday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Yes I can think of one reason: the Bills as an organization stick to the mantra that good teams stick to their value board. They are correct about that. However, the Bills are not a good team. They are a pile of crap with 2 or 3 good players on it. Byrd is one of them, and they should be doing everything possible to keep him in the building. Levitre was another, but hey, We don't overpay for guards around here - good teams don't do that, right? The Bills are excellent at aping good teams in every category except talent acquisition and winning games. But it seems to suit roto-capologists like you just fine. And I find it amusing that you keep questioning my objectivity, as though I must have a hard-on for Byrd. I have no strong feeling about him as a player. I think there aren't any elite safeties left in the league, which helps his cause. You can't compare him to Ed Reed circa 2009 and use it as a basis for paying Byrd less than that. Byrd is now one of the top players at his position in the league; it doesn't matter that the position as a whole has gotten weaker. It doesn't work that way. You pay based on comparative value at the time. I question your objectivity because you don't seem to want to acknowledge there may be several reasons the Bills have for not meeting Byrd's demands at the moment. There are. I don't know if good teams overpay for guards or not. But the Titans certainly did. Not sure what a "roto-capologist" is. But I don't spend a lot of time worrying about the cap anyway. They have to be at 89% of it this year so it's gonna take care of itself anyway. I don't recall bringing Ed Reed into the discussion as that has no bearing. My only reference to Reed as it pertains to Byrd is that I can see Pettine wanting to use him like he did Reed in Baltimore; as a playmaking centerfielder to go and get the ball. But I also see why Pettine may not feel Byrd is that kind of player because he lacks the speed to bring what Reed did. We can agree Byrd is a terrific player. We can also agree that the Bills are in dire need of playmakers. Unfortunately, neither preclude the Bills from having those legit reasons not to give him what he's asking. And let's not pretend like we know what he's asking for, either. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I question your objectivity because you don't seem to want to acknowledge there may be several reasons the Bills have for not meeting Byrd's demands at the moment. There are. I don't know if good teams overpay for guards or not. But the Titans certainly did. Not sure what a "roto-capologist" is. But I don't spend a lot of time worrying about the cap anyway. They have to be at 89% of it this year so it's gonna take care of itself anyway. I don't recall bringing Ed Reed into the discussion as that has no bearing. My only reference to Reed as it pertains to Byrd is that I can see Pettine wanting to use him like he did Reed in Baltimore; as a playmaking centerfielder to go and get the ball. But I also see why Pettine may not feel Byrd is that kind of player because he lacks the speed to bring what Reed did. We can agree Byrd is a terrific player. We can also agree that the Bills are in dire need of playmakers. Unfortunately, neither preclude the Bills from having those legit reasons not to give him what he's asking. And let's not pretend like we know what he's asking for, either. GO BILLS!!! According to the edia reports he is asking for $9M and they are offering $7M. How about let's not pretend we know what Pettine thinks of him. Presumably Pettine was on board with franchising him for $6.9M. The inference is that someone at OBD thinks $9M is too much because Byrd is not an elite safety. Well there are no elite safeties, and frankly, I would rather they just pay Byrd what he is asking rather than let him go in the hopes of someday burning a high draft pick on an elite safety (whom one one at OBD won't want to pay, either). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 The question isn't whether Byrd is elite. It's whether he is the 'best' int he league. He wants to paid like as the best. I'd be curious if teams that have consistent success often make players the highest paid at their position (outside of QB). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) The question isn't whether Byrd is elite. It's whether he is the 'best' int he league. He wants to paid like as the best. I'd be curious if teams that have consistent success often make players the highest paid at their position (outside of QB). I agree with your framing of the question. So: Name a better free safety in the league right now. Goldson? Maybe. But only maybe. And Byrd has a good argument that he's better (and more versatile - he's performed well in several different defenses, on far worse teams, and as an added bonus he played CB in college). Can you name any other FS who is in Byrd's class? Not Ed Reed - at least not in 2012-2013. Byrd is lucky in the sense that the safety class has weakened. But his agent is going to argue, persuasively, that Byrd currently is the best free safety in the league and should be paid accordingly. The Bills obviously think he's at least in the conversation because they were willing to franchise him. So instead of haggling over an extra $1-$2M a year, they should just pay him. Edited June 9, 2013 by Coach Tuesday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 According to the edia reports he is asking for $9M and they are offering $7M. How about let's not pretend we know what Pettine thinks of him. Presumably Pettine was on board with franchising him for $6.9M. The inference is that someone at OBD thinks $9M is too much because Byrd is not an elite safety. Well there are no elite safeties, and frankly, I would rather they just pay Byrd what he is asking rather than let him go in the hopes of someday burning a high draft pick on an elite safety (whom one one at OBD won't want to pay, either). Once AGAIN, what may some of the reasons be that they don't want to pay Byrd $9m? I mean aside from the tired tripe of "they're just too cheap" or "Littman/Overdorf are meddling?" I thinks it's safe to say Pettine likes Byrd. Why wouldn't he? Look, if the Bills were one All Pro FS away from a SB, I'd rule out most of the other reasons I can think of that they think $9m is too much pay at the moment. But Jarius Byrd ain't gonna put us over the top at the moment. GO BILLS!!! I agree with your framing of the question. So: Name a better free safety in the league right now. Goldson? Maybe. But only maybe. And Byrd has a good argument that he's better (and more versatile - he's performed well in several different defenses, on far worse teams, and as an added bonus he played CB in college). Can you name any other FS who is in Byrd's class? Not Ed Reed - at least not in 2012-2013. Byrd is lucky in the sense that the safety class has weakened. But his agent is going to argue, persuasively, that Byrd currently is the best free safety in the league and should be paid accordingly. The Bills obviously think he's at least in the conversation because they were willing to franchise him. So instead of haggling over an extra $1-$2M a year, they should just pay him. Why don't we make it simple and just assume Byrd is the best FS in the game right now. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Some team is going to pay Byrd very, very well. I haven't heard a good argument yet about why it shouldn't be the Bills. What we forget about these "highest paid" contracts is that: 1) most players don't see the end of them without - getting cut for not living up to them (worst case), - restructuring (best case, means they want to fit others under the cap and he's a team player) - extending (also a good case) 2) somebody else will eclipse it in a matter of time. He is not going to cripple the team, given what we know about their financial and cap position. People want to say that bringing past signings like Mario or Fitz into this is folly; I disagree. What these show is that a big, perhaps even a bad contract can be offered and it won't set the team back any more than anything else. Good teams are the product of good drafting, re-signing your own, and shrewd FA pickups. The Bills need to continue on this track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 July 15: Deadline for franchise tagged players to sign multi-year contract extensions. If no deal is reached by this date, a franchised player can only play on a one-year deal in 2013. This is a key date to keep in mind with Jairus Byrd. http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2013/6/6/4403724/important-dates-for-jairus-byrd-contract-watch-july-15-november-12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 July 15: Deadline for franchise tagged players to sign multi-year contract extensions. If no deal is reached by this date, a franchised player can only play on a one-year deal in 2013. This is a key date to keep in mind with Jairus Byrd. http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2013/6/6/4403724/important-dates-for-jairus-byrd-contract-watch-july-15-november-12 Nov 12th.....(10 games would have already been played) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Nov 12th.....(10 games would have already been played) He will miss out on his over $400,000 weekly paycheck.I doubt he misses any games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 July 15: Deadline for franchise tagged players to sign multi-year contract extensions. If no deal is reached by this date, a franchised player can only play on a one-year deal in 2013. This is a key date to keep in mind with Jairus Byrd. http://www.buffaloru...-15-november-12 Nov 12th.....(10 games would have already been played) He will miss out on his over $400,000 weekly paycheck.I doubt he misses any games. In other words, if he made that play it would cost him $4 million. How long it would it take him to make that up if he eventually signed long term for 5 years and $40 million? What might that do to his negotiation leverage if he only played 6 games this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts