harmonkillebrew

Makes the draft strategy a little more clear. Character guys and volume over skill and quality.

This thread is about Beane's seeming tendency, across many years, to like big-bodied slower WRs and maybe also slower RBs that run between the tackles. The similarities are there. Is Beane out of step offensively? Is McDermott? The Bills have taken a lukewarm approach to surrounding Josh with explosive weapons, since the Diggs trade. It's been a long standing issue. Gabe was a 4th rounder. That same draft (2020) they drafted AJ Epenesa and Zack Moss in the 2nd and 3rd (eerily similar RB/WR pattern to this year) The next draft it was 2 DEs in the top 2 rounds. There was a glaring WR need this year and it feels like the Bills had the wrong priorities. Didn't make us faster or deeper at WR. I might have changed my tune if they had drafted Franklin or Tez Walker in the 3rd/4th. But to just roll with Coleman seems risky.

It's many factors, but speed is the most reliable. His high jump was not as high as I would have thought. I think his contested catch rate also wasn't super great. I think he'll be like Gabe. If we hadn't traded Diggs, he'd be a good replacement for Gabe on the outside. Can he replace what Diggs used to be before 2nd half of the season, I'm just not convinced. I see you conveniently stopped at 2017, as Tyreek Hill was drafted in the 6th in 2016. Moore seems like a bust but Rice was pretty good as a rookie. Hardman had his moments. Everyone else was Rd 4-6. The one thing I see in that chart is that the Chiefs at least tried. They invested a 1st or 2nd in 4 out of the past 6 years. They're committed to getting weapons for Mahomes. I'm not sure the Bills are.

Robbie Anderson was/is a lanky burner. He ran in the 4.3s (I know its fashionable to dismiss the 40 suddenly, but it still matters as a metric among others) Coleman is much more muscular.... and slower. His split time is very solid and his gauntlet speed was impressive. He should develop into a solid middle of the field target. Some are saying he's a good deep threat because of his jump ball ability but I'm not buying that. CBs are too good in the NFL. Dominating long speed is the only way to beat them long. The Bills passed on some guys, like Worthy, that KC really liked. Are the Bills smarter than KC? We both needed WRs. They chose a fast, shifty guy, we chose a bigger guy with less long speed. We'll see who's right in the end, I guess. I think the difference is probably in offensive philosophy. The Chiefs still believe in big plays and speed. The Bills want to control the ball. I just fundamentally disagree with not trying to be explosive and hit big plays. With a guy like Josh, we need more WRs that can get open quickly on deep-intermediate routes, in addition to the Kincaid and Shakir's we already have on the team to work the short stuff. It's more than just speed. It's also route-running, physicality to beat the press, tracking the ball, and hands on over the shoulder catches. Gabe had a few of those traits, but not the speed. Coleman is similar, but just slower still. Samuel has never been a field stretcher despite the 40 time, probably due to lack of playing strength and maybe tracking.

I'm hopeful Shakir takes the next step. He came on strong at the end, but he had two established WRs taking away the best CBs. He'll now be more of a target. What bothers me is that we don't have a field stretcher anymore. That seems a shame with Josh's howitzer. You'd have thought that after trading Steph and letting Gabe walk that they might have made more of an investment - traded up, drafted two guys, etc... The Diggs trade for a 2025 pick in particular stinks for this year. I guess the plan is to see who Josh can float. Maybe he won't need a #1, but a variety of guys all on the same script.

God, I hope so. Evans is a freak - 6'5" and ran in the 4.5s. He had consistent college production as well - multiple 1,000 yd seasons I think. Coleman should be good, but I hope he doesn't end up like many so college big-bodied WRs that cannot simply overpower and out jump NFL CBs. That's been the record recently. It's now all about guys that get separation.

I'm looking forward to seeing what Samuel does with Josh, but that said he was the 3rd option in Wash and they passed a lot. He had a good year, but he averaged 9.9 yds/catch. He's more a secondary slot guy or competition for Shakir, rather than an outside down the field threat. I'm not upset with the Coleman pick. It's not my favorite. But I'm probably more upset with not doubling down. We needed an influx of youth and our depth is rough.

Agreed. This FO is wasting away Josh's prime years. They need to add a vet WR, but the question is who? not alot left... unless they trade

Speed matters. it's how you measure it effectively is how it's changed. GPS, 10-yd splits, etc.... Coleman's gauntlet drill speed was impressive. But everything I've read on him mentions his big body, contested catch, traits. I've not seen much about separation and certainly not speed. So he falls more into the Benjamin, Funchess, Marques Colston, mode. There are some good players out there with the same skill set. But what's interesting is that Beane really seems to like to draft them, even liked Benjamin so much that he traded a 3rd for him as well (when he got to Buffalo). That's the friggin point. Reading comprehension in decline on this board.

Didn't Beane also draft Devin Funchess? There has long been an assumption that big bodied outside WRs can outmuscle and make contested catches, but that has been debunked. It's separation that produces results, either from speed, quickness, or good footwork/routes. Teams have been going more and more for smaller WRs with great separation skills. Look at who Andy Reid added this offseason - Worthy and Hollywood Brown. People are pretty high on Coleman as a contested catch specialist with great hands, but can he separate consistently? We know Gabe couldn't. I don't know why Beane traded Moss for a guy they never used. He was still on his rookie K. I guess he wants a do-over. I'm not dogging any of these guys as players. I don't know enough about them as a fan. I'm just pointing out what seems to be a trend from Beane that seems old school, out of touch with the league, and counter to what the say themselves. They seem to like/want a plodding, ball-control offense.

All talk. You see the Chiefs and Dolphins, even Ravens adding speed with some measurable success. Then we go out and get slower. Coleman and Davis were both considerably slower than other guys available. Doesn't mean they will fail, but it does track to a Beane tendency that seems to be out of step with the league.

Beane has a real tendency for a certain type of player. Ray Davis is a Zack Moss clone Coleman isn't too far off from Kelvin Benjamin and Devin Funchess. None of those guys panned out. Seems Beane consistently under values speed in skill players. I was hoping we'd come out of this draft faster and more explosive on O, but instead it's more of the usual. Coleman would have been a decent replacement for Gabe. Similar skill set. Is Samuel supposed to be the Diggs replacement? Hard to see us being better on offense. Or defense for that matter. They don't seem to have a vision or plan for getting better than the Chiefs. Feels like a reset year.

You'd think he would have been available by our 2nd 2nd round pick, even our third. Why pass up WRs with better pro traits and then not trade back or pick someone else

Interesting analysis on the 5th year option and 1st v. 2nd rd salaries and new CBA. Seems consensus now is that it's better to pick in the top of the 2nd then in the bottom of the 1st.

I think they like Troy Franklin and think he'll be available in mid-2nd. They'll probably trade back again. It's risky assuming others don't like the same guy. At some point you just have to make your pick and not try to squeeze all the value you can out of where you pick him.

Beane will try to move up, no doubt. He already is trying. If a guy falls even a bit that they like, we know Beane's track record. That said, I think this WR class is so deep, better to trade back and get two guys

totally expect that Diggs compensation to be part of the trade package to move up. Easy justification for Beane. Not sure mortgaging the future to move way up is the right strategy though....

Trade back and get 2 WRs, DT and S in first 4 rounds. Seeing a lot of good WRs going in the 2nd in mocks. Not sure there is much difference between guys you could get in the back half of the 1st and middle of the 2nd

Legette reminds me of AJ Brown. I'd take that any day, but in this draft we can probably trade back and still get him

Interesting how both he and Hines had two (really three) of the most impactful plays in the last 2 years. Yet, both were underutilized, overpaid and on to other teams.

Definitely a youth movement on Offense. Surrounding Josh with guys that have more in the tank and can grow together. Diggs is on the downslope of his career and didn't have many more good years and would likely be a cancer as you say, if the bills weren' force feeding him.

Do we get any cap relief this year? what FA WRs are still available?

Based on his track record, I think Beane always sees DE as a need. I've seen a few mocks giving us DE at #28. There might be good value at that point in the 1st. I'd be surprised if we don't address in the first 3 rounds

We probably will re-sign Shaq at this point. We need someone to play the run. Neither Epenesa nor this guy Toohill are good edge setters.

Didn't Diggs catch 100+ balls again this year? He owns the top...what...4 receiving seasons in Bills history? The guy is good, still good But he needs a better sidekick. Time to invest a 1st in a WR.