Sundancer Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 1 hour ago, plenzmd1 said: sorry have not had time to respond to this. Seems to me every article presented there is dated pre November, most of them pre October. Granted i did not click every article, but i am guessing they were all using pre September numbers...before Delta really kicked in. PLease tell me if i am wrong in that assumption. Wait what? Delta wasn't spreading before September? VA, TX, and lots of other states and countries are tracking these numbers. See the Google machine. And there have been many studies. I know you don't like the science-y stuff but they all tell the same story: Vaccine works vs Delta. Sorry to report that to you. 1 hour ago, plenzmd1 said: The number i do know for sure is that Erie county used a 43% of hospitalized patients were fully vaxed number in the press release they put out to justify the mask mandates. Thats a real world, up to date number. Do you think that is just an anomaly? Va seems to do a good job of tracking this..see here https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/see-the-numbers/covid-19-in-virginia/covid-19-cases-by-vaccination-status/ So if i use that number of 4.6 times as effective at even contracting Covid, and then another factor of say 6X times as effective keeping the positive cases out of hospital, something aint adding up there. Unless we just accept the fact that WNY has massive obesity problems, and that is prolly more a factor than vaccine status on hospitalization.... This is where my vaccine hesitancy comes from. I think the data is garbage,especially on the federal level..and the message we get from our politicians and the Fauci's of the world directly contradict what they tall us about the vaccines. I could probably live with them calling it preventative therapeutics, just stop calling them vaccines. I love how Erie County NY is your data point to prove vaccines don't work, despite the mountain of evidence, statistically and scientifically, showing the opposite. Keep up the masterful exhibition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 5 minutes ago, Sundancer said: It's hard to even have this conversation with you. (1) There is no accepted measure of what an "immune" antibody level means. So that's not a thing. (2) The level of antibodies wanes at different rates in different people so that waning is also not uniform. (3) Measuring antibody levels is a stupid way to determine how well you will fight off the disease. Antibody waning is expected and should happen. The body makes antibodies when needed--it doesn't keep them on hand for all time. (4) Stop trying to be the scientist that you're not. Okay. And maybe I have a completely different question. So how does a clinical researcher supporting a vaccine trial determine whether or not an effective immune response was generated by the vaccine in the subject? Unless you can measure some biomarker or antibody level before the trial to produce a baseline for the subject and during or after the trial how can you determine the effectiveness of the vaccine in producing an immune response? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Buffalo Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 13 minutes ago, Sundancer said: It's hard to even have this conversation with you. (1) There is no accepted measure of what an "immune" antibody level means. So that's not a thing. (2) The level of antibodies wanes at different rates in different people so that waning is also not uniform. (3) Measuring antibody levels is a stupid way to determine how well you will fight off the disease. Antibody waning is expected and should happen. The body makes antibodies when needed--it doesn't keep them on hand for all time. (4) Stop trying to be the scientist that you're not. Was the flu shot part of the police state too? Grow up. Get vaccinated. Get on with your life. You are literally arguing not to advance science and are to dumb to understand that you do a study to learn all the things you just said we don't know. In February we did not know how much the vaccine wanes over any period of time, therefore we did studies. Your last line though is precious" get vaccinated. Get on with your life" as if Cali is doing that. I live in FL and thankfully I have been living my life since June 2020. 8 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: Okay. And maybe I have a completely different question. So how does a clinical researcher supporting a vaccine trial determine whether or not an effective immune response was generated by the vaccine in the subject? Unless you can measure some biomarker or antibody level before the trial to produce a baseline for the subject and during or after the trial how can you determine the effectiveness of the vaccine in producing an immune response? Don't waste your time- his argument is simply since we don't have an agreed upon threshold at this time that we don't do a study. He did not even realize that they could measure the protein until after a few dozen posts condemning the idea. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundancer Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 Just now, Buffalo Timmy said: You are literally arguing not to advance science and are to dumb to understand that you do a study to learn all the things you just said we don't know. In February we did not know how much the vaccine wanes over any period of time, therefore we did studies. Your last line though is precious" get vaccinated. Get on with your life" as if Cali is doing that. I live in FL and thankfully I have been living my life since June 2020. You are such a dolt. Your level of antibody is a limited measure regarding your ability to fight off infection. Stop thinking you know something. I haven't been stopped from doing anything that I wanted to do since early 2021, and that thing was the f-ing Bills blocking me from sitting in my seats for the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Sundancer said: Was the flu shot part of the police state too? Grow up. Get vaccinated. Get on with your life. I did. I'm in a f****g mask all day as are my kids. And 10s millions more. Post more vaccine data that doesn't matter. And in that time.....we'll get more variants that need another 6 months of tweaking. You'll be updated regularly on the political shows: Can the vaccines be tweaked and how long could that take? Yes, teams behind vaccines are already working on updating vaccines with the new spike protein to prepare for an eventuality where a new version might be needed. A lot of the preparation work for such an update took place when the Beta and Delta variants emerged – although in those cases existing vaccines have held up well. This means research teams were already poised to create new versions of vaccines and have discussed with regulators what additional trials would be required. However, it could still take four to six months before updated vaccines, if required, are widely available. https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/26/vaccine-resistant-what-scientists-know-new-covid-variant Seem to sure know a lot about the "new" variant in just 3 weeks. Edited December 2, 2021 by Big Blitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 Pro-Life=Pro-vaccine Right to life 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 7 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Pro-Life=Pro-vaccine Right to life Know Abortion, No Life, No Abortion...Know life? Interesting Tibsy, you stumbled across that ever-elusive nut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 Just now, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Know Abortion, No Life, No Abortion...Know life? Interesting Tibsy, you stumbled across that ever-elusive nut. Vaccines save lives, too. Force women to have babies but don't force people to get shots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 Another Omicron case found in Minnesota. "The person with the Omicron variant is an adult male, is a resident of Hennepin County, and had been vaccinated. The person developed mild symptoms on Nov. 22 and sought COVID-19 testing on Nov. 24. The person’s symptoms have resolved." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 1 minute ago, All_Pro_Bills said: Another Omicron case found in Minnesota. "The person with the Omicron variant is an adult male, is a resident of Hennepin County, and had been vaccinated. The person developed mild symptoms on Nov. 22 and sought COVID-19 testing on Nov. 24. The person’s symptoms have resolved." But did he get infected by an unvaccinated anti-lifer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 1 minute ago, Tiberius said: Vaccines save lives, too. Force women to have babies but don't force people to get shots? Force people to have shots to save lives, but don't force women to save lives by having babies? My issue with abortion is like that of many people--sometime, early on in a pregnancy, a person decides to terminate the pregnancy and does so outside the purview of politics, opinions and religion as they see fit. What constitutes 'early' to me is probably up to around 3 months, though I understand people have different opinions. The argument that anyone is making anyone have a baby seems sort of silly to me. That said, your argument above is as extreme as any pro-lifer's view on abortion that you'll ever encounter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 2 minutes ago, Tiberius said: But did he get infected by an unvaccinated anti-lifer? The bigger question is are the current vaccine formulas effective against Omicron? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundancer Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 57 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: I did. Really: 57 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: I'm in a f****g mask all day as are my kids. And 10s millions more. Doesn't sound like you've gotten on with much of anything big talker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 11 minutes ago, Sundancer said: Really: Doesn't sound like you've gotten on with much of anything big talker. Required by work. Have to on all public transit. Still. Ever been to DC lately? It's a complete dump. Mandatory testing if not vaccinated. Required by the public schools where the school boards all use "but the CDC says" as their cover. Or, your corrupt politicized Local Health Department. Required everywhere you go now in Erie County and countless other counties I'm sure taking advantage of the afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Buffalo Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 3 hours ago, Sundancer said: You are such a dolt. Your level of antibody is a limited measure regarding your ability to fight off infection. Stop thinking you know something. I haven't been stopped from doing anything that I wanted to do since early 2021, and that thing was the f-ing Bills blocking me from sitting in my seats for the playoffs. Hey we are making progress with your understanding of science. The level of antibodies at this time is a limited measure of your ability to fight infection, maybe if we do a study we might find out that at certain levels your immune response is substantially better. There is no reason not to do the study unless you are invested in a certain outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 3 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said: The bigger question is are the current vaccine formulas effective against Omicron? If you're in the money making business of vaccines, of course they are not. If you were in the altruistic, let's save the world by sharing our recipe with the world frame of mind, of course they are. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 3 hours ago, Sundancer said: You are such a dolt. Your level of antibody is a limited measure regarding your ability to fight off infection. Stop thinking you know something. I haven't been stopped from doing anything that I wanted to do since early 2021, and that thing was the f-ing Bills blocking me from sitting in my seats for the playoffs. I'm just praying you get to sit in your seats this year! Go Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaCrispy Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said: Hey we are making progress with your understanding of science. The level of antibodies at this time is a limited measure of your ability to fight infection, maybe if we do a study we might find out that at certain levels your immune response is substantially better. There is no reason not to do the study unless you are invested in a certain outcome. If you two had a TV show, I would watch every week... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
716er Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 4 hours ago, Big Blitz said: I'm in a f****g mask all day as are my kids. ***** sheep 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 2, 2021 Share Posted December 2, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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