mannc Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 the guy has thrown 200 passes in college. What fool team would draft this guy before round 6 at best ? Cardale's played the equivalent of about one full season--in other words, the same amount as Cam Newton coming out of Auburn, so you're right, he can't possibly be any good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 They are both big, black and play QB. That's about where the comparisons stop IMO. Cardale is a very intriguing prospect because of his raw skills. His natural skill set is right there with just about anyone in this draft. He just doesn't have a lot of experience. He's raw. only other thing they have in common is ability to throw the ball 70 yards standing still or from midfield while on his knees... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) They are both big, black and play QB. That's about where the comparisons stop IMO. Cardale is a very intriguing prospect because of his raw skills. His natural skill set is right there with just about anyone in this draft. He just doesn't have a lot of experience. He's raw. And I would add that the Russell comparison ignores the fact that he was just plain lazy, unmotivated, indisciplined and lacked desire. I don't know Cardale, Yolo could probably tell us more. But, doesn't it always get back to the mental aspects of the game! Hell Manziel has talent, no pun intended, but he certainly seems to lack the head. Edited April 22, 2016 by The Thurmanator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) Cardale's played the equivalent of about one full season--in other words, the same amount as Cam Newton coming out of Auburn, so you're right, he can't possibly be any good. Cam Newton also completely dominated JuCo ball and had a much better performance in his one season than Cardale did. Cardale is a big time arm and that's about it at this point. I've been saying this ever since he won the National Championship and people were declaring him a future #1 overall pick. Anyone who watched those games carefully should have seen a guy that took advantage of defenses trying to stop Elliot from running all over them (which he did anyway). Cardale was just launching the ball to wide open guys or one on one coverage and the WRs were making great catches. All the big plays exaggerated his stats. He did not show great accuracy or great decision making, he just chucked it a lot. Add on to that the fact that he will not be able to run even close to as much against NFL defenses and, to me, he is a wasted pick before the 5th. And this is coming from an OSU fan. Edited April 22, 2016 by Mark80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Cam Newton also completely dominated JuCo ball and had a much better performance in his one season than Cardale did. Cardale is a big time arm and that's about it at this point. I've been saying this ever since he won the National Championship and people were declaring him a future #1 overall pick. Anyone who watched those games carefully should have seen a guy that took advantage of defenses trying to stop Elliot from running all over them (which he did anyway). Cardale was just launching the ball to wide open guys or one on one coverage and the WRs were making great catches. All the big plays exaggerated his stats. He did not show great accuracy or great decision making, he just chucked it a lot. Add on to that the fact that he will not be able to run even close to as much against NFL defenses and, to me, he is a wasted pick before the 5th. And this is coming from an OSU fan. I watched all those games too, and I saw something very different. Every time OSU needed a big play, he delivered, and he threw the ball with very good accuracy against some excellent defenses. The team played far better than it had before Barrett got hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) I watched all those games too, and I saw something very different. Every time OSU needed a big play, he delivered, and he threw the ball with very good accuracy against some excellent defenses. The team played far better than it had before Barrett got hurt. Really? Watch these highlights and tell me if you feel the same. 0:34 - Underthrown and most likely picked or at least broken up in NFL 0:41 - inaccurate 10 yard high throw to guy who is standing wide open. 0:59 - Underthrown and most likely picked or at least broken up in NFL 1:34 - Underthrown again to a wide open guy 3:10 - WR has to slow down again to catch ball after DB falls down And this is the HIGHLIGHT reel. Tyrod hits those deep balls in stride consistently. Edited April 22, 2016 by Mark80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 I didn't see a thread on it. http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/25547259/bills-enamored-with-boom-or-bust-cardale-jones-eagles-blowing-smoke Gross. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Much like Robert Nkemdiche, I think Cardale Jones has a high Maybin bust quotient. You just don't know if he's really "into" playing football. I watched the entirety of Gruden's show where he was the focus based on all the talk on here about him. I came away with the feeling he's interested in football - to a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 While 12 Gauge would make a certain kind of sense (a project who could sit and learn behind TT), I'm not convinced LaConfora has any inside knowledge concerning the Bills draft plans. I think like many sportswriters, he overstates his sources. He mention "buzz" about the Bills liking Jones. Is this buzz what he hears from sportswriters? What he reads in the press? What he hears from other teams that may or may not have good information and may or may not be honest with a sportswriter? Or does he actually have a good source at OBD? I don't think it's the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Many other scouts love his potential based on his physical attributes as well as his intelligence. Dumb as a rock? Hardly. Where are you getting that from? Here's is just one opinion for your consideration based on his potential in an NFL styled offense: 2016 NFL Draft Scouting Report: Ohio State QB Cardale Jones Very detailed analysis and - to me - surprisingly positive. Nice find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Really? Watch these highlights and tell me if you feel the same. 0:34 - Underthrown and most likely picked or at least broken up in NFL 0:41 - inaccurate 10 yard high throw to guy who is standing wide open. 0:59 - Underthrown and most likely picked or at least broken up in NFL 1:34 - Underthrown again to a wide open guy 3:10 - WR has to slow down again to catch ball after DB falls down And this is the HIGHLIGHT reel. Tyrod hits those deep balls in stride consistently. Wow, you're picky. In those highlights, which were mostly from one game, I saw Cardale hit a lot of guys in stride. Some of the balls you say were underthrown I would call back shoulder passes. And when he decides to run, DBs might want to get out of the way. Here's the bottom line with Cardale: He is a huge guy with an even bigger arm. He is very mobile, especially for a guy his size. Because of his size and mobility, he is difficult to sack and is likely to be highly durable in the pros. Despite some borderline racist comments I have read here and other places, he appears to be a smart guy who for the most part has his head on straight. He has NEVER lost a college game and he performed at his best on the biggest possible stage. His upside is unlimited. I will be surprised if he makes it to round 3, but if he does, the Bills had better pull the trigger on the 12-gauge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 Wow, you're picky. In those highlights, which were mostly from one game, I saw Cardale hit a lot of guys in stride. Some of the balls you say were underthrown I would call back shoulder passes. And when he decides to run, DBs might want to get out of the way. Here's the bottom line with Cardale: He is a huge guy with an even bigger arm. He is very mobile, especially for a guy his size. Because of his size and mobility, he is difficult to sack and is likely to be highly durable in the pros. Despite some borderline racist comments I have read here and other places, he appears to be a smart guy who for the most part has his head on straight. He has NEVER lost a college game and he performed at his best on the biggest possible stage. His upside is unlimited. I will be surprised if he makes it to round 3, but if he does, the Bills had better pull the trigger on the 12-gauge. No, those throws would be "pickies." In the NFL you have to be picky with your QB. Isn't that obvious? Tighter coverages, better schemes, faster closing times, etc. He was underthrowing guys who were open by 3-5 yards over and over again. You are delusional if you think he meant to throw a 45 yard back shoulder throw. Those throws are 20 yard throws on a rope when guys do it, not 45-50 yard underthrown bombs. Come on man. This was just the first video I found and in the whole video he had 1 good throw in stride. 1. It was the same story throughout those games and last season. Thus, the demotion. I'm sure I could find numerous other videos showing the same thing but I don't feel like wasting the time, especially to someone who tries to justify those throws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 I think some folks are slightly missing the point with Jones... With the extraordinarily high rate of failure QB's drafted after the 2nd round have had, if you're going to take a guy in the 3rd or later, it might as well be a guy with all the physical tools and a rocket arm... The truth is the chances of getting the right guy are slim...But with a kid like Jones you really don't have to tweak much physically...You just have to coach him up and hope he catches on...If he doesn't, it's not like it's going to be a big surprise...But the truth is had he started 3 full years at Ohio St he more than likely would be a 1st Round pick...Right or wrong...So if you're going to do it...Why not do it with the QB that has the most upside?...Work him hard and see if you get lucky... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 I think some folks are slightly missing the point with Jones... With the extraordinarily high rate of failure QB's drafted after the 2nd round have had, if you're going to take a guy in the 3rd or later, it might as well be a guy with all the physical tools and a rocket arm... The truth is the chances of getting the right guy are slim...But with a kid like Jones you really don't have to tweak much physically...You just have to coach him up and hope he catches on...If he doesn't, it's not like it's going to be a big surprise...But the truth is had he started 3 full years at Ohio St he more than likely would be a 1st Round pick...Right or wrong...So if you're going to do it...Why not do it with the QB that has the most upside?...Work him hard and see if you get lucky... Exactly. If he was a more polished product, and without some of the uncertainty, there is no way the Bills would have a chance at drafting him. It's not like the Bills haven't bombed on plenty of second and third-round picks; might as well roll the dice on a guy who has incredible upside at the most important position in sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) I think some folks are slightly missing the point with Jones... With the extraordinarily high rate of failure QB's drafted after the 2nd round have had, if you're going to take a guy in the 3rd or later, it might as well be a guy with all the physical tools and a rocket arm... The truth is the chances of getting the right guy are slim...But with a kid like Jones you really don't have to tweak much physically...You just have to coach him up and hope he catches on...If he doesn't, it's not like it's going to be a big surprise...But the truth is had he started 3 full years at Ohio St he more than likely would be a 1st Round pick...Right or wrong...So if you're going to do it...Why not do it with the QB that has the most upside?...Work him hard and see if you get lucky... I didn't miss the point on it. I said 5th or later on him is where I would be comfortable with the Bills taking him. We could easily get starters in rounds 1-3 and round 4 could be great depth. A QB that needs that much work (in my opinion) shouldn't trump those. I whole heartedly disagree with that latter statement though. People were saying the exact same thing about him going in to last season and he didn't play well at all. Edited April 22, 2016 by Mark80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 If the guy was showing extreme accuracy dont you think he would be a first round pick? I think some people are approaching this from the wrong direction You are looking for a guy with warts but high upside that you can sit for a year.....then he will be holding the clipboard after that....you are NOT looking to replace Tyrod Taylor. That is what makes him appealing......ceiling is high..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) Cardale's played the equivalent of about one full season--in other words, the same amount as Cam Newton coming out of Auburn, so you're right, he can't possibly be any good. LMAO.. Ok.. newton 30 TDs 7 INTs in one full season jones 8 tds 5 INts in a partial season pretty sure Jones will be EJ part deux if he is drafted but the Bills.. Edited April 22, 2016 by ddaryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) Wow, you're picky. In those highlights, which were mostly from one game, I saw Cardale hit a lot of guys in stride. Some of the balls you say were underthrown I would call back shoulder passes. And when he decides to run, DBs might want to get out of the way. Here's the bottom line with Cardale: He is a huge guy with an even bigger arm. He is very mobile, especially for a guy his size. Because of his size and mobility, he is difficult to sack and is likely to be highly durable in the pros. Despite some borderline racist comments I have read here and other places, he appears to be a smart guy who for the most part has his head on straight. He has NEVER lost a college game and he performed at his best on the biggest possible stage. His upside is unlimited. I will be surprised if he makes it to round 3, but if he does, the Bills had better pull the trigger on the 12-gauge. I do not know what level of academic intelligence Jones has, but I do believe that there is little correlation between "book smarts" and the ability to quickly see and process what is happening on an athletic field and then react to it - and it is the latter that is more important for a QB. On this, I think Jones' grade is "incomplete" because there just isn't enough game tape to tell. No doubt he has size, athletic ability and a great arm, but does he have the quick mental recognition and will he prepare like a pro? I don't think anyone really knows that. It is the lack of available evidence that would cause me to avoid him before round 3. I would have to think very hard to take him in round 3, but I think the risk/reward ratio is OK there. Edited April 22, 2016 by OldTimer1960 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 LMAO.. Ok.. newton 30 TDs 7 INTs in one full season jones 8 tds 5 INts in a partial season pretty sure Jones will be EJ part deux if he is drafted but the Bills.. It would not be EJ part deux because its not the same situation..... EJ got rushed along.....started in his first year.....and relied upon when he should have been holding a clip board. QBs that get drafted later get that luxery...nothing would be expected from C. Jones for a while That is a big difference.....it gives them a chance to get their feet under them and watch and learn....also....the amount of risk is greatly reduced because they dont get that 1st round contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted April 22, 2016 Share Posted April 22, 2016 (edited) It would not be EJ part deux because its not the same situation..... EJ got rushed along.....started in his first year.....and relied upon when he should have been holding a clip board. QBs that get drafted later get that luxery...nothing would be expected from C. Jones for a while That is a big difference.....it gives them a chance to get their feet under them and watch and learn....also....the amount of risk is greatly reduced because they dont get that 1st round contract. doesn't matter IMO. I see nothing at all to think Jones is going to be anything. IMO EJ could hold a clip board and be groomed for a decade and he would still be the exact same QBc maybe Jones as an undrafted player, but there has to be someone with a better resume out there Edited April 22, 2016 by ddaryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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