Was Buddy Nix A Good GM? Make Your Case

[Guest K-GunJimKelly12]

The 2014-2016 drafts tell you all you need to know about Whaley.  Oh and the Watkins trade.  Oh and the Dareus and Glenn contracts.

Edited March 23, 2018 by K-GunJimKelly12

[GreggTX]

The proof is in the results, so no.

 

Then again, I could listen to Buddy talk football all day long. I really liked his press conferences a lot. I wish he'd write a book or maybe someone at NFL films would do a documentary with him and let him narrate.

[QCity]

7 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Take a look at the starters on that top five defense that Whaley "built."

 

How many of the starters were brought in after Whaley became GM. 

 

Whaley became GM on May 16th, 2013. The 2014 team was the one that had the 4th ranked defense. Here were the starters and how they were brought to Buffalo:

 

Jerry Hughes - Nix trade

Mario Williams - Nix FA

Marcell Dareus - Nix draft

Nigel Bradham - Nix draft

Stephon Gilmore - Nix draft

Aaron Williams - Nix draft

Da'Norris Searcy - Nix draft

Robey (slot corner) - Nix UDFA

 

Kyle Williams - pre-Nix draft

Leodis McKelvin - pre-Nix draft

 

Corey Graham - Whaley FA

Brandon Spikes - Whaley FA

Preston Brown - Whaley draft

 

 

 

Whaley "built" that defense? Please.

 

Whaley didn't build that defense, but he sure as hell wasted it.

[mead107]

Sucked

[Gigs]

Fitzpatrick was there as Trent Edwards backup. Trent goes down, what’s new, and Ryan comes in and !@#$ing slings it. Give Fitz better receivers than a 7th rounder who couldn’t run real routes and he’d have had 30 TDS easily. Fitz wasn’t franchise material but he was damn good. 

[GunnerBill]

For a minute let's talk facts. I know the OP prefers to live in a world where they don't matter but just for a second let's do that. 

 

Over Mario Williams first 3 seasons with the Bills only two players outperformed him in sacks across the whole NFL. JJ Watt and Justin Houston. To argue he was not a difference maker those 3 years is simply to argue against reality. Did he underperform year 4? Sure. Was he horribly mismanaged by the worst Bills Head Coach of all time (okay of all time is opinion but terrible Head Coach is fact)? Absolutely. 

 

I don't think Buddy was a great GM. He clearly wasn't. But he did at least bring some professionalism and credibility to the Bills operation. He inherited the biggest mess in the NFL. A team that was constantly terrible and had cap issues as well. He got a lot of picks wrong and his "build a team first find the QB later" approach is one I fundamentally disagree with. However, I think he had a plan and Modrak never seemed to. 

 

Overall a failure, but an honourable one who put the Bills somewhat back on the tracks.  

 

 

[Irv]

Buddy Nix should be power slammed through a burning table.  

[Mat68]

Whaley was better in every way.  He couldnt find a franchise qb but made the roster 100% better.  His down fall was inhertiting Ej  2014 sammy trade.  ODB Jr was picked later and best wr in the draft.  Him landry and allen robinson were all more prolific than sammy.  That was a mistake or take Mack the best player in the draft and from their back yard.

Edited March 24, 2018 by Mat68

[BuffaloRush]

20 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

For a minute let's talk facts. I know the OP prefers to live in a world where they don't matter but just for a second let's do that. 

 

Over Mario Williams first 3 seasons with the Bills only two players outperformed him in sacks across the whole NFL. JJ Watt and Justin Houston. To argue he was not a difference maker those 3 years is simply to argue against reality. Did he underperform year 4? Sure. Was he horribly mismanaged by the worst Bills Head Coach of all time (okay of all time is opinion but terrible Head Coach is fact)? Absolutely. 

 

I don't think Buddy was a great GM. He clearly wasn't. But he did at least bring some professionalism and credibility to the Bills operation. He inherited the biggest mess in the NFL. A team that was constantly terrible and had cap issues as well. He got a lot of picks wrong and his "build a team first find the QB later" approach is one I fundamentally disagree with. However, I think he had a plan and Modrak never seemed to. 

 

Overall a failure, but an honourable one who put the Bills somewhat back on the tracks.  

 

 

 

Ok so Buddy put the Bills back on track by going 16-32 over three season?  Explain how three losing season puts the team back on track, when they failed the make the playoffs with a team that had few hold overs from the Nix era.

 

As far as Mario - yes the numbers were good.  But can you name me one memorable game where Mario completely took over and made the play of the game?  You really can’t.  In comparison I can name multiple games with JJ Watt or even a Khalil Mack has.  

 

Also take a look at the Bills defenses with Mario on the team.  They basically had one good year in 2014, right after Buddy left.  That’s why I don’t think he was worth that huge deal Buddy signed him to.  

 

Who’s living in a fantasy world now, Chester?

5 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Whaley was better in every way.  He couldnt find a franchise qb but made the roster 100% better.  His down fall was inhertiting Ej  2014 sammy trade.  ODB Jr was picked later and best wr in the draft.  Him landry and allen robinson were all more prolific than sammy.  That was a mistake or take Mack the best player in the draft and from their back yard.

 Well according to @GunnerBill the Bills didn’t need a player like Mack because Mario Williams was such a difference maker

[Mat68]

6 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Ok so Buddy put the Bills back on track by going 16-32 over three season?  Explain how three losing season puts the team back on track, when they failed the make the playoffs with a team that had few hold overs from the Nix era.

 

As far as Mario - yes the numbers were good.  But can you name me one memorable game where Mario completely took over and made the play of the game?  You really can’t.  In comparison I can name multiple games with JJ Watt or even a Khalil Mack has.  

 

Also take a look at the Bills defenses with Mario on the team.  They basically had one good year in 2014, right after Buddy left.  That’s why I don’t think he was worth that huge deal Buddy signed him to.  

 

Who’s living in a fantasy world now, Chester?

 Well according to @GunnerBill the Bills didn’t need a player like Mack because Mario Williams was such a difference maker

No Mack and Williams is imposing.  3rd down move Mario insiden and have hughes and mack off the edge.  Gunner is a probably a cool smart guy.  Whaley stays at 10 drafts Beckham or trades up for Mack he is still employed.

Edited March 24, 2018 by Mat68

[JohnC]

13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

For a minute let's talk facts. I know the OP prefers to live in a world where they don't matter but just for a second let's do that. 

 

Over Mario Williams first 3 seasons with the Bills only two players outperformed him in sacks across the whole NFL. JJ Watt and Justin Houston. To argue he was not a difference maker those 3 years is simply to argue against reality. Did he underperform year 4? Sure. Was he horribly mismanaged by the worst Bills Head Coach of all time (okay of all time is opinion but terrible Head Coach is fact)? Absolutely. 

 

I don't think Buddy was a great GM. He clearly wasn't. But he did at least bring some professionalism and credibility to the Bills operation. He inherited the biggest mess in the NFL. A team that was constantly terrible and had cap issues as well. He got a lot of picks wrong and his "build a team first find the QB later" approach is one I fundamentally disagree with. However, I think he had a plan and Modrak never seemed to. 

 

Overall a failure, but an honourable one who put the Bills somewhat back on the tracks.  

 

 

I don't know anyone who is saying or hinting that Buddy wasn't an honorable person. Of course he was a very decent and genuine person. When he took over he had a mess to straighten out not only with the roster but also with the cap. The primary problem I have with him is that as a GM he thought like a scout rather than from a wider perspective that a GM should have. 

 

It's fair to say that he stabilized the franchise. But he didn't come close to taking the next step and have it move beyond the pack. As you noted he had the philosophy of "building a team" before addressing the qb issue. In the NFL of today  and in the NFL of the period in which he worked as a GM that is a predictable self-destructive approach to take. What frustrated me with both Nix and Whaley is that each had more than a few opportunities to take the one action that would have been most meaningful in elevating a franchise i.e. find a franchise qb. The inexplicable passivity on this issue not only made no sense but was a prime reason why each of these GMs fall in the failure category. 

 

Nix was certainly well intentioned and very earnest. He was a good person. However, he was in way over his head as a GM. He was a man with a land line phone in an era of the iPhone. A battlefield corporal needs to be tactical while a general putting together the battle plan needs to be strategic. Buddy was a good soldier but he had a job beyond his abilities. 

[formerlyofCtown]

No.  EJ Manuel. Enuff said in the first round after getting robbed by the Rams.  Terrible returns on his trades.

[formerlyofCtown]

23 hours ago, BuffaloRush said:

Working on my popular blog post "Hits and Misses: How Successful Was GM Buddy Nix in The Draft,"   made me wonder - do my fellow Bills fans think Buddy Nix a good GM? In my opinion, I will say NO he was not a good GM.   People complain about the tenure's of Marv Levy and Russ Brandon as GM, but the winning percentage of the Bills was actually much higher under Levy (14-18) and Brandon (13-19) than Buddy(16-32).

 

He had some good draft picks in Gilmore, Cordy, Marcell.  Buddy also should be credited with the trade of Jerry Hughes for Kelvin Sheppard (which his assistant Doug Whaley was heavily involved with).  He also had a really cool accent and a "hip for an old guy" look.

 

But there's a lot that he didn't do well including missing on many other selections including drafting Torrell Troupe over Rob Gronkowski and then wasting a very high draft pick on CJ Spiller when the team was stacked at RB.

Buddy also mismanaged the QB position by hitching his wagon to Ryan Fitzpatrick as his franchise QB and signing him to a long-term deal which hindered their salary cap.  In the process he put off the decision to draft a QB of future and passed on several prospects.  In the end, Buddy put the team in "QB purgatory" resulting in ridiculous over-drafting of EJ Manuel in round 1 (which Doug Whaley was heavily involved). 

 

Then there's free agency - Buddy never seemed to get that right.  He would tend to overpay very average talents (Dwan Edwards, Brad Smith, Erik Pearz) and severely overpay good talents (Matio Williams, Mark Anderson, Spencer Johnson).  Unlike some of the great Bills GM's, he never really had a great free agent signing.  

 

But I am sure someone will make the argument for Buddy being a good GM.   In the end, I don't think his tenure as GM really helped the team.   Instead you can make the argument he left them worse off than the previous regime 

 

 

 

I don't know that we ever had a great GM but we have had some good ones that is why we end up stuck in QB purgatory.  Whaley could find everything but the QB.

23 hours ago, Rockee96 said:

Is this even a question? He was a horrible GM!

Not horrible. Just Decent.  If Whaley found a QB and Didn't run off Marone Some of his players would have been key along with Whaley's moves.  (If the new Regime gets a QB then Some of his picks will be key).  But in order to be consistently in SB contention you need a QB.  You can be in playoff contention every year with an average QB and good roster as long as your Coaching staff is competent.  (Not Rex Although I am ashamed to admit it I will, I was a Rex Ryan guy and in case you are concerned therapy is going well.)   Bad GMs pick Top 5 every year.

For the record I don't think EJ or Tyrod were Whaley's guys or they would not have been benched but he was solely in charge with Tyrod.  So I give Nix all the credit for EJ and Rex/Whaley credit for Tyrod.  I think someone other than Rex is coach and we make the playoffs off of both Nix and Whaley but the QB is Rex so I don't know.  Ralph Meddled an awful lot.  I can't call a GM good if he doesn't get at least a decent QB but I have often wondered if Ralph didn't want to pay Bradford Type money on a draft pick.  Why did none of these GMs post Free agency ever try to draft a QB high in the draft. 

Edited March 24, 2018 by formerlyofCtown

[klos63]

23 hours ago, Scorp83 said:

No! He wasn't as bad as Russ Brandon acting like a GM... but you don't take Spiller when you already have BeastMode & FredEx on the roster. Then... drafting EJ... & leaving it on Whaley was just plain wrong! 

Picking Spiller may have had the most negative repercussions of any personnel decision for this team.  Imagine having Lynch and Fred and using that first pick on someone valuable. Could have changed the fortunes of this team for years to come.

[BuffaloRush]

38 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I don't know anyone who is saying or hinting that Buddy wasn't an honorable person. Of course he was a very decent and genuine person. When he took over he had a mess to straighten out not only with the roster but also with the cap. The primary problem I have with him is that as a GM he thought like a scout rather than from a wider perspective that a GM should have. 

 

It's fair to say that he stabilized the franchise. But he didn't come close to taking the next step and have it move beyond the pack. As you noted he had the philosophy of "building a team" before addressing the qb issue. In the NFL of today  and in the NFL of the period in which he worked as a GM that is a predictable self-destructive approach to take. What frustrated me with both Nix and Whaley is that each had more than a few opportunities to take the one action that would have been most meaningful in elevating a franchise i.e. find a franchise qb. The inexplicable passivity on this issue not only made no sense but was a prime reason why each of these GMs fall in the failure category. 

 

Nix was certainly well intentioned and very earnest. He was a good person. However, he was in way over his head as a GM. He was a man with a land line phone in an era of the iPhone. A battlefield corporal needs to be tactical while a general putting together the battle plan needs to be strategic. Buddy was a good soldier but he had a job beyond his abilities. 

I feel that this was perfectly summarizes Buddy's tenure in Buffalo

[billsfan89]

22 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

If you look at the rosters pre Nix and When he retired i think you will see that he added a lot of talent to the roster 

 

we had GMs like Marv Levy who sucked and Russ Brandon. We didn't field an NFL line backing core

 

He added a lot of talent to make our defense very Good 

2

 

Nix was much better than the previous administration but that's like saying someone who is mediocre at best at their job is better than someone who was horrendous. The 2010 draft class with Spiller was !@#$ing awful, 2011 and 2012 were good but Nix's free agency and general personnel decisions weren't that great (I liked the Mario signing as a culture change, but there weren't many other good signings.) 

 

Nix and Whaley were mediocre at best, for every good move there was a corresponding bad move. 

[BuffaloRush]

1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Nix was much better than the previous administration but that's like saying someone who is mediocre at best at their job is better than someone who was horrendous. The 2010 draft class with Spiller was !@#$ing awful, 2011 and 2012 were good but Nix's free agency and general personnel decisions weren't that great (I liked the Mario signing as a culture change, but there weren't many other good signings.) 

 

Nix and Whaley were mediocre at best, for every good move there was a corresponding bad move. 

 

Fair and well said.

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Nix was much better than the previous administration but that's like saying someone who is mediocre at best at their job is better than someone who was horrendous. The 2010 draft class with Spiller was !@#$ing awful, 2011 and 2012 were good but Nix's free agency and general personnel decisions weren't that great (I liked the Mario signing as a culture change, but there weren't many other good signings.) 

 

Nix and Whaley were mediocre at best, for every good move there was a corresponding bad move. 

 

Again i never once said that he was remarkable or very good or anything like that...

 

i said he brought in better players than in previous years... getting Mario was huge 

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Ok so Buddy put the Bills back on track by going 16-32 over three season?  Explain how three losing season puts the team back on track, when they failed the make the playoffs with a team that had few hold overs from the Nix era.

 

As far as Mario - yes the numbers were good.  But can you name me one memorable game where Mario completely took over and made the play of the game?  You really can’t.  In comparison I can name multiple games with JJ Watt or even a Khalil Mack has.  

 

Also take a look at the Bills defenses with Mario on the team.  They basically had one good year in 2014, right after Buddy left.  That’s why I don’t think he was worth that huge deal Buddy signed him to.  

 

Who’s living in a fantasy world now, Chester?

 Well according to @GunnerBill the Bills didn’t need a player like Mack because Mario Williams was such a difference maker

 

Miami 2013 he absolutely dominated. As he did the home win against Carolina (EJ comeback game). He had a monster game at Miami in 2014 as well even though we lost. The 2014 Green Bay game he was outstanding, and in fact even in 2015 under Rex when he was not great by any means he was probably the biggest single reason we beat Tennessee. 

 

In at least 3 of those games listed above he was the definition of "difference maker" because he literally made plays that were the difference in the game.

 

Arguing Mario Williams was not a difference maker for the Bills is pure, unadulterated fantasy. 2013 and 2014 he was the one single elite player on the team. 

 

As for Buddy overall.... I said he was a failure and criricised him heavily for not doing enough to find a Quarterback. And if you read my post I explained why I felt he put us a bit back on track..... and it links to arguments we have had before. When Buddy was here we had a single football decision maker - Buddy. He cleaned up the cap and left a nucleus of decent young players. It could have worked even if it didn't. What came before - the Modrak mess era could never have worked. It was doomed to fail year after year after year because the process was wrong and the structure was wrong. 

 

Simply I will put it like this... under Buddy we operated like an NFL team just a not very successful one. The Modrak era we were not even behaving like an NFL franchise. We were bush league. 

[Scorp83]

7 hours ago, klos63 said:

Picking Spiller may have had the most negative repercussions of any personnel decision for this team.  Imagine having Lynch and Fred and using that first pick on someone valuable. Could have changed the fortunes of this team for years to come.

Exactly!