Doc Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Technically, players accrue seasons at the start of the league year. He is a 3rd year player. This type of babying is why people get frustrated with the bleeding heart EJ supporters. He has improved for sure but do we need to pretend that he is less experienced to justify his place in the QB battle? By pretending that he is in year "2 and a half" does that help his case? He is on his 3rd year and in a 3 way battle for the QB position which he is currently 3rd in. He was 3rd. And then he suddenly got time with the starters yesterday. I doubt that's coincidence and/or sympathy. But I still think that TT is the starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 He was 3rd. And then he suddenly got time with the starters yesterday. I doubt that's coincidence and/or sympathy. But I still think that TT is the starter. He has improved for sure. I have no issue with that topic. It is saying things like "he's not really a 3rd year player" that drive me nuts. Let's call it what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB3 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) @ChrisBrownBills Rex infers that all 3 QBs in competition will see time with the starters in next preseason game. #Bills This is getting interesting. Edited August 23, 2015 by LBSeeBallLBGetBall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 He has improved for sure. I have no issue with that topic. It is saying things like "he's not really a 3rd year player" that drive me nuts. Let's call it what it is. He is a 3rd year player and expectations should be of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSOL Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) Look, every beat reporter who has attended camp would tell you EJ is third. John Murphy would tell you EJ is third. Sal C currently has it at 45/45/10. That is being generous. I can tell you with the utmost certainty that EJ is not part of the equation to start opening day. This is not detracting. This is being a realist. You are doing whatever the opposite of detracting is.Opposite of detracting in my words is supporting. Besides, I'm just screwin around, its just a game and I can only take it so seriously. Like I said, I love the debate. I also fully accept your source saying Cassel is frontrunner in Romans eyes and I think it's best to leave the decision up to him. I will accept Cassel as starter if that's what happens, I'm OK with it. I'm also mostly OK with EJ being 3rd string. Technically, players accrue seasons at the start of the league year. He is a 3rd year player. This type of babying is why people get frustrated with the bleeding heart EJ supporters. He has improved for sure but do we need to pretend that he is less experienced to justify his place in the QB battle? By pretending that he is in year "2 and a half" does that help his case? He is on his 3rd year and in a 3 way battle for the QB position which he is currently 3rd in.You seem to be one of the most level headed posters on here, and I know you don't fact bend, but many on here do. If the detractors want to fact bend in their favor, I'll try to do it in my favor, that's all. He has two seasons under his belt, not three and that's all I want to point out. Edited August 23, 2015 by mastershake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB3 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 That's the point. People questioned whether EJ could even win the competition. It had nothing to do with Rex or Roman bringing in their guys. It all comes down to talent and people weren't confident EJ had enough of it to beat Cassel and Taylor out. The fact that he couldn't really separate himself from 2 backups in his 3rd year is what makes it hard for me to believe he will ever improve enough to be a decent starter in this league. I think Whaley and company took a chance on a guy they hoped could be coached up but ultimately he had too many critical flaws and it hasn't worked out the way we had all hoped. It happens every year. Could you elaborate on these sources? Obviously I don't expect names but could you say what makes them good sources? What do they do that would allow them to have this information? I don't agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Opposite of detracting in my words is supporting. Besides, I'm just screwin around, its just a game and I can only take it so seriously. Like I said, I love the debate. You seem to be one of the most level headed posters on here, and I know you don't fact bend, but many on here do. If the detractors want to fact bend in their favor, I'll try to do it in my favor, that's all. He has two seasons under his belt, not three and that's all I want to point out. I'm not directing that specifically at you either to clarify. It just happened to be a real time example of some of the things that have been said throughout. Whether it has been coaching, or experience or whatever people have made excuses for him. He played in like 40 games at FSU and 14 in the NFL. That is A LOT of games at a high level. He is improving for sure but it's not like he is new to the position either. We should just call it what it is. EJ is an improving player and way ahead of where he was last year. He still isn't the starter in all likelihood (Sal has him at a 10% chance). That is okay. The other guys have played well too. The QB situation is much better than we thought it would be. At least it looks like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) I've been listening. I've also been watching as well. Let's see where EJ's reps come in the 3rd preseason game. Yeah he's had solid showings in the pre-season so far. Point being that it's year 3 and the bar is still being set so incredibly low. It should have been expected that EJ win this competition. If he had as much talent and potential as people claim then he should have easily ran away with this thing and it wouldn't be a debate as to who the starter next week was going to be. The fact he wasn't even a favorite to win the job over a couple of backups speaks volumes. I expected much more. The training wheels are off now and it's time to produce and right now, it doesn't seem likely that he'll be starting this year. That's not me hating on him. That's just the reality of the situation. It's true, EJ isn't great. But the real question is "Is EJ better than Cassel and Tyrod?" I have noticed that most anti-EJ guys, just rant against EJ, but they don't seem to realize what the Bills are going to trot out there to replace him. Matt Cassel is Kelly Holcomb II.... he sucks. Tyrod is at least as risky a choice as Manuel. None of these guys are very good, it's about the lesser evil. Edited August 23, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 It's true, EJ isn't great. But the real question is "Is EJ better than Cassel and Tyrod?" I have noticed that most anti-EJ guys, just rant against EJ, but they don't seem to realize what the Bills are going to trot out there to replace him. Matt Cassel is Kelly Holcomb II.... he sucks. Tyrod is at least as risky a choice as Manuel. None of these guys are very good, it's about the lesser evil. This was my take most of the offseason but I think that all 3 are a little better than they get credit for. I can only speak for me personally but each guy has played above what I expected from them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB3 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) It's true, EJ isn't great. But the real question is "Is EJ better than Cassel and Tyrod?" I have noticed that most anti-EJ guys, just rant against EJ, but they don't seem to realize what the Bills are going to trot out there to replace him. Matt Cassel is Kelly Holcomb II.... he sucks. Tyrod is at least as risky a choice as Manuel. None of these guys are very good, it's about the lesser evil. We don't know that. TT could be. Hard to unseat a Super Bowl winning QB. I still hold out hope for EJ. He's improving. Cassel, I do not have hope for. Though if he's chosen, I'll support him. Edited August 23, 2015 by LBSeeBallLBGetBall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) This was my take most of the offseason but I think that all 3 are a little better than they get credit for. I can only speak for me personally but each guy has played above what I expected from them. Great. My point is, I think that people are so set on being "right" about EJM not being a "franchise QB", and pointing out his flaws, that they aren't grasping that Matt Cassel is likely going to be the QB. Cassel was HATED in Kansas City. Edited August 23, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 It's true, EJ isn't great. But the real question is "Is EJ better than Cassel and Tyrod?" I have noticed that most anti-EJ guys, just rant against EJ, but they don't seem to realize what the Bills are going to trot out there to replace him. Matt Cassel is Kelly Holcomb II.... he sucks. Tyrod is at least as risky a choice as Manuel. None of these guys are very good, it's about the lesser evil. And clearly, the lesser evil is not EJ at this point. Honestly, I thought everyone would suck and we'd repeat last preseason. And Cassel would win by default. I agree with Kirby that everyone has surprised, but I still think Cassel wins. Great. My point is, I think that people are so set on being "right" about EJM no being a "franchise QB", and pointing out his flaws, that they aren't grasping that Matt Cassel is likely going to be the QB. Cassel was HATED in Kansas City. Who cares? Just because Cassel may suck, doesn't mean EJ should start. Especially if he sucks more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Does the fact that all of these qbs are playing well in preseason just not sink in with some of you.......... There are qbs that are considered good that are not playing as well as our qbs are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 He has improved for sure. I have no issue with that topic. It is saying things like "he's not really a 3rd year player" that drive me nuts. Let's call it what it is. Fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YattaOkasan Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Does the fact that all of these qbs are playing well in preseason just not sink in with some of you.......... There are qbs that are considered good that are not playing as well as our qbs are I think a lot of us get it. We just can't stop talking about EJ. OMG did you see what he was wearing at the mall the other day!!!! On a serous note, because a lot of us are pleased by our QB situation we are happy with any of them starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Does the fact that all of these qbs are playing well in preseason just not sink in with some of you.......... There are qbs that are considered good that are not playing as well as our qbs are I don't think they have played that well. They have been alright. I don't give much weight to preseason...so I'm not gonna step back and say "wow, I'm just coming to grips with the talent we have at QB". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 I don't agree. Fair enough It's true, EJ isn't great. But the real question is "Is EJ better than Cassel and Tyrod?" I have noticed that most anti-EJ guys, just rant against EJ, but they don't seem to realize what the Bills are going to trot out there to replace him. Matt Cassel is Kelly Holcomb II.... he sucks. Tyrod is at least as risky a choice as Manuel. None of these guys are very good, it's about the lesser evil. My hope was that either Tyrod or EJ would win the competition. Obviously you hope that EJ would win it and be the guy for the next decade but ultimately I just want to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) It's true, EJ isn't great. But the real question is "Is EJ better than Cassel and Tyrod?" I have noticed that most anti-EJ guys, just rant against EJ, but they don't seem to realize what the Bills are going to trot out there to replace him. Matt Cassel is Kelly Holcomb II.... he sucks. Tyrod is at least as risky a choice as Manuel. None of these guys are very good, it's about the lesser evil. I don't think people who "rant against EJ" necessarily think that Cassel is great. Look, you mention Kelly Holcomb. I realize that's a name that is always sure to draw a lot of laughs on here but Kelly Holcomb was decent in 2005. If we can get Kelly Holcomb 2005 level of play, the Bills will make the playoffs. EJ Manuel has not achieved Kelly Holcomb 2005 or Matt Cassel 2008/2010 level of play at this stage in his career and there is no guarantee that he will. Again, this doesn't have to be that complicated: just go take the job from Matt Cassel/Tyrod Taylor. If Cassel sucks so bad and EJ has all this magic upside then it shouldn't be that hard. Edited August 23, 2015 by metzelaars_lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) Please stop with the "haters" accusations. Everyone is acknowledging that he is improved over last preseason. Can you acknowledge that he is still running third in this competition? I don't think anyone is hating. I pretty much laid out where he stands for you: better than last year, still not as good as Matt Cassel. just want to clear up a few things. YOU are not what people call "haters" as you give EJ some credit, so you should stop taking this personal. You are arguing with faceless people who just might be busting your balls to get a rise out of you. I am sure you are aware of that as you have done so. Funny I was criticized a number of times for using the term Meh, yet earlier you used it to describe Cassel. To the non EJ fanboys What people forget is that we are all entitled to our own opinion. Being ridiculed for supporting EJ is a bit irritating by the people convinced EJ is the worst of the group. So please stop with the accusations , the twisting of words and the antagonizing posts. Edited August 23, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YattaOkasan Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 I don't think people who "rant against EJ" necessarily think that Cassel is great. Look, you mention Kelly Holcomb. I realize that's a name that is always sure to draw a lot of laughs on here but Kelly Holcomb was decent in 2005. If we can get Kelly Holcomb 2005 level of play, the Bills will make the playoffs. EJ Manuel has not achieved Kelly Holcomb 2005 or Matt Cassel 2008/2010 level of play at this stage in his career and there is no guarantee that he will. Again, this doesn't have to be that complicated: just go take the job from Matt Cassel/Tyrod Taylor. If Cassel sucks so bad and EJ has all this magic upside then it shouldn't be that hard. Can you remind me your stance on what you would like the FO to do with EJ? I still have some logic issues with trying to determine if EJ will be "decent" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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