Please tell me you guy are not serious about

[stuckincincy]

i didnt realize this was bring-your-daughter-to-post-on-the-board day.

 

my brother's roommate's girlfriend's cousin says he smells funny! OMG, gag me with a spoon!

 

tell me, how do you feel about Jim Kelly?

 

That was a snotty post, Dank...

[DrDawkinstein]

Wow, I'm really glad I'm not You

 

good one. so how do you feel about Jim Kelly?

[DrDawkinstein]

That was a snotty post, Dank...

 

no offense was meant towards the daughters of posters.

[BUFFALOTONE]

What does your reply even mean with regard to the Big Ben scenario?

He was accused of something, not found guilty. There is a difference.

[BUFFALOTONE]

No ,it makes you one

Good come back tool, read the reason for the response. He is ACCUSED of sexual assault, not found guilty by a jury of his peers. Once more ACCUSED.

 

Is he a MORON for putting himself in the situation?YEP. That is why I wrote the previous statement.

[Mr. ChumChums]

I am completely appalled by some of the people here that want him. I would become a steeler fan the day we traded for that loser. I have met him and hated him then. I dated a girl that lived with a girl he used to "mess around with" and she told me that he thinks that he is irresistable to every woman. He is the biggest loser I have ever met hands down and I would puke if the bills grabbed him. Pittsburgh is trying so hard to rid themselves of this trash and you want him. Unbelievable. I lose total respect for every single one of you that would welcome him

 

In all fairness, NONE of us know what really happened.

 

What we DO know is that yes, he is an ass and a douche - from first hand accounts and general consensus around the city of Pittsburgh.

Yes, he is a bit immature - shown by the fact that he still parties like a frat boy in nightclubs.

Yes, he did have sexual relations with those women.

 

However, how does all this make him an automatic scumbag? The 2 rape and sexual assault allegations? Possibly. However, keep in mind, that for 1 of those, the accusing women's own FRIEND claimed in a signed affidavit that her friend was NOT raped, and that it was COMPLETELY consensual She even goes on to say that her friend wanted to "bump into him again."

 

So here are my thoughts. BR is an immature douche who can't help partying it up in nightclubs getting drunk with women. He takes advantage of his money and his fame, and uses that to help himself get with more girls. However, there is a STRONG possibility that all these allegations are just gold-digging whores going after his money because he gave them a little bit of attention. I'm not saying that'st he case, but it's a possibility.

 

As a recent college graduate, I can understand the appeal of using money and fame to go out with your boys, and hit the clubs, hoping to nail loose drunk women. In fact, I have had my share of those nights (minus the money and fame). However, like most people, I graduated from that lifestyle and understand that as a working professional, I have a responsibility to ACT MY PART.

 

So far, BR has not understood the importance of acting his part. The fame, money, and limelight have seemingly gone to his head. At this point, the only thing that should be a concern of ours, should be his MATURITY. If he truly understands what he must do from this point forward, I say there isn't a question that we should pull the trigger on this deal. However, if that really is the case, then Pittsburgh won't be trying to trade him.

 

If he still DOES have maturity issues, and if our front office still sees him as a maturity risk, then no dice, I don't want him, and neither should anybody else, for more than a 2nd or 3rd rounder.

 

I honestly see Buddy and Chan's actions as messages on what they believe. If they don't want BR, then we have our answer. If they do, then it's all about a new story for the Bills.

 

GO BILLS!

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

I understand there is a league wide issue that no team can field a lineman willing to play center for Big Ben...

[seq004]

I think they're stupid not to be at least interested in a trade for him. He's a proven pro bowl QB. Yes, he has some issues but I would still send the Steelers our 1st for him.

[LynchMob23]

If Pittsburgh doesn't want him, and Whaley, who just came from Pittsburgh doesn't, why should we?

[JohninMinn.]

this is clearly the best place for him. no way these women are going to tempt him...

 

[lets_go_bills]

Pittsburg wants to unload a super bowl winning franchise QB but look at the guy he is a total sleezebag......

 

You seriously want this guy doing this crap in Buffalo

 

I dont care if he came for a 5th round pick.....

 

I DONT WANT HIM

 

I'm with you. Horrible person.

[Quester74]

I would take Roethlisberger in a minute -- and stop calling it "rape" he has not been convicted of such crime!

 

Uh huh.. and OJ's not a murderer.

[dave mcbride]

As do I. Which is the same reason I will never root for any Duke team... because those lacrosse players are total scum bags rapists!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

PS: TRADE FOR BIG BEN

Right. Because charges of rape are usually false. Especially when drunk hellraising a-holes with mullets are involved. Keep maintaining the illusion.

[Simon]

If he still DOES have maturity issues, and if our front office still sees him as a maturity risk, then no dice, I don't want him.....

 

I honestly see Buddy and Chan's actions as messages on what they believe. If they don't want BR, then we have our answer.

 

This is very accurate.

[dave mcbride]

i didnt realize this was bring-your-daughter-to-post-on-the-board day.

 

my brother's roommate's girlfriend's cousin says he smells funny! OMG, gag me with a spoon!

 

tell me, how do you feel about Jim Kelly?

You really, really want the Bills to win a Super Bowl, don't you? Newsflash: in the grand scheme of things, it ain't that important.

 

BR is an ass. As was Kelly, mind you, but I do think he was a lesser violator than Roethlisberger. I still don't know why Kelly missed a couple of games after his horrible game on Monday night in Pitt in 1996. The team said it was a "muscle pull", but he walked off the field pretty easily that night. There were rumors about domestic violence as you may recall.

 

The point is the alleged sins of a guy in the nineties don't legitimate the (alleged) ugly behavior of people now. That's a fool's argument.

[DrDawkinstein]

You really, really want the Bills to win a Super Bowl, don't you? Newsflash: in the grand scheme of things, it ain't that important.

 

yes, that is why i have registered a user name on a Bills board. i really do want the Bills to win a super bowl some day.

 

i have PLENTY of good people and role models in my life. i dont care if the athletes who play for the Bills don't know how to find girls who will keep their mouths shut. the players' personal lives mean almost nothing to me. and if Buffalo was a winning team (like it was in the 90s), you'd be saying the same thing (like you were in the 90s).

 

you say the Bills winning a Super Bowl isn't important "in the grand scheme of things". tell me, how are the personal affairs of some football player i will never personally know important to me or anyone else here? to the point that i would cross over and consider their personal life meaningful to mine in any way? how do the sexual relations of Ben Rothlisberger make any difference in your or my life? answer: they dont.

 

here's what im here to worry about:

can the guy play football? he has 2 super bowl rings so yes

would he improve the Buffalo Bills? yes, drastically

 

he has not been convicted, or even charged, of any crime. even Michael Vick, a CONVICTED FELON is back playing and better than anyone we have on our roster. time to build a bridge and get over yourself as a fan. people do all sorts of messed up things in their lives. we dont need to know about every single incident, and "in the grand scheme of things" they don't matter anyways. not nearly as much as a Super Bowl victory would mean to the city of Buffalo and everyone who lives there, or who has lived there.

 

BR is an ass. As was Kelly, mind you, but I do think he was a lesser violator than Roethlisberger.

 

as long as you THINK so... dont you think the "information age" has a bit to do with this? do you really think if twitter, and camera phones, and even this message board was around in the early 90s that Kelly and Co. would have been as loved as they were? the answer is no.

 

The point is the alleged sins of a guy in the nineties don't legitimate the (alleged) ugly behavior of people now. That's a fool's argument.

 

agree completely. im not trying to say it is OK. but there are a large number of people here who will bash one person, and worship another, both of which committed the same level of ugly behavior. you have posters in this thread that say if we brought on "someone like BR" that it would be the end of the franchise and they would stop being a Bills fan. all i'm doing is pointing out that we've HAD someone like BR on the team before and he is one of the most beloved players in team history.

 

 

 

what it comes down to is getting your nose out of a person's personal life, and being a fan. a fan of the GAME. not necessarily the person. people are people. if BR or JK want to be a royal prick in real life, it does not (and should not) effect me one bit.

[1B4IDie]

You really, really want the Bills to win a Super Bowl, don't you? Newsflash: in the grand scheme of things, it ain't that important.

 

BR is an ass. As was Kelly, mind you, but I do think he was a lesser violator than Roethlisberger. I still don't know why Kelly missed a couple of games after his horrible game on Monday night in Pitt in 1996. The team said it was a "muscle pull", but he walked off the field pretty easily that night. There were rumors about domestic violence as you may recall.

 

The point is the alleged sins of a guy in the nineties don't legitimate the (alleged) ugly behavior of people now. That's a fool's argument.

You keep posting as if you're an authority on what happened but you clearly haven't bothered to read any of the reports.

 

let me help you.

 

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years...lisberger3.html

 

She never said she was raped in her own hand written statement.

[DrDawkinstein]

Right. Because charges of rape are usually false. Especially when drunk, self-conscious, gold digging, females are involved.

 

now this statement is correct.

[MRW]

You keep posting as if you're an authority on what happened but you clearly haven't bothered to read any of the reports.

 

let me help you.

 

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years...lisberger3.html

 

She never said she was raped in her own hand written statement.

You do realize that whether or not it was rape doesn't hinge on whether she actually wrote the word "rape", don't you? Thanks for the link, I read several pretty consistent accounts of Ben taking advantage of a drunk college girl. Why you're linking it as a defense is beyond me.

[MRW]

now this statement is correct.

In case anyone's is looking for an explanation of why a rape accuser might not want to go forward with testifying in a rape trial, look no farther than the good Dr.'s "clever" alteration of what he quoted.

[1B4IDie]

You do realize that whether or not it was rape doesn't hinge on whether she actually wrote the word "rape", don't you? Thanks for the link, I read several pretty consistent accounts of Ben taking advantage of a drunk college girl. Why you're linking it as a defense is beyond me.

Its a defense because he clearly did not rape her. Two drunk people having sex is how a great percentage of people in Buffalo were conceived.

[DrDawkinstein]

In case anyone's is looking for an explanation of why a rape accuser might not want to go forward with testifying in a rape trial, look no farther than the good Dr.'s "clever" alteration of what he quoted.

 

unfortunately, this is what we are faced with in today's society. look no further than Duke lacrosse, or Ben's first accuser. heck, it even happened to a kid on the soccer team when i was at Fredonia back in the late 90s. Girl said the soccer team raped her, she ruined a couple lives, then it turned out she was lying to get back at a boyfriend.

 

it's unfortunate that all of these females who try to take advantage of people for their own gain ruin it for actual victims.

 

if you want to be mad at someone for this, be mad at the females who cry wolf for personal gain.

[Richard Longwood]

unfortunately, this is what we are faced with in today's society. look no further than Duke lacrosse, or Ben's first accuser. heck, it even happened to a kid on the soccer team when i was at Fredonia back in the late 90s. Girl said the soccer team raped her, she ruined a couple lives, then it turned out she was lying to get back at a boyfriend.

 

it's unfortunate that all of these females who try to take advantage of people for their own gain ruin it for actual victims.

 

if you want to be mad at someone for this, be mad at the females who cry wolf for personal gain.

 

So b/c some wacked out stripper cried rape on the Duke team and a few other girls cry rape on occasion, you arbitrarily assume any time an athlete is accused he's innocent and she's (fill in the blank)?

 

After everything that's come out, it's not clear that he raped her, and it's not clear that he didn't. What is clear is that he's a sleazy dude, who despite having all the advantages, stoops to methods that would be frowned upon when employed by the desperate, and are down right dispicable coming from a man of his stature. And that's the best case scenario.

 

I realize that you have spent your lonely life eluded by the sexual attraction of women which has clearly led to a frustrated bitterness that clouds your thought, but try not to paint with such broad strokes.

[Buftex]

I have mentioned this in a few posts, and nobody has responded, so I will try again... our own HOF wide receiver, James Lofton was accused of much the same as what Roethlisberger is accused of, and as I recall, there was much more damning evidence against him, than there was Roethlisberger in either of his cases, including witnesses, and Lofton's own statements. This is the reason this great talent was shipped from Green Bay to Oakland, and eventually Buffalo. Of course, Lofton found god, caught a ton of passes, and all was/is forgotten...

 

Nobody brings it up, and many here still worship the guy, using his name and image as their identity. He is considered by nearly everyone as a "class act"...he was elected to the NFL Hall of Fame... why didn't this matter to anyone then? Why so much now?

[DrDawkinstein]

So b/c some wacked out stripper cried rape on the Duke team and a few other girls cry rape on occasion, you arbitrarily assume any time an athlete is accused he's innocent until proven guilty?

 

no, not just because of the Duke case. because i dont just assume everyone is guilty without knowing the facts. which NONE OF US will ever really know. i dont assume he is innocent either. i just say "that's unfortunate for everyone involved" and let the system and process figure it out. i dont live in the celebrity soap opera world the 24 news stations would like us to. so get over it and move on.

 

it's none of our business. if he was convicted, then i'd say go ahead and judge the guy as being a scumbag. but so far, the first allegation has already been PROVEN as bull **** by the girl's friend. and we'll never really know what happened with this second case. we DO know that she was not forced to go into the bathroom with BR. we DO know she was too drunk to even remember if they had sex or not. only the two of them will ever know what really happened, and given their level of intoxication, THEY will never really know either.

 

build a bridge and get over it. the only thing he is definitely guilty of is being a douche-bag. do you think he's the FIRST douche-bag to play football? how do you feel about James Lofton? Jim Kelly?

[Richard Longwood]

no, not just because of the Duke case. because i dont just assume everyone is guilty without knowing the facts. which NONE OF US will ever really know. i dont assume he is innocent either. i just say "that's unfortunate for everyone involved" and let the system and process figure it out. i dont live in the celebrity soap opera world the 24 news stations would like us to. so get over it and move on.

 

it's none of our business. if he was convicted, then i'd say go ahead and judge the guy as being a scumbag. but so far, the first allegation has already been PROVEN as bull **** by the girl's friend. and we'll never really know what happened with this second case. we DO know that she was not forced to go into the bathroom with BR. we DO know she was too drunk to even remember if they had sex or not. only the two of them will ever know what really happened, and given their level of intoxication, THEY will never really know either.

 

build a bridge and get over it. the only thing he is definitely guilty of is being a douche-bag. do you think he's the FIRST douche-bag to play football? how do you feel about James Lofton? Jim Kelly?

 

I like the way you said you don't follow the "soap opera" and then cite all the details.

 

I don't remember Jim Kelly the sexual predator, and I don't really give a !@#$ about James Lofton. I do think that anyone who wants to cheer for guy like Rothlesberger (and I did cheer for him before this) is a dick and probably has a degenerate mother who raised him to have disdain for women.

[CodeMonkey]

So b/c some wacked out stripper cried rape on the Duke team and a few other girls cry rape on occasion, you arbitrarily assume any time an athlete is accused he's innocent and she's (fill in the blank)?

No. But at the same time you can not automatically assume that anyone, athlete or otherwise, is guilty just because a girl says so either. It is obvious that many people here made such an assumption immediately upon hearing the story.

[K Gun Special]

were talking about a FOOTBALL player not someone who is gonna take your daughter on a date.

 

Some of you need to get off your high horses, stop pontificating, and talk football. He's been convicted of nothing and until then shut it.

 

Anyone who has seen our legal system knows a lot of people are accused of things, some guilty, some not.

[Richard Longwood]

were talking about a FOOTBALL player not someone who is gonna take your daughter on a date.

 

Some of you need to get off your high horses, stop pontificating, and talk football. He's been convicted of nothing and until then shut it.

 

Anyone who has seen our legal system knows a lot of people are accused of things, some guilty, some not.

 

And I don't hear anyone saying to lock him up and throw away the key either, bright boy.

 

Some of us don't get off on the idea of cheering for a scum bag like Ben. I realize that as a pathetic no-kitty-getting douche you see no harm in any of this. All of you who defend and want to cheer for this shtbag and don't see what the big deal is should shampoo my crotch.

 

BEST CASE scenario, the guys a dick. Worst case scenario he's a rapist. Most likely he falls somewhere between the two. If you're lame enough that you're willing to support that guy so that a team of men you don't know who wear laundry with your city's name on it, has a better chance of winning then you might want to keep it to your self.

[Meark]

You keep posting as if you're an authority on what happened but you clearly haven't bothered to read any of the reports.

 

let me help you.

 

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years...lisberger3.html

 

She never said she was raped in her own hand written statement.

 

I dunno.. seems pretty clear from that link that he DID take advantage of her. She didn't want the publicity which is why the case was dropped.

[SnakeOiler]

do you guys have any idea what a prick Jim Kelly was back in the day? sure, he may not have been accused of rape, but those were different times. who knows what he got away with. and so far no charges have stuck with Ben.

 

not saying that Ben isnt stupid, but we've had worse on this team. and they are known as "Legends" for the Bills.

 

 

Jim Kelly ?? That was over 20 years ago, times have changed, things are different now.

 

If we pick a QB in round 1, would we be happy if he turns out to be as good a QB as Ben R ? My answer is yes. So you can take the known commodity in Ben R (warts and all), or roll the dice on a QB who is likely to fail based on statistics. Why is that even a question ? I go for the known commodity. I think the NFL WAY overvalues draft picks. Plus, a QB in the Top 10 will probably get a contract at equal or more $$ than Ben ? That is insane.

[Gibran Chandan]

Its a defense because he clearly did not rape her. Two drunk people having sex is how a great percentage of people in Buffalo America were conceived.

 

Fixed - but agreed on the general statement.

 

I'd take Ben over the QBs we have any day.

[SawchukBills]

Pittsburg wants to unload a super bowl winning franchise QB but look at the guy he is a total sleezebag......

 

You seriously want this guy doing this crap in Buffalo

 

I dont care if he came for a 5th round pick.....

 

I DONT WANT HIM

 

If we can get a Santonio Holmes-like deal (5h rounder) for Big Ben... why not??? Big Ben for less than a 1st... how could you not???

[Booster4324]

What I find most telling about Ben's guilt or lack thereof, whatever happened in that bathroom, Pittsburgh (the people who know him best) don't want him anymore.

[DrDawkinstein]

If we can get a Santonio Holmes-like deal (5h rounder) for Big Ben... why not??? Big Ben for less than a 1st... how could you not???

 

because some people apparently think they identify with professional football players at a personal level. when nothing could be farther from the truth. they hold them up to standards that they dont even hold their own children to.

[yall]

unfortunately, this is what we are faced with in today's society. look no further than Duke lacrosse, or Ben's first accuser. heck, it even happened to a kid on the soccer team when i was at Fredonia back in the late 90s. Girl said the soccer team raped her, she ruined a couple lives, then it turned out she was lying to get back at a boyfriend.

 

it's unfortunate that all of these females who try to take advantage of people for their own gain ruin it for actual victims.

 

if you want to be mad at someone for this, be mad at the females who cry wolf for personal gain.

 

I was at SUNY Fredonia when that happened. IIRC she even did their dishes the next day, which was one of the things that got those kids off the hook. What rape victim sticks around the day after and cleans your kitchen?

[John from Riverside]

I have mentioned this in a few posts, and nobody has responded, so I will try again... our own HOF wide receiver, James Lofton was accused of much the same as what Roethlisberger is accused of, and as I recall, there was much more damning evidence against him, than there was Roethlisberger in either of his cases, including witnesses, and Lofton's own statements. This is the reason this great talent was shipped from Green Bay to Oakland, and eventually Buffalo. Of course, Lofton found god, caught a ton of passes, and all was/is forgotten...

 

Nobody brings it up, and many here still worship the guy, using his name and image as their identity. He is considered by nearly everyone as a "class act"...he was elected to the NFL Hall of Fame... why didn't this matter to anyone then? Why so much now?

 

I saw it the other day but did not respond....

 

I did not know this about Lofton.....I dont really worship but in truth all I remember is he was a very good reciever for us

 

Somebody earlier in the thread asked me for a link to Ben R.'s earlier transgressions.....I actually DONT have them.

 

It is the wierdest thing....I will read about something...and then it dissappears. I am either losing my mind or Ben R. is very smart and has PR people covering his @ss

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

At this point I don't care if he drinks baby blood. Can he win? If so, bring him here.

[bills_fan]

unfortunately, this is what we are faced with in today's society. look no further than Duke lacrosse, or Ben's first accuser. heck, it even happened to a kid on the soccer team when i was at Fredonia back in the late 90s. Girl said the soccer team raped her, she ruined a couple lives, then it turned out she was lying to get back at a boyfriend.

 

it's unfortunate that all of these females who try to take advantage of people for their own gain ruin it for actual victims.

 

if you want to be mad at someone for this, be mad at the females who cry wolf for personal gain.

 

 

Exactly my point posting the link to the NY Post article in this thread. Exactly why I posted my little script. Don't always believe the girl. The motivations are not always what you think.

[yungmack]

Sorry, and call me old fashioned. But I draw the line at rape.

And when exactly was he convicted of rape? Or even charged with it?