Game week thread - Pats at Bills SNF

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, julian said:

He didn’t almost make a play there, he did make a play there hitting Kincaid in the hands, just wish it didn’t have to be so hectic on that final play.

 

 I also like to give Spags some credit.

I give Spags all the credit in the world. He set up that play for the entire season, and then sprung the trap when it REALLY mattered. To get this back on topic, I'll talk about something McDaniels did where he wasted a pretty slick set of play calls on a September game against the hapless Panthers. This happened in the second 2nd quarter with the Pats up 7-6.

1. 2-4 from the 50. Maye under center. In 11 personnel with Stevenson as the single setback. But the player lined up in the slot is RB Antonio Gibson. They put Gibson in motion and run the end around to him for 21 yards.
2. Next Play! 1-10 from the Carolina 29. Exact same formation and personnel grouping, but this time they have RB TreVeyon Henderson out wide. Henderson goes in motion. At the snap they fake the end around to Henderson and give the ball to Stevenson on a delayed inside handoff.  The whole defense bit on the fake. 22 yards down to the Carolina 7.

Beautiful football. But they put all that on film against the Panthers in week 4. I would rather have my OC run that end around every time from that look this early in the season and keep the fake for a key moment in a big game. 

[Dillenger4]

3 hours ago, PaattMaann said:

I think some people here have absolute insane expectations for our defense, especially after just 4 weeks where we have seen two of our best defenders missing multiple games (ed and Milano), our 1st round CB not taken a snap, and two major offseason additions suspended for the first 6 games and not playing. LOL. Oh and we have a top 10 pass defense.

 

FACTS:

McD defenses have ALWAYS been soft on the run, BY DESIGN! We want you to run the ball. Please, run the ball all you want. We would rather have you run than have explosive pass plays. That. Is. What. We. Want! You will never see this defense have big space eating DTs who are dominant against the run, thats not who we draft, thats not who we sign. 

 

Our defense thrives on negative plays and takeaways. We are OK giving up yards because we are hunting for a negative play that puts the opponents behind the sticks at some point and the drive stalls out. We are looking for turnovers, and ALWAYS get them. McD defenses have been causing turnovers regularly since his arrival in Buffalo (and before that). It isn't an accident, it isn't a fluke. It is preached and practiced. It is successful. You know what stat is the most predictive when it comes to wins in the NFL, TURNOVERS!

 

The defense this year has not been as bad as many think. For some reason many have whack expectations. We just held a team to under 20 points and under 300 total yards, under 150 passing yards. You do that and your going to win every game. It does not matter who the opponent was, its a week to week league and every team is going to give us their A+ effort. 

 

 

Against the Patriots

We will do what it takes to win the game. Will they run on us? Sure, see above. Will we get a turnover, and likely a timely one, Sure, see above. It doesn't have to look pretty, it just has to get the job done. 

 

I get what you are saying here. It makes some sense - but I don't think we are going into each game, each week, hoping/praying for a turnover or a negative play at a costly time to ensure that we win. That is not a strategy. Not by a LONG shot.

We need to be better on D. Full. Stop.

Yes, we have a few guys injured and suspended. Hopefully that will help and I think it will. (Although we have no clue how Max will play).

But to say this D is "Hey boys, let em run... we don't care. We will get a TO at some point today and baby, we will win" is just a myth at best.

McD knows we need to play better with a LOT to fix.

[Chandler#81]

 

[finn]

58 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I'm sure Ray Davis can do it.

 

Honestly, have Josh kick it out of shotgun if it's close to midfield.

 

If you have the first team offense out there, the defense has to have their first team defense out there.

 

Josh can kick it down the field because there won't be a return man.  I'm confident he can roll that ball 35-40 yards down the field.

 

5 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

Worth adding that the defense is trying new schematic things.  As they master those parts they will improve and hopefully itll lead to an identity for this defense.  But right now were struggling with things like getting set or getting people on the field.  Some of that is coaching but also think some is cause players are still learning too.

I hope it doesn't end up as one of those "too complicated" scenarios that players never master, relieved only by a new hire the following year who "just let's us play football." 

4 hours ago, Metal Man said:

 

Some of these kinds of stats can be a little misleading though. When you're one of the worst in the league in giving up rush yards it will affect how teams attack you.

 

Then the question is are the Bills actually very good defending against the pass or are opposing teams just not bothering to pass as much against Buffalo because it is so easy to run on them?

Not sure, but I think I'd prefer the Bills be the best against the rush and worst against the pass. 

[YattaOkasan]

2 minutes ago, finn said:

 

I hope it doesn't end up as one of those "too complicated" scenarios that players never master, relieved only by a new hire the following year who "just let's us play football." 

Definitely a risk.  Full mastery seems unlikely in a single season.  Im mostly just hoping they find some identity and settle into an above average defense rather than the average to slightly below average defense they are now.  Few years ago they had a similar situation with Milano being out and they did find the identity as a team that uses dime more often.  I dont think were going with more dime (though not sure our dime usage rate), but gives me hope this staff can figure out how to find an identity for the defense in time for the playoffs.

[PaattMaann]

3 minutes ago, Dillenger4 said:

I get what you are saying here. It makes some sense - but I don't think we are going into each game, each week, hoping/praying for a turnover or a negative play at a costly time to ensure that we win. That is not a strategy. Not by a LONG shot.

We need to be better on D. Full. Stop.

Yes, we have a few guys injured and suspended. Hopefully that will help and I think it will. (Although we have no clue how Max will play).

But to say this D is "Hey boys, let em run... we don't care. We will get a TO at some point today and baby, we will win" is just a myth at best.

McD knows we need to play better with a LOT to fix.

 

They are 100% going into each gameplan with the idea that its OK if they give up yards on the ground. No they arent saying "lets let them gash us in the run" they are saying "if we are going to give up yards, lets let it be on the ground". Without a doubt. Thats why they normally present light boxes and play in nickel. They would LOVE to stop the run, but only if that means stopping the run with 5/6 guys. They will live with it if they cant stop the run with 5/6 guys. 

 

In the NFL you cannot stop everything the offense is going to do, so you make choices, we choose to live with rushing yards against. 

 

They absolutely plan to get negative plays and create turnovers, that is why they game plan and call the game they do. I don't know how anyone can see how we have played defense and think that is not the case. They absolutely plan on creating negative plays and turnovers, they practice it, they call the game that way, it is true. 

 

Yes they want to fix their deficiencies, but that does not mean they will load the box with heavy guys and load up to stop the run. It means they need to fill gaps and have better gap integrity, thats the ideal defensive world they create by their choices, but if that fails, the result is giving up 186 rushing yards to the Saints. Oh well, we won. 

[boyst]

3 minutes ago, PaattMaann said:

 

They are 100% going into each gameplan with the idea that its OK if they give up yards on the ground. No they arent saying "lets let them gash us in the run" they are saying "if we are going to give up yards, lets let it be on the ground". Without a doubt. Thats why they normally present light boxes and play in nickel. They would LOVE to stop the run, but only if that means stopping the run with 5/6 guys. They will live with it if they cant stop the run with 5/6 guys. 

 

In the NFL you cannot stop everything the offense is going to do, so you make choices, we choose to live with rushing yards against. 

 

They absolutely plan to get negative plays and create turnovers, that is why they game plan and call the game they do. I don't know how anyone can see how we have played defense and think that is not the case. They absolutely plan on creating negative plays and turnovers, they practice it, they call the game that way, it is true. 

 

Yes they want to fix their deficiencies, but that does not mean they will load the box with heavy guys and load up to stop the run. It means they need to fill gaps and have better gap integrity, thats the ideal defensive world they create by their choices, but if that fails, the result is giving up 186 rushing yards to the Saints. Oh well, we won. 

this is why i am encouraged with the remainder of our season against the Chiefs, Eagles, Bucs, and Steelers. those teams will look to use the run to balance out their efficient offenses.

[HappyDays]

34 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Or we just score more.

 

Yes I've been in favor of that idea. Score 35+ per game and just steamroll the competition. Make the defense practically irrelevant. The investments made over the past couple offseasons however tell you the team was expecting a different path to victory so I'd like to see those investments start to produce the desired result.

[Success]

I was worried when I saw how much the Pats scored on Sunday. But I just checked the game stats, and it wasn't like they were running all over the field. Pretty modest offensive #'s for 42 points.  Looks like they really benefitted from some huge special teams plays and great field position, and an inept Carolina team.

 

They lost to the Raiders and Steelers, and pulled it out against Miami in the final minutes.  My take is that this is still an average team. 

 

It's also a much-improved division rival playing in the biggest game they've had in quite awhile, so I'm not taking them lightly.  But we should win this one at home if we take care of the ball.

 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

[BigAl2526]

38 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

Worth adding that the defense is trying new schematic things.  As they master those parts they will improve and hopefully itll lead to an identity for this defense.  But right now were struggling with things like getting set or getting people on the field.  Some of that is coaching but also think some is cause players are still learning too.

Could you be a bit more explicit?  The new stuff - is it common stuff done elsewhere that the Bills just haven't done much of or is Babich really getting creative?  How do you know this?  Are you doing film analysis yourself or reading it somewhere?

[Simon]

12 hours ago, Fan in Chicago said:

Playing this out... Let's say McD were to decide to make a change at DC, who is it there that fits his D philosophy? Off the top of my head, I can't think of anyone. And promote from within will leave a hole somewhere. I dont want McD taking over D duties in this year where we are aspiring for a SB. 

It is quite frustrating to see after all the resources that have been allocated to that side of the ball. 

 

I'm not tuned in enough to the rest of the league to have a valid opinion on a replacement, but your points are 100% valid.

At the very least I would consider leaving Babich in charge of calling the D on Sundays so McDermott can focus on managing the game, but during the week have McDermott take on a much larger role in regards to preparation in hopes of eliminating much of the confusion we're regularly seeing out there.

[TFBillsfan]

On 9/29/2025 at 11:18 AM, PoundingDog said:

Please don't use this argument. There are people all over question what the Bills have beat. The Bills are 4-0 and their opponents have 1 win TOTAL so far. 1  WIN. if not for the respect of Josh Allen, Bills would be treated like the Colts prior yesterday.

Two after last night! 😀

[boyst]

9 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

I'm not tuned in enough to the rest of the league to have a valid opinion on a replacement, but your points are 100% valid.

At the very least I would consider leaving Babich in charge of calling the D on Sundays so McDermott can focus on managing the game, but during the week have McDermott take on a much larger role in regards to preparation in hopes of eliminating much of the confusion we're regularly seeing out there.

I would like to know what goes on beyond what I don't know. 

Josh Allen at this point in his career to be a large part of the offensive process, and any competent offensive coordinator should be able to run the whole entire offense with Josh Allen. The head coach shouldn't need to meddle in this especially if he is a defensive specialist 

 

Therefore, what is McDermott doing that he's not spending enough time on defense when clearly there is a major problem here? This is his defense, this is always been his defense, how many defensive coordinators will it take to make this a point?

[Low Positive]

10 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

True.

 

And regardless of what people here think "should" be happening, no team in the NFL has dominated all 4 games that they've played. The Eagles first TD that set the tone of the game against the Bucs, for example, was off of a punt block. But you'll say "the Bucs are a good team." Well, if you are going to play "shoulda/coulda" with the Bills wins, you have to do that with other teams too. The Eagles "shoulda" lost to the Rams. The Bucs "shoulda" lost to both the Texans and Jets. The Colts should be 2-2 because they lost the game to the Broncos, if not for a last-second "leverage" call that saved them. The Chargers just lost to the Giants and shoulda lost to the Broncos. The Jags, on the other hand, should be 4-0 because their sole loss was due almost entirely to a BS DPI call on Travis Hunter. The Lions were dominated by a Packers team that has since lost to the Browns and tied the Cowboys.  In fact, if you are being objective, the team that has looked the best this year is the Seattle Seahawks. But they lost week 1 at home and then required one of the most boneheaded special teams mistakes to win in Pittsburgh in week 2. 

 

tldr; If you nitpick the Bills' wins, do that for all the other teams too.

[Simon]

7 minutes ago, boyst said:

Therefore, what is McDermott doing that he's not spending enough time on defense when clearly there is a major problem here? This is his defense, this is always been his defense, how many defensive coordinators will it take to make this a point?

 

This time seems different with all the presnap confusion and out of position players and opposing offenses recognizing the problems and taking advantage of them. We might not love how he approaches defense philosophically, but that disorganization is not something that has typically been a problem in his tenure. 

[boyst]

Just now, Simon said:

 

This time seems different with all the presnap confusion and out of position players and opposing offenses recognizing the problems and taking advantage of them. We might not love how he approaches defense philosophically, but that disorganization is not something that has typically been a problem in his tenure. 

Except when it was a problem before and Leslie Frazier got blame. And that's just the biggest circumstance we know of Jerry Hughes has alluded to the fact that the organization was all suspension and fluff without any body. 

 

The head coach is there to instill discipline, the chief organizer, the person who is on top of all things systemically. 

 

That this just magically appears to be a new problem concerns me to make me wonder if it was one all along. Hindsight being 20/20 it certainly appears to be. 

[TBBills Fan]

Where we at on the injury front?

 

Anyone back practicing?

[Simon]

7 minutes ago, boyst said:

Except when it was a problem before and Leslie Frazier got blame.

 

Frazier had his warts but I don't every recall there being these kind of widespread issues with preparation and recognition.

His defenses may not have always done what we wanted them to do, but at the bare minimum they did seem to know what they were doing.

OC's may have taken advantage of their passivity at times but there was never the kind of constant confusion we've been seeing out there since the minute the season started.

[Low Positive]

Just now, Simon said:

 

Frazier had his warts but I don't every recall there being these kind of widespread issues with preparation and recognition.

His defenses may not have always done what we wanted them to do, but at the bare minimum they did seem to know what they were doing.

OC's may have taken advantage of their passivity at times but there was never the kind of constant confusion we've been seeing out there since the minute the season started.

Could this be the loss of Poyer and Hyde? They did a lot of pre-snap adjustments.