dpberr Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 What are you willing to give up in order to be "safe" from the germs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 4 minutes ago, dpberr said: What are you willing to give up in order to be "safe" from the germs? Nothing. It should all be voluntary unless the hospitals break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 1 minute ago, shoshin said: Nothing. It should all be voluntary unless the hospitals break. Isn’t that exactly what the Feds have been promoting since March? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Isn’t that exactly what the Feds have been promoting since March? I haven't seen any consistent messaging at all from Trump in terms of promoting intelligent behavior. Large indoor maskless gatherings are not recommended by any credible scientist. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 53 minutes ago, shoshin said: I haven't seen any consistent messaging at all from Trump in terms of promoting intelligent behavior. Large indoor maskless gatherings are not recommended by any credible scientist. Well you clearly weren’t paying attention then...but it’ll al be better with Joe at the podium. He’s known for being a clear communicator. 😳 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 36 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Well you clearly weren’t paying attention then...but it’ll al be better with Joe at the podium. He’s known for being a clear communicator. 😳 I paid attention to Trump’s many large group events. I liked Herman Cain and I never mocked Biden’s small gatherings. Biden may mess up a mask here or there but he is unlikely to be holding large non distant maskless events for a while. And he’s already acting consistently with his messaging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 1 hour ago, shoshin said: I haven't seen any consistent messaging at all from Trump in terms of promoting intelligent behavior. Large indoor maskless gatherings are not recommended by any credible scientist. And? Doesn't mean we have to ban them. At all. They can recommend that's it. When any of them speak with a "we can't" do A B or C certainty based on what we know about the virus, they should be locked up in their basement and kept there till we say it's safe for them to come out due to the unfathomable damage they've caused 100s of millions of people around the world. 100 million people are going to be immunized in this country in the next 6 months. If we aren't full open by Memorial Day this wasn't about the virus (it never was anyway). We're done here. All "mandates" that clearly work should be lifted by March. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 15 minutes ago, shoshin said: I paid attention to Trump’s many large group events. I liked Herman Cain and I never mocked Biden’s small gatherings. Biden may mess up a mask here or there but he is unlikely to be holding large non distant maskless events for a while. And he’s already acting consistently with his messaging. Let me try and explain it to you. Trump worked off the basic idea that the virus was going to be a local problem with peaks and valleys across the nation, weeks and months. He felt the Federal Government’s role was to manufacture supplies and a vaccine. But he wanted local control and response to remain with the States. He was extremely consistent from Day One. You and I can disagree that it was a good or bad approach but there’s NO DEBATING what he was trying to do and the consistency of his messaging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 45 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: And? Doesn't mean we have to ban them. At all. They can recommend that's it. Trump could have lead by example. He chose to do the opposite of what was recommended by every scientist and send mixed messages on how to control this. 45 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: 100 million people are going to be immunized in this country in the next 6 months. If we aren't full open by Memorial Day this wasn't about the virus (it never was anyway). If there are 100M people vaccinated by June, yes, we would see a massive drop in numbers. We should see massive drops long before that if we immunize the elderly and at risk by March. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 8 minutes ago, shoshin said: Trump could have lead by example. He chose to do the opposite of what was recommended by every scientist and send mixed messages on how to control this. A President has a lot on his or her plate. While you seem to be singularly focused on the Virus. The President can’t be. He’s trying to walk a balancing act between shutting down and opening up. Priests and scientists aren’t the elected leaders of the country.....thank goodness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 8 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: A President has a lot on his or her plate. While you seem to be singularly focused on the Virus. The President can’t be. He’s trying to walk a balancing act between shutting down and opening up. Priests and scientists aren’t the elected leaders of the country.....thank goodness! All he has to do is follow the recommendations set by scientists and not host giant rallies. Do you believe because of everything on his plate, he forgot this? What...with 3000 Americans dying per day and all? Just slipped his mind? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 54 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Let me try and explain it to you. Trump worked off the basic idea that the virus was going to be a local problem with peaks and valleys across the nation, weeks and months. He felt the Federal Government’s role was to manufacture supplies and a vaccine. But he wanted local control and response to remain with the States. He was extremely consistent from Day One. You and I can disagree that it was a good or bad approach but there’s NO DEBATING what he was trying to do and the consistency of his messaging. It's the role he chose because that's what the Constitution dictates. Flu season isn't under the Federal government's jurisdiction. Deciding to be 6 feet from everyone in masks that don't work and no one knows how to use anyway are not under his jurisdiction. So because the left knows all this, in order to blame Trump anyway, they turned it into he didn't set an example. Ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 https://www.mediaite.com/news/white-house-official-reportedly-had-foot-lower-leg-amputated-after-contracting-covid-19/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q-baby! Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 21 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: It's the role he chose because that's what the Constitution dictates. Flu season isn't under the Federal government's jurisdiction. Deciding to be 6 feet from everyone in masks that don't work and no one knows how to use anyway are not under his jurisdiction. So because the left knows all this, in order to blame Trump anyway, they turned it into he didn't set an example. Ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said: A President has a lot on his or her plate. While you seem to be singularly focused on the Virus. The President can’t be. He’s trying to walk a balancing act between shutting down and opening up. Priests and scientists aren’t the elected leaders of the country.....thank goodness! No excuse. At all. All presidents have a lot on their plate; that’s the job. And when prioritizing you should put a global pandemic near the top of the list, right? Instead he decided to lie to the American people as shown by the Woodward interview, and when asked what responsibility he had he said he took no responsibility. He abdicated his duties as president. Why do you try to defend that? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: No excuse. At all. All presidents have a lot on their plate; that’s the job. And when prioritizing you should put a global pandemic near the top of the list, right? Instead he decided to lie to the American people as shown by the Woodward interview, and when asked what responsibility he had he said he took no responsibility. He abdicated his duties as president. Why do you try to defend that? You know who we do have on record as actually lying? The WHO. "No human to human transmission." - - January 15, sometime around when Trump told Woodward in the middle of his impeachment. One month later in response to the China ban, the 3rd most powerful person on the planet (Pelosi) was telling everyone to "hug a Chinese" bc racism. If you believe she didn't know what the "threat" was you're delusional. Discuss..... Because I already know you've been duped by everyone. Trump included. Everyone is lying. And the most important thing to Democrats is you need to know Trump sucks. And that's where their interests in everything about the virus and our response stops. Which means you should never take these people seriously. Ever. People like this are begging.....begging to be legit enslaved or worse Cambodia 1975 style. They even went so far in 2020 to mock people that dared questions the line between liberty and pandemic response. Can you imagine being someone like that??? Edited December 14, 2020 by Big Blitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 9 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: No excuse. At all. All presidents have a lot on their plate; that’s the job. And when prioritizing you should put a global pandemic near the top of the list, right? Instead he decided to lie to the American people as shown by the Woodward interview, and when asked what responsibility he had he said he took no responsibility. He abdicated his duties as president. Why do you try to defend that? Oh brother ...he has a lot on his plate on the PANDEMIC! His job is to balance opening and closing. If you want to stay closed old man...by all means do so! Nobody is stopping you. He performed his role admirably. And now you’ll have a vaccine, instead of waiting years for committees to be formed just so they can talk about a vaccine being made. And the appropriate response would be Thank You Mr President Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEATHER DOT COM Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: His job is to balance opening and closing. He left this up to the states and was applauded for it by his supporters. Are you saying he did not do his job? Finally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Maiden Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: Let me try and explain it to you. Trump worked off the basic idea that the virus was going to be a local problem with peaks and valleys across the nation, weeks and months. He felt the Federal Government’s role was to manufacture supplies and a vaccine. But he wanted local control and response to remain with the States. He was extremely consistent from Day One. You and I can disagree that it was a good or bad approach but there’s NO DEBATING what he was trying to do and the consistency of his messaging. Hummm.....Liberate Michigan....Liberate Minnesota....Liberate Virginia......those were his tweets when Dems States were shutting down......Aimed at making those States job to " control " the virus much harder......I don't remember seeing Liberate Texas.....or any other tweets when the red States were starting to close down.......Consistent ?... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 22 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: You know who we do have on record as actually lying? The WHO. "No human to human transmission." - - January 15, sometime around when Trump told Woodward in the middle of his impeachment. One month later in response to the China ban, the 3rd most powerful person on the planet (Pelosi) was telling everyone to "hug a Chinese" bc racism. If you believe she didn't know what the "threat" was you're delusional. Discuss..... Because I already know you've been duped by everyone. Trump included. Everyone is lying. And the most important thing to Democrats is you need to know Trump sucks. And that's where their interests in everything about the virus and our response stops. Which means you should never take these people seriously. Ever. People like this are begging.....begging to be legit enslaved or worse Cambodia 1975 style. They even went so far in 2020 to mock people that dared questions the line between liberty and pandemic response. Can you imagine being someone like that??? You and the other gentleman refuse, absolutely refuse, to acknowledge that the president has the ultimate responsibility in a national crisis. Regardless of party, regardless of the nature of the event. That is their job. I cannot think of another president in the history of this country who said, when asked if he takes responsibility, said no. For a crisis that affects the entire nation. If something similar happens the next 4 years and Biden shirks responsibility you’ll hear the same from me. How you can defend the kind of nonsense our now official soon to be ex-president is beyond me and most clear thinking Americans. 29 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Oh brother ...he has a lot on his plate on the PANDEMIC! His job is to balance opening and closing. If you want to stay closed old man...by all means do so! Nobody is stopping you. He performed his role admirably. And now you’ll have a vaccine, instead of waiting years for committees to be formed just so they can talk about a vaccine being made. And the appropriate response would be Thank You Mr President First I have no problem and never did opening things after the initial concern about hospitals being overrun. And that could have been done safely if the president actually supported the recommendations of distancing and masks. Instead he ridiculed masks and such and refused to act as a leader. And now 300,000 people are dead. I do give credit for Warp Speed; although Pfizer did not take government resources to develop theirs placing a priority of vaccine development was good. I get mine Sunday. I am stunned at the level of excuse making for a leader who did not want to lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: No excuse. At all. All presidents have a lot on their plate; that’s the job. And when prioritizing you should put a global pandemic near the top of the list, right? Instead he decided to lie to the American people as shown by the Woodward interview, and when asked what responsibility he had he said he took no responsibility. He abdicated his duties as president. Why do you try to defend that? I could have sworn the science dudes all said millions were going to die in our country alone. It seems to me you guys just keep moving the goalposts. Prediction: this virus will begin to slow down roughy May 1. It won’t be because of the onset of spring and the normal slowdown or seasonal flu and the like. Btw—Trump explained his comments from the Woodward sessions. Thank God some of the numbnuts weren’t around when FDR gave his famous “we have nothing to fear but fear itself” speech. Fundamentally and demonstrably a lie. One of the other fears (beside fear of fear) was that the forces of the Imperial Japanese Army would be incinerating tens of millions and enslaving those that were left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 (edited) 32 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I could have sworn the science dudes all said millions were going to die in our country alone. It seems to me you guys just keep moving the goalposts. Prediction: this virus will begin to slow down roughy May 1. It won’t be because of the onset of spring and the normal slowdown or seasonal flu and the like. Btw—Trump explained his comments from the Woodward sessions. Thank God some of the numbnuts weren’t around when FDR gave his famous “we have nothing to fear but fear itself” speech. Fundamentally and demonstrably a lie. One of the other fears (beside fear of fear) was that the forces of the Imperial Japanese Army would be incinerating tens of millions and enslaving those that were left. You are unfortunately being deliberately obtuse. The science dudes as you put it said millions would did if no measures were talent to try and control the spread. And the measures the science dudes said initially were to quarantine to bend the curve and keep hospitals from being overrun, and to do things like distance and hand washing and wear masks. Thankfully enough people listened to the experts and not the guy in the White House saying not to wear masks; it kept the death rate down to “only” 300k. And don’t even try the “but Fauci said not to wear masks garbage( he said that early on when PPE needed to be in the hands of front line workers and before the research showed beneficial effects of masks to slow the spread. And as for Trump explains his Woodward comments? The ones where he claimed he didn’t want to panic people? Being honest and straightforward with the public in the midst of a crisis does not panic people, it gives them resolve. He lied, he can try to couch it any way he wants but he lied. And that is not acceptable. And now he’s gone. Good. Edited December 15, 2020 by oldmanfan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Maiden Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 13 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: And as for Trump explains his Woodward comments? The ones where he claimed he didn’t want to panic people? Being honest and straightforward with the public in the midst of a crisis does not panic people, it gives them resolve. He lied, he can try to couch it any way he wants but he lied. And that is not acceptable. And now he’s gone. Good. His explanation was that he basically did not trust Americans to do the right thing....he lied to protect our fragile state of mind....this, coming from Trump.....cannot make this stuff up !.....To even pretend to think that Trump did a good job on Covid is just silly..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 16 minutes ago, Iron Maiden said: His explanation was that he basically did not trust Americans to do the right thing....he lied to protect our fragile state of mind....this, coming from Trump.....cannot make this stuff up !.....To even pretend to think that Trump did a good job on Covid is just silly..... Unfortunately the media defined "good job" as no cases. Dr. Birx said in March 200K dead by end of the year if we did everything PERFECTLY. So we got a 90/100 on the test. To think anything else as the cases! soar "and go up up and up" (Fauci gleefully describing America v Europe in October....pos) is really peak sheep planet earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Maiden Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, Big Blitz said: Unfortunately the media defined "good job" as no cases. Dr. Birx said in March 200K dead by end of the year if we did everything PERFECTLY. So we got a 90/100 on the test. To think anything else as the cases! soar "and go up up and up" (Fauci gleefully describing America v Europe in October....pos) is really peak sheep planet earth. We didn't need to be " perfect " to avoid that extra 100K dead...which, might be close to 150K by Jan 1st if things do not improve....to actively deride the masks wearing and making it political...is just one of the many ways Trump made the situation harder to manage...ignoring his own CDC time after time..etc... Edited December 15, 2020 by Iron Maiden 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 We went from 15 days to indefinite mitigation until full community immunity and complete eradication of the virus. In a world with let's see........7 billion people that should be in about 15 years or so or never. Sheep. You asked and Karen'd for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 Ivermechtin? Never heard of it. Just get me all the novel drugs no questions asked. Don't ask questions. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I could have sworn the science dudes all said millions were going to die in our country alone. It seems to me you guys just keep moving the goalposts. Prediction: this virus will begin to slow down roughy May 1. It won’t be because of the onset of spring and the normal slowdown or seasonal flu and the like. Btw—Trump explained his comments from the Woodward sessions. Thank God some of the numbnuts weren’t around when FDR gave his famous “we have nothing to fear but fear itself” speech. Fundamentally and demonstrably a lie. One of the other fears (beside fear of fear) was that the forces of the Imperial Japanese Army would be incinerating tens of millions and enslaving those that were left. Is it possible for you to criticize Trump without whataboutism or dodging? Not on the laughable election court challenges. Not on calling state legislators to send slates of electors that would betray voters. Anf not on Trump holding rallies in a pandemic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 And this is exactly why the federal government's role during flu season is....nothing. We told you exactly what the lunatics on the left would do if Trump broke Federalism by expanding powers to the executive over a cold. Everything will be this: Joe Biden Declares Gun Violence a ‘National Health Crisis’ in Sandy Hook Remembrance https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/12/14/joe-biden-declares-gun-violence-a-national-health-crisis-in-sandy-hook-remembrance/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 Trump’s maskless rallies and consequences thereof. The president has to meet people. The president has to travel. The president does not have to have parties and giant rallies with minimal protections in place. I wonder if Bailey got the Regeneron cocktail that Trump got for himself, Rudy, and Christie. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 This is the kind of leadership we need. The optimism we all need. The hope we all need. ALBANY — If the current rate of COVID-19 infection stays steady, Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo said the state will be forced to once again institute a shutdown in which all nonessential businesses are closed. “All the numbers across the world are going up; all the numbers across the nation are going up — welcome to the holiday season," Cuomo said in his Monday briefing. “If we don’t change the trajectory we’re going to go to shut down, and then your business is going to close.” https://www.timesunion.com/news/article/New-York-will-shut-down-again-if-current-15800647.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: You are unfortunately being deliberately obtuse. The science dudes as you put it said millions would did if no measures were talent to try and control the spread. And the measures the science dudes said initially were to quarantine to bend the curve and keep hospitals from being overrun, and to do things like distance and hand washing and wear masks. Thankfully enough people listened to the experts and not the guy in the White House saying not to wear masks; it kept the death rate down to “only” 300k. And don’t even try the “but Fauci said not to wear masks garbage( he said that early on when PPE needed to be in the hands of front line workers and before the research showed beneficial effects of masks to slow the spread. And as for Trump explains his Woodward comments? The ones where he claimed he didn’t want to panic people? Being honest and straightforward with the public in the midst of a crisis does not panic people, it gives them resolve. He lied, he can try to couch it any way he wants but he lied. And that is not acceptable. And now he’s gone. Good. I’m not being obtuse, I’m just chopping it up on a message board trying to make sense of a shitton of information and misinformation from a variety of different sources. I’ve been clear on the things that bother me, and personally I think your Trump hatred blinds you to rational discussion on this whole calamity. For you, it’s all Trump all the time. To me, if everything you believe is true, Fuacci et al $#@&ed us all over. He’s an expert across the board, again, why the f wasn’t he out screaming to keep the masses assembled in the streets? The guy was impotent at best, and doing his little song and dance about “mischief” when he was caught violating social distance protocol and mask discipline at the baseball game did not help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 29 minutes ago, shoshin said: Is it possible for you to criticize Trump without whataboutism or dodging? Not on the laughable election court challenges. Not on calling state legislators to send slates of electors that would betray voters. Anf not on Trump holding rallies in a pandemic. Yes, it’s possible for me to criticize Trump. As for the tired old whataboutism (how boring it must be to sit and wait for the cliche buzzer to sound), oldmanfan talked about presidential leadership in definite terms. Someone else made a Pearl Harbor reference, and I was reminded of FDR’s powerful speech was obviously a blatant lie. On the Trump rallies, to this day I’m hard pressed to understand why folks in your camp mention the rallies by steering clear of blaming people that took to the street by the tens of thousands this summer. It’s fairly clear the people who attended (I did not) felt a certain kinship with the protestors, yet one group is excoriated while the other is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 No way - 300,000 dead Americans and Trumpholes are the only one saying Trump killed it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 9 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I could have sworn the science dudes all said millions were going to die in our country alone. It seems to me you guys just keep moving the goalposts. Prediction: this virus will begin to slow down roughy May 1. It won’t be because of the onset of spring and the normal slowdown or seasonal flu and the like. Btw—Trump explained his comments from the Woodward sessions. Thank God some of the numbnuts weren’t around when FDR gave his famous “we have nothing to fear but fear itself” speech. Fundamentally and demonstrably a lie. One of the other fears (beside fear of fear) was that the forces of the Imperial Japanese Army would be incinerating tens of millions and enslaving those that were left. Roosevelt’s nothing to fear quote was in his inauguration speech in 1933 and referred to the Depression. As you know Pearl Harbor was 1941. This is the problem one runs into when you try to absolve this President by talking about supposed failures of others. It doesn't matter what other presidents did for other situations. Trump gets evaluated on his own actions. And he deliberately lied about and refused to accept any responsibility. And thus rightfully lost re-election. Which of course for which he also lies about and refuses to accept responsibility. How again can this conduct be defended? 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshin Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 7 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Yes, it’s possible for me to criticize Trump. As for the tired old whataboutism (how boring it must be to sit and wait for the cliche buzzer to sound), oldmanfan talked about presidential leadership in definite terms. Someone else made a Pearl Harbor reference, and I was reminded of FDR’s powerful speech was obviously a blatant lie. On the Trump rallies, to this day I’m hard pressed to understand why folks in your camp mention the rallies by steering clear of blaming people that took to the street by the tens of thousands this summer. It’s fairly clear the people who attended (I did not) felt a certain kinship with the protestors, yet one group is excoriated while the other is not. You could have just said, “No, not possible.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 9 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Yes, it’s possible for me to criticize Trump. As for the tired old whataboutism (how boring it must be to sit and wait for the cliche buzzer to sound), oldmanfan talked about presidential leadership in definite terms. Someone else made a Pearl Harbor reference, and I was reminded of FDR’s powerful speech was obviously a blatant lie. On the Trump rallies, to this day I’m hard pressed to understand why folks in your camp mention the rallies by steering clear of blaming people that took to the street by the tens of thousands this summer. It’s fairly clear the people who attended (I did not) felt a certain kinship with the protestors, yet one group is excoriated while the other is not. So you answered a criticism of whataboutisms with a whataboutism. Nice. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 3 hours ago, oldmanfan said: Roosevelt’s nothing to fear quote was in his inauguration speech in 1933 and referred to the Depression. As you know Pearl Harbor was 1941. This is the problem one runs into when you try to absolve this President by talking about supposed failures of others. It doesn't matter what other presidents did for other situations. Trump gets evaluated on his own actions. And he deliberately lied about and refused to accept any responsibility. And thus rightfully lost re-election. Which of course for which he also lies about and refuses to accept responsibility. How again can this conduct be defended? I hate when I make that type of mistake. You’re right of course, I attributed the quote to the wrong date, place and time. I apologize for that. It wasn’t about the annihilation of our country, it was about widespread poverty, unemployment and hunger. I skimmed the speech this morning. It’s eloquent and beautiful, but ultimately quite misleading. Parts of it were quite deceptive...talking about shared suffering and the like. Still, it was uplifting and recognized as a great speech. I think I’ll listen to it later, and thanks for taking the time to correct me. 2 hours ago, shoshin said: You could have just said, “No, not possible.” Or, not. 46 minutes ago, Scraps said: So you answered a criticism of whataboutisms with a whataboutism. Nice. You’ve revealed yourself to be a low character individual. Your thoughts are irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: You’ve revealed yourself to be a low character individual. Your thoughts are irrelevant. Why thank you. Considering the source, I take this as a high compliment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 29 minutes ago, Scraps said: Why thank you. Considering the source, I take this as a high compliment. It was my privilege to provide clarity for you today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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