Kelly the Dog Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) He is not having enough impact, and none of the counter arguments are convincing. They sound like apologists. Lol. Not producing in games he didn't actually play in, which is exactly 45% of them, is not convincing? You wanted him to get, say, at least 4-50 in those games he wasn't in? Edited November 15, 2015 by Kelly the Dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Billieve Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 That he is both overrated, and not being used properly, and that possibly he is going to waste with this coaching staff. Is a team message board the wrong place for opinions about the team? I believe there are enough "variables" to keep him out of the top 20. I can be convinced that there are enough variables to keep him out of the top 40. But he is not even in the top 60. Does anyone here think he would be in the top 20 if he played for the Browns? Would he be having Travis Benjamin's season, or better? I don't think he would be doing any better. He is not having enough impact, and none of the counter arguments are convincing. They sound like apologists. Do you think the same thing about Taylor's passing yards? He's coming in at 31. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 That he is both overrated, and not being used properly, and that possibly he is going to waste with this coaching staff. Is a team message board the wrong place for opinions about the team? I believe there are enough "variables" to keep him out of the top 20. I can be convinced that there are enough variables to keep him out of the top 40. But he is not even in the top 60. Does anyone here think he would be in the top 20 if he played for the Browns? Would he be having Travis Benjamin's season, or better? I don't think he would be doing any better. He is not having enough impact, and none of the counter arguments are convincing. They sound like apologists. That's ridiculous. It'd be more honest if you just said you wanted to troll. You're upset because he's not producing stats -- he's clearly impacting the games in which he plays. That's undeniable to anyone who watches the games. You do watch the games, don't you? Or do you just read the stat lines? Lol. Not producing in games he didn't actually play in, which is exactly 25% of them, is not convincing? You wanted him to get, say, at least 4-50 in those games he wasn't in? Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Lol. Not producing in games he didn't actually play in, which is exactly 45% of them, is not convincing? You wanted him to get, say, at least 4-50 in those games he wasn't in? If you don't play, you can't have an impact. Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 If you don't play, you can't have an impact. Lol. But you're saying him not playing isn't a good enough reason for why his stats are low. Don't you see why that's batty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Billieve Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 If you don't play, you can't have an impact. Lol. Seriously, I want to know, do you think the same about Taylor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 That's ridiculous. It'd be more honest if you just said you wanted to troll. You're upset because he's not producing stats -- he's clearly impacting the games in which he plays. That's undeniable to anyone who watches the games. You do watch the games, don't you? Or do you just read the stat lines? Thank you. So everyone is satisfied with his career? Cool, nothing more to discuss. I guess he is truly on his way to the HoF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 So everyone is satisfied with his career? Cool, nothing more to discuss. I guess he is truly on his way to the HoF. You started the conversation with this: I have high hopes for Watkins (obviously), and it's cool to admire the nuances of his game, but when I pull up the list of leading receivers this season...he ain't on it. http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving 69th (just below Kamar Aiken). There are lots of guys on the list that aren't close to his level of skill and talent. Something needs to change. No one's talking about his career, we're talking about this season. Specifically, you were complaining that his numbers were low and "something needs to change". When it was pointed out that it's tough to put up stats from the cold tub, you said that's not a good enough reason. Which is just silly. I mean really, REALLY silly. If you want to rail on Sammy's career, rail on it. Don't pretend like you're really interested in figuring out what "needs to change", you clearly are not interested in that at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) Seriously, I want to know, do you think the same about Taylor? A QB is judged differently. Firstly, the Bills didn't use 2 first picks to obtain him, so they haven't invested as much in him. QB's have to run the offense, and Tyrod has done a good job, and is getting better at the toughest position on the field. I'm not over the moon about Tyrod though. And I think he will miss a lot of time due to injury. If a guy can't be counted on to play, that counts against him. If the Bills had used first picks to obtain Tyrod, I would be more disappointed, too. I'm not a "stat guy", and I haven't played Fantasy Football in 20 years, so that has no influence on my feelings either. I want and expect more from Watkins. Edited November 15, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 So everyone is satisfied with his career? Cool, nothing more to discuss. I guess he is truly on his way to the HoF. He doesn't have a career yet. I'm satisfied with his contributions so far but expect much, much more down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finn Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 And I expect it will change. Various factors have contributed to this. Missed games/ practice time by Watkins. Missed time / games by Taylor. EJ Manuel at QB all have a role in this. If Watkins, Taylor, McCoy stay healthy the remainder of the season, I think the second half numbers will improve dramatically. We heard this at the beginning of the year, too. Will we hear the same type of thing at the end of the year? One wonders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 That he is both overrated, and not being used properly, and that possibly he is going to waste with this coaching staff. Is a team message board the wrong place for opinions about the team? I believe there are enough "variables" to keep him out of the top 20. I can be convinced that there are enough variables to keep him out of the top 40. But he is not even in the top 60. Does anyone here think he would be in the top 20 if he played for the Browns? Would he be having Travis Benjamin's season, or better? I don't think he would be doing any better. He is not having enough impact, and none of the counter arguments are convincing. They sound like apologists. Yes , I think his stats would be better. He would likely have more targets on the Browns as they are often playing from behind and passing. McCown had some good days throwing the ball, so I don't see why Watkins wouldn't benefit from that. I'm assuming you mean if he were taking the place of Bejamin, not playing across the field from him, as that might cut down how many passes come his way . I imagine he'd be more of a focal point in that offense . It's not exactly convincing to say the Bills O is underutilizing him, then say you don't think he'd be doing any better if he were somewhere else. If you think that way, you just don't think he's any good. That's fine, but why not just say it? I think Watkins is good. His only issue has been missed time, which is not his fault. Saying there are reasons for his low numbers this year is not apologizing for him. If he were getting 8-10 targets a game and not catching them I'd have a problem. If he was struggling to get open I'd take issue with that too. I know he had the best rookie season by a Bills WR ever last year with EJM and Kyle Orton at QB, missing 1000 yards by 40 yards or so. I don't think he's been a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 A QB is judged differently. Firstly, the Bills didn't use 2 first picks to obtain him, so they haven't invested as much in him. QB's have to run the offense, and Tyrod has done a good job, and is getting better at the toughest position on the field. I'm not over the moon about Tyrod though. And I think he will miss a lot of time due to injury. If a guy can't be counted on to play, that counts against him. If the Bills had used first picks to obtain Tyrod, I would be more disappointed, too. I'm not a "stat guy", and I haven't played Fantasy Football in 20 years, so that has no influence on my feelings either. I want and expect more from Watkins. Well, you seem to be baseing your displeasure with Watkins completely on stats. A player has no control over who drafts them and how the pick(s) used to acquire them are obtained. I don't expect less from Taylor because he wasn't a high pick. If he's the QB I expect him to play well. What is Watkins not doing well enough for you? Would you be more satisfied if he were putting up numbers and the Bills were 3-6? Is SW a problem with the Bills offense, or is he likely a part of what is right with it? They sure looked different without him, and not in a good way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I'm not a "stat guy", and I haven't played Fantasy Football in 20 years, so that has no influence on my feelings either. I want and expect more from Watkins. You're not a stat guy, but the lead post today was about how Sammy's stats were behind Aiken's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) That he is both overrated, and not being used properly, and that possibly he is going to waste with this coaching staff. Is a team message board the wrong place for opinions about the team? I believe there are enough "variables" to keep him out of the top 20. I can be convinced that there are enough variables to keep him out of the top 40. But he is not even in the top 60. Does anyone here think he would be in the top 20 if he played for the Browns? Would he be having Travis Benjamin's season, or better? I don't think he would be doing any better. He is not having enough impact, and none of the counter arguments are convincing. They sound like apologists. Last year as a rookie, he was ranked 24th in WR rankings (by yards) with Orton at QB. You aren't being ridiculed because we are a bunch of apologists, you are being ridiculed because you are passive aggressively attacking Sammy based on games he couldn't play. Criticize the injury? fine whatever, but call him out and say hes no better than a top 40 WR based on non-performances this season when he was 24th according to your own ranking his rookie year is absurd and ridiculous. Then to top it all off you waffle back and forth between blaming the coaches for utilization of him, and then flip to him being no better if he was healthy and on the Browns, as if he couldn't beat Travis Benjamin, and Gary Barnidge (TE but your choice not mine) for the WR1 spot. Edited November 15, 2015 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) Well, you seem to be baseing your displeasure with Watkins completely on stats. A player has no control over who drafts them and how the pick(s) used to acquire them are obtained. I don't expect less from Taylor because he wasn't a high pick. If he's the QB I expect him to play well. What is Watkins not doing well enough for you? Would you be more satisfied if he were putting up numbers and the Bills were 3-6? Is SW a problem with the Bills offense, or is he likely a part of what is right with it? They sure looked different without him, and not in a good way. meh, I guess you guys are right. This team is a juggernaut, and if Watkins doesn't score, or get many receptions, I'm not gonna judge. It's asking too much! I really doubt he could do more than what he has already, and his contributions away from the ball are enormous. I mean, he might get into the HoF on his blocking alone. From what I understand, the opposing defense put the BEST CB on him every game! I know they do that to DeAndre Hopkins too, but he has been lucky enough to have Brian Hoyer back there slinging it. I'm hoping Whaley trades away the Bills 2017 pick so we can use 2 firsts to pick up a bookend WR. If we have 2 guys playing like Watkins, it would be UnBillievable! Edited November 15, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) meh, I guess you guys are right. This team is a juggernaut, and if Watkins doesn't score, or get many receptions, I'm not gonna judge. It's asking too much! I really doubt he could do more than what he has already, and his contributions away from the ball are enormous. I mean, he might get into the HoF on his blocking alone. From what I understand, the opposing defense put the BEST CB on him every game! I know they do that to DeAndre Hopkins too, but he has been lucky enough to have Brian Hoyer back there slinging it. I'm hoping Whaley trades away the Bills 2017 pick so we can use 2 firsts to pick up a bookend WR. If we have 2 guys playing like Watkins, it would be UnBillievable! Let's project DeAndre Hopkins based on half of his games played (like Watkins). Hmmm 435 yards and 3 tds. What does Sammy have? 329 yards and 3 tds. Damn what a bust. But wait a minute looking at the targets, Hopkins has 57 in half of his games and Sammy has 32. Edited November 15, 2015 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I never thought I'd see a guy named HoF Watkins bitching about how Watkins sucks. We've come completely full circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I never thought I'd see a guy named HoF Watkins bitching about how Watkins sucks. We've come completely full circle. I'm pretty sure it was an ironic screen name when he made it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 meh, I guess you guys are right. This team is a juggernaut, and if Watkins doesn't score, or get many receptions, I'm not gonna judge. It's asking too much! I really doubt he could do more than what he has already, and his contributions away from the ball are enormous. I mean, he might get into the HoF on his blocking alone. From what I understand, the opposing defense put the BEST CB on him every game! I know they do that to DeAndre Hopkins too, but he has been lucky enough to have Brian Hoyer back there slinging it. I'm hoping Whaley trades away the Bills 2017 pick so we can use 2 firsts to pick up a bookend WR. If we have 2 guys playing like Watkins, it would be UnBillievable! No, the Bills are not a juggernaut. I'd like to see the Bills throw his way more often, as he usually gets open. If they do, I think he will catch the vast majority of his targets and will put up good numbers. With a WR like him, I'd expect him to be the focal point offensively. Nice eggageration though. Why not just disclose your manifesto on Watkins and what the Bills should do to get his numbers up where you think they should be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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