It's Time to Mandate Vaccines

[Sundancer]

15 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

It give it immunity for a short while- I have watched it rip through my parents retirement community over the past 6 weeks. All of them vaccinated who caught COVID, thankfully no one has died but stop with the immunity talk. If true immunity then you would require people to be vaxxed to attend events, or wear masks when at school.

Your anecdote is nice but ignores the data on long lasting immunity in under 65 year olds, who by coincidence if vaccinated and don’t catch Covid, won’t spread it to others like your parents’ retirement community. It’s called something like herb shmimmunity. Some term like that. Maybe you’ve heard of it. 

[Orlando Tim]

24 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

Your anecdote is nice but ignores the data on long lasting immunity in under 65 year olds, who by coincidence if vaccinated and don’t catch Covid, won’t spread it to others like your parents’ retirement community. It’s called something like herb shmimmunity. Some term like that. Maybe you’ve heard of it. 

Herd immunity does not work with viruses like Covid that keep mutating, if it did then we would not get colds or the flu anymore. For a guy who claims to understand numbers perhaps you should learn about the virus. Not to mention that in my parents community they had certainly hit herd immunity (90+%) and more than half their friends got Covid 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Buffalo Timmy

[Irv]

Demented Biden and Hyena Harris have wrecked the country with their "America Last" agenda.  They mandate international travelers to be vaccinated to take focus away from their growing lists of crises they have created.  Oh, but if you are a Hatian crossing the Rio Grande illegally, no vaccine needed.  When Trump banned entry from China during the early stages of the pandemic, these two losers called it xenophobic.  What abject liars and hypocrites.     

 

What

A

Mess 

 

 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Irv

[Sundancer]

59 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Herd immunity does not work with viruses like Covid that keep mutating, if it did then we would not get colds or the flu anymore. For a guy who claims to understand numbers perhaps you should learn about the virus. Not to mention that in my parents community they had certainly hit herd immunity (90+%) and more than half their friends got Covid 

I post data point after data point about immunity in people, including the above. 
 

You counter with an anecdote about people well over 65 in a nursing home. 
 

Timmy this is why I keep reminding you that your earlier scientific analysis led you to conclude that the vaccine doesn’t work for most people after 6 months…and dig in on that when confronted with a pile of data. This is why your thoughts on science are suspect. 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Sundancer

[plenzmd1]

 

On 9/26/2021 at 10:38 AM, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

 

Are you doing ok?

I am thanks...feel 95% now, just a slight tiredness to joints...any other Non Covid year would not be thinking twice about it.

[B-Man]

 

 

New York prepares to fire unvaccinated healthcare workers

 

 

As we learned over the weekend, teachers in New York City won a court victory to delay their termination if they don’t get vaccinated by midnight tonight. But healthcare workers around the state apparently didn’t come up with a similar plan, or if they did, it didn’t work. A similar mandate applying to them is set to go into effect after today and it applies to doctors, nurses, and just about everyone else working at any hospital, nursing home, doctor’s office, or other medical facilities. Given the significant number of frontline healthcare workers who are among the

 

https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2021/09/27/new-york-prepares-to-fire-unvaccinated-healthcare-workers-n418487

 

 

 

 

Police union: ‘Dozens’ of Mass. troopers to resign over vaccine mandate

by Tom Howell Jr.

 

A top police union says “dozens” of Massachusetts troopers will resign after a judge denied its bid to delay the COVID-19 vaccine mandate imposed by Republican Gov. Charlie Baker. The State Police Association of Massachusetts said the troopers plan to seek employment at departments with “reasonable alternatives” such as mask-wearing or regular testing. The union is disappointed by a judge’s ruling last week that refused to delay Mr. Baker’s mandate, which requires 42,000 state workers and contractors to get vaccinated or receive an exemption by Oct. 17. Those who don’t comply face termination.(Snip)“The state police are already critically short-staffed and acknowledged this

 

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/sep/27/police-union-dozens-mass-troopers-resign-over-covi/

 

 

 

Edited September 27, 2021 by B-Man

[Orlando Tim]

1 hour ago, Sundancer said:

I post data point after data point about immunity in people, including the above. 
 

You counter with an anecdote about people well over 65 in a nursing home. 
 

Timmy this is why I keep reminding you that your earlier scientific analysis led you to conclude that the vaccine doesn’t work for most people after 6 months…and dig in on that when confronted with a pile of data. This is why your thoughts on science are suspect. 

Your data points are crap if they say you get proper herd immunity against a rapidly mutating virus. I also never said nursing home- it is a retirement community and most of the people I am speaking of are relatively physically fit and under 70. You are clearly paid by the one of vaccine companies because literally no one but you is arguing anymore that the Covid shots last forever, and the main mistake on my earlier analysis was that I did not recognize the study was the only in the most vulnerable. 

[Sundancer]

19 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Your data points are crap if they say you get proper herd immunity against a rapidly mutating virus. I also never said nursing home- it is a retirement community and most of the people I am speaking of are relatively physically fit and under 70. You are clearly paid by the one of vaccine companies because literally no one but you is arguing anymore that the Covid shots last forever, and the main mistake on my earlier analysis was that I did not recognize the study was the only in the most vulnerable. 

Pfizer pays me handsomely. 

[Irv]

Does anybody get the sense that nobody knows what's going on or what to do with COVID?  I was fully vaccinated and still got it with four of my friends who went on the same trip.  But Demented Biden says only 1 in 5000 fully vaccinated can get infected.  What a crock of horse *****.  Demented Biden is a liar and has botched the COVID so badly, nobody knows what to do.  How many died because this idiot and Hyena Harris said they didn't trust the "Trump Vaccination".  Killers.  Should be tried for treason and executed for that alone.  Cuomo and Demented Biden.  Murderers.    

 

What

A

Mess

Edited September 27, 2021 by Irv

[Big Blitz]

3 hours ago, Irv said:

Does anybody get the sense that nobody knows what's going on or what to do with COVID?  I was fully vaccinated and still got it with four of my friends who went on the same trip.  But Demented Biden says only 1 in 5000 fully vaccinated can get infected.  What a crock of horse *****.  Demented Biden is a liar and has botched the COVID so badly, nobody knows what to do.  How many died because this idiot and Hyena Harris said they didn't trust the "Trump Vaccination".  Killers.  Should be tried for treason and executed for that alone.  Cuomo and Demented Biden.  Murderers.    

 

What

A

Mess

 

 

Because fully vaccinated people are still dying.  The virus will be here for years and find (it already has) ways to infect the "fully vaccinated."  

 

 

He died over the weekend.  

 

As long as that's happening, global protocols will never stop.  

 

They will be possible because people are irrationally scared and manipulated easily.  Completely ready to surrender to the virus and expect the State to protect them.    

 

They won't resist bc they'll get fired. 

 

They won't resist because the business they run will not be looked upon kindly by the State so they will be rewarded for going along.   

 

And politicians will use the situation to maintain and increase power because they can.  The people will think it's all necessary to keep them safe.   

 

Collectively, these measures lead to the demise of life as we knew it ......but it can't happen overnight this will take years.  

 

 

Unless the left stands with the right against any and all protocols (Red States will essentially be autonomous zones within the U.S. the rest will be a biomedical police state), then it's over.     

 

But by all means, let's get to the bottom of January 6th.  

Edited September 28, 2021 by Big Blitz

[Beast]

7 hours ago, B-Man said:

 

 

New York prepares to fire unvaccinated healthcare workers

 

 

As we learned over the weekend, teachers in New York City won a court victory to delay their termination if they don’t get vaccinated by midnight tonight. But healthcare workers around the state apparently didn’t come up with a similar plan, or if they did, it didn’t work. A similar mandate applying to them is set to go into effect after today and it applies to doctors, nurses, and just about everyone else working at any hospital, nursing home, doctor’s office, or other medical facilities. Given the significant number of frontline healthcare workers who are among the

 

https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2021/09/27/new-york-prepares-to-fire-unvaccinated-healthcare-workers-n418487

 

 

 

 

Police union: ‘Dozens’ of Mass. troopers to resign over vaccine mandate

by Tom Howell Jr.

 

A top police union says “dozens” of Massachusetts troopers will resign after a judge denied its bid to delay the COVID-19 vaccine mandate imposed by Republican Gov. Charlie Baker. The State Police Association of Massachusetts said the troopers plan to seek employment at departments with “reasonable alternatives” such as mask-wearing or regular testing. The union is disappointed by a judge’s ruling last week that refused to delay Mr. Baker’s mandate, which requires 42,000 state workers and contractors to get vaccinated or receive an exemption by Oct. 17. Those who don’t comply face termination.(Snip)“The state police are already critically short-staffed and acknowledged this

 

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/sep/27/police-union-dozens-mass-troopers-resign-over-covi/

 

 

 

 

 

From yesterdays Heros to todays Zeros.

 

 

[GaryPinC]

54 minutes ago, Irv said:

Does anybody get the sense that nobody knows what's going on or what to do with COVID?  I was fully vaccinated and still got it with four of my friends who went on the same trip.  But Demented Biden says only 1 in 5000 fully vaccinated can get infected.  What a crock of horse *****.  Demented Biden is a liar and has botched the COVID so badly, nobody knows what to do.  How many died because this idiot and Hyena Harris said they didn't trust the "Trump Vaccination".  Killers.  Should be tried for treason and executed for that alone.  Cuomo and Demented Biden.  Murderers.    

 

What

A

Mess

No.  What's going on is far too many of us want black and white hard rules on this virus.  That's impossible.  What's going on is the virus is very widely circulating which increases mutations.  It's changing and science is learning.  Science is not a black and white hard rules system.  It's shades of gray that trend to either black or white over long periods of time which require many studies and more studies and discussion to build on previous results.

 

The mRNA vaccines were a rare home run, closest thing to black or white against previous versions of the virus.  They stopped or limited both infection and transmission over 90% of the time.  That is simply amazing.  Since delta, this efficacy has slipped, not failed, but slipped lower.  And to be expected from a mutating virus to survive.  But the ignorant black and whiters like to condemn the vaccines as useless now.

 

Of course the CDC and virus extremists are their own problem, convinced you can stamp this out if you just distance, mask, vaccinate.

 

The reality is we need to get this virus out of wide circulation to slow the mutation rate through vaccinations worldwide, distancing and masking indoors. Then, we can avoid mass outbreaks and bring things under better control. 

 

What's the measuring stick?  Hospitalizations and the taxing on our healthcare system.  For states not governed by extremist numbnuts, you tighten up as the health care strain increases and loosen as it wanes.

 

I am fully vaccinated but wear KN-95 masks when in indoor public spaces.  Why?  Because paper/cloth masks offer almost no self-protection and are only effective if everyone wears them (as my school district found out this fall).  I also believe the KN-95 makes a statement in doing my part to limit viral circulation.  Don't get me wrong, I totally get and respect people who are vaccinated and feel they don't have to mask, they've done the biggest part.

[Sundancer]

2 hours ago, Beast said:

 

 

From yesterdays Heros to todays Zeros.

 

 

 

It's terrible that we can't convince people to get the vax. So many people spreading bad info. 

[Orlando Tim]

10 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

It's terrible that we can't convince people to get the vax. So many people spreading bad info. 

Like you pretending it is provides true immunity. It does not and only you are pretending it is a permanent shot also 

[Big Blitz]

No truer words....

 

 

 

[Sundancer]

Just now, Buffalo Timmy said:

Like you pretending it is provides true immunity. It does not and only you are pretending it is a permanent shot also 

 

WTF is "true immunity?" I've never heard that term. Please define it and then tell me where I used it. 

 

Get vaccinated because it works. Not a little. Not just against pre-Delta. It works vs all Covid extremely well both to resist infection and severity.

 

There's one message to spread: The vaccine works.

 

You can try to undermine it all you want but you don't know what you're talking about, as you consistently establish. 

[Irv]

What 

A 

Mess

[Big Blitz]

Long read.....I'm sure it's all b.s. tho....not a Facebook accredited Physician publishing it AND it's linked on Zero Hedge not CNN.

 

This is a possible explanation for why they want everyone to get vaccinated. 

 

I don't agree with the dystopian conclusions made - mostly.  I do believe what's more likely is that 2016 freaked out the elites - Brexit and Trump won because Social Media was the Wild West and it allowed for populism to rise and crush the people behind Obama movements around the world (if you don't understand how the 22nd century works by now I don't know what to tell you).  Silicon Valley reigned it all in.  The people behind Obama - all tied to China and various socialist and anti capitalist movements around the world did indeed ok this bio attack.  Because they knew they had treatments (the vaccine) for it.  Silicon Valley becoming the propaganda wing of the State.  

 

If you read it, it's pretty jarring.  While no scientist (I absolutely want to hear why the science claims in this re the vaccine are all wrong), I understand what mankind is capable of - and that the enemies of this country and freedom are right here in your own backyard; they don't care about being subjects......imagine what the Chinese think of us....

 

 

 

"...In ADE, antibodies from a previous infection become non-neutralizing due to mutations in the virus’s proteins. These non-neutralizing antibodies then act as trojan horses, allowing live, active virus to be pulled into macrophages through their Fc receptor pathways, allowing the virus to infect immune cells that it would not have been able to infect before. This has been known to happen with Dengue Fever; when someone gets sick with Dengue, recovers, and then contracts a different strain, they can get very, very ill.

 

If someone is vaccinated with mRNA based on the Spike from the initial Wuhan strain of SARS-CoV-2, and then they become infected with a future, mutated strain of the virus, they may become severely ill. In other words, it is possible for vaccines to sensitize someone to disease.....

 

.. In November of 2019, three technicians at the Wuhan Institute of Virology developed symptoms consistent with a flu-like illness. Anthony Fauci, Peter Daszak, and Ralph Baric knew at once what had happened, because back channels exist between this laboratory and our scientists and officials.

December 12th, 2019, Ralph Baric signed a Material Transfer Agreement (essentially, an NDA) to receive Coronavirus mRNA vaccine-related materials co-owned by Moderna and NIH. It wasn’t until a whole month later, on January 11th, 2020, that China allegedly sent us the sequence to what would become known as SARS-CoV-2. Moderna claims, rather absurdly, that they developed a working vaccine from this sequence in under 48 hours (the author here claims they always had it).  

 

Stephane Bancel, the current CEO of Moderna, was formerly the CEO of bioMerieux, a French multinational corporation specializing in medical diagnostic tech, founded by one Alain Merieux. Alain Merieux was one of the individuals who was instrumental in the construction of the Wuhan Institute of Virology’s P4 lab.

 

https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/damn-you-hell-you-will-not-destroy-america-here-spartacus-covid-letter-thats-gone-viral

 

 

Enjoy and take from the conspiracy given in great detail all you want; trash it make fun of it with no facts I don't really care.  The core question about vaccine push, neglecting natural immunity, and no end game that should be clear as day (can't say return to normal) remains...

 

So ADE....I know ADE has been brought up here before (and obviously completely brushed off as nonsense); what's more likely for our dear leaders to be going to EXTREME lengths to get everyone vaccinated?

 

 

1.  They care about you

 

OR

 

2.  The fear a mutated version of this will kill 10s of millions because of the vaccine they forced you to take because they needed to play God with a virus that has a 99.98% survival rate.

 

I'm betting it's #2

[GaryPinC]

8 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Like you pretending it is provides true immunity. It does not and only you are pretending it is a permanent shot also 

It does provide true immunity, you are the one pretending because this is not the real question.  The real questions are in what circumstances does it provide true immunity and how long will it last?  These are the exact same questions with natural immunity.

[Orlando Tim]

9 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

WTF is "true immunity?" I've never heard that term. Please define it and then tell me where I used it. 

 

Get vaccinated because it works. Not a little. Not just against pre-Delta. It works vs all Covid extremely well both to resist infection and severity.

 

There's one message to spread: The vaccine works.

 

You can try to undermine it all you want but you don't know what you're talking about, as you consistently establish. 

True immunity would be the protection you get from the measles, polio, chickenpox vaccine. They are not perfect but 99% of people are immune. As for the rest, you keep claiming it works better than it does but that does not surprise me since you admitted you work for Pfizer 

1 hour ago, GaryPinC said:

It does provide true immunity, you are the one pretending because this is not the real question.  The real questions are in what circumstances does it provide true immunity and how long will it last?  These are the exact same questions with natural immunity.

Immunity does not have to be 500 years but 4 months does not cut it. The Covid shot simply lessens the illness for most people. If it provided real immunity then the vaccinated would be afraid of the unvaccinated. 

[OrangeBills]

19 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

 

I am thanks...feel 95% now, just a slight tiredness to joints...any other Non Covid year would not be thinking twice about it.

 

Gosh, we should really disrupt Life & the Economy for what is really the same old Cold/Flu (albeit hystericized by the Left/Media)

 

I have news for people...there haven't been enough human "generations" for Evolutionary process to catch our Immune Systems up for the fact that Life Spans have basically doubled from 38 years in 1880s to mid-70s in 2020s.  

 

Thus this common cold coronavirus could cause a problem for older people (and of course immuno-compromised)...we can not and should not ruin society for 2 years every time this happens -- they didn't in 1969 and yadda yadda, they just didn't have Social Media and Left media capable of freaking everyone out.

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

True immunity would be the protection you get from the measles, polio, chickenpox vaccine. They are not perfect but 99% of people are immune.

 

So this is not a scientific term but just a term you made up. And you said that I used it but refuse to provide the link, so I guess we'll add that to another thing you're wrong about. 

 

And another thing you're wrong about: 99% of people who get those vaccines are not immune. About 90% is the actual number. 

 

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

As for the rest, you keep claiming it works better than it does but that does not surprise me since you admitted you work for Pfizer 

 

You posited some theory from nowhere that I work for pharma. I went along with that for your benefit. You can't believe what Pfizer pays me to post here. PPP is one of their big influencer campaigns.  

 

I'm sorry that when I link to study after study about the effectiveness, long and short term, of the vaccines, it bothers you so much.

 

Nevertheless, let's do a short review of the data thus far since you don't seem to get it (Pfizer sent me these bullet points to share with you): The vaccines' effectiveness does wane to prevent infection a little for younger people and more for old people. The vaccines' ability to prevent severe complications remains high in all people with some more waning in old people. The vaccine remains very effective against Delta though less so than vs other variants. Natural immunity is effective too, and even more so with a vaccine on top of it. The vaccine is extremely safe (something like 3.5 billion doses so far). Everyone should get vaccinated, and if you don't believe me and you shouldn't because I'm just some guy on the Internet, ask your doctor if you should get vaccinated. 

 

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Immunity does not have to be 500 years but 4 months does not cut it. The Covid shot simply lessens the illness for most people. If it provided real immunity then the vaccinated would be afraid of the unvaccinated. 

 

More of you diminishing the vaccines' effectiveness. This is your schtick, Mr. Science. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Sundancer

[Orlando Tim]

7 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

So this is not a scientific term but just a term you made up. And you said that I used it but refuse to provide the link, so I guess we'll add that to another thing you're wrong about. 

 

And another thing you're wrong about: 99% of people who get those vaccines are not immune. About 90% is the actual number. 

 

 

You posited some theory from nowhere that I work for pharma. I went along with that for your benefit. You can't believe what Pfizer pays me to post here. PPP is one of their big influencer campaigns.  

 

I'm sorry that when I link to study after study about the effectiveness, long and short term, of the vaccines, it bothers you so much.

 

Nevertheless, let's do a short review of the data thus far since you don't seem to get it (Pfizer sent me these bullet points to share with you): The vaccines' effectiveness does wane to prevent infection a little for younger people and more for old people. The vaccines' ability to prevent severe complications remains high in all people with some more waning in old people. The vaccine remains very effective against Delta though less so than vs other variants. Natural immunity is effective too, and even more so with a vaccine on top of it. The vaccine is extremely safe (something like 3.5 billion doses so far). Everyone should get vaccinated, and if you don't believe me and you shouldn't because I'm just some guy on the Internet, ask your doctor if you should get vaccinated. 

 

 

More of you diminishing the vaccines' effectiveness. This is your schtick, Mr. Science. 

Polio and Measles are 97% effective but I would accept the true 90% of chickenpox. You also keep arguing against points I have never make, as I stated I have taken the jab, therefore I believe it is safe, but you keep pretending it is permanent protection. Maybe if you would tell me when you believe the effectiveness wanes we could have a real discussion. Lastly the 4 months comment was hyperbole but apparently that is above you since I answered that directly to you the other day.

[oldmanfan]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Polio and Measles are 97% effective but I would accept the true 90% of chickenpox. You also keep arguing against points I have never make, as I stated I have taken the jab, therefore I believe it is safe, but you keep pretending it is permanent protection. Maybe if you would tell me when you believe the effectiveness wanes we could have a real discussion. Lastly the 4 months comment was hyperbole but apparently that is above you since I answered that directly to you the other day.

Every virus is different.  We were able to get more effective vaccines against some of those you mention because they apparently don't mutate to the same degree as Covid does.  Covid I suspect will be more like the flu in that boosters will be needed yearly as new variants are found.  We should all be glad Covid is not HIV, a virus that has been impossible to vaccinate against.

 

[Irv]

Demented Biden and Hyena Harris are personally responsible for thousands of lost lives when they said the didn't trust the "Trump Vaccine".   How could anyone with a soul politicize something like that?  They both should be ashamed.  They both join Cuomo in the murderers hall of shame.  

 

What

A

Mess

 

 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Irv

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Polio and Measles are 97% effective but I would accept the true 90% of chickenpox.

 

So yes, you were wrong. 

 

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

You also keep arguing against points I have never make, as I stated I have taken the jab, therefore I believe it is safe, but you keep pretending it is permanent protection.

 

Link me where I said it's permanent? You can't, so I'll save you the trouble. Wrong again. 

 

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Maybe if you would tell me when you believe the effectiveness wanes we could have a real discussion.

 

Literally in the post you quoted, "The vaccines' effectiveness does wane"

 

Dude, you should quit this argument. 

 

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

 

Lastly the 4 months comment was hyperbole but apparently that is above you since I answered that directly to you the other day.

 

Well you said over and over again until two days ago that the vaccine doesn't work for most people after 6 months so when you say 4 months, who knows what you now believe? 

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

Every virus is different.  We were able to get more effective vaccines against some of those you mention because they apparently don't mutate to the same degree as Covid does.  Covid I suspect will be more like the flu in that boosters will be needed yearly as new variants are found.  We should all be glad Covid is not HIV, a virus that has been impossible to vaccinate against.

 

Covid is easier to wrangle because it’s dependent on the spikes for effectiveness and it does not mutate that quickly compared to others. The smart money is probably on a limited number of boosters before cases are effectively negligible. Delta did us a favor in some ways by driving out a lot of somewhat successful mutations but even delta is only so effective vs the vaccine, and most of its effectiveness is just because it’s so prevelant…and it is so prevelant especially in the US because we have so many people unvaccinated!
 

I think we are in the 50s now for most vaccinated country rankings. What a cluster. Govs like DeSantis are pounding the table about anti mask mandates when he could be dedicating more energy to talking to his base about the importance of vaccination. Trump holds a rally and gets booed for his wink-wink vaccination line but won’t stand up to his base on that. Failures of leadership abound on vaccination messaging. The CDC has been a disaster too. There should be one message from all leaders: Get vaccinated. And they should be messaging that exactly at the people who are resisting it, be they the GOP base or the black communities. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Sundancer

[oldmanfan]

24 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

Covid is easier to wrangle because it’s dependent on the spikes for effectiveness and it does not mutate that quickly compared to others. The smart money is probably on a limited number of boosters before cases are effectively negligible. Delta did us a favor in some ways by driving out a lot of somewhat successful mutations but even delta is only so effective vs the vaccine, and most of its effectiveness is just because it’s so prevelant…and it is so prevelant especially in the US because we have so many people unvaccinated!
 

I think we are in the 50s now for most vaccinated country rankings. What a cluster. Govs like DeSantis are pounding the table about anti mask mandates when he could be dedicating more energy to talking to his base about the importance of vaccination. Trump holds a rally and gets booed for his wink-wink vaccination line but won’t stand up to his base on that. Failures of leadership abound on vaccination messaging. The CDC has been a disaster too. There should be one message from all leaders: Get vaccinated. And they should be messaging that exactly at the people who are resisting it, be they the GOP base or the black communities. 

Agreed

[Beach]

i havent heard a good reason for me to get vaccinated yet.  but i will keep listening.

[Sundancer]

4 minutes ago, Beach said:

i havent heard a good reason for me to get vaccinated yet.  but i will keep listening.

650,000 dead Americans have relatives who would like to make the case for you to get vaccinated. 

[Orlando Tim]

49 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

So yes, you were wrong. 

 

 

Link me where I said it's permanent? You can't, so I'll save you the trouble. Wrong again. 

 

 

Literally in the post you quoted, "The vaccines' effectiveness does wane"

 

Dude, you should quit this argument. 

 

 

Well you said over and over again until two days ago that the vaccine doesn't work for most people after 6 months so when you say 4 months, who knows what you now believe? 

I am done arguing with a guy who never answers any questions but has admitted to being a Pfizer employee 

23 hours ago, Sundancer said:

Pfizer pays me handsomely. 

 

[Beach]

9 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

650,000 dead Americans have relatives who would like to make the case for you to get vaccinated. 

thats a reason for me to get vax?

[TSOL]

10 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

650,000 dead Americans have relatives who would like to make the case for you to get vaccinated. 

 

 

520,000 of them over 85 with pre existing co-morbidities 

[Beach]

if your vax requires me to get it too then i dont think it works well

[Orlando Tim]

2 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Every virus is different.  We were able to get more effective vaccines against some of those you mention because they apparently don't mutate to the same degree as Covid does.  Covid I suspect will be more like the flu in that boosters will be needed yearly as new variants are found.  We should all be glad Covid is not HIV, a virus that has been impossible to vaccinate against.

 

I stated this the other day. Covid is fast evolving and thankfully for 99.5% of the population not deadly. The shot is similar to the flu shot, we are protecting against some kinds but not all. 

[B-Man]

 

 

Very well put.

 

 

 

 

 

[plenzmd1]

1 hour ago, Sundancer said:

Covid is easier to wrangle because it’s dependent on the spikes for effectiveness and it does not mutate that quickly compared to others. The smart money is probably on a limited number of boosters before cases are effectively negligible. Delta did us a favor in some ways by driving out a lot of somewhat successful mutations but even delta is only so effective vs the vaccine, and most of its effectiveness is just because it’s so prevelant…and it is so prevelant especially in the US because we have so many people unvaccinated!
 

I think we are in the 50s now for most vaccinated country rankings. What a cluster. Govs like DeSantis are pounding the table about anti mask mandates when he could be dedicating more energy to talking to his base about the importance of vaccination. Trump holds a rally and gets booed for his wink-wink vaccination line but won’t stand up to his base on that. Failures of leadership abound on vaccination messaging. The CDC has been a disaster too. There should be one message from all leaders: Get vaccinated. And they should be messaging that exactly at the people who are resisting it, be they the GOP base or the black communities. 

yea, i am becoming more and more convinced this vaccine thing not working the way it should. All anecdotally...but 7 of 8 people i was with at WVU game two weekends ago now have had the coco..all vaxed.

 

My Bills seatmate lives in CO..early August had 5 houseguests in...5 of the 6 get coco..all vaxed, 6th was/is unvaxed and never tested positive.

 

At my golf club...pre-vaccines...we had like 10 cases of Covid from March 2020-August 2021 And trust me, there was no social distancing or  mask wearing etc at this good ole boys club in Richmond VA..ever...yes that is correct...i have yet to see one mask worn in my club since this thing started.

 

Last two months seems like over 30 cases...as far as we can tell...all vaxed. 

 

Granted, in the CDC stats, only 2 of those cases  count as breakthrough as only 2 people were hospitalized( 2 old guys at golf club)

 

And i don't want to hear "well, it lessens the symptoms"...then call it something else...but what we putting in our arms right now is anything BUT a vaccine.

 

Kinda glad i have the coc right now, will finally have some freaking protection that works moving forward.

 

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

I am done arguing with a guy who never answers any questions but has admitted to being a Pfizer employee 

 

 

I post stats and studies. You post anecdotes and misinformation, including about me being a Pfizer employee. You're a troll. 

1 hour ago, TSOL said:

 

 

520,000 of them over 85 with pre existing co-morbidities 

 

So...what? Eff em? 

24 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

yea, i am becoming more and more convinced this vaccine thing not working the way it should. All anecdotally...but 7 of 8 people i was with at WVU game two weekends ago now have had the coco..all vaxed.

 

My Bills seatmate lives in CO..early August had 5 houseguests in...5 of the 6 get coco..all vaxed, 6th was/is unvaxed and never tested positive.

 

At my golf club...pre-vaccines...we had like 10 cases of Covid from March 2020-August 2021 And trust me, there was no social distancing or  mask wearing etc at this good ole boys club in Richmond VA..ever...yes that is correct...i have yet to see one mask worn in my club since this thing started.

 

Last two months seems like over 30 cases...as far as we can tell...all vaxed. 

 

Granted, in the CDC stats, only 2 of those cases  count as breakthrough as only 2 people were hospitalized( 2 old guys at golf club)

 

And i don't want to hear "well, it lessens the symptoms"...then call it something else...but what we putting in our arms right now is anything BUT a vaccine.

 

Kinda glad i have the coc right now, will finally have some freaking protection that works moving forward.

 

 

Ya had me at "anecdotally." 

[plenzmd1]

27 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

I post stats and studies. You post anecdotes and misinformation, including about me being a Pfizer employee. You're a troll. 

 

So...what? Eff em? 

 

Ya had me at "anecdotally." 

Well, tell ya what. Show me the number of actual % cases of Covid  that are in fully vaxed people. 

What’s  that? Ya can’t cause the CDC only counts someone who gets hospitized and or dies as a breakthrough case? 
 

So we could be at 10% cases in fully vaxed, or 50%… wonder why we don’t freaking know. 
 

So if you quoting CDC about the effectiveness of the vaccine, rest assured that is “ anecdotally “ as well. 
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.propublica.org/article/the-cdc-only-tracks-a-fraction-of-breakthrough-covid-19-infections-even-as-cases-surge/amp

 

 

man, critical thinking and questioning has left the building in this Covid crap. 

 

Edited September 28, 2021 by plenzmd1

[Irv]

58 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

yea, i am becoming more and more convinced this vaccine thing not working the way it should. All anecdotally...but 7 of 8 people i was with at WVU game two weekends ago now have had the coco..all vaxed.

 

My Bills seatmate lives in CO..early August had 5 houseguests in...5 of the 6 get coco..all vaxed, 6th was/is unvaxed and never tested positive.

 

At my golf club...pre-vaccines...we had like 10 cases of Covid from March 2020-August 2021 And trust me, there was no social distancing or  mask wearing etc at this good ole boys club in Richmond VA..ever...yes that is correct...i have yet to see one mask worn in my club since this thing started.

 

Last two months seems like over 30 cases...as far as we can tell...all vaxed. 

 

Granted, in the CDC stats, only 2 of those cases  count as breakthrough as only 2 people were hospitalized( 2 old guys at golf club)

 

And i don't want to hear "well, it lessens the symptoms"...then call it something else...but what we putting in our arms right now is anything BUT a vaccine.

 

Kinda glad i have the coc right now, will finally have some freaking protection that works moving forward.

 

 

Agree with this.  Went on fishing trip wiht six guys.  Five of the six tested positive and had symptoms.  All were fully vaccinated.  These vaccines are not working or they are quickly losing efficacy.  And we have Demented Biden and Forgetful Fauci blowing smoke up our asses.  Dopey Joe has totally screwed up the COVID situation.  

 

What

A

Mess 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Irv