Football sucks...

[justnzane]

I think it's funny we are getting so worked up trying to prove a crusader wrong. When his sole purpose is to volley a rock into a hornets nest and have fun at the mayhem. If he were here for true rational conversation, he would not present NFL players as mere chumps in the athletic stage. Take for example Ben Johnsons world breaking 1988 100 meter dash. When broken down, he covered the first 40 meters in 4.08 seconds. Bo Jackson fan a 4.12 40, Deion Sanders ran a 4.17, and even our pedestrian Lee Evans managed a 4.31. I would say that those times easily falls into world class stature.

I wouldn't call gettin worked up, i'd call trying to heighten the situation... ie.) half of the crap i say on PPP when Holcomb's Arm is talking. My object is to make this person continuously make an ass out of himself/herself.

[Heels20X6]

I wouldn't call gettin worked up, i'd call trying to heighten the situation... ie.) half of the crap i say on PPP when Holcomb's Arm is talking. My object is to make this person continuously make an ass out of himself/herself.

 

In all my time on the Wall, I've never called anyone a retard before.

Times change.

 

Blue on Blue, you are a retard.

 

Kelly is right, you're lack of logic in dispelling American athletes ability on the global stage via a contrived arguement about team sports (most of your examples citing teams that are put together weeks prior to the event).

 

Canada's dominance in hockey is a result of a nation built upon hockey and nothing else. Save for winter sports, what else are Canadians good at. Our performance in the World Baseball Classic mainly consisted of Canadian athletes trained in the American system (college, farm teams, MLB, etc).

 

Canada plays football. I'm pretty sure the best CFL team couldn't beat the Houston Texans if we played 3 down football.

 

When it comes to basketball, its popularity worldwide grew because of the relative cheapness of the sport. The rest of the world caught up to America because, like soccer, any child can play it if he owns a ball and a hoop. It took years before the world caught up. Remember the 1992 Dream Team? They ran roughshod over everyone. The world watched, focussed, and more than 10 YEARS LATER learned to play the game.

 

The Ryder Cup is a joke. It's stupid match play style golf and no one cares about it but die hard golf enthusiasts. And even they b!tch about the stupid rules.

[Adam]

Don't most European countries have national teams dedicated to the Olympics, or at least athletes much more involved with the Olympics training then America? I also see some of our athletes receive less fundamental training then our European counterparts. For an example of both worlds look no further then the NBA. We bring our NBA players from every team, but they have no clue how work together. I've always felt the NBA champions (excluding foreign players) would field a more competitive team because they're a team.

I can agree with that- and I'll take it one step further- the NCAA Champions would be better as well

[Prognastic]

No one has asked this question so I guess I'll be the first in response to the original post.

 

 

who cares?

[Stanley Lombardi]

no actually he was at an elite top 50 in the world level, as his times were 13.81 and 49.77 for the hurdles. Both of those times easily place him in the top 50 in the world for any given year. Please keep talking out of your ass, i am enjoying it too much.

 

According to the Track and Field News website, Moorman's best time in the 110 high hurdles was around the 250th best time in 2005. There were approximately 114 individual hurdlers (some had multiple performances which exceeded his best) ahead of him:

http://www.iaaf.org/statistics/toplists/in...al=A/index.html

 

The same website puts his 400 meter hurdle time around the 225th best performance of 2005:

http://www.iaaf.org/statistics/toplists/in...al=A/index.html

 

Now unless you can squeeze the numbers 250 and 114 into 50 ( "Both of those times easily place him in the top 50 in the world for any given year," you said above) it seems that you should be mouthing your apology to me, just after you take the crow feathers out of your mouth!

 

You guys are way too easy to beat. You bore me. Bring back the armpit farts, jzmack, but leave the facts alone. The facts just made you look really, really ignorant.

Do you practice this "talking out of your ass" trick (as you mentioned above) every night, like you've been practicing it in this thread? Your dedicated practice has made you world-class at this trick, "easily in the top 50 in any given year!"

 

To quote one of your posts in this thread:

"I wouldn't call gettin worked up, i'd call trying to heighten the situation... ie.) half of the crap i say on PPP when Holcomb's Arm is talking. My object is to make this person continuously make an ass out of himself/herself."

 

You've made an ass out of yourself. I'm embarassed to see anybody get his head handed to him like you just did.

[KD in CA]

I have $5 that this idiot is the reincarnation of b.harami98.

[finknottle]

(Blue on Blue @ Jan 30 2007, 07:10 PM)

Half of Samoa seems to be playing nose tackle in the NFL, and they just heard about the sport yesterday.

Huh? Once again, I'm not afraid to post the evidence for you. Can you find five?

 

Well, he's essentially correct on this point. By population, Fiji/Tonga/Samoa contribute an extraordinary number of athletes to the NFL. A far greater percentage of their populations grow up to become NFL pros than do Americans, which is amazing since the sport it is either unheard of or second to rugby there.

 

My math is correct if there are 6 islanders on NFL rosters. I havn't checked, but I bet the average number is around 10. There's a long tradition that goes from todays Ngata back through Mosi Toutupu and Jack Thompson (aka the Throwin' Samoan).

[Pete]

What about Shaun White, Laird Hamilton, Dave Mira, Travis Prastana, Dan Osman, Bode Miller? Damn, America has some phenomenal athletes!

chirp.....chirp.....chirp......Mr oversensitive PC dude

[justnzane]

You've made an ass out of yourself. I'm embarassed to see anybody get his head handed to him like you just did.

:worthy: Even, if my numbers were a little off, the point was that elite athletes in the NFL could easily be competing in other sports that are internationally contested. ( you have your Renaldo Nehemiahs, and Rod Woodsons, and Bo Jacksons, and Deions... all of these especially the last two could have been considered modern day Thorpes).

[Orton's Arm]

I think it's funny we are getting so worked up trying to prove a crusader wrong. When his sole purpose is to volley a rock into a hornets nest and have fun at the mayhem. If he were here for true rational conversation, he would not present NFL players as mere chumps in the athletic stage. Take for example Ben Johnsons world breaking 1988 100 meter dash. When broken down, he covered the first 40 meters in 4.08 seconds. Bo Jackson fan a 4.12 40, Deion Sanders ran a 4.17, and even our pedestrian Lee Evans managed a 4.31. I would say that those times easily falls into world class stature.

I wouldn't necessarily take those 40 times at face value. Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders ran the 40 before electronic timing became the norm. 40 yard dash times timed by hand . . . tend to be unreliable in ways that maybe give the athlete the benefit of the doubt.

[Chilly]

k, everyone needs to read Holcombs Arm's favorite source, Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

[Orton's Arm]

Our basketball 'dream teams" win internationally, but only in their dreams.

You bring up an excellent point. Consider Lithuania, a country so small many of its own citizens haven't even heard of it. It'd be one thing if Lithuania won an individual sport, like a marathon. You could put that down to random chance. But to win a basketball game, you need to find a number of talented athletes; and how can you possibly expect to find so many talented athletes in so small a country? Lithuania has a population of 3.5 million people, as opposed to 10 million for Los Angeles County.

 

I don't care how much they messed with the rules of basketball. I don't care how unfamiliar those American players were with each other. There's no excuse for a country this big getting beaten by Lithuania in basketball. This isn't soccer, where we can say our attention was elsewhere. This is basketball; a sport we literally invented. Just about every decent-sized American high school has its own basketball team. It's one of the two most highly paid professional sports in this country. We're doing everything anyone can reasonably expect to find basketball talent. And to get owned by a country that's been accidentally used as a postage stamp? That's inexcusable.

[Orton's Arm]

k, everyone needs to read Holcombs Arm's favorite source, Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

Yes, pointing out the flaws with non-electronic 40 times is the very height of troll-like behavior.

Because so much emphasis is placed on the 40, many players or programs claim to have run much faster times than they actually did. Part of this is hype from college programs wishing to promote their players by claiming they have run sensational times in practice. Another significant issue is that many colleges time players by hand, which typically records inaccurately low times. Because human reaction time is slow, this typically takes as much as 0.25 seconds off a player's time.

 

As a general rule, only 40 yard dash times recorded electronically can be considered accurate. This method is used at the NFL Combine. However, because this method usually records correct, slower times, many players in recent years have declined to be timed electronically, preferring to be timed in personal workouts where they think they will get a more favorable time by hand.

[Chilly]

No dumbass, I was saying HE was the troll, not you. I was just saying that you liked to quote wikipedia a lot.

[Orton's Arm]

No dumbass, I was saying HE was the troll, not you. I was just saying that you liked to quote wikipedia a lot.

Well, on the one hand I feel a little silly. On the other I feel relieved that I don't have to spend the next ten pages vainly trying to convince Bungee Jumper and Ramius that electronic 40 times are in fact more accurate than hand-measured 40 yard times. I was sort of expecting something like this:

Me: according to Wikipedia, hand measured 40 yard times are seriously flawed.

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: you're an idiot for quoting Wikipedia. Find real sources which support this.

Me: I've now found quotes from Stanford or Duke or someplace, and they support this.

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: you're an idiot, and you obviously didn't understand a word of those sources, now did you?

Me: Of course I understood them. They said the same thing I've been saying the last ten pages.

Bungee Jumper: What's amazing is he thinks he's actually right. Ramius, let me suck on your penis.

Ramius: Wow! I know you said Holcomb's Arm is a moron, but man. He's a moron! And Bungee Jumper, let me suck on your penis.

Me: Do you or don't you now feel hand measured 40 times are seriously flawed?

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: I've already answered that question. Go back and look it up.

[Chilly]

lawlz

[Pete]

Well, on the one hand I feel a little silly. On the other I feel relieved that I don't have to spend the next ten pages vainly trying to convince Bungee Jumper and Ramius that electronic 40 times are in fact more accurate than hand-measured 40 yard times. I was sort of expecting something like this:

Me: according to Wikipedia, hand measured 40 yard times are seriously flawed.

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: you're an idiot for quoting Wikipedia. Find real sources which support this.

Me: I've now found quotes from Stanford or Duke or someplace, and they support this.

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: you're an idiot, and you obviously didn't understand a word of those sources, now did you?

Me: Of course I understood them. They said the same thing I've been saying the last ten pages.

Bungee Jumper: What's amazing is he thinks he's actually right. Ramius, let me suck on your penis.

Ramius: Wow! I know you said Holcomb's Arm is a moron, but man. He's a moron! And Bungee Jumper, let me suck on your penis.

Me: Do you or don't you now feel hand measured 40 times are seriously flawed?

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: I've already answered that question. Go back and look it up.

Spot on! Except BJ is a little more arrogant and megalomaniac like and Ramius is a bigger asskisser and BJ want to be

[Shamrock]

You mean except for the fact that in almost every spot, the Americans are the guys or team to beat? The Ryder Cup is ALL of Europe. Our basketball teams would kill these teams if we used all our players and they played together as much as their competitors. Think if we use our best baseball players we might win a world competition against another country?

 

Granted, it's okay if we're not the best in certain sports anymore. It's actually good, for everyone. And surely other countries are catching up in a lot of sports, and that's good, too. But it's still not even remotely close as to who has the most and best athletes overall.

 

Australia punches above it's weight per capita for sporting status...

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Well, he's essentially correct on this point. By population, Fiji/Tonga/Samoa contribute an extraordinary number of athletes to the NFL. A far greater percentage of their populations grow up to become NFL pros than do Americans, which is amazing since the sport it is either unheard of or second to rugby there.

 

My math is correct if there are 6 islanders on NFL rosters. I havn't checked, but I bet the average number is around 10. There's a long tradition that goes from todays Ngata back through Mosi Toutupu and Jack Thompson (aka the Throwin' Samoan).

 

Don't forget Seau.

[marauderswr80]

Im willing to bet anything that the Phoenix Suns would stomp ANY national team out there! Thats a fact!

 

These National basketball teams practice together alot more then our NBA players.

 

by the way....hockey sucks.....

[The Poojer]

I think what he meant was the americans were the benchmark for the longest time, except for hockey,

 

You mean except for the fact that in almost every sport, the Americans are the guys who get beat?

[smokinandjokin]

Not to make excuses or even keep this rediculous thread going, but don't underestimate the motivation factor. Right or wrong, the majority of the athletes we send to international events are multi-millionaires, who have been pampered, sponsored, and well-compensated for many years. Travelling abroad to play in a semi-amateur tournament is probably more of a hassle than an honor to them. While most of us mortals can't even comprehend representing your country as being a hassle, it is the way some of these guys look at it.

 

The other nations, conversely, view beating the USA as the major highlight of their tournament, year, lives, etc. A victory often triggers national holidays and celebrations in these countries. The USA literally takes every team's best shot in every event, no matter the sport, no matter the round. The USA is like Notre Dame football or the Yankees...The other teams don't care who's wearing the uniform, they just want to say they beat them. And you can tell by the celebrations after a USA loss what the game meant to their opponent.

 

I can't imagine that beating Argentina in a 'FIBA Basketball' tournament means a whole hell of a lot to Tim Duncan. Not that that line of thinking is right, or that it's an excuse...But it's definitely a factor.

[Cheeseburger in Paradise]

Well, on the one hand I feel a little silly. On the other I feel relieved that I don't have to spend the next ten pages vainly trying to convince Bungee Jumper and Ramius that electronic 40 times are in fact more accurate than hand-measured 40 yard times. I was sort of expecting something like this:

Me: according to Wikipedia, hand measured 40 yard times are seriously flawed.

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: you're an idiot for quoting Wikipedia. Find real sources which support this.

Me: I've now found quotes from Stanford or Duke or someplace, and they support this.

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: you're an idiot, and you obviously didn't understand a word of those sources, now did you?

Me: Of course I understood them. They said the same thing I've been saying the last ten pages.

Bungee Jumper: What's amazing is he thinks he's actually right. Ramius, let me suck on your penis.

Ramius: Wow! I know you said Holcomb's Arm is a moron, but man. He's a moron! And Bungee Jumper, let me suck on your penis.

Me: Do you or don't you now feel hand measured 40 times are seriously flawed?

Bungee Jumper/Ramius: I've already answered that question. Go back and look it up.

 

Absolutely a classic. You have captured the essence of the PPP circle jerk perfectly.

[Kelly the Dog]

I think it's funny we are getting so worked up trying to prove a crusader wrong. When his sole purpose is to volley a rock into a hornets nest and have fun at the mayhem. If he were here for true rational conversation, he would not present NFL players as mere chumps in the athletic stage. Take for example Ben Johnsons world breaking 1988 100 meter dash. When broken down, he covered the first 40 meters in 4.08 seconds. Bo Jackson fan a 4.12 40, Deion Sanders ran a 4.17, and even our pedestrian Lee Evans managed a 4.31. I would say that those times easily falls into world class stature.

This is one of my favorite articles. Ben Johnson, in the Olympics, on steroids, in track shoes, with the wind, running the fastest race ever, covering the first 40 yards in 4.38. It's almost impossible to believe that any football player has ever ran under 4.4, so all 40 times should be considered bullschit.

 

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

[buzzbait1965]

As far as the 40 times it's apples and oranges anyway. 40 meters is about 43 yards.

 

This discussion is pointless anyway, but you can't compare those two stats.

[Kelly the Dog]

As far as the 40 times it's apples and oranges anyway. 40 meters is about 43 yards.

 

This discussion is pointless anyway, but you can't compare those two stats.

The article linked talks about 40 yards, not meters. Ben Johnson ran the first 40 yards in 4.38.

[buzzbait1965]

didn't read the link. I assumed, (yeah I know), they were talking about 40 meters as that's what the track stars run. Alot of those guys are amazing that they don't really slow down that much over the length of the course. The 200 and 400 splits are amazing.

 

Christ they could take me straight to the morgue after running them, assuming I'd even finish.

[Hardy Pyle]

Canadians won the MVP in 3 of the big American sports this year. NHL, MLB, NBA.

[smokinandjokin]

Canadians won the MVP in 3 of the big American sports this year. NHL, MLB, NBA.

 

Who won the gold medal in Snowboard half-pipe, B word?

[Hardy Pyle]

Is that a sport or something you smoke in the Igloo? B word.

[bartshan-83]

I was thinking HogBoy myself....no one is this much of an idiot....

First thing that came to my mind.

 

No one could pull it off like Hogboy in his day...

[bobblehead]

First thing that came to my mind.

 

No one could pull it off like Hogboy in his day...

 

 

All firemen are arsonists.

 

[Matt in KC]

All firemen are arsonists.

 

Not the professionals, just the volunteers. There's one in every volunteer fire department.... actually most of them are sick and just want to be heroes putting out the fires they start.

[Pete]

All firemen are arsonists.

 

Classic hogboy! Does anyone have a link to that thread?

[SACTOBILLSFAN]

I'm an avid Bills fan, but I'm also a fan of international, Olympic-type sports.

 

The other day at work a guy said that the only sport the USA is good at any more on the world stage is football. I said that's because football is not on the world stage...

 

Our golfers get blown away in the Ryder Cup (or whatever it's called where we annually get taken apart by the Europeans).

Our basketball 'dream teams" win internationally, but only in their dreams.

Our baseball could not win an international tournament that began last year.

Our soccer doesn't win

Our hockey doesn't win.

I don't know who our tennis players are anymore.

Track still does well, but not great.

 

Our "great" football athletes are competing against the fewest people in the world for their positions. If we started to open it up to international competition, our "world's greatest athletes" would be selling shoes, or crack, in Des Moines or Kansas City...

"Impossible," we said about our basketball players, but now they are the world's B word.

 

Half of Samoa seems to be playing nose tackle in the NFL, and they just heard about the sport yesterday.

 

Think about this, provincial American slobs and wimps, when you diss soccer players, track athletes, et. al.-- if the entire world cared about football, our hero Nate Clemen$ (or Clement$ or Clement or however he wants it spelled/pronounced) would likely be playing semi-pro in Peoria.

 

Big fish in a small pond.

 

BASEBALL

Just because I have played a higher level of baseball than a lot of people lets look at that "tournament" first. Pitch counts? Are friggin serious? The pitchers in the Little League World Series have less stringent requirements. Its a much different game when you know that you only have to face a Clemens or a Peavy or Willis until the 3rd inning and then face another starter who does not come out of the bullpen, which, if you've played the game, is much much much different than starting a game. That one rule alone, to me, made the World Baseball Classic an utter joke. Many US players didn't participate because of owners, whereas the Japanese teams have always had a little chip on their shoulder and put their best out there just to win, but yet with the exception of Ichiro, the Japanese players have been absolute busts in our game.

 

HOCKEY

Not our sport. Most of our kids do not grow up with sticks in their hands like the Canadian and European teams. If more of our top athletes that chose to play sports like football basketball and baseball chose to play hockey we'd be much more competitive in the international game.

 

SOCCER

Who friggin cares? Again, if you had NFL DBs and WRs and small forwards and guards from the NBA playing soccer we would dominate the game, but America finds this game to be tedious and our kids play sports designed for real men. The speed and physical nature of hoops and football make soccer look like a joke.

 

BASKETBALL

Again, because a lot of players fear injury, they don't participate in a great deal of international competition. Our players remain loyal to their employers, whereas the Euros get paid pittance compared to our guys and love the chance to beat the US and A. To be sure, this sport has boomed outside of the US and even with our very best the gap has closed to almost nothing. Also, the teams from other countries are fielded much differently than ours and play together a lot more often.

 

GOLF

Kelly was right. Europe is not a country moron.

[OCinBuffalo]

As much as I hate to keep this going - I just wanted to add a point. Has anyone considered that these international tournaments(Olympics, etc.) are one gigantic tryout? North American(I'll add the Canadians just to make them feel good ) players in baseball, basketball, hockey and football all get paid a heck of a lot of money. Meaning our guys represent the "Haves", or Major Leaguers . The "big time" players from Croatia(or insert tool country here) are lucky to get paid 1/20th of what our players in all four sports get. They play in leagues that are the equivalent of box lacrosse in their countries(compared to soccer). Meaning the rest of the world's guys represent the "Have nots", or Minor Leaguers.

 

Beyond playing for national pride, the minor leaguers know that this international competition is probably their best possible opportunity to impress NFL,NBA,MLB,NHL scouts/organizations. Meanwhile, why in the hell would some "Have" guy coming up on a contract year want to match up against a "Have not" and potentially get shown up? Or get hurt?

 

Bottom Line: the bigger the deal the "Have Not" guys make out of beating the USA, the more likely they are gonna get a look. The "Have"s essentially gain nothing out of playing for the USA, and the only thing they lose is people on a message board like this one pissing and moaning. Read: no real effect. The fact is I haven't seen attendance/TV revenue go down in any of the leagues we have as a result of losing and international competition.

 

Which leaves the question: If everyone is so upset about USA team losing, why are they still willing to go to its leagues regular season/playoff games?

 

So, basically as a country we are rewarding bad behavior - QED we have no one to blame but ourselves. For my part, I have sworn off the NBA in total until they bring home a gold medal. I turned down free tickets last year and I won't watch it on TV.