For those that say McDermott is a younger jauron

[atlbillsfan1975]

3 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Wow NOT one offense. Yep more and more Dicky J like 

No. A plan. Build D and draft a QB. I think you will sing a different tune post 2019 draft and FA.

43 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Beane does not get credit for Hyde and Poyer.

 

That was Doug Whaley. 

That was McDermott. 

34 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Jesus. Enough with the "they inherited a bad salary cap" bull ****. No they didn't. 

 

Players that didn't buy in? Who? What's with the excuses? They intentionally did all this. They purged talent for JAGs. 

 

I agree with those who say McDermott is a good coach. He is a good defensive coach. He doesn't have a clue offensively. That's obviously worrisome going forward. 

You are tough to have a discussion with. Bills have a huge amount of dead money. They are getting some bad contracts off the books at the end of this season. 

As for the buy in, look at who is gone.

[dave mcbride]

16 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

The defense is definitely solid. The offense is a nightmare. One of the best things that I can say about McDermott is that he wins when he has a chance. The Bills had one of the worst point differentials in the league last year and went to the playoffs. That’s because of games like today, they end up on the right side of them. They execute and don’t make mistakes. That’s offsets some of their physical limitations.

But that was the same with  Jauron, right? They had a pretty decent D and terrible offenses under him, and he got them to the neighborhood of .500 doing exactly the same thing - minimizing mistake potential on offense, generating turnovers (his defenses were good at that and prioritized it), and keeping the game close - an approach that leads to close games, which in turn can lead to wins, especially against average teams and decent teams that just happen to be mistake-prone. 

Edited October 8, 2018 by dave mcbride

[oldmanfan]

3 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Lmao. They have dead cap BECAUSE of the new regime. 

 

 

Right.  Because they got rid of guys who either were making a ton of money and not earning it, or were going to demand a lot of money and whom they felt wouldn't earn it.

 

Rodney Harrison said last night about Beckham and the Giants dustup; you can't have the guy making the most money causing the problems, or words to that effect.  That was Dareus a year ago.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Hmmmmmm

 

[QCity]

15 hours ago, BillsVet said:

 

No dissenting opinions tolerated here!  

 

It's not a dissenting opinion it's a lazy, uneducated one. It shows that out of the entire gamut of coaching around the NFL over the past few decades your scope is limited to only what you see on the Bills sideline. It's a clumsy attempt to shoehorn a comparison when their clearly isn't one there. 

[oldmanfan]

Just now, ScottLaw said:

Aren't Dareus and Watkins making STILL making a **** ton of money on super bowl contending teams? 

 

There goes your logic.

No, it's you showing your unfortunate regular lack of understanding.  Dareus was a problem child here.  He got shipped out.  And we still went to the playoffs, and with the moves we made in the offseason our run D is shored up.  Dareus is also in what appears to be a better situation for him (I would bet when he got there Coughlin and Marrone laid down the law).

 

I have said a number of times I would have liked Sammy to stay.  But he gets what?  15 million a year?  And through his first five games this year he has 1 TD? 

 

The guys running the BIlls have a way they want to construct the team.  You don't like it.  Too bad for you.

[atlbillsfan1975]

33 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Lmao. They have dead cap BECAUSE of the new regime. 

 

 

The dead cap exists because Whaley paid some players and then they didn’t produce, like Marcel. I’m not going to argue with you. You have your belief. I have mine. It’s all good. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

17 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

The walking dead versus ......

Great point Kirby 

 

 

...EXACTLY......Jauron could make a wake look exciting.....

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

25 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

The guys running the BIlls have a way they want to construct the team.  You don't like it.  Too bad for you.

 

This is the meat of the matter on this board.

 

People disagree with the FO and coaches and think they could do better...when CLEARLY they could not. Why? Because they all operate in hindsight mode.

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 hour ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

No. A plan. Build D and draft a QB. I think you will sing a different tune post 2019 draft and FA.

That was McDermott. 

You are tough to have a discussion with. Bills have a huge amount of dead money. They are getting some bad contracts off the books at the end of this season. 

As for the buy in, look at who is gone.

No it was Doug Whaley. 

 

He was the GM and oversaw the Pro Personnel Department. 

 

That is not Sean McDermott. 

[JGMcD2]

5 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

Another TSW nazi censor wannabe heard from.    If you want to be a cheerleader for the current crappy Bills regime, be my guest, but don't presume to tell others what they can post. 

 

 

 

If you want to criticize everything the current Bills regime does, be my guest, but don’t presume to tell other what they can post. 

 

I’m really curious how they’re crappy. I’d love to hear it. They know they don’t have talent IT WAS ON PURPOSE. It’s been well documented. Just explain to me the waiver process, the NFL Draft, the Salary Cap, practice squad rules, roster rules, contract negotiations, etc. Then tell me how you would operate within those rules with your chosen offensive and defensive scheme to produce a product on the field better than what we have, with the long term goal of sustained success. 

 

Running an organization is just as much about looking ahead as it is looking to right now. You can’t try and be competitive and add pieces when you’re trying to tear it down and rebuild so that your roster is in a good position talent-wise and contract wise. If you try to, that’s when you become the Buffalo Bills from 2000-2016.

 

Whatever your feelings are on this regime, they’re doing something different from what we’ve done the last 17 years - as proven by the fact they ended the damn drought. You may not like it, that’s fine, but you ought to at least give it  a chance. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over again and expecting different results, this regime figured that out. Now maybe this message board should change up how they do things , as the same people continuously come on here whining and complaining about who’s in charge and the players in place. Give it a break. Rather than tearing everything down from ownership, the players, the coaches, just root the team on. Sure get upset when they play bad and be skeptical when they overachieve, but be positive rather than call for the head of the guy in charge every time you don’t like something. You might be surprised. Let’s send someone to follow you around at your job and call for your head every time you don’t fax a paper the way they’d like. It’s ridiculous.

 

Everyone wants to be so negative all the time like we’re still experiencing the drought. News flash we’re not. Things are different now, at least appreciate that, and try to realize what stage we’re in right now. 

 

Another arm chair analyst wannabe heard from.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

25 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

This is the meat of the matter on this board.

 

People disagree with the FO and coaches and think they could do better...when CLEARLY they could not. Why? Because they all operate in hindsight mode.

 

Joesixpack: From an X's and O's standpoint fans don't know as much as McDermott. No questions asked. We don't sit in NFL Film rooms for 20 hours a day. 

 

But you look at the Bills busts in draft picks: Aaron Maybin, EJ Manuel, Sammy Watkins, John McCargo, JP Losman, Erik Flowers, Mike Williams, Torrell Troup, James Hardy, Zay Jones, Shaq Lawson and so on, its also clear that Bills GMs have not been all knowing football men either. 

 

We won yesterday so the usual fans are in McDermott/Beane defense mode. But it is more than fair to question this regime 21 games in looking at the players they've dumped, the players they've signed, the players the drafted, their draft strategy and how many wins they have. 

 

Its fair to question McDermott's style, or Beane's affinity for former Panthers. 

 

The answer with a lot of fans is always patience. But its the NFL. You don't get 5 years to plan and execute. Beane and McDermott got the Bills to the Playoffs last year. So this year is a complete Get Out of Jail Free Card. But, it looks through 21 games that they are trying to win with 1974 style football in an age where passing and scoring are at all time highs.  

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

The answer with a lot of fans is always patience. But its the NFL. You don't get 5 years to plan and execute. Beane and McDermott got the Bills to the Playoffs last year. So this year is a complete Get Out of Jail Free Card. But, it looks through 21 games that they are trying to win with 1974 style football in an age where passing and scoring are at all time highs.  

 

Again, no offense, but this is lame. It's clear to anyone who can think that the plan was to purge cap, and begin rebuilding through defense. And if you can't see the value they've brought in the door while doing so, that's kind of a you problem.

 

I can list them out if you want.

 

[oldmanfan]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Should I go root for another team?

 

Obviously they have a way they want to construct the team. Doesn't mean they don't  deserve any criticism. 

 

The state of the offense is concerning right now. They'd be much better served with Sammy and his salary then without him. It was a bad trade then and it still is today.

 

 

I'll et you decide on your question. 

23 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Joesixpack: From an X's and O's standpoint fans don't know as much as McDermott. No questions asked. We don't sit in NFL Film rooms for 20 hours a day. 

 

But you look at the Bills busts in draft picks: Aaron Maybin, EJ Manuel, Sammy Watkins, John McCargo, JP Losman, Erik Flowers, Mike Williams, Torrell Troup, James Hardy, Zay Jones, Shaq Lawson and so on, its also clear that Bills GMs have not been all knowing football men either. 

 

We won yesterday so the usual fans are in McDermott/Beane defense mode. But it is more than fair to question this regime 21 games in looking at the players they've dumped, the players they've signed, the players the drafted, their draft strategy and how many wins they have. 

 

Its fair to question McDermott's style, or Beane's affinity for former Panthers. 

 

The answer with a lot of fans is always patience. But its the NFL. You don't get 5 years to plan and execute. Beane and McDermott got the Bills to the Playoffs last year. So this year is a complete Get Out of Jail Free Card. But, it looks through 21 games that they are trying to win with 1974 style football in an age where passing and scoring are at all time highs.  

The players they've drafted (and let's assume it's the last two drafts since you'll argue McD ran that draft, but of course when I start naming names it will all of a sudden be Whaley that did):

 

White - stud

Dawkins - starting LT

Jones - starting to come on

Milano- starting OLb and defensive player of the week a couple weeks ago

Peterman - backup QB (for now)

Allen - their long term QB

Edmunds - long term answer at MLB and a stud in the making

Phillps - solid rotational DT

Johnson - starting slot CB having a good year

McCloud - figuring it out and on the active roster

Neal - backup safety and special teams guy

Teller- grooming as an O line starter

 

As for FAs:

 

Murphy - coming on and showing his pass rushing ability

Star- stabilized the middle of the D front

Ivory - solid second RB, we don't win yesterday without him

Mc Carron - didn't work out and got back a pick for him

Davis - went nuts for whatever reason

 

You really want to go there?

 

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

25 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

Again, no offense, but this is lame. It's clear to anyone who can think that the plan was to purge cap, and begin rebuilding through defense. And if you can't see the value they've brought in the door while doing so, that's kind of a you problem.

 

I can list them out if you want.

 

Joe - You act like they won 12 games last year and led the league in performance metrics. 

 

They were a 9-7 Football team that squeaked in on an Andy Dalton TD pass, and immediately got bounced from the Playoffs with a 3 point offensive effort. 

 

This year they're 2-3, and have been blown out 3 times. 

 

Ok, the plan was to purge and rebuild the defense first. That doesn't mean that all fans have to bow down and accept the plan and assume it means that major winning is just around the corner. 

 

It is okay to judge and critique the moves the regime have made until this point. 

 

We're 5 games into the season and the leading WR on this team is Zay Jones, who has 13 catches for 164 yards. 2.8 cpg and 33 ypg. 

 

Its okay and valid to judge Beane's ability and be critical. It's not the same thing as fire both of them right now. 

[oldmanfan]

2 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Joe - You act like they won 12 games last year and led the league in performance metrics. 

 

They were a 9-7 Football team that squeaked in on an Andy Dalton TD pass, and immediately got bounced from the Playoffs with a 3 point offensive effort. 

 

This year they're 2-3, and have been blown out 3 times. 

 

Ok, the plan was to purge and rebuild the defense first. That doesn't mean that all fans have to bow down and accept the plan and assume it means that major winning is just around the corner. 

 

It is okay to judge and critique the moves the regime have made until this point. 

 

We're 5 games into the season and the leading WR on this team is Zay Jones, who has 13 catches for 164 yards. 2.8 cpg and 33 ypg. 

 

Its okay and valid to judge Beane's ability and be critical. It's not the same thing as fire both of them right now. 

You are criticizing the moves they did NOT make, like not bringing in WRs, not taking QB X vs. QB Y, not drafting X instead of Y.  And so on.

[MAJBobby]

2 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

No. A plan. Build D and draft a QB. I think you will sing a different tune post 2019 draft and FA.

That was McDermott. 

You are tough to have a discussion with. Bills have a huge amount of dead money. They are getting some bad contracts off the books at the end of this season. 

As for the buy in, look at who is gone.

 

I will wait and see. What I do no is they have used assets on O. And not one of them listed as a talent 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

24 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Its okay and valid to judge Beane's ability and be critical. It's not the same thing as fire both of them right now. 

 

You must be missing the parade of people asking for that very thing. And it's all part of this McD=Jauron stupidity.

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

14 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I'll et you decide on your question. 

The players they've drafted (and let's assume it's the last two drafts since you'll argue McD ran that draft, but of course when I start naming names it will all of a sudden be Whaley that did):

 

White - stud

Dawkins - starting LT

Jones - starting to come on

Milano- starting OLb and defensive player of the week a couple weeks ago

Peterman - backup QB (for now)

Allen - their long term QB

Edmunds - long term answer at MLB and a stud in the making

Phillps - solid rotational DT

Johnson - starting slot CB having a good year

McCloud - figuring it out and on the active roster

Neal - backup safety and special teams guy

Teller- grooming as an O line starter

 

As for FAs:

 

Murphy - coming on and showing his pass rushing ability

Star- stabilized the middle of the D front

Ivory - solid second RB, we don't win yesterday without him

Mc Carron - didn't work out and got back a pick for him

Davis - went nuts for whatever reason

 

You really want to go there?

 

 

 

Edmunds - I like that he was hyper athletic and 20 years old. 

 

Phillips - My favorite pick of this last draft. 

 

Johnson - Nice.

 

McCloud/Neal/Teller - These guys have no +/- on really winning games in the NFL. Most likely these guys wash out of the league in a couple of years. 

 

Murphy - 2.5 sacks, projects to 7.5/year. Not bad for a #2 DE.

 

Star - Ok, a run stuffer from Carolina. Not cheap though. 

 

Ivory - A journeyman RB who has been around the league (Saints, Jets, Jags, Bills). Speaks to the nature of RB. 

 

McCarron - A flop, but agreed, they cut their loses quickly. 

 

Davis - Elected to not pay E.J. Gaines and Davis showed quickly he was on his last legs. 

 

 

So, overall you list guys on a 2-3 football team that is scoring 12.5 ppg and allowing 23.6 ppg. 

 

 

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

18 hours ago, Steptide said:

I say you couldn't be more wrong. I watched McDermott all game long being animated on the sidelines and up in the refs faces. This is the opposite of jauron. Jauron looked like an aging skeleton on the sidelines and was rarely, if ever animated. 

 

McDermott says alot of things that make you scratch your head (culture over strategy) but I believe this all PR talk. The bills are horrendous on offense, yet this team has a ton of fight in them. We actually watched the bills drive down field with less than 2 mins left to win the game. This is a RARE thing to witness from the bills, and I give our line and running backs a ton of credit being able to do that with the game on the line 

 

I agree, its mind boggling how some compare him to Juaron.  There is literally no similarity at all and its a completely lazy assessment. 

 

For the love of god, people need to get a dam grip with the reality that this offense its the least talented in the NFL.  Allen has nothing to work with, making his job harder.  McD and Daboll have WR's that are terrible at getting consistent separation.  And I dont want to hear the Allen haters say on this or that play someone was open to refute that.  Its 100% fact and not even debatable that our WR's suck at separation and catching.  Will a rookie QB sometimes miss seeing a guy who did happen to get open some play, absolutely.  And with a below average OL, that isnt going to help him either.  But it doesn't change the fact that the kid just doesn't often have a lot of good places to go with the ball nor does he get good protection either.  

 

Daboll has not done a good job IMO on game planning properly in several games to help cope with these deficiencies at WR, OL, and young rookie QB.  But again, none of that makes McD a Juaron clone.  Its just a lazy assessment IMO.  

 

PS:  We are 2-1 in our last 3 games after the team seemed to turn a corner at halftime in SD.  Not to mention, we beat 2 teams that have been playing people pretty tough.