mannc Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Not really, teams do that all of the time. It's not uncommon that the vet finishes the game and the young guy plays for weeks. The Texans kind of did it with Tom Savage (although he entered during a game). You don't put the rookie in to finish a game. You give him a week to prepare. If he isn't ready you start the vet and try again the next week. This isn't uncommon at all in the NFL. The staff knew EJ sucked. He wasn't going to be the answer in an extended absence of TT. They would have rolled Cardale out and let him sink or swim. I think the Raiders did just that when Carr was hurt this year: McGloin finished the game but they rolled out Connor Cook after a week or two, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Per Vic carucci Whaley is in favor of starting Cardale Jones next season That's a dart that missed the board and landed on the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 seriously. he has fallen totally off the cliff of credibility. its sad to see someone who used to be so good fall so far. its like hes losing his mind serious question: how old is he? is there any chance hes developing early dementia? im not even joking, something seems wrong that he can turn so completely in the other direction from where he used to be I think he may be 60. http://www.livingprimetime.com/AllCovers/July1997/workjul1997/vic_carucci_and_football.htm It looks like this was written in 1997 and they make mention of him being 40. Other than this ... I can find nothing with regard to his age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Vic's source is likely Russ Brandon. Brandon is saying to himself, how the heck am i going to sell season tickets, suites & sponsors with Cardale as QB. this is Brandon applying public & private pressure on whaley to address the QB situation in a splashy way if they move on from TT so russ can do his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 What's your point? Tanking accomplishes nothing. This isn't hockey. There's no guarantee a great QB will be in next years draft. Do you agree that it's more of a guarantee that, if Tyrod get his money from the Bills, that they will continue to hover around .500 while he's the starter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 (edited) There's no question it would backfire. Watch the offense tank with Jones starting but the defense improves under McDermott so the team goes 8-8 again and can't draft any of the stud franchise QB's available in the 2018 Draft. The defense is a mystery to me. McDermott hasn't decided who will call the plays. If it's Leslie Frazier, ouch. Get ready to be carved like a turkey. Edited February 11, 2017 by jeffismagic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 EJ is a bust. Cardale couldn't even beat out EJ. he ain't ready and never will be. the chances of hitting on a draft choice better than TT is about 10%. the chances of signing a free agent who wants to come to buffalo and is better than TT is about 1%. bite the bullet and keep TT whether or not he makes that contract a little more to the bills liking. add a RT & WR and you got something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Not really, teams do that all of the time. It's not uncommon that the vet finishes the game and the young guy plays for weeks. The Texans kind of did it with Tom Savage. You don't put the rookie in to finish a game. You give him a week to prepare. If he isn't ready you start the vet and try again the next week. This isn't uncommon at all in the NFL. The staff knew EJ sucked. He wasn't going to be the answer in an extended absence of TT. They would have rolled Cardale out and let him sink or swim. I don't understand your response and reasoning. This was the last game of the year where the front office ordered the starter to the bench for contract reasons. Not only did the organization firmly conclude that EJ wasn't good but they also knew that after this game he would no longer be associated with the team. Yet the staff wasn't willing to expose him as a starter. Cardale had a year to prepare, even if it was a third string practice player. At the minimum he should know the plays. If the staff was reluctant to play him in this meaningless last game of the season then what does it tell you where he is at as a player? (Polish Dave's point)Even if CJ wasn't fully ready to start a game what would be the harm to allow him to be exposed to the speed of an actual game? The argument that he could be set back by being overwhelmed in his first game is an insulting condemnation of the fragility of his psyche. If Whaley made the determination that TT shouldn't play then it is not unreasonable to believe that he entertained the possibility that Cardale should start in this game. It's not too difficult to then make the leap that the coaches told Whaley that his pet projection was still too ill-equipped to even handle such an inconsequential last game between two sad sacked teams. That in itself is troubling when considering Cardale's prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 (edited) With Tyrod playing well enough to keep us in the playoff race into December (and healthy), what would have been the benefit of announcing that Cardale has surpassed EJ on the depth chart? When has a similar situation happened, ever? I have very little with which to base my opinion of CJ, just like you, but to say he's no good because the team didn't officially promote him to #2 is just absurd, IMO. I don't think they would have made an announcement about it. They would have been asked about it when it happened. And then Whaley and coaches could have taken that opportunity to bask in the limelight - saying Cardale is developing faster than we expected. And it would have pushed Tyrod too. There is no good reason to keep a guy hiding in the shadows and farther away from a football field if he is coming on strong. The goal is to win games, especially during the middle of the season. As far as saying the guy is no good - I don't have any evidence to think otherwise. Do you? We haven't seen anything at all to say otherwise. And he couldn't beat EJ. So, why in the world would I or anybody else think otherwise? What evidence do you have that he is any good at all? College? Just because he was on a winning team in college doesn't mean he is going to be a success in the NFL. With zero NFL evidence to prove he is good, I am going to keep assuming he isn't very good. I hope he does become good - wicked good - as long as he is a Bill. I am just being realistic about what evidence we have seen so far. Edited February 11, 2017 by PolishDave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I don't think they would have made an announcement about it. They would have been asked about it when it happened. And then Whaley and coaches could have taken that opportunity to bask in the limelight - saying Cardale is developing faster than we expected. And it would have pushed Tyrod too. There is no good reason to keep a guy hiding in the shadows and farther away from a football field if he is coming on strong. The goal is to win games, especially during the middle of the season. As far as saying the guy is no good - I don't have any evidence to think otherwise. Do you? We haven't seen anything at all to say otherwise. And he couldn't beat EJ. So, why in the world would I or anybody else think otherwise? What evidence do you have that he is any good at all? College? Just because he was on a winning team in college doesn't mean he is going to be a success in the NFL. With zero evidence to prove he is good, I am going to keep assuming he isn't. I hope he does become good - wicked good - as long as he is a Bill. I am just being realistic about what evidence we have seen so far. This could easily be about Tyrod. In fact, it's exactly how I feel about Tyrod. Yes - including the part about not beating EJ (he didn't; I clearly recall reading about practices and preseason games - that is NOT to say that EJ is good; he's not. But neither is Taylor). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 (edited) I don't understand your response and reasoning. This was the last game of the year where the front office ordered the starter to the bench for contract reasons. Not only did the organization firmly conclude that EJ wasn't good but they also knew that after this game he would no longer be associated with the team. Yet the staff wasn't willing to expose him as a starter. Cardale had a year to prepare, even if it was a third string practice player. At the minimum he should know the plays. If the staff was reluctant to play him in this meaningless last game of the season then what does it tell you where he is at as a player? (Polish Dave's point)Even if CJ wasn't fully ready to start a game what would be the harm to allow him to be exposed to the speed of an actual game? The argument that he could be set back by being overwhelmed in his first game is an insulting condemnation of the fragility of his psyche. If Whaley made the determination that TT shouldn't play then it is not unreasonable to believe that he entertained the possibility that Cardale should start in this game. It's not too difficult to then make the leap that the coaches told Whaley that his pet projection was still too ill-equipped to even handle such an inconsequential last game between two sad sacked teams. That in itself is troubling when considering Cardale's prospects. A few things on it, for one they didn't want to win the game. It ended up a difference in 8 draft slots I believe. 2 they could have been trying to do a favor for EJ by allowing him to play well heading into FA. He is a nice guy and a guy that you wish the best for. 3 they didn't want Cardale to go out there and struggle. They didn't want to hurt his confidence (which would be EXTREMELY difficult to do in his case). They looked at this year as a redshirt year. They would have pulled the redshirt if need be. He has played very little football since high school. He's talented. I don't know how else to put it but trust me the Bills didn't believe in EJ. He wasn't a part of the plan. They don't know what they have in Cardale. It isn't a situation though of them thinking EJ gave them a better chance to win. I guess what I am saying is don't read into EJ as 2 & Cardale as 3 (at all). EJ would have been the answer in a short term absence and Cardale long-term. Edited February 11, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSOL Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Would Whaley even survive a 4-12, 6-10 season with Cardale starting? How would McD be cool with that? Starting Cardale would be a death knell for both of them. The idea of starting Cardale is ridiculous. And if im wrong, if he lights it up this season, ill gladly take my medicine. The odds of Cardale starting in 2017 are slim to none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 This could easily be about Tyrod. In fact, it's exactly how I feel about Tyrod. Yes - including the part about not beating EJ (he didn't; I clearly recall reading about practices and preseason games - that is NOT to say that EJ is good; he's not. But neither is Taylor). When watching the preseason games, it wasn't anywhere near close who the best QB was. Tyrod was moving the chains with ease while he was in there. It was incredibly obvious he was head and shoulders better than the other guys. It was exciting to watch where as the other guys entirely lacked excitement. Maybe we remember it differently. I don't remember it being close at all. Would Whaley even survive a 4-12, 6-10 season with Cardale starting? How would McD be cool with that? Starting Cardale would be a death knell for both of them. The idea of starting Cardale is ridiculous. And if im wrong, if he lights it up this season, ill gladly take my medicine. The odds of Cardale starting in 2017 are slim to none. I agree that the idea of starting Cardale is ridiculous at this point. It won't be ridiculous if he lights it up in preseason and ends up winning the start because he beat whoever the other guys are. But to be expecting Cardale to start (right now) with zero proof he is capable - is in fact totally ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 This could easily be about Tyrod. In fact, it's exactly how I feel about Tyrod. Yes - including the part about not beating EJ (he didn't; I clearly recall reading about practices and preseason games - that is NOT to say that EJ is good; he's not. But neither is Taylor). Tyrod didn't beat EJ? Huh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HT02 Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 he is a stubborn moron. as others have written here this is ej all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 When watching the preseason games, it wasn't anywhere near close who the best QB was. Tyrod was moving the chains with ease while he was in there. It was incredibly obvious he was head and shoulders better than the other guys. It was exciting to watch where as the other guys entirely lacked excitement. Maybe we remember it differently. I don't remember it being close at all. I agree that the idea of starting Cardale is ridiculous at this point. It won't be ridiculous if he lights it up in preseason and ends up winning the start because he beat whoever the other guys are. But to be expecting Cardale to start (right now) with zero proof he is capable - is in fact totally ridiculous. Well, I guess Dak shows us that you never really know when a guy's ready until you (have to) give him a try, but let's be honest: the likelihood that Cardale is another Dak (or that any 4th rounder is another Dak) is minimal ... ... So either Vic is making this up (unlikely), or it's from an unreliable source (fairly likely), or it's from a reliable source who has an ulterior motive (the Brandon is the source theory, which I'd say is even more likely), and that ulterior motive is either to undercut Whaley or to just scare Tyrod and his agent a bit so that they're willing to talk renegotiation, which at this point is probably the best solution for both the Bills and Tyrod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 When watching the preseason games, it wasn't anywhere near close who the best QB was. Tyrod was moving the chains with ease while he was in there. It was incredibly obvious he was head and shoulders better than the other guys. It was exciting to watch where as the other guys entirely lacked excitement. Maybe we remember it differently. I don't remember it being close at all. I agree that the idea of starting Cardale is ridiculous at this point. It won't be ridiculous if he lights it up in preseason and ends up winning the start because he beat whoever the other guys are. But to be expecting Cardale to start (right now) with zero proof he is capable - is in fact totally ridiculous. No. In preseason games against 1st team defenses, EJ was FAR better than Tyrod. Not even a contest. Tyrod didn't beat EJ? Huh... Tyrod was chosen over EJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 whaley can draft the hell out of defensive guys but man it seems he has no clue about offense at allKarlos Williams and Mike Gillislee say hi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 No. In preseason games against 1st team defenses, EJ was FAR better than Tyrod. Not even a contest. Tyrod was chosen over EJ. Ha ha, you are hilarious. I love that you still believe this. We also saw the largest crowd ever at an inauguration - period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts