3rdand12 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Drunk members of the Enforcer Class v. Drunk Money Could go either way. Each has carved out a special niche in the criminal justice system. LOL !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Very wide right Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 I understand your position that players fall under the category of "entertainers" and not public servants but I respectfully and strenuously disagree with your stance. The individual players don't only represent themselves by the manner in which they conduct themselves but they also represent the league. If an entertainer endorsed a product and was involved in "incidents" then the company that they are representing certainly don't want someone who is promoting their product to behave in a manner that doesn't represent the values of the company. If a player gets involved in a brawl that he didn't initiate that doesn't mean that the league is going to tolerate that type of conduct in public. Is it unfair that the standard is higher for the player than it is for the public in general? Not in my eyes and not in the eyes of the league. The same type of higher standard applies in the corporate world. It is not unusual for a company to take a dim view of someone who is identified with the company to expect them to behave in a higher standard than what other people are expected to behave. I'm not judging anyone's behavior here because I don't have the facts. But the point I am stressing is that for some public people being involved in an "incident", even in a tangential manner, can get you in trouble with your employer. The concept of a code of conduct is very often applied to employees' behavior outside of the workplace. Is it unfair? That is not the issue. It is a reality of being a professional athlete. Some athletes find it a challenge to stay within the boundaries of good conduct while most athletes don't. Nice post John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionC3 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Unless decent video shows Shady actually hitting/kicking someone and that hit/kick injuring him, not sure how he gets charged with assault, much less aggravated. Accomplice liability. Not sure about PA (have no reason to expect different from NY), but the greater the injuries and the greater the number of assailants the greater the penalty. This mess could have resulted in a gang assault charge in NY; not sure if there is a PA equivalent. Also, picking on cops (no matter whether cops deserved it) is always a bad plan. McCoy needs an attorney with a good relationship with the DA's office. Could be tough to negotiate a case like this otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) I understand your position that players fall under the category of "entertainers" and not public servants but I respectfully and strenuously disagree with your stance. The individual players don't only represent themselves by the manner in which they conduct themselves but they also represent the league. If an entertainer endorsed a product and was involved in "incidents" then the company that they are representing certainly don't want someone who is promoting their product to behave in a manner that doesn't represent the values of the company. If a player gets involved in a brawl that he didn't initiate that doesn't mean that the league is going to tolerate that type of conduct in public. Is it unfair that the standard is higher for the player than it is for the public in general? Not in my eyes and not in the eyes of the league. The same type of higher standard applies in the corporate world. It is not unusual for a company to take a dim view of someone who is identified with the company to expect them to behave in a higher standard than what other people are expected to behave. I'm not judging anyone's behavior here because I don't have the facts. But the point I am stressing is that for some public people being involved in an "incident", even in a tangential manner, can get you in trouble with your employer. The concept of a code of conduct is very often applied to employees' behavior outside of the workplace. Is it unfair? That is not the issue. It is a reality of being a professional athlete. Some athletes find it a challenge to stay within the boundaries of good conduct while most athletes don't. I dont think we are all that far apart here. If the "employee" has stepped outside of the boundaries of the said employer's expectations and requirements. The employee should be dressed down or reprimanded. possibly resulting in dismissal. Unless he is still making money for the corporation. Its a business decision at that point. On the other side. It sure as hell better be about ethics and morals and nothing else Edited February 9, 2016 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Accomplice liability. Not sure about PA (have no reason to expect different from NY), but the greater the injuries and the greater the number of assailants the greater the penalty. This mess could have resulted in a gang assault charge in NY; not sure if there is a PA equivalent. Also, picking on cops (no matter whether cops deserved it) is always a bad plan. McCoy needs an attorney with a good relationship with the DA's office. Could be tough to negotiate a case like this otherwise. Accomplice liability is an equal stretch, again without better video evidence showing he assisted the others. And from what I've heard so far, they were never identified as cops during the incident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontario51 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 How much cap space do the Bills save if they release LM he is good but if he is not available, he is no good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 I understand your position that players fall under the category of "entertainers" and not public servants but I respectfully and strenuously disagree with your stance. The individual players don't only represent themselves by the manner in which they conduct themselves but they also represent the league. If an entertainer endorsed a product and was involved in "incidents" then the company that they are representing certainly don't want someone who is promoting their product to behave in a manner that doesn't represent the values of the company. If a player gets involved in a brawl that he didn't initiate that doesn't mean that the league is going to tolerate that type of conduct in public. Is it unfair that the standard is higher for the player than it is for the public in general? Not in my eyes and not in the eyes of the league. The same type of higher standard applies in the corporate world. It is not unusual for a company to take a dim view of someone who is identified with the company to expect them to behave in a higher standard than what other people are expected to behave. I'm not judging anyone's behavior here because I don't have the facts. But the point I am stressing is that for some public people being involved in an "incident", even in a tangential manner, can get you in trouble with your employer. The concept of a code of conduct is very often applied to employees' behavior outside of the workplace. Is it unfair? That is not the issue. It is a reality of being a professional athlete. Some athletes find it a challenge to stay within the boundaries of good conduct while most athletes don't. Well said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Accomplice liability is an equal stretch, again without better video evidence showing he assisted the others. And from what I've heard so far, they were never identified as cops during the incident. Does that really matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) How much cap space do the Bills save if they release LM he is good but if he is not available, he is no good. none, it will use more cap space to cut him than to keep him I really can't tell anything from the video and I've watched it twice. Someone on Twitter says that he's actually holding back the guy with the bottle (good) others say based on the video he's in for a sizable suspension (bad) Edited February 9, 2016 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Does that really matter? It's worse legally to beat up a cop than someone you don't know is a cop. I understand your position that players fall under the category of "entertainers" and not public servants but I respectfully and strenuously disagree with your stance. The individual players don't only represent themselves by the manner in which they conduct themselves but they also represent the league. If an entertainer endorsed a product and was involved in "incidents" then the company that they are representing certainly don't want someone who is promoting their product to behave in a manner that doesn't represent the values of the company. If a player gets involved in a brawl that he didn't initiate that doesn't mean that the league is going to tolerate that type of conduct in public. Is it unfair that the standard is higher for the player than it is for the public in general? Not in my eyes and not in the eyes of the league. The same type of higher standard applies in the corporate world. It is not unusual for a company to take a dim view of someone who is identified with the company to expect them to behave in a higher standard than what other people are expected to behave. I'm not judging anyone's behavior here because I don't have the facts. But the point I am stressing is that for some public people being involved in an "incident", even in a tangential manner, can get you in trouble with your employer. The concept of a code of conduct is very often applied to employees' behavior outside of the workplace. Is it unfair? That is not the issue. It is a reality of being a professional athlete. Some athletes find it a challenge to stay within the boundaries of good conduct while most athletes don't. Good points. On the flip side, don't the police officers have a duty to make sure the incident didn't escalate? Does the fact that they were injured make them innocent? And what repercussions from their employers should be expected? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 It's worse legally to beat up a cop than someone you don't know is a cop. Good points. On the flip side, don't the police officers have a duty to make sure the incident didn't escalate? Does the fact that they were injured make them innocent? And what repercussions from their employers should be expected? Really? I've never read that. I figured it was an "ignorance is no excuse" law, like defacing a federal vehicle. Either way, you gotta think the PD and DA's office will be gunning for them more because the alleged victims were officers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Does that really matter? oh hell yes it does!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Really? I've never read that. I figured it was an "ignorance is no excuse" law, like defacing a federal vehicle. Either way, you gotta think the PD and DA's office will be gunning for them more because the alleged victims were officers. Oh, I'm sure they will be. And he's rich to boot. Edited February 9, 2016 by Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 He will have fresh legs for the playoff run Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Really? I've never read that. I figured it was an "ignorance is no excuse" law, like defacing a federal vehicle. Either way, you gotta think the PD and DA's office will be gunning for them more because the alleged victims were officers. Nope once they Identify themselves you must cease and desist or else. seriously. if they did not this also makes them look guilty as hell. Just a "hey we are cops " should be enough to turn the volume down quickly for everyone. Including the bar. full stop. He will have fresh legs for the playoff run always always with the positive vibe. Love you Man ! Really? I've never read that. I figured it was an "ignorance is no excuse" law, like defacing a federal vehicle. Either way, you gotta think the PD and DA's office will be gunning for them more because the alleged victims were officers. and why might you bring that particular offense into the discussion? Leniency is afforded when cooperation is expressed. Have you something to tell "us" Edited February 9, 2016 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Nope once they Identify themselves you must cease and desist or else. seriously. if they did not this also makes them look guilty as hell. Just a "hey we are cops " should be enough to turn the volume down quickly for everyone. Including the bar. full stop. always always with the positive vibe. Love you Man ! and why might you bring that particular offense into the discussion? Leniency is afforded when cooperation is expressed. Have you something to tell "us" It was never proven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) It's worse legally to beat up a cop than someone you don't know is a cop. Good points. On the flip side, don't the police officers have a duty to make sure the incident didn't escalate? Does the fact that they were injured make them innocent? And what repercussions from their employers should be expected? The off-duty cops getting hurt has little bearing on whether they are innocent or not. The question is what exactly happened? Who instigated it and what was the reaction. A person can start a problem such as bumping into someone in a bar or look lasciviously at your babe but that doesn't give the aggrieved party the right to take a bat and beat the person over the head. The off-duty cops certainly can be in trouble from the way they behaved in the bar. Were they drunk? Were they acting loudly and being ill-mannered. Those types of behavior that bring ill-repute to the organization can certainly get them in trouble with their department, even if they have no legal liabilities associated with the brawl. Edited February 9, 2016 by JohnC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Accomplice liability is an equal stretch, again without better video evidence showing he assisted the others. And from what I've heard so far, they were never identified as cops during the incident. All he had to do was encourage them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 Meet the off duty cops http://www.pennlive.com/philadelphiaeagles/index.ssf/2016/02/meet_the_off-duty_police_offic.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 9, 2016 Share Posted February 9, 2016 It was never proven. It was never proven. I suppose we can make our assumptions then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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