Mikie2times Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Yards per play is total rushing and passing yards, minus sack yards, divided by attempts. Taylor 43 Attempts, 335 Yards, 7.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 9 drives= 77.8% Manuel 39 Attempts, 328 Yards, 8.4 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 13 drives= 53.8% Cassell 17 Attempts, 82 Yards, 4.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 2 of 4 drives= 50.0% I really hope Cassell is't in the mix. I understand he has taken a back seat so the coaches can see what they have in EJ and Taylor, but I just don't see him getting his Yards Per Play near 7.0, which Taylor and Manuel are both comfortably in. Taylor really seems to have a knack for sustaining drives. Leading 7 out of 9 drives into scoring range is pretty impressive and most those were TD's. EJ has also done well in this area including a game winning drive and by far the strongest job in the deep passing game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 EJ is the only one to have thrown a TD pass. I think he has thrown four. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 That's a good breakdown of the stats. Cassel's been efficient, but too conservative. I think the starting WRs would've executed the West Coast route combinations better, but Cassel missed open guys too. For instance, on that short throw to Easley where he got called for PI, Cassel had Clay running a dig route 10 yards further down the field. He goes to the high percentage throws too often. Gotta take chances. They've been paying off for Taylor and EJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 (edited) Yards per play is total rushing and passing yards, minus sack yards, divided by attempts. Taylor 43 Attempts, 335 Yards, 7.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 9 drives= 77.8% Manuel 39 Attempts, 328 Yards, 8.4 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 13 drives= 53.8% Cassell 17 Attempts, 82 Yards, 4.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 2 of 4 drives= 50.0% I really hope Cassell is't in the mix. I understand he has taken a back seat so the coaches can see what they have in EJ and Taylor, but I just don't see him getting his Yards Per Play near 7.0, which Taylor and Manuel are both comfortably in. Taylor really seems to have a knack for sustaining drives. Leading 7 out of 9 drives into scoring range is pretty impressive and most those were TD's. EJ has also done well in this area including a game winning drive and by far the strongest job in the deep passing game. I think the fact that EJM was playing with 3rd stringers was holding him back in the early games. He would have had better stats. That should be factored in. Against the Browns it was a real struggle with some crap play from the backups (those bad snaps were ridiculous), but he managed to keep things together. And TD's should count for more, no? How about "Points Scored"? I mean, if I was a guy that wanted Tyrod to look best, I would use your stats (Field Goals Attempted?...oh yeah,Taylor had that sack that led to a failed attempt), but if I wanted EJM, I could doctor some up a bit differently, yet they would appear just as "fair". Using the eyeball test, which I trust way more than these kind of stats, I think EJ has looked the best overall in the preseason games. I like Tyrod, too. And I will be happy to see him be named the starter (I have no idea what has transpired at practice, and have to trust the coaches to evaluate that part). I won't accept Cassel though. If he is chosen, I have to believe it is the coaches being way too conservative. I expect Tyrod. Edited August 31, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 .... I think EJ has looked the best overall in the preseason games..... I expect Tyrod. I've seen a lot of people state pretty much the same thing around the many QB threads and I don't really understand the logic. By saying that one thinks QB A has looked a better QB than QB B...but they expect QB B will get the start, isn't that saying that one either does not have faith in the coaches to make the right decision, or that one(for some reason) thinks that their own analysis is wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 (edited) I've seen a lot of people state pretty much the same thing around the many QB threads and I don't really understand the logic. By saying that one thinks QB A has looked a better QB than QB B...but they expect QB B will get the start, isn't that saying that one either does not have faith in the coaches to make the right decision, or that one(for some reason) thinks that their own analysis is wrong? yes, Dibs. Edited August 31, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWesternBill Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 (edited) I do appreciate the numbers you provided, curious if you feel these are the most telling ones? Edited August 31, 2015 by NorthWesternBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Taylor with EJ as backup and Cassel is the security blanket. Make it so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsMagic1 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Taylor with EJ as backup and Cassel is the security blanket. Make it so Can agree with this or with EJ one and TT two...either way works for me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemac2001 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Why not a points scored per drive average makes more sense then fg attempt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Yards per play is total rushing and passing yards, minus sack yards, divided by attempts. Taylor 43 Attempts, 335 Yards, 7.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 9 drives= 77.8% Manuel 39 Attempts, 328 Yards, 8.4 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 13 drives= 53.8% Cassell 17 Attempts, 82 Yards, 4.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 2 of 4 drives= 50.0% I really hope Cassell is't in the mix. I understand he has taken a back seat so the coaches can see what they have in EJ and Taylor, but I just don't see him getting his Yards Per Play near 7.0, which Taylor and Manuel are both comfortably in. Taylor really seems to have a knack for sustaining drives. Leading 7 out of 9 drives into scoring range is pretty impressive and most those were TD's. EJ has also done well in this area including a game winning drive and by far the strongest job in the deep passing game. Humh. NFL.com has different stats for the three preseason games to date: Taylor 31attempts, 24 completions, 236 yds, 0 TDs passing 1 TD running* Manuel 30 attempts, 20 completions, 358 yds, 4 TDs passing Cassel 15 attempts, 13 completions, 83 yds, 0 TDs passing http://www.nfl.com/player/tyrodtaylor/2495240/profile http://www.nfl.com/player/ejmanuel/2539228/profile http://www.nfl.com/player/mattcassel/2506562/profile * When Tyrod needed to run, he ran for 20 and a score. When Cassel needed to run he got stopped three yards short like he had a rope tied to his waste and the goal post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Yards per play is total rushing and passing yards, minus sack yards, divided by attempts. Taylor 43 Attempts, 335 Yards, 7.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 9 drives= 77.8% Manuel 39 Attempts, 328 Yards, 8.4 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 13 drives= 53.8% Cassell 17 Attempts, 82 Yards, 4.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 2 of 4 drives= 50.0% I really hope Cassell is't in the mix. I understand he has taken a back seat so the coaches can see what they have in EJ and Taylor, but I just don't see him getting his Yards Per Play near 7.0, which Taylor and Manuel are both comfortably in. Taylor really seems to have a knack for sustaining drives. Leading 7 out of 9 drives into scoring range is pretty impressive and most those were TD's. EJ has also done well in this area including a game winning drive and by far the strongest job in the deep passing game. Awesome post bro. I think your stats explain why I feel better about Tyrod compared to the other guys at this point. He moves the chains and gets you in scoring position on a high percentage of drives. That to me is the biggest thing that separates him from the other guys. And combined with the ability to get it done on 3rd down, he also has the big play potential in him. If he is given the start in week 1 and he plays as well as he has played in preseason so far, the Bills are going to win the AFC East. Those are two big "if's" I know, but if they do happen, we will be enjoying a playoff game or two in wintertime. And nothing beats the atmosphere of a home Buffalo Bills playoff game. Anybody remember those? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Buffalo Wings Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Why not a points scored per drive average makes more sense then fg attempt I agree, FG attempts aren't a great thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think the fact that EJM was playing with 3rd stringers was holding him back in the early games. He would have had better stats. That should be factored in. Against the Browns it was a real struggle with some crap play from the backups (those bad snaps were ridiculous), but he managed to keep things together. And TD's should count for more, no? How about "Points Scored"? I mean, if I was a guy that wanted Tyrod to look best, I would use your stats (Field Goals Attempted?...oh yeah,Taylor had that sack that led to a failed attempt), but if I wanted EJM, I could doctor some up a bit differently, yet they would appear just as "fair". Using the eyeball test, which I trust way more than these kind of stats, I think EJ has looked the best overall in the preseason games. I like Tyrod, too. And I will be happy to see him be named the starter (I have no idea what has transpired at practice, and have to trust the coaches to evaluate that part). I won't accept Cassel though. If he is chosen, I have to believe it is the coaches being way too conservative. I expect Tyrod. To your first point, he was playing with and against 3's. Are you saying that our 3's are worse than their 3's? To your second point, EJ had 39 points on 13 Drives (One of which was a TD that involved 3 Fred Jackson runs and no passing attempts), Tyrod had 34 points on 9 Drives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I've seen a lot of people state pretty much the same thing around the many QB threads and I don't really understand the logic. By saying that one thinks QB A has looked a better QB than QB B...but they expect QB B will get the start, isn't that saying that one either does not have faith in the coaches to make the right decision, or that one(for some reason) thinks that their own analysis is wrong? I've seen a lot of people state pretty much the same thing around the many QB threads and I don't really understand the logic. By saying that one thinks QB A has looked a better QB than QB B...but they expect QB B will get the start, isn't that saying that one either does not have faith in the coaches to make the right decision, or that one(for some reason) thinks that their own analysis is wrong? I think it indicates that we as fans don't get to see everything that goes into making the decision. Practices, meetings, film study, work habits, interactions with teammates, etc. We only judge our opinions based on limited data and preconceived notions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Yards per play is total rushing and passing yards, minus sack yards, divided by attempts. Taylor 43 Attempts, 335 Yards, 7.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 9 drives= 77.8% Manuel 39 Attempts, 328 Yards, 8.4 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 7 of 13 drives= 53.8% Cassell 17 Attempts, 82 Yards, 4.8 Yards Per Play, FG attempted or better on 2 of 4 drives= 50.0% I really hope Cassell is't in the mix. I understand he has taken a back seat so the coaches can see what they have in EJ and Taylor, but I just don't see him getting his Yards Per Play near 7.0, which Taylor and Manuel are both comfortably in. Taylor really seems to have a knack for sustaining drives. Leading 7 out of 9 drives into scoring range is pretty impressive and most those were TD's. EJ has also done well in this area including a game winning drive and by far the strongest job in the deep passing game. Points scored? I've seen a lot of people state pretty much the same thing around the many QB threads and I don't really understand the logic. By saying that one thinks QB A has looked a better QB than QB B...but they expect QB B will get the start, isn't that saying that one either does not have faith in the coaches to make the right decision, or that one(for some reason) thinks that their own analysis is wrong? Look at points scored and then it would become clear to you. Very clear. EJ is my guy. He is Mr. TD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorom Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think the fact that EJM was playing with 3rd stringers was holding him back in the early games. He would have had better stats. That should be factored in. Against the Browns it was a real struggle with some crap play from the backups (those bad snaps were ridiculous), but he managed to keep things together. we were down 5 RBs and our top 3 WR's + during that game which should also factor into Taylor's stats ass well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 EJ is the only one to have thrown a TD pass. I think he has thrown four. Cassell is the only QB that has yet to lead this team on a TD drive. I apologize if I am mistaken from the first game, but I thought he just lead them to a FG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted August 31, 2015 Author Share Posted August 31, 2015 I agree, FG attempts aren't a great thing. Most of Manuel and Taylor's drives ended in TD's, I wasn't going to penalize players for Kickers missing FG's. Which did happen, which is why it's a % stat. I can convert it into TD% if you wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Most of Manuel and Taylor's drives ended in TD's, I wasn't going to penalize players for Kickers missing FG's. Which did happen, which is why it's a % stat. I can convert it into TD% if you wish. Your stats are the best for preseason. Points scored doesn't matter when you're throwing to guys like Dez Lewis. Tyrod gave them more chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 only one of Tyrod's drives ended in a TD Most of Manuel and Taylor's drives ended in TD's, I wasn't going to penalize players for Kickers missing FG's. Which did happen, which is why it's a % stat. I can convert it into TD% if you wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 only one of Tyrod's drives ended in a TD You want to re-think that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 (edited) i guess my bad...did he hand off to brown for one and seale for one? no, cassell handed off to seale...i guess he handed off to brown in the carolina game? forgot about the karlos williams play in carolina You want to re-think that? Edited August 31, 2015 by The Poojer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I've seen a lot of people state pretty much the same thing around the many QB threads and I don't really understand the logic. By saying that one thinks QB A has looked a better QB than QB B...but they expect QB B will get the start, isn't that saying that one either does not have faith in the coaches to make the right decision, or that one(for some reason) thinks that their own analysis is wrong? I think it's saying that there are other factors than preseason games that go into the analysis of QB choice, for example performance during practice, especially the practices towards the end of training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 i guess my bad...did he hand off to brown for one and seale for one? no, cassell handed off to seale...i guess he handed off to brown in the carolina game? forgot about the karlos williams play in carolina Both of his drives against the Steelers ended in TDs. A run from Wood and a run from Tyrod. He handed off to Karlos for a TD in the 1st game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think it's saying that there are other factors than preseason games that go into the analysis of QB choice, for example performance during practice, especially the practices towards the end of training camp. I unerstand that, but several people stated that they thought QB A was the better QB but thought QB B would start. This makes very little sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I stand corrected... Both of his drives against the Steelers ended in TDs. A run from Wood and a run from Tyrod. He handed off to Karlos for a TD in the 1st game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I think it's saying that there are other factors than preseason games that go into the analysis of QB choice, for example performance during practice, especially the practices towards the end of training camp. I think it's saying that most fans have no idea how to analyze QB play. I unerstand that, but several people stated that they thought QB A was the better QB but thought QB B would start. This makes very little sense to me. Tyrod looked better and Tyrod should start. Did you see Manuel or Cassel fake the defense out on a Goodwin stop-and-go down the left side and then come clear across the field to Gray for the 1st down? No. No other QB executed a 3-step and 5-step drop combo in preseason (that I saw), which is a classic run-and-shoot concept. Here's an excerpt from a smartfootball.com article: Three-step and five-step, together. The idea for this solution came from two sources: the old run and shoot “Read” play and the book, Concept Passing,” where Dan Gonzalez describes something similar. The broad idea is to achieve multiple things in one play-call, but to sequence it so that it all can actually be done by a high school or college kid. The run and shoot “read route” put a “quick” or three-step-esque (remember that the run and shoot used half-rollouts) to one side, while putting the old favorite, the “switch” to the backside. See below: Against any kind of blitz or tight-man, the quarterback would deliver the ball to one of the outside receivers (typically the slot running to the flat) off his third-step. If the defense covered that, he would finish his drop, step up, and read the two backside receivers running the old switch, which was just a form of the “seam read” from four verticals but where the two receivers criss-crossed at the snap. - See more at: http://smartfootball.com/passing/packaging-three-step-and-five-step-concepts-into-the-same-play#sthash.sewHWGz9.dpuf Tyrod is doing everything that Roman wants and passing with flying colors. I'm not saying he's going to be an elite QB, but he's looked the best and he's earned the spot, for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted August 31, 2015 Author Share Posted August 31, 2015 only one of Tyrod's drives ended in a TD It's amazing how far off you're on this. His drives ended in a higher TD% than any QB. I'm eating lunch at work, if you really want the TD's I can do that for you. But it's a waste of time. His % of TD drives was the highest of any QB. His points per possession were the highest of any QB. These are stats remember, not open to opinion outside of debating the merits of the stats. Sorry if it doesn't fit your narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 please see my mea culpa that I posted It's amazing how far off you're on this. His drives ended in a higher TD% than any QB. I'm eating lunch at work, if you really want the TD's I can do that for you. But it's a waste of time. His % of TD drives was the highest of any QB. His points per possession were the highest of any QB. These are stats remember, not open to opinion outside of debating the merits of the stats. Sorry if it doesn't fit your narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Greg Roman is the QB whisperer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 ... Tyrod looked better and Tyrod should start. .... See, that sort of thinking makes perfect sense. (No sarcasm) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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