KeisterHollow Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I'd like to add - when I look over that list of QB's drafted in the last 10 plus years, I see an average of about 2 quality starters in each year, until the last 2, which produced 4 or 5 good QB's per draft. I also noted that the "running QB" really began with Vince Young. After that we saw Cam newton, Kaepernick, Griffin, and Wilson - and the trend will continue on that front. I think the success of these QB's lately, coming out of college, hinges on the fact that offenses in the NFL are doing other things with their QB's than just having them drop back and throw. Plays are designed to allow the read option, the QB designed run plays, the scramblers, even, like Rothlisberger, all these running QB's I think MASK their otherwise lesser abilities in passing (not the case with all of them, as some are very good passers, too). My point is this: QB's who aren't necessarily purely great pocket passers can succeed with other skills - mobility and athleticism. So, I think the trend continues this year, too, and we end up seeing 4 or more QB's from this draft starting and finding success, if not at first, in a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I'd like to add - when I look over that list of QB's drafted in the last 10 plus years, I see an average of about 2 quality starters in each year, until the last 2, which produced 4 or 5 good QB's per draft. I also noted that the "running QB" really began with Vince Young. After that we saw Cam newton, Kaepernick, Griffin, and Wilson - and the trend will continue on that front. I think the success of these QB's lately, coming out of college, hinges on the fact that offenses in the NFL are doing other things with their QB's than just having them drop back and throw. Plays are designed to allow the read option, the QB designed run plays, the scramblers, even, like Rothlisberger, all these running QB's I think MASK their otherwise lesser abilities in passing (not the case with all of them, as some are very good passers, too). My point is this: QB's who aren't necessarily purely great pocket passers can succeed with other skills - mobility and athleticism. So, I think the trend continues this year, too, and we end up seeing 4 or more QB's from this draft starting and finding success, if not at first, in a few years. I hope that you are right and that Buffalo has one of them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I heard (not certain) that Marrone wants to run a West Coast offense, which I also heard (again, not certain) that Barkley is best suited for such a scheme. Could happen. that's what I was thinking, not that I want Barkley. On a side note this has got to be one of the worst QB drafts in awhile. Usually I can hone in a guy and be confident that he'll be good but this year I've jumped from QB to QB not sure any of these guys will be good. If we want the Lockers and Ponders of the world then this draft is for us but I want a lot more than that. Maybe next year we can get one but that means we have to suck again which seems intolerable at this point or mortgage the farm to move up. Am I the only one who gets what being a QB from USC means? Rob Johnson anyone? Mark Sanchez? Any takers? School is no indication of ability. All those QBs suck but Palmer was good and the new kid Max Wittek looks promising, so judge the player not the school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 Too bad no one was talking about the new staff in the thread, Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrobot Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 Yds/Attempt, best 2 years (avg): Manuel 9.0, McCarron 8.72, Wilson 8.66, Smith 8.23, Barkley & Klein 8.2, Jones 7.82, Nassib 7.24, Glennon 6.95 Best year's TD:INT Ratio: 10.0 McCarron, 7.0 Geno Smith, 5.58 Barkley, 4.0 Wilson, 3.16 Jones, 2.8 Bray, 2.6 Nassib, 2.6 Glennon QB's in 2013 Draft with >143 QB Rating more than one year: 3 yrs: Geno Smith, EJ Manuel, Tyler Wilson, McCarron. 2 yrs: Bray-Barkley-Jones I'll take one QB in RD 1-3: Smith if available in RD1, Jones over Nassib in RD2, and Manuel or Bray in RD3. I'll develop another QB in RD7 or UDFA: Florence or Doege in RD7, or Pachall-Dysert-Sorensen in UDFA. 1 5 Geno Smith 1 12 Matt Barkley 1 32 Tyler Wilson 2 43 Mike Glennon 2 48 Ryan Nassib 2 49 Landry Jones 3 73 E.J. Manuel 3 75 Tyler Bray (Jr.,decl) 3 86 Collin Klein 3 88 Aaron Murray (Jr.) 4 108 Matt Scott 4 120 Logan Thomas (Jr.) 5 159 Brendon Kay 7 199 Nick Florence 7 203 Seth Doege 7 208 Zach Mettenberger (Jr.) U 227 Keith Price (Jr.) U 239 Casey Pachall (suspJr.) U 240 Colby Cameron U 246 Jordan Rodgers U 254 Zac Dysert U 255 Taylor Martinez (Jr.) U 274 Brad Sorensen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 Yds/Attempt, best 2 years (avg): Manuel 9.0, McCarron 8.72, Wilson 8.66, Smith 8.23, Barkley & Klein 8.2, Jones 7.82, Nassib 7.24, Glennon 6.95 Best year's TD:INT Ratio: 10.0 McCarron, 7.0 Geno Smith, 5.58 Barkley, 4.0 Wilson, 3.16 Jones, 2.8 Bray, 2.6 Nassib, 2.6 Glennon QB's in 2013 Draft with >143 QB Rating more than one year: 3 yrs: Geno Smith, EJ Manuel, Tyler Wilson, McCarron. 2 yrs: Bray-Barkley-Jones I'll take one QB in RD 1-3: Smith if available in RD1, Jones over Nassib in RD2, and Manuel or Bray in RD3. I'll develop another QB in RD7 or UDFA: Florence or Doege in RD7, or Pachall-Dysert-Sorensen in UDFA. Wow 'stro...daughter goes to OU so I've seen Jones in person several times and seen him on the tube most other weeks. I wish I could give you more than he "doesn't have it," but that's what I've got. I have zero confidence in his ability to be a prime NFL starting QB. Conversly, the wifey went to SU so I also watched many of Nassib's games. I saw him improve greatly and think he's a much better athlete than Jones. I pray the Bills don't go this (Jones) direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 Nassib is going to be gone by the end of round one, and everyone knows the Bills want him. They had better take him at #8 if they truly believe in him. If he turns into a star, everyone will be happy and nobody will complain about a "reach." If he sucks as a pro, there will be no less heat to take for the pick if you spend multiple picks to get back into the first to take him later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I'll develop another QB in RD7 or UDFA: Florence or Doege in RD7, or Pachall-Dysert-Sorensen in UDFA. So many talk about the "developmental" QB. What does "develop" a QB mean? It surely doesn't mean take a guy that does not have the physical talent/skills to play at the NFL level and "teach" him to be a star. I think "developing" a QB is a misnomer. What it really means is: take a shot on some guy mid-to-late in the draft and get lucky that everyone mis-evaluated him (ie, he is way better than anyone thought) and then take credit for "developing" him. To be clear, I think that coaching and experience do play some important role in QB play, but I don't think that you can "coach up" a guy that doesn't have "it". "It" consists of at least a minimal level of NFL physical skills and a bunch of intangibles that are very difficult to assess including: leadership, work-ethic, desire, toughness, quick-decision making, "game intelligence", confidence and probably some other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 If he sucks as a pro, there will be no less heat to take for the pick if you spend multiple picks to get back into the first to take him later and the number one consideration when picking a QB should be is what will the fans think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transient Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I really dont understand how im in the minority around here in liking Barkley. He has a great deep ball and good zip on quick throws like the slant. He also has some Big Ben in him. Watch play at 4:17 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4SfjfEyBgc If the part about Big Ben is true, I'm betting it was not consensual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 It's such an incredible crap shoot. I find it so amusing that people on here are certain of who is and isn't going to be a good pro. I have no idea myself. They're going to take a QB in rds 1 or 2 and whoever they take I will get very excited about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I heard (not certain) that Marrone wants to run a West Coast offense, which I also heard (again, not certain) that Barkley is best suited for such a scheme. Could happen. IMHO...No matter what Offense Marrone wants to run, there will be a QB better suited than Barkley for said Offense...I'm not a big Barkley fan...But I do think he's a tough kid and a decent leader...To me at least, Barkley will end up having a similar career to Fitz...Just with a lot more hype... If the part about Big Ben is true, I'm betting it was not consensual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I don't know why, but I've somehow convinced myself to a 95% degree of confidence that the Bills will NOT select Nassib in the first round. It's too obvious. I think they're going to keep talking him up to anyone who listens, and then go Wilson, Dysert, or someone else at #8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I don't know why, but I've somehow convinced myself to a 95% degree of confidence that the Bills will NOT select Nassib in the first round. It's too obvious. I think they're going to keep talking him up to anyone who listens, and then go Wilson, Dysert, or someone else at #8. I'm with you, the same thing has crossed my mind. If they pick him and he isn't the starter from day one the naysayers will be all over Marrone. Heck some already are over his coaching hires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted January 15, 2013 Share Posted January 15, 2013 I don't know why, but I've somehow convinced myself to a 95% degree of confidence that the Bills will NOT select Nassib in the first round. It's too obvious. I think they're going to keep talking him up to anyone who listens, and then go Wilson, Dysert, or someone else at #8. Taking Nassib is way over-hyped. Pete Carroll coached at USC, yet he didn't go trade for Matt Leinart or Matt Cassell. Chan Gailey coached a bunch of players at GT, yet they didn't draft Stephen Hill (or any other GT player that I know of). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Concrete Buffalo Feet Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 I just want this franchise turned around so I'll let the coaches and front office do their jobs and make their choices and I'll take the wait and hope approach. With that being said... After watching the coaching hires of Marrone I see Nassib being the pick at 8. He seems to like familiarity and Nassib fits the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Wow 'stro...daughter goes to OU so I've seen Jones in person several times and seen him on the tube most other weeks. I wish I could give you more than he "doesn't have it," but that's what I've got. I have zero confidence in his ability to be a prime NFL starting QB. Conversly, the wifey went to SU so I also watched many of Nassib's games. I saw him improve greatly and think he's a much better athlete than Jones. I pray the Bills don't go this (Jones) direction. Totally agree...Would not touch Landry Jones with a ten foot pole...Something is missing from that kid...I don't think he's got the fire... On the other hand I like Nassib a lot...Just seems to be more of a gamer and did continue to improve... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 If Marrone is smart, go get the young guy and let him get his experience in year 1. The expectations are not as high like they will be in years 2 & 3 of his tenure. I don't care who it is, Glennon, Nassib, Wilson...pick one or two and let the best one play in 2013. If Marrone is smart, he fends off the pressure to draft a QB, and goes HARD on LB, S, and SS..... These positions are the buried treasure in this year's draft. If he's smart, he goes after a veteran who may be looking for a new home. Matt Moore, Matt Flynn, -VINCE YOUNG! IMO, a smart guy takes a chance on a young QB prospect NO EARLIER than Rds. 5-7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 If Marrone is smart, he fends off the pressure to draft a QB, and goes HARD on LB, S, and SS..... These positions are the buried treasure in this year's draft. If he's smart, he goes after a veteran who may be looking for a new home. Matt Moore, Matt Flynn, -VINCE YOUNG! IMO, a smart guy takes a chance on a young QB prospect NO EARLIER than Rds. 5-7 How many 5-7th rounder QBs are successful in this league and taken their teams to multiple playoff appearance. From the teams that made the playoffs this year: AFC Brady - 6th Rd Manning - 1st overall pick Flacco - 1st Rd Dalton - 2nd Rd Schaub - 3rd Rd Luck - 1st overall pick NFC Kaepernick - 2nd Rd Rodgers - 1st Rd Wilson - 3rd Rd Ryan - 1st Rd (3rd overall) RGIII - 1st Rd (2nd overall) Ponder - 1st Rd I don't see any 4th to 7th Rounders in that group of QBs except for the immortal Brady. Other successful QBs who did not make it to the playoffs this year: Drew Brees - 2nd rd Ben Roethelisberger - 1st Rd Cutler - 1st Rd Vick - 1st Rd Manning - 1st Rd (1st overall) The bottom feeder teams are at the bottom because they do not have a qualified QB on their team. These include Buffalo, Jax, Jets, KC, Oakland etc. I just want this franchise turned around so I'll let the coaches and front office do their jobs and make their choices and I'll take the wait and hope approach. With that being said... After watching the coaching hires of Marrone I see Nassib being the pick at 8. He seems to like familiarity and Nassib fits the bill. Too early to make this prediction. We still have the Free Agency and the Combine to go. The draft is still 3 1/2 months away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 How many 5-7th rounder QBs are successful in this league and taken their teams to multiple playoff appearance. From the teams that made the playoffs this year: AFC Brady - 6th Rd Manning - 1st overall pick Flacco - 1st Rd Dalton - 2nd Rd Schaub - 3rd Rd Luck - 1st overall pick NFC Kaepernick - 2nd Rd Rodgers - 1st Rd Wilson - 3rd Rd Ryan - 1st Rd (3rd overall) RGIII - 1st Rd (2nd overall) Ponder - 1st Rd I don't see any 4th to 7th Rounders in that group of QBs except for the immortal Brady. Other successful QBs who did not make it to the playoffs this year: Drew Brees - 2nd rd Ben Roethelisberger - 1st Rd Cutler - 1st Rd Vick - 1st Rd Manning - 1st Rd (1st overall) The bottom feeder teams are at the bottom because they do not have a qualified QB on their team. These include Buffalo, Jax, Jets, KC, Oakland etc. I agree with the part about us being bottom-feeders, but i think it's because of our LOUSY decision making in moment-of-truth situations. -If we were serious about getting a blue-chip rookie QB, we SHOULD have went hard after one last NFL draft. -We didn't. That was our shot, and we didn't get it done. -No doubt Buddy has taken some heat for it. So, in response to that, what does he do? THE EXACT WRONG THING. -Reach for a franchise QB that SIMPLY ISN'T THERE. What's so terrible about this: - Re-up our LB corp this draft, along with our SS, and DE (Mark Anderson's) position... Take a big, strong, physical reciever (The opposite of TJ Graham), that can go up and compete for balls... Pick up a VETERAN QB who can impart some leadership, and preparation to the 2013 Bills rookie class. (Also win us some games!) Then, if you want to, you can take a young prospect in later rounds. You never know. with a year or so of observation, he may turn into the next Brady. The important thing to me, is for us to hit the ground running in '13.... WIN NOW. -Why bog ourselves down with the agonizing process of breaking-in a new QB? As far as I can see, there are no Lucks, RG3's or R. Wilson's in this year's draft. IMO, reaching for one will only end in disappointment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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