Hot Diggity!

[JoPoy88]

Just now, Warcodered said:

When exactly did he do that?

That’s inside baseball we can’t know that…

[Beck Water]

23 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Trust me, he was unapologetic behind the scenes too. That's per my usual source. Not that anyone on the team asked him to apologize. But Diggs clearly does not believe his behavior over the past few months was wrong. In his mind it was justified because of his frustration. He said as much in his presser today, it's no big secret.

 

So as far as I can tell the problem is still there under the surface. Diggs is not going to cause any issues right now, he's putting last year behind him. But if he still thinks losing like we did to end last season justifies the way he acted, why should we expect anything different if this season ends in similar fashion? It's not about apologizing. It's about his behavior in the face of adversity.

 

I thought there were some hints in the press conference that Diggs is committed to doing some things differently this season.  Stuff Diggs said.

I don't have enough energy about it to go back through the whole thing and find them. 

It was stuff about how he can do more, and he WILL, to support Josh and the team. 

 

I don't want to cast doubt upon your source, but I tend to doubt he or she is privy to every private conversation between Diggs and the coaches or Diggs and Josh Allen or Diggs and the other WR.

[HappyDays]

2 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

yeah well maybe just get rid of him then. Let’s see how they fare.

 

I absolutely don't want to get rid of him. I am just worried about how he will act if we face adversity. It seems like a lot of fans saying "water under the bridge" also recognize that things can go south at any moment if the season takes a turn for the worse. To me that is not "water under the bridge." That is "to be determined."

 

4 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

Making an a** out of himself? How so?

 

He was going on talk shows and radio shows expressing how unhappy he was with the state of the team. He did not go about it the right way. He threw the team under the bus and acted like he was above it all. Again none of this is a secret. It was a huge story all offseason and culminated in the mandatory minicamp debacle.

[Low Positive]

Here’s what I think happened. Diggs has thin skin. Eli Apple was taunting him all game, and he lost it. That happened very publicly. Instead of apologizing and making amends, he doubled and tripped down. The team gave him space to save face. He finally took that opportunity today.

[Warcodered]

4 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

He was going on talk shows and radio shows expressing how unhappy he was with the state of the team. He did not go about it the right way. He threw the team under the bus and acted like he was above it all. Again none of this is a secret. It was a huge story all offseason and culminated in the mandatory minicamp debacle.

It kind of feels like you're twisting him going around the sports media circuit talking about his frustrations about the results of the season and the teams performance in the last game of the season and saying that that's him talking ***** about the rest of the team. It's not really, if he'd gone around talking ***** about the team I'm pretty sure that would have been a much bigger story, much sooner.

[JoPoy88]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

I absolutely don't want to get rid of him. I am just worried about how he will act if we face adversity. It seems like a lot of fans saying "water under the bridge" also recognize that things can go south at any moment if the season takes a turn for the worse. To me that is not "water under the bridge." That is "to be determined."

 

 

He was going on talk shows and radio shows expressing how unhappy he was with the state of the team. He did not go about it the right way. He threw the team under the bus and acted like he was above it all. Again none of this is a secret. It was a huge story all offseason and culminated in the mandatory minicamp debacle.

Well maybe I was tuned out immediately after the season ended so I’ll need some links to some quotes he apparently made on that. 
 

And you say you “absolutely” don’t want to get rid of him while attacking his attitude and demeanor throughout this thread about his press conference wherein he said literally all the right things. So I guess I’m a little confused on that as well.

 

The team is almost certainly going to face adversity again in some form. Hopefully not as much as late last year but still - and Diggs will probably express frustration at that adversity in some sort of public way. Are you saying that that next time is the last straw? Or next to last or whatever? 

[Beck Water]

9 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

He was going on talk shows and radio shows expressing how unhappy he was with the state of the team. He did not go about it the right way. He threw the team under the bus and acted like he was above it all. Again none of this is a secret. It was a huge story all offseason and culminated in the mandatory minicamp debacle.

 

I guess this must be one of those Rashoman things.

 

I can't defend a lot of Diggs behavior.  I thought he threw a hissy fit on the sideline and stormed out in a huff.  The word a media member who posts here used was "petulant" as in "he appeared petulant".

I'm not a professional football player, but I think there are ways to psych up and encourage your teammates, and that wasn't what Diggs was showing on the sidelines.  And I heard inclings in today's presser that Diggs realizes that.

 

Where the Rashoman thing came in, is that I'm sure I didn't hear every interview or show Diggs gave off season but I didn't hear him "expressing how unhappy he was with the state of the team" or throwing them under the bus.  He expressed frustration with how the season ended that I believe every player on the team felt, so that's not a surprise.

 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Beck Water

[JoPoy88]

22 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I see his behavior explained by it a lot

 

But he's the only one acting this way 

Yes we all must have good little soldiers stone faced on the sideline in full “process” mode at all times - including one of the most talented guys on the team. 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, JoPoy88 said:

Yes we all must have good little soldiers stone faced on the sideline in full “process” mode at all times - including one of the most talented guys on the team. 

Now that's not what I said😂😂

 

I love diggs, he's the second most important guy on the team. I just worry sometimes theres something irreparable happened that's going to always be a stone in the shoe

[JerseyBills]

7 hours ago, Nephilim17 said:

Don't have time right now to watch the 20-minute press conference.

 

Sal's snippets sound very encouraging, especially as Stef was totally "transparent."

Can anyone here offer a quick thought on whether this is truly closure and that we can feel like Stef is happy to be a Bill and play with Josh? I think the answer is yes, but I'd like to hear someone here who watched the whole thing say it.

Cheers.

Ya I watched earlier.  Stef also stressed being a team captain, doesn't want more input on o.

it was just overblown by the media because he's an elite WR, it was the off-season and how the Vikings turned out. 

 

I'd take 53 guys with Diggs mentality all day

Edited July 27, 2023 by JerseyBills

[Beck Water]

11 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

Yes we all must have good little soldiers stone faced on the sideline in full “process” mode at all times - including one of the most talented guys on the team. 

 

I mean, would you honestly try to defend that split between the way Diggs was behaving (gesticulating and yelling at Allen on the bench while Allen is trying to look at stills, storming out of the tunnel without gathering with the team)  vs. "good little soldiers stone faced on the sideline"?

 

Seems to me there's a lot of space in between.

 

1 hour ago, JoPoy88 said:

I don’t doubt your source but I do not think they are privy to every single conversation that have occurred between Diggs and Allen/McDermott/Dorsey since January.

 

And even if he didn’t apologize for, whatever, I didn’t have a problem with him in that game anyways. I was more concerned with Allen staring off into space on the bench (during the game) like he just had to put his dog down or something. 

So yeah - Diggs being expressive and emotional on the field, on the sidelines during games - that’s probably not going to change. I have no problem with it. Maybe you do and your “source” does but it’s pretty clear by now that’s who he is. 

 

One of the worst things for any athlete is knowing that he's getting beaten and he can't do anything about it, because physically he's lacking the chops.  It must be unimaginably worse for an elite athlete playing at the highest level.  That seems to be a very hard thing to change around during a game.

 

We saw that same thousand-mile "dog just died" stare out of Joe Burrow, by the way, during the AFCCG against the Chiefs and during the Chiefs SB loss to Tampa Bay.

 

In Allen's case, it's possible there was a factor of his elbow injury making him physically unable to make some of the throws he needed to be able to make to change things around

Edited July 27, 2023 by Beck Water

[JoPoy88]

7 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I mean, would you honestly try to defend that split between the way Diggs was behaving (gesticulating and yelling at Allen on the bench while Allen is trying to look at stills, storming out of the tunnel without gathering with the team)  vs. "good little soldiers stone faced on the sideline"?

 

Seems to me there's a lot of space in between.

 

One of the worst things for any athlete is knowing that he's getting beaten and he can't do anything about it, because physically he's lacking the chops.  It must be unimaginably worse for an elite athlete playing at the highest level. 

 

We saw that same stare out of Joe Burrow, by the way, during the AFCCG against the Chiefs. 

 

In Allen's case, it's possible there was a large helping of his elbow injury making him physically unable to make some of the throws he needed to be able to make to change things around

I’m not defending Diggs so much as I am accepting it. He’s equally demonstrative when things are going well. Knowing his production over the years (which is all I really care about) I’ve learned to accept it and him for what he is. 
 

I absolutely do not care about whether or not he hurt Josh Allen’s feelings. Both men are paid enough to where if they can’t work it out, or if one or the other is hung up on this or that supposed public “slight”, then tough, I guess. i thought only the manbaby fans got hung up on that sort of **** but maybe not.

20 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Now that's not what I said😂😂

 

I love diggs, he's the second most important guy on the team. I just worry sometimes theres something irreparable happened that's going to always be a stone in the shoe

That’s fine then. 
 

And if something irreparable happened (or is happening) then we all know how it will end already - one of them will be gone, and it won’t be Allen.

[MasterStrategist]

2 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

I’m not defending Diggs so much as I am accepting it. He’s equally demonstrative when things are going well. Knowing his production over the years (which is all I really care about) I’ve learned to accept it and him for what he is. 
 

I absolutely do not care about whether or not he hurt Josh Allen’s feelings. Both men are paid enough to where if they can’t work it out, or if one or the other is hung up on this or that supposed public “slight”, then tough, I guess. i thought only the manbaby fans got hung up on that sort of **** but maybe not.

Agree.  With Diggs, you take the occasional bad with the good.

 

Is he a "perfect" teammate? Definitely not.  But he contributes alot more good, than bad.  Not only his play, but he's voted as a captain for a reason and he demands/brings the level of play up of his teammates. 

 

These are the types of leaders we can afford, when you have balanced personalities also as leaders (and some less critical/emotional guys like Josh) and McD coaching.  Every team needs some "fire", just finding the right balance.

 

And this isn't directed at you, as I agreed with your comments and good place to put this.

 

So much speculation and alot of wasted energy by fans/media.  Month ago, it was everyone paranoid about Dorsey/playcalls, some posters insisting they had "sources" that Diggs' issue was Ken.  Who knows for certain, and it doesn't matter if we do.  Diggs handled today's presser nearly perfectly, IMO, and did his due diligence.  Now time to move on.

[BillsFan2313]

The highlight of the interview was Diggs telling Warrow to just ask his question, after he was talking in circles.  🤣

[JoPoy88]

9 minutes ago, BillsFan2313 said:

The highlight of the interview was Diggs telling Warrow to just ask his question, after he was talking in circles.  🤣

JW flubbed his question, for sure. He admitted it afterwards.

[SCBills]

What do we consider “adversity”?

 

I don’t recall Diggs being a problem at all last year, aside from a heated sideline moment in Detroit.. which really depends on one’s view of the situation.  
 

We went through a lot of adversity, but what happened against the Bengals wasn’t “adversity”… it was a collective failure to even show up for a game to get us back to the AFC CG. 

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, JoPoy88 said:

I absolutely do not care about whether or not he hurt Josh Allen’s feelings. Both men are paid enough to where if they can’t work it out, or if one or the other is hung up on this or that supposed public “slight”, then tough, I guess. i thought only the manbaby fans got hung up on that sort of **** but maybe not.

 

This seems like a weird response to me.  Where did anyone say anything about Diggs (or anyone) "hurting Josh Allen's feelings"?

 

You expressed concern about Josh Allen sitting there looking like his dog died.  I pointed out that we've seen that look in other top QB - Burrow, Mahomes - when their team is getting its butt whipped, and that it's an awful feeling for a competitive athlete to know they're getting physically beaten and don't have the chops at that moment to change it.  That doesn't have to do with getting your feelings hurt by someone.  As Josh Allen attributes to his college coach, "Football is a man whupping man game".  Getting whupped does not feel good.

 

However, that said, there are constructive/helpful and unconstructive ways for teammates and coaches to try to change the momentum.  And Diggs standing there yelling at Allen while he's sitting with his QB coach trying to diagnose plays on his Surface is not constructive.  It has nothing to do with Diggs hurting his feelings, and everything to do with, it's just not useful.

Edited July 27, 2023 by Beck Water

[JoPoy88]

22 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

This seems like a weird response to me.  Where did anyone say anything about Diggs (or anyone) "hurting Josh Allen's feelings"?

 

You expressed concern about Josh Allen sitting there looking like his dog died.  I pointed out that we've seen that look in other top QB - Burrow, Mahomes - when their team is getting its butt whipped, and that it's an awful feeling for a competitive athlete to know they're getting physically beaten and don't have the chops at that moment to change it.  That doesn't have to do with getting your feelings hurt by someone.  As Josh Allen attributes to his college coach, "Football is a man whupping man game".  Getting whupped does not feel good.

 

However, that said, there are constructive/helpful and unconstructive ways for teammates and coaches to try to change the momentum.  And Diggs standing there yelling at Allen while he's sitting with his QB coach trying to diagnose plays on his Surface is not constructive.  It has nothing to do with Diggs hurting his feelings, and everything to do with, it's just not useful.

I’m comparing Diggs reaction to things going sideways in that Bengals game to what the cameras also showed us of Allen during the same game. That’s what Allen looked like to me - in space somewhere. Checked out. Other QBs have looked the same way when it just isn’t their day, as you pointed out. And that is okay.

My whole point is neither bothers me. And as far as Diggs “interrupting” Josh on his tablet, well I’d figure listening to your only elite weapon in the midst of a win or go home playoff game (even if he’s only venting) is more important than checking replays. Make time for both, since we all know, so they should definitely know, that Diggs isn’t going to be quiet about it. Any conduct fans or commentators are deeming as “counterproductive” by Diggs is far outweighed by his ACTUAL PRODUCTION on the field
 

Or don’t! Like I said if they both continue to produce - awesome. If one or both still have a hair up their a** about how it went down then one will be gone, it won’t be Allen and the team will probably be worse off for it. 

My whole issue in this thread and the earlier ones about Diggs and minicamp isn’t with you - it’s with the usual suspects claiming the team needs to get rid of Diggs, he’s not worth it, he’s F’ing up the culture or the “process” (whatever that is.) 

 

Picture a Bills team with the roster as currently constructed without Stefon Diggs. That’s not great. That’s not even good, at least on offense. So you learn to manage your personalities and figure it out. 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by JoPoy88

[PrimeTime101]

2 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

I’m comparing Diggs reaction to things going sideways in that Bengals game to what the cameras also showed us of Allen during the same game. That’s what Allen looked like to me - in space somewhere. Checked out. Other QBs have looked the same way when it just isn’t their day, as you pointed out. And that is okay.

My whole point is neither bothers me. And as far as Diggs “interrupting” Josh on his tablet, well I’d figure listening to your only elite weapon in the midst of a win or go home playoff game (even if he’s only venting) is more important than checking replays. Make time for both, since we all know, so they should definitely know, that Diggs isn’t going to be quiet about it. Any conduct fans or commentators are deeming as “counterproductive” by Diggs is far outweighed by his ACTUAL PRODUCTION on the field
 

Or don’t! Like I said if they both continue to produce - awesome. If one or both still have a hair up their a** about how it went down then one will be gone, it won’t be Allen and the team will probably be worse off for it. 

My whole issue in this thread and the earlier ones about Diggs and minicamp isn’t with you - it’s with the usual suspects claiming the team needs to get rid of Diggs, he’s not worth it, he’s F’ing up the culture or the “process” (whatever that is.) 

 

Picture a Bills team with the roster as currently constructed without Stefon Diggs. That’s not great. That’s not even good, at least on offense. So you learn to manage your personalities and figure it out. 

 

I could never picture Diggs off this team. That being said if Diggs were traded, so would the contract be traded... Another Words... If we traded Diggs? We would be getting another top 5 WR off another roster who also wants off there team with a sizeable contract. 

[JoPoy88]

4 minutes ago, PrimeTime101 said:

I could never picture Diggs off this team. That being said if Diggs were traded, so would the contract be traded... Another Words... If we traded Diggs? We would be getting another top 5 WR off another roster who also wants off there team with a sizeable contract. 

Yeah chances are if that ever would happen (it won’t) you wouldn’t get comparable talent, you’d get lesser talent and/or draft picks.