Philly deadline to get under the cap: Nick Foles

[mannc]

58 minutes ago, IgotBILLStopay said:

Philly has to knock off 9 mill from its cap before 4 pm ET March 14. Can they get there without trading Foles? After losing out in the Tyrod Taylor sweepstakes (felt good saying that), looks like it might come down to the Cardinals as the Bills, main competition.

 

Dark Horse is the Colts who might move down from no. 3 and use part of the returns to reunite Frank Reich with the SB MVP.

 

bottomline: I'd offer good odds on a trade for Foles happening the afternoon of March 14.

And that’s why the Eagles are dreaming if they think someone will give them a first for Foles.  They will unload him for a second, plus maybe a fifth or sixth.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, mannc said:

And that’s why the Eagles are dreaming if they think someone will give them a first for Foles.  They will unload him for a second, plus maybe a fifth or sixth.

 

Did anyone think they'd get a 1st plus more for Bradford and nobody believed Beane would get anything for Tyrod.  Some team might pony up, but I hope it's not the Bills. 

[mannc]

20 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't think the Bills would have moved on from Taylor if they weren't nearly complete certain that they had a veteran replacement.  They weren't going into 2018 with Peterman and a rookie.  

 

This is correct.  If they want Foles, they can get him with one of their second round picks...just have to be patient.

[MAJBobby]

People want to give uo picks for this. 

 

How does this scream Trade for me

 

7 games

56.6 Comp %

537 yards

5.3 YPA

5 TDs

2 INTs

5 Sacks 

 

that value was set. A 3rd no higher 

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Did anyone think they'd get a 1st plus more for Bradford and nobody believed Beane would get anything for Tyrod.  Some team might pony up, but I hope it's not the Bills. 

That was a unique situation.  Minn had lost their QB just before the season and felt they could contend.  No one is that desperate right now.

[Manther]

9 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

I'm looking toward the draft for Rosen, Darnold, or Mayfield.

Seriously, for me, it comes down to process of elimination on these 3.

 

1.  Mayfield - least amount of questions and who I like the best

 

2. Rosen - not sure he is the real deal.  Questions on his heart and two concussions.  The two concussions is a problem even if you like him.  And, I don't like him.

 

3.  Darnold - interceptions and a USC QB.  The picks is my main concern.

 

So, final answer,  Mayfield.  If you can trade up for Mayfield do it!  Otherwise sit tight.  IF something falls into the teens we can re evaluate.

 

I like Mayfield and Foles.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, mannc said:

That was a unique situation.  Minn had lost their QB just before the season and felt they could contend.  No one is that desperate right now.

 

They can afford to be patient and there's the matter of Wentz not being certain to be available when the season starts. 

[Manther]

8 minutes ago, mannc said:

And that’s why the Eagles are dreaming if they think someone will give them a first for Foles.  They will unload him for a second, plus maybe a fifth or sixth.

That would be sweet.  Their cap is soo bad, I agree with you.

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

That was a unique situation.  Minn had lost their QB just before the season and felt they could contend.  No one is that desperate right now.

Agreed

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

Seriously, for me, it comes down to process of elimination on these 3.

 

1.  Mayfield - least amount of questions and who I like the best

 

2. Rosen - not sure he is the real deal.  Questions on his heart and two concussions.  The two concussions is a problem even if you like him.  And, I don't like him.

 

3.  Darnold - interceptions and a USC QB.  The picks is my main concern.

 

So, final answer,  Mayfield.  If you can trade up for Mayfield do it!  Otherwise sit tight.  IF something falls into the teens we can re evaluate.

 

I like Mayfield and Foles.

 

Mayfield has questions both on field and off. Foles, isn't worth giving up capital that could be required in a move up.  Getting both Foles and a top rated QB for 2018 is highly unlikely.

[mannc]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

They can afford to be patient and there's the matter of Wentz not being certain to be available when the season starts. 

But, as the OP suggests, the cap situation reduces Eagles’ ability to be patient.

[Manther]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

They can afford to be patient and there's the matter of Wentz not being certain to be available when the season starts. 

The thing in our favour is Wentz continues to get ahead of schedule.  At one point the Eagles were going to have to roll with their back up QB for 6-8 weeks.  Now it may be zero.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, Manther said:

The thing in our favour is Wentz continues to get ahead of schedule.  At one point the Eagles were going to have to roll with their back up QB for 6-8 weeks.  Now it may be zero.

 

That doesn't mean much on March 10th. 

[Manther]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Mayfield has questions both on field and off. Foles, isn't worth giving up capital that could be required in a move up.  Getting both Foles and a top rated QB for 2018 is highly unlikely.

What are your questions on Mayfiel?.  I have some, but, think he is legit.  

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Manther said:

What are your questions on Mayfiel?.  I have some, but, think he is legit.  

 

On field

 

play from Center

ability to see both sides of field

Recognize the Blitz

 

still my Third Best QB though and would take him if my other two gone. 

 

Not sure I would move up into top 10 to take him though

[Manther]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

 

On field

 

play from Center

ability to see both sides of field

Recognize the Blitz

 

still my Third Best QB though and would take him if my other two gone. 

 

Not sure I would move up into top 10 to take him though

Who are your top two?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

51 minutes ago, IgotBILLStopay said:

Philly has to knock off 9 mill from its cap before 4 pm ET March 14. Can they get there without trading Foles? After losing out in the Tyrod Taylor sweepstakes (felt good saying that), looks like it might come down to the Cardinals as the Bills, main competition.

 

Dark Horse is the Colts who might move down from no. 3 and use part of the returns to reunite Frank Reich with the SB MVP.

 

bottomline: I'd offer good odds on a trade for Foles happening the afternoon of March 14.

 

NotSoFast.  Foles, I believe, carries a $7.6M cap hit, but has $2.4M prorated signing bonus on the Iggles books ($.6M/yr x 4 years).  So trading him only saves them $4.6M in cap.

The Iggles got to clear $10.8M in cap.  So Foles only gets them part of the way there.  Will they trade him?  Sure, if a team stacks up the draft picks high enough, but they need to do something else besides, and they do have options.

 

Bennett has a $6.5M cap hit because of a $5M roster bonus.    Look for Philly to renegotiate his contract and convert that plus some of next year's salary to signing bonus.

Bennett wins because he puts more in his pocket and maybe gets some salary guaranteed next year.  Eagles win because they clear up cap.  Say, they do $6M signing bonus, clear up $4M in cap.  Cap remaining to clear: $10.8 - $4M = $6.8M

 

Candidates to trade or restructure:

1) Brandon Graham, DE.  FA next year.  $8M cap hit this year, $7M salary.  Trade him and you're there.  Extend him, you can perhaps lower your cap hit this year to $4M

2) Brent Celek, TE.  FA next year.  $5M cap hit this year, $4M salary.  Trade or cut him, and you're there if you extend Graham.

 

Point is, Foles is neither necessary or sufficient to solve the Eagles cap problem.  Will they trade him for the right offer, Sure, but it will depend on the offer vs the value they place on Foles,  it's not something they have to do to clear cap, because they do have other paths to get there.

 

I'm missing the "Tyrod Taylor Sweepstakes" ref, are the Eagles supposed to have had interest?

 

 

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Manther said:

Who are your top two?

Rosen No 1

Darnold No 2

 

and yes there are weaknesses with them too both I would move into the top 5 for 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, Manther said:

What are your questions on Mayfiel?.  I have some, but, think he is legit.  

 

I question how he'll be perceived in an NFL room with the cocky attitude and I do have some concerns on how consistent he can be as a pocket QB with his size and limited athleticism at the NFL level.  I'd give him a shot, but he's no 100% sure thing. 

[Green Lightning]

44 minutes ago, Juice_32 said:

 

Maybe you failed to read where I said he'd not prevent us from getting a rookie and I'd still get one. 

I don't want to give up any draft capital for Foles. Save if for the big move to the top 5. Get the rook first, a veteran back up later. 

[Manther]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

Rosen No 1

Darnold No 2

 

and yes there are weaknesses with them too both I would move into the top 5 for 

Totally agree.  They all have questions.  The only one that totally scares me and I don't want is Darnold though.  He just scares me.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I have no interest in Foles. Go get a top rookie

 

Errr.  We do draft at #21, yes?

 

I have no interest in "a top rookie".  If there is one, maybe two, QB the Bills think has a clear shot at being Franchise Man, sure, give it your best shot to trade up and get him!

But other teams have interest - it isn't just push a button and the trade ticket slides into the winnings tray.

 

[Lurker]

1 hour ago, nucci said:

Before the Superbowl he was an average QB and there wasn't much confidence in Foles by Eagles people when playoffs started. Having said that, he played very well in the playoffs

 

Putting him in a RPO offense, rather than a standard pro set, seemed to do wonders for Foles.   I wonder how many guys are misused throughout their careers by trying to pound square pegs into round holes...

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Manther said:

Totally agree.  They all have questions.  The only one that totally scares me and I don't want is Darnold though.  He just scares me.

 

Darnold does scare me a bit because if the Turnovers his funky release 

[buffalobloodfloridahome]

I'm ok with Foles as long as we hedge out bet with a top tier rookie to go along with him. No reason to not go hard for both. If Foles ends up being great for us awesome, if not we have the Rookie learning behind him to switch too. 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, buffalobloodfloridahome said:

I'm ok with Foles as long as we hedge out bet with a top tier rookie to go along with him. No reason to not go hard for both. If Foles ends up being great for us awesome, if not we have the Rookie learning behind him to switch too. 

 

How are you going to get both with a need to trade for Foles that requires giving them draft picks?

[artmalibu]

Still too many moving parts....

 

We need to see where the the FA QBs land.  If the QB needy teams get their guy as a FA moving up is much more possible.  

 

If not the cost to move up could be ridicules and the guy might be gone.  Possibly  2  QBs off the board in 2 picks,  and 4  in 6 picks.  

 

Is the 3rd QB taken this draft worth a kings ransom?    

[Manther]

2 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Darnold does scare me a bit because if the Turnovers his funky release 

I can't get over the turnovers.  I feel like his upside and ability to score doesn't offset  his turnovers.  I don't want a QB that is scared to make plays and fine with them learning and tossing picks along the way.  But, I think Darnold won't learn, doesn't have the upside on TD's vs INTs.  JMO.  If we pick him, I will cheer for him.  But, I hope we don't pick Darnold.

[Doc]

4 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Putting him in a RPO offense, rather than a standard pro set, seemed to do wonders for Foles.   I wonder how many guys are misused throughout their careers by trying to pound square pegs into round holes...

 

Been saying this since the SB and they mentioned this.  Most people are talking as if Foles' incredible play in the playoffs was a fluke.  There was a reason. 

[Manther]

1 minute ago, artmalibu said:

Still too many moving parts....

 

We need to see where the the FA QBs land.  If the QB needy teams get their guy as a FA moving up is much more possible.  

 

If not the cost to move up could be ridicules and the guy might be gone.  Possibly  2  QBs off the board in 2 picks,  and 4  in 6 picks.  

 

Is the 3rd QB taken this draft worth a kings ransom?    

Totally too many moving parts.  The most important piece to me is to have a great evaluation on the QBs in the draft and available in the league already.  That is the key to making the best play.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Yep. Enough with the retreads.

This is where I'm at too, go get Rosen!

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

I can't get over the turnovers.  I feel like his upside and ability to score doesn't offset  his turnovers.  I don't want a QB that is scared to make plays and fine with them learning and tossing picks along the way.  But, I think Darnold won't learn, doesn't have the upside on TD's vs INTs.  JMO.  If we pick him, I will cheer for him.  But, I hope we don't pick Darnold.

 

I would rather not want Darnold either. But in terms of how I grade he is No 2. And worth a trade up. Now that is not saying that is what I want the Bills to do. 

 

Really only want them to trade up into top 5 for Rosen

[Lurker]

Just now, buffalobloodfloridahome said:

I'm ok with Foles as long as we hedge out bet with a top tier rookie to go along with him. No reason to not go hard for both. If Foles ends up being great for us awesome, if not we have the Rookie learning behind him to switch too. 

 

I agree.   The Green Bay model--with a veteran Farve (clearly better than any option the Bills have, admittedly) allowing at young-but-talented Rogers to learn rather than be thown into the fire--is the best way to handle the QB position...

 

[Doc]

And I can't get behind trading away most of the Bills' top picks to trade up to the top-5 to take Rosen or Mayfield, when neither has proven a single thing.  Darnold will be another USC bust.  Outside of them, I don't see a guy worth taking, much less trading the farm for.

[Avisan]

I would do a 2nd and a 4th for Foles in a heartbeat, BPA for a QB in a spot where it makes sense, use the other three top picks to plug our numerous holes.

 

Solid vet QB + rookie, plus Center, LB, and Tackle would be lovely.

[Manther]

4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

I would rather not want Darnold either. But in terms of how I grade he is No 2. And worth a trade up. Now that is not saying that is what I want the Bills to do. 

 

Really only want them to trade up into top 5 for Rosen

I would be fine and excited with a trade up to the top 5 for Rosen or Mayfield.

 

EDIT: I am fine with trading for Foles too.  I don't think he is a retread.

Edited March 10, 2018 by Manther

[Kirby Jackson]

7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Errr.  We do draft at #21, yes?

 

I have no interest in "a top rookie".  If there is one, maybe two, QB the Bills think has a clear shot at being Franchise Man, sure, give it your best shot to trade up and get him!

But other teams have interest - it isn't just push a button and the trade ticket slides into the winnings tray.

 

Except these conversations have been had. The Bills know the price to get up to get their guy. The Bills have loaded up their war chest to do just that. It would be SHOCKING if the Bills did anything else at this point to address QB.

 

They aren't going to overpay for Foles’ hot streak. It isn’t like Jimmy G where he played great as soon as the chance presented itself. Foles has a pretty long resume and it is wildly inconsistent. The playoffs last year and the one year with Kelly were great. He’s been pretty much bad the rest of the time. I have no interest in spending on that resume. Give me Rosen or Baker or Darnold and roll. Try to get top end QB play not good enough QB play. It’s the exact reason that you pass on Cousins too.

 

21,22, 56 and next year’s 2 to go into the top 5. 

[*******]

Foles has had one good year, plus the super bowl run. Is the newbills offense going to fit him? Seems like he needs a specific offense for him to succeed 

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

I would be fine and excited with a trade up to the top 5 for Rosen or Mayfield.

 

EDIT: I am fine with trading for Foles too.  I don't think he is a retread.

 

Depends on the package and timing of the Foles Trade. 

 

I am not giving up a 1st or 2nd for Foles. 

 

 

[Manther]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Except these conversations have been had. The Bills know the price to get up to get their guy. The Bills have loaded up their war chest to do just that. It would be SHOCKING if the Bills did anything else at this point to address QB.

 

They aren't going to overpay for Foles’ hot streak. It isn’t like Jimmy G where he played great as soon as the chance presented itself. Foles has a pretty long resume and it is wildly inconsistent. The playoffs last year and the one year with Kelly were great. He’s been pretty much bad the rest of the time. I have no interest in spending on that resume. Give me Rosen or Baker or Darnold and roll. Try to get top end QB play not good enough QB play. It’s the exact reason that you pass on Cousins too.

 

21,22, 56 and next year’s 2 to go into the top 5. 

I thought Foles had a good season with Andy Reid in Philly AND a good season with Kelly in Philly?  Yes or no?

[Lurker]

Just now, ******* said:

Foles has had one good year, plus the super bowl run. Is the newbills offense going to fit him? Seems like he needs a specific offense for him to succeed 

 

Philly's RPO was a pretty good offense.    I woundn't mind copying it...