OldTimer1960

Point is over Rivers’ career how good have the Chargers been? I’d say pretty good when they have occasionally put good talent around him and not so good when they haven’t. Sure, Their highs have been a bit better than the Bills better seasons, but they hav not really ever been serious SB contenders.

But if the coin comes up tails and the QB is a bust, then what with no 1st next year? Also, Colts haven’t won much even though they have Andrew Luck.

NOBODY doesn’t want a franchise QB. BUT, you have to realize that just because you trade a TON to move up to take one of these guys doesn’t mean that you just locked in someone like Brady, Rodgers or Brees who can just carry a weak supporting cast. IF you are lucky, you get Phillip Rivers who has been very good, but has to have a good supporting cast. Would it be prudent to trade 21, 22, 53 and next year’s 1st for a young Rivers? And if the answer is yes, don’t forget you could also end up with RG3. BTW, note that none of Brady, Rodgers and Brees were high first round picks.

I’m with you. If he is healthy, he is worth far more than you could get in a trade. If he isn’t healthy, you won’t get much in trade.

Yes, and they very likely are not HOFers - maybe very good, but odds are way against HOF level. i am not sure we want to include Mariota with Goff and Wentz. He was pretty bad last year.

It appears to have worked out for Philly, but note that they moved up fro pick 8, not 21. Future draft picks in trades are typically “discounted” by a round per year in the future they are. So look at what Philly gave up: 1, 3 and 4 plus future 1=2,(discount by 1 round)future 2=4(2 years out discounted by 2 rounds). - so equivalent to 1 First 1 second, 1 third and 2 fourths. How do you think the Redskins fans feel about the trade up for Robert Griffin? If they hadn’t also drafted Cousins in the 4th, think how bad they would still be. (Sorry, I obviously didn’t see the post above that is very similar)

I think it is even a bit worse than this. 50% bust probability is about right, but the "other" 50% is probably really 48% "decent to good starter, but can't single-handedly carry a team" and 2% "HOF level team carrying superstar". if that is true, after giving up both firsts a 2nd and maybe next year's 1st, you need to hope you get a good starter and that he doesn't get ruined/run out of town in the next two years when the lack of picks will certainly hinder the ability to put a good team around him. Maybe by year 3 they'll be able to build some talent around him and the team can do well...

+1

I am not a scout, for sure, but I have watched a fair amount of game cut ups and I could make a case for any of the big 5 + Rudolph. I could even get behind Mike White in round 2. i think they all have enough physical talent to do well. What none of us know is how their knowledge of the game and work ethic. Give me the guy of the above that wants it most and can process what he sees the fastest.

I think that is possible, but I’ve been told over and over here that RBs are a dime a dozen and you should never take one before the mid rounds. (To be clear, I disagree with that sentiment).

Funny!

And Goodwin who played well enough for the Niners to get a BIG raise.

I would be VERY depressed if they did that for Foles.

I agree with your statement, I just don’t see how the move suggests that they are trading for Foles.

I agree strongly.

Boy, if you didn’t know that those plays were few and far between....

? How do you draw that conclusion- unless I missed sarcasm ?

Missed that -for what?

I think that the Browns will be much better, but mostly because they already have some good talent and because they have picks 1, 4, 33 and 35. IF they choose not to draft a QB at 1 or 4 (I think that would be dumb), they could draft Saquan Barkley and probably come back with the Norte Dame OG and have the 2 highest rated players in the draft. They also just acquired Jarvis Landry for a pick this year both reported to be less than a 2nd round pick. Now that Bills have their 3rd, must be 4th or later this year. I *could* imagine, but wouldn’t agree with, that Browns plan to hold onto Deshone Kiser and let him decompress behind Taylor for a while. Kiser has a live arm and had some good moments among his bad moments.

Absolutely thrilled with getting the 65th pick for Taylor. I thought that they would get at best a 4th- happily i was wrong.

Well, yes he might be very good. Seriously, even trading up to the top of the draft, you still hope to find a good starter. There are VERY few Bradys, Rodgers and Brees

So the plan is to find the greatest QB of all time and let him single-handedly carry the team? Not very realistic IMHO.

I don't think Foles has somehow "turned a corner" and the "light has gone on" such that he will be a top-10 QB for next several years. Could he be a decent starter for a year or three? Sure, that might be possible. I think he'd probably be lucky to be Andy Dalton level over an extended period of time - that's OK. If they Bills trade a 2nd or more for Foles, they are surely not trading a bunch more to move up for a rookie. The investment in picks would be too great between those two options. If the Bills want to sit tight and see what QB falls to them at 21 and make a value judgment whether that guy is better or worse long-term than Foles, I could see that, but I would not even expect them to use the 21st pick on a rookie QB AND trade a 2nd or more for Foles. I could see it being possible that the Bills do wait to see who is available at 21 and then decide that they don't like those options as possible long-term answers. If that is the case, perhaps, they could then slide a 2nd to Philly for Foles as an interim guy until they can find a good prospect. I would be very hard pressed to say that Foles is worth a 1st round pick when very good veteran players at other positions are being traded for 4th round picks (see Michael Bennett trade).

Could he be a place holder for a year or two? Maybe, but to think he is a long-term answer is, I think, wishful thinking. He had one miracle season then flamed out. His regular season performances this year were not great, but he did get hot in this year’s playoffs. If you believe that his hot streak in the playoffs with a very talented team means that he could carry an under talented team, then I disagree. If the Bills just want someone to hold the position with marginally competent play, he can do that. However, to me you’d want more from the draft picks that you’d need to give Philly for him. Not in my opininion for even a 2nd round pick. I hope that they would laugh at the Eagles request of a 1st round pick plus some.

How many QBs have had the”light come on” after 6 mostly nondescript years - the last 3 as a not-sought-after backup. His career stats can be seen here: http://www.nfl.com/player/nickfoles/2532842/careerstats in his last year as a starter he completed 56% of his passes for 186 yards per game with 7 TDS and 10 Ints. That is below EJ standards.