Hardcore Bills Fan Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 So when did Dallas win the '17 Super Bowl? I must have been sleeping.... As for Jerry, this is a guy who still has Romo on his roster, ROMO!!!!!!! Just the fact that it took 20 years of high draft picks and a rookie QB to show that Romo is a terrible QB proves Jones has no clue. Stay on your knees about Jones if you want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Why are people taking offense to this? Whoever the GM of the Cowboys is is doing a better job than Whaley. Can we agree on that? Most certainly yes, and I am somebody who likes Whaley. My big problem with this thread is why it doesn't include the Oakland Raiders and their GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 jerry has to thank his kid for not selecting manziel and instead taking zack martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Jerry wins. Doug loses. Except that is not quite true. Doug took over as GM after free agency and the draft in 2013. Putting that year's record on him before he had been the man pulling the trigger on anything is unfair in my mind. The record since the first offseason Doug, Jim Monos and Calvin Fisher had charge of is 22-20. This front office has a winning record... just not enough of one. This is the quandry with where the Bills sit. Are there people who might be better than Whaley? Sure. But there are a hell of a lot who are worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 So when did Dallas win the '17 Super Bowl? I must have been sleeping.... As for Jerry, this is a guy who still has Romo on his roster, ROMO!!!!!!! Just the fact that it took 20 years of high draft picks and a rookie QB to show that Romo is a terrible QB proves Jones has no clue. Stay on your knees about Jones if you want Yikes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinii Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Most certainly yes, and I am somebody who likes Whaley. My big problem with this thread is why it doesn't include the Oakland Raiders and their GM. No the biggest problem is the Raiders are moving to Vegas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 As for QB success being the entire key to their system, I'd argue it's the entire key to everyone's system but not everyone realizes it. It's just that very few teams have been able to get top ten or twelve QBs on their roster. And there's very little chance at a Lombardi without a top ten or twelve guy. You have to have a top ten or twelve defense of all time to have a decent chance of success with a QB below that level. Seems a little strange in the context of this thread. Dak Prescott wasn't drafted in the top 10 or 12. (For that matter, Russell Wilson, Tom Brady, and Derek Carr weren't either and those are the 4 best teams in the NFL at the moment record-wise.) Sammy is not similar to Dez...Not by a long shot. They both get paychecks from NFL teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 (edited) Seems a little strange in the context of this thread. Dak Prescott wasn't drafted in the top 10 or 12. (For that matter, Russell Wilson, Tom Brady, and Derek Carr weren't either and those are the 4 best teams in the NFL at the moment record-wise.) Drew Brees was a high 2nd - he's been pretty good too, no? If I've said it once I've said it a million times.... it comes down to talent evaluation. Picking a guy in the top 5 is no guarantee if you have not evaluated the guy properly. The guys who come later pan out less.... but that generally suggests that despite a high % of busts NFL teams are normally pretty good at working out who the good Quarterbacks are - although arguably also that 1st round picks get longer to prove it. If Alex Smith has his first 5 years in the league as 3rd rounder he is out of the league by year 6 when it turned around for him. Edited November 25, 2016 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Drew Brees was a high 2nd - he's been pretty good too, no? If I've said it once I've said it a million times.... it comes down to talent evaluation. Picking a guy in the top 5 is no guarantee if you have not evaluated the guy properly. The guys who come later pan out less.... but that generally suggests that despite a high % of busts NFL teams are normally pretty good at working out who the good Quarterbacks are - although arguably also that 1st round picks get longer to prove it. If Alex Smith has his first 5 years in the league as 3rd rounder he is out of the league by year 6 when it turned around for him. It's really important to hire a coach who can only operate his own "diametrically opposed to the current roster" system every 2 or 3 years. Adios, Rex! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted November 25, 2016 Author Share Posted November 25, 2016 Drew Brees was a high 2nd - he's been pretty good too, no? If I've said it once I've said it a million times.... it comes down to talent evaluation. Picking a guy in the top 5 is no guarantee if you have not evaluated the guy properly. The guys who come later pan out less.... but that generally suggests that despite a high % of busts NFL teams are normally pretty good at working out who the good Quarterbacks are - although arguably also that 1st round picks get longer to prove it. If Alex Smith has his first 5 years in the league as 3rd rounder he is out of the league by year 6 when it turned around for him. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the GM charged with the duty to assemble a supporting cast of talent evaluators to not only prioritize players but to make recommendations on who should be drafted and/or signed as FA's?? It seems JJ has done just that...unlike our beloved team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the GM charged with the duty to assemble a supporting cast of talent evaluators to not only prioritize players but to make recommendations on who should be drafted and/or signed as FA's?? It seems JJ has done just that...unlike our beloved team. Yes. I wasn't doubting that the FO in charge at Dallas has done a great job. I only pulled you up on "Doug loses"... he doesn't. Judged properly he has just about a winning record. The Bills haven't done a good job with Quarterback evaluations in forever.... Dallas have with both Romo and Dak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the GM charged with the duty to assemble a supporting cast of talent evaluators to not only prioritize players but to make recommendations on who should be drafted and/or signed as FA's?? It seems JJ has done just that...unlike our beloved team. One might even think that the GM's job is to run the organization. Hiring the coaches, players, et. al. and putting them under the same roof and giving them the tools to be successful together as a, you know, team. Or maybe the job is really nothing more than a beauty pageant judge. "What do we know about her?" "She's hot." "And?" "She's hot in a dress." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted November 25, 2016 Author Share Posted November 25, 2016 One might even think that the GM's job is to run the organization. Hiring the coaches, players, et. al. and putting them under the same roof and giving them the tools to be successful together as a, you know, team. Or maybe the job is really nothing more than a beauty pageant judge. "What do we know about her?" "She's hot." "And?" "She's hot in a dress." Are you saying Jerry Jones would look hot in a dress?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 One might even think that the GM's job is to run the organization. Hiring the coaches, players, et. al. and putting them under the same roof and giving them the tools to be successful together as a, you know, team. Thing is in Buffalo we know that isn't the case. They were very clear at the Rex hiring presser who is in charge of what and Whaley's remit does not extend that wide. He is basically the GM in charge of formulating the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Thing is in Buffalo we know that isn't the case. They were very clear at the Rex hiring presser who is in charge of what and Whaley's remit does not extend that wide. He is basically the GM in charge of formulating the roster. Not disagreeing. But let's close the loop. Ask yourself who did/does make those decisions. Are you saying Jerry Jones would look hot in a dress?? Heh. No, not my point. I happen to think "the beauty contest judge" angle is overplayed by some. It's not "great scouting" to be able to identify 10 "hot chicks" at a beauty pageant, is it? It's even worse when, if there is a slip up, the judge is excused. Well, he did get 5 out of 10! Anyway, my point was about identity. You want a winning football program? Fine. How the !@#$ are you going to win football games? How exactly are you going to beat Belichick, the Fins, and the Jets? What is your strategy? Falling for the first guy to run a 4.3 40 at the combine isn't a plan. Switching defensive schemes more often than your underwear isn't a plan. Drafting every size and style QB out of the freezer case on aisle 10 isn't a plan. Decide what sort of !@#$ing football team you are going to be, and that better address whipping the competition directly, do that first, and execute the **** out of that plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Not disagreeing. But let's close the loop. Ask yourself who did/does make those decisions. Asked and answered: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 So when did Dallas win the '17 Super Bowl? I must have been sleeping.... As for Jerry, this is a guy who still has Romo on his roster, ROMO!!!!!!! Just the fact that it took 20 years of high draft picks and a rookie QB to show that Romo is a terrible QB proves Jones has no clue. Stay on your knees about Jones if you want Thank goodness the Bills haven't had to rely on a QB that terrible over the past 20 years, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 I really don't understand this thread. It has been well documented his son had to talk him out of Manziel to draft O-line. He historically has not been good. He fired the best coach the team ever had who built the team that won three SuperBowls. He didn't want Dak anymore then the Patriots wanted Brady. He wanted to trade up with Buffalo for Paxton Lynch. The only solid decision he has made was not signing Demarco Murray to a big contract. As for Whaley, lets be honest his tenure has been a mixed bag. He has had some very nice moments and he has crapped the bed on some other decisions. His legacy will be defined by TT and Watkins. If Watkins can stay healthy and becomes as dominant as his peer WRs then he will get a pass on giving up so much for him. I still regard it as a dumb move to move up in the draft and give up a #1 for any WR. I hate that Whaley moves up in the draft to target players. It is a stupid waste of precious resources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 I really don't understand this thread. It has been well documented his son had to talk him out of Manziel to draft O-line. He historically has not been good. He fired the best coach the team ever had who built the team that won three SuperBowls. He didn't want Dak anymore then the Patriots wanted Brady. He wanted to trade up with Buffalo for Paxton Lynch. The only solid decision he has made was not signing Demarco Murray to a big contract. As for Whaley, lets be honest his tenure has been a mixed bag. He has had some very nice moments and he has crapped the bed on some other decisions. His legacy will be defined by TT and Watkins. If Watkins can stay healthy and becomes as dominant as his peer WRs then he will get a pass on giving up so much for him. I still regard it as a dumb move to move up in the draft and give up a #1 for any WR. I hate that Whaley moves up in the draft to target players. It is a stupid waste of precious resources. I'm wondering why you are leaving out the pick of Elliot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 I'm wondering why you are leaving out the pick of Elliot? @SI_PeterKing Dallas drafted Elliott to take heat off defense, in part. Seems to be working. Possessions per game by Dallas foes: 2015: 10.9. 2016: 9.7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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