Allen’s weapons relative to Tenn/KC

[SCBills]

One thing that has stuck out to me, is how we still lag behind the elite teams when it comes to “weapons”.   
 

Coming into the season, we certainly didn’t expect to have no running game and we also thought Knox would make a jump.  
 

So far, we have no running game and Knox has not made the jump.  
 

That leaves Allen with our WR’s and a solid OL.    

 

However, you essentially take Brown out of the equation with his injury these past two weeks and we’re left with Diggs, Beasley and Davis as Josh’s “weapons”.  
 

Tannehill was down Davis and Humphries, but still had AJ Brown, Jonnu Smith and Derrick Henry.   
 

Mahomes down Watkins, but still has Tyreek Hill, Travis Kelce and CEH.  
 

Diggs is a beast, but when we’re playing the elite, and our defense has been trash... we suddenly don’t look that scary when Brown is out and Allen has Diggs, Beasley and a rookie, against teams who also have multiple weapons at WR, plus a monster tight end and upper echelon running back.  

 

We need to be able to sustain a skill position injury, and right now, the lack of speed opposite Diggs is evident when we have no tight end threat or running game to speak of.  
 

The elite teams though.... they do, and they can sustain an injury to a WR2.  
 

Moss/Singletary/Knox... anyone involved in the run game.  Step up, because Allen and the WR room can’t, and shouldn’t have to, carry the offense every game. 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2020 by SCBills

[Rc2catch]

Our weapons are fine. Allen has to get them the ball. Wentz is throwing to grocery baggers out there and they are scheming them open for him. 
Kroft can be used, McKenzie has flashes, good teams fit their scheme to their talent. Our screen game hasn’t been working. AGAIN.  
Difference for me the first 4 games vs the last two is Allen had forever and a day to throw those first four games. Now that time in the pocket is less he’s rushing and not setting his feet correctly. We had plenty of chances to make plays the last two games and put on an offensive show. We did not. 
Ball placement is still spotty. 
And if you want a run game, you gotta have run attempts. We’re near the bottom of the league in rushing attempts. Could you imagine if Tennessee only ran Henry 8-10 times a game and he didn’t break one? Their run game would look like crap too. 

[Penfield45]

1 minute ago, Rc2catch said:

Our weapons are fine. Allen has to get them the ball. Wentz is throwing to grocery baggers out there and they are scheming them open for him. 
Kroft can be used, McKenzie has flashes, good teams fit their scheme to their talent. Our screen game hasn’t been working. AGAIN.  
Difference for me the first 4 games vs the last two is Allen had forever and a day to throw those first four games. Now that time in the pocket is less he’s rushing and not setting his feet correctly. We had plenty of chances to make plays the last two games and put on an offensive show. We did not. 
Ball placement is still spotty. 
And if you want a run game, you gotta have run attempts. We’re near the bottom of the league in rushing attempts. Could you imagine if Tennessee only ran Henry 8-10 times a game and he didn’t break one? Their run game would look like crap too. 

 

the deeper rooted issue seems to be this coaching staff has no idea what they are doing. when it comes to big game they constantly get out coached and can't create a successful gameplan. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

They obviously realize it, otherwise they wouldn’t have been After Bell

[BurpleBull]

I think Feliciano back would make a world of difference in the run game. Kick Ford back to RG and play Feliciano at LG. 

 

That would alleviate the O-line issues I think, then it's on Moss from there.

 

I wasn't feeling the Moss pick at all, because of his lack of breakaway speed paired with Singletary's didn't make sense to me. 

 

I warmed up after repeatedly watching his highlights and listening on the intricacies that possibly made Moss better than I was giving him credit for. 

 

I'm hopeful that Moss will turn it on and show why so many people in here wanted him drafted.

[Rc2catch]

4 minutes ago, Penfield45 said:

 

the deeper rooted issue seems to be this coaching staff has no idea what they are doing. when it comes to big game they constantly get out coached and can't create a successful gameplan. 

You clearly have an agenda to fill with this staff. How many staffs in the league are better? 5? 10? 
And when you take over and fire these guys who you replacing them with? 

[Chicken Boo]

Haven't the faintest idea why we don't get Mckenzie the ball in space.  I'm sure he's capable of more than end arounds.

[Penfield45]

2 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

You clearly have an agenda to fill with this staff. How many staffs in the league are better? 5? 10? 
And when you take over and fire these guys who you replacing them with? 

 

I'm not advocating firing them lol. I want them to show some improvement first. Maybe McD take over the playcalling and we replace Fraizer in the offseason (he isn't that great imo) 

 

right now we are the worst 3rd quarter team in the league. that is 100% on coaching. 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2020 by Penfield45

[Paup 1995MVP]

1 minute ago, Penfield45 said:

 

the deeper rooted issue seems to be this coaching staff has no idea what they are doing. when it comes to big game they constantly get out coached and can't create a successful gameplan. 

Best post I have read on here in ages Penfield!!  (I had to come out of retirement to respond)  We get bullied.  We play scared.  And we look completely unprepared against any top 12-15 team.  (The Eagles game last year comes to mind right away.  A combination of the Titans and Chiefs game.  Totally run over.  Not prepared.  And played scared) 

[whatdrought]

I mean, they could try throwing to Beasely before the 4th Quarter.

[Rc2catch]

Just now, Penfield45 said:

 

I'm not advocating firing them lol. I want them to show some improvement first. Maybe McD take over the playcalling and we replace Fraizer in the offseason (he isn't that great imo) 

 

right now we are the worst 3rd quarter team in the league. that is 100% on coaching. 

 

 

Mcd has shown improvement. He’s conservative, but we’ve seen him show more aggression this season in some instances. When he’s confident his team will execute he doesn’t coach as scared. It’s not like he’s clueless that the defense has been bad. I think they have proven if players don’t buy in and do their job they’ll replace them with someone who will. Maybe we can’t replace some of these guys mid season but maybe the light can still turn on for some. Since the day he started here he’s gotten the absolute most from his players, they’ve played above their talent level. That’s not the case this season for whatever reason. I can’t see any scenario after that KC game Frazier and any and everyone on that defense did not get chewed out. They are all embarrassed, and if they’re not then they won’t be in this league much longer. 

[SCBills]

28 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

Our weapons are fine. Allen has to get them the ball. Wentz is throwing to grocery baggers out there and they are scheming them open for him. 
Kroft can be used, McKenzie has flashes, good teams fit their scheme to their talent. Our screen game hasn’t been working. AGAIN.  
Difference for me the first 4 games vs the last two is Allen had forever and a day to throw those first four games. Now that time in the pocket is less he’s rushing and not setting his feet correctly. We had plenty of chances to make plays the last two games and put on an offensive show. We did not. 
Ball placement is still spotty. 
And if you want a run game, you gotta have run attempts. We’re near the bottom of the league in rushing attempts. Could you imagine if Tennessee only ran Henry 8-10 times a game and he didn’t break one? Their run game would look like crap too. 

Our weapons are fine, when everyone is healthy and plays to their potential.  
 

They are not fine when we have no backup pitches when a team hits our fastball, or perhaps more relatable to the situation at hand, our fastball is weakened by injury.  
 

Wentz’s Eagles are garbage... why would we compare ourselves to them?  
 

Im specifically comparing our weapons to those we are, hopefully, competing with.... 
 

Tennessee - Brown, Davis, Humphries, Smith, Henry

 

KC - Hill, Hardman, Watkins, Kelce, CEH

 

Pitt - Juju, Claypool, Johnson, Conner

 

Browns - OBJ, Landry, Hooper, Chubb, Hunt

 

Ravens - The best RB’s and TE’s $$$ can buy

 

Raiders - Ruggs, Edwards, Waller, Jacobs 

 

Bills - Diggs, Brown, Beasley..... (what else?)

 

Bills and Ravens are lowest on the totem pole with playmakers.  Unless Moss/Singletary/Knox/Kroft step up, our playmakers are not in line with the best of the best.  ....that becomes very evident when Brown goes down and we face two of those aforementioned teams.  
 

 

Edited October 20, 2020 by SCBills

[JoPoy88]

Wow we digging up THIS excuse this year too? My goodness. 

[ngbills]

It is more about how we use our weapons. Not many teams have WR talent like Diggs, Brown and Beasley then throw in a G Davis and McK. Our TE's are weak, butb this staff seemed high on Knox and Kroft. Had some upgrades and they passed on guys like Henry, Hooper, etc. Same goes with RB. Could have upgraded from Singletary, Moss, Yeldon but this is the group they wanted. They liked the Singletary / Moss combo. There were a number of better options in the draft or FA. Gurley, Gordon and Peterson all available. Dobbins, Gibson or Kelley in draft. 

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

Wow we digging up THIS excuse this year too? My goodness. 

Not an excuse.  Allen needs to be better.  Our defense is in shambles.  
 

It can also be noted that we vastly overrate our weapons due to never having any.  
 

Six games in with Moss/Singletary/Knox not making the jump yet and the playmakers we thought we had, aren’t necessarily that impressive when compared to other playoff teams.   
 

Our WR room is elite when healthy... but currently, that’s our only pitch, and that’s not going to get  it done unless Allen goes back to MVP status. 
 

Edited October 20, 2020 by SCBills

[Mango]

23 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

I mean, they could try throwing to Beasely before the 4th Quarter.

Recently Beasley has been a part of the super secret playbook that we refuse to use. This playbook contains all plays designed for Yeldon/his pads, Jersey, cleats, etc, slants, and the rest of the plays for McKenzie. 

[JoPoy88]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

Not an excuse.  Allen needs to be better.  Our defense is in shambles.  
 

It can also be noted that we vastly overrate our weapons due to never having any.  
 

Six games in with Moss/Singletary/Knox not making the jump yet and the playmakers we thought we had, aren’t necessarily that impressive when compared to other playoff teams.   
 

Our WR room is elite when healthy... but currently, that’s our only pitch, and that’s not going to get  it done unless Allen goes back to MVP status. 
 

Moss has been hurt basically all year. Not sure what kind of jump you’re expecting him to make injured. The OL can’t run block for Singletary. Knox has been supremely average and trending towards bad; expecting him to improve at this point is folly. 
 

All that said, the Bills have more than enough very good weapons in the passing game. Diggs/Beasley/Davis/Brown (who’s not healthy). Even Kroft is playing better.
 

You can point and look at what CEH did against buffalo and say “elite weapon” but in reality CEH has been pretty pedestrian outside of week 1 and playing against our non-existent defense.

 

sorry I’ve been hearing this same excuse for Allen’s play for 2+ seasons now and I just can’t entertain it anymore. 

[Rc2catch]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

Our weapons are fine, when everyone is healthy and plays to their potential.  
 

They are not fine when we have no backup pitches when a team hits our fastball, or perhaps more relatable to the situation at hand, our fastball is weakened by injury.  
 

Wentz’s Eagles are garbage... why would we compare ourselves to them?  
 

Im specifically comparing our weapons to those we are, hopefully, competing with.... 
 

Tennessee - Brown, Davis, Humphries, Smith, Henry

 

KC - Hill, Hardman, Watkins, Kelce, CEH

 

Pitt - Juju, Claypool, Johnson, Conner

 

Browns - OBJ, Landry, Hooper, Chubb, Hunt

 

Ravens - The best RB’s and TE’s $$$ can buy

 

Bills - Diggs, Brown, Beasley..... (what else?)

 

Bills and Ravens are lowest on the totem pole with playmakers.  Unless Moss/Singletary/Knox/Kroft step up, our playmakers are not in line with the best of the best.  ....that becomes very evident when Brown goes down and we face two of those aforementioned teams.  

Lol you’re talking crazy. 
I specifically listed the Eagles because despite a losing record they have done a fantastic job once again scheming no name practice squad players open. Similar to a couple weeks ago when Green Bay without Adams schemed running backs open in the pass game all night long. Proving with a little coaching and game planning you can make lots of players weapons. 

The Bills as we currently stand should be able to march out Davis, McKenzie and Roberts and STILL get production from them and utilize them as weapons. Because why???   Good coaches fit their scheme to their players. 
You literally just put the ravens have the best running backs and tight ends money can buy lol... They most certainly do not. They have a wonderful SCHEME that works to their current players strengths. 
The Cleveland browns just benched their #1 draft pick because he can’t even use his weapons. They could SCHEME those weapons open against dallas but not against Pittsburgh and look at the difference. 
 

The run game can never work weekly when you only have 10-20 attempts in a game. Nobody gets in rhythm. 
So before we continue, those teams you listed. Go look them up in the run game. Almost all of them top 10 in attempts, yards per game and yards per carry. 
 

We are bottom 5 in almost everything. Take Allen’s rushing out and we’re the worst rushing team in the league probably I’m not doing that homework.  But we also have zero dedication to  running. Teams don’t even have to defend run against us they can stop it with their front 4, we’re throwing and they know it. And it shows. Allen with great mechanics and ball placement the first 4 games wins the last 2. That’s the reality. 

 

[Dablitzkrieg]

58 minutes ago, SCBills said:

One thing that has stuck out to me, is how we still lag behind the elite teams when it comes to “weapons”.   
 

Coming into the season, we certainly didn’t expect to have no running game and we also thought Knox would make a jump.  
 

So far, we have no running game and Knox has not made the jump.  
 

That leaves Allen with our WR’s and a solid OL.    

 

However, you essentially take Brown out of the equation with his injury these past two weeks and we’re left with Diggs, Beasley and Davis as Josh’s “weapons”.  
 

Tannehill was down Davis and Humphries, but still had AJ Brown, Jonnu Smith and Derrick Henry.   
 

Mahomes down Watkins, but still has Tyreek Hill, Travis Kelce and CEH.  
 

Diggs is a beast, but when we’re playing the elite, and our defense has been trash... we suddenly don’t look that scary when Brown is out and Allen has Diggs, Beasley and a rookie, against teams who also have multiple weapons at WR, plus a monster tight end and upper echelon running back.  

 

We need to be able to sustain a skill position injury, and right now, the lack of speed opposite Diggs is evident when we have no tight end threat or running game to speak of.  
 

The elite teams though.... they do, and they can sustain an injury to a WR2.  
 

Moss/Singletary/Knox... anyone involved in the run game.  Step up, because Allen and the WR room can’t, and shouldn’t have to, carry the offense every game. 

 

 

What on the hell are you talking about?  You seriously think they don't have weapons?  This is ridiculous.  You have an as of late, regressing and inaccurate QB, couples with an injured deep threat and ***** oline play. 

[SCBills]

8 minutes ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

What on the hell are you talking about?  You seriously think they don't have weapons?  This is ridiculous.  You have an as of late, regressing and inaccurate QB, couples with an injured deep threat and ***** oline play. 

You sound like you’re gearing up for a political debate by completely misrepresenting my position right out the gate.  
 

Clearly I don’t believe we have no weapons when I stated we have an elite WR room, when healthy.  
 

I honestly have no clue how some of you have watched what I’ve watched for six weeks and think we have the weaponry needed to go up against the weapons the other playoff teams have.  I’m not saying they can’t get better... they have to get better or this team will be fighting tooth and nail to make the playoffs given the defensive dumpster fire.  
 

We can’t withstand an injury to our WR2.   Those other teams can.  And the reason they can is because they have weapons at RB and TE.   TE can stay strugglesville, but it’s imperative that we develop a running game.  I thought that was wildly apparent but somehow it isn’t to some.. A lot of it is the OL isn’t great at run blocking right now, but Singletary hasn’t made much of the chances they have provided either. 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2020 by SCBills