The Walking Dead Return

[4merper4mer]

 

Nicotero and whoever cut the series of shots went to great lengths to hide it. Really, there's no identifiable background that matches to anything earlier. The sound is the best clue...but even then, it's vague.

 

Chandler Riggs had an interesting tweet last night: six months after reading the script, and he still doesn't know who got killed. (Though I'd guess then that it wasn't Carl, since they probably would have told Riggs he wouldn't be back next season.) But if the actors who were in the scene don't even know...

 

But at least we're still one-up on Tara. She still doesn't know here girlfriend's dead.

 

 

Heath is a good looking dude who may have un-gayed Tara already. Tara was digging on Glenn at one point in the past if I recall. I think if Glenn met the bat that it would be in the best interest of the show for them to pair up Maggie and Heath so all of this un-gaying and un-straighting and re-gaying and re-straighting stuff can finally just be put to rest.

[John from Riverside]

 

That's just the people out there in the woods at that moment though. They have to have some back protecting their home too. Either way, they've got a major numbers advantage over Alexandria.

For Alexandria yes.....but they are already introducing other friendly groups into the mix.

 

A collaboration between different good guy factions would not be that hard to overcome Negan's group.....which I thought would be like a thousand

[Dorkington]

I have to admit, I'm getting tired of shows depending on cliffhangers so much. I think they're best used when they are relatively rare, instead we have so, so many in modern television. It makes things feel dull, and needlessly prolonged.

 

I might just go back to reading the comic instead.

[DC Tom]

 

 

Heath is a good looking dude who may have un-gayed Tara already. Tara was digging on Glenn at one point in the past if I recall. I think if Glenn met the bat that it would be in the best interest of the show for them to pair up Maggie and Heath so all of this un-gaying and un-straighting and re-gaying and re-straighting stuff can finally just be put to rest.

 

Or you can just stop posting about it. That'll put it to rest.

I have to admit, I'm getting tired of shows depending on cliffhangers so much. I think they're best used when they are relatively rare, instead we have so, so many in modern television. It makes things feel dull, and needlessly prolonged.

 

I might just go back to reading the comic instead.

 

Good point. It's not just a TWD thing...it's a television thing. There's no simple, self-contained stories any more. But there's some excellent reasons for this.

 

 

Which I'll discuss six months from now.

[4merper4mer]

 

Or you can just stop posting about it. That'll put it to rest.

 

 

 

I think sometimes the underlying sub plot stuff becomes important and can show where the show may lead. Not everyone picks up on every sub plot.

 

 

 

Good point. It's not just a TWD thing...it's a television thing. There's no simple, self-contained stories any more. But there's some excellent reasons for this.

 

 

Which I'll discuss six months from now.

 

 

 

I like that the streaming and binge watching and proliferation of many avenues for production/broadcast allow stories to not have to be self contained any more. They did do cliffhangers like this back in the day with shows like Dallas and others but I find today's shows are far better and need crap like this less. They can get deep into most characters and have multiple threads going at a time. The characters are no longer all one dimensional and are allowed to make "normal people" mistakes.

 

I think this cliffhanger, although I understand what they said on TTD, is very ill advised. Rumors of it leaked and everyone who talked about it on TTD seemed defensive to me. They had examples at the ready for other shows cliffhangers that they loved. It was rehearsed because they knew already that there was a backlash. My bet is if they had it to do over again, they would include the death. I think it was Gimple that said he owed the audience an episode showing the impact of the deceased character...blah blah blah sounded retroactive, like they already knew their plan had backfired. I thought it was an awesome episode and for the most part a great season....and the last 5 seconds took a lot away from it. If it was 1970 maybe they could get away with this but they can't any more. Everyone who wants to know will know and most of those who don't want to know are casual fans. It was a big mistake IMO. I don't know yet if it was a total jumping the shark moment but that is the worst case scenario.

[shrader]

Nicotero and whoever cut the series of shots went to great lengths to hide it. Really, there's no identifiable background that matches to anything earlier. The sound is the best clue...but even then, it's vague.

 

Chandler Riggs had an interesting tweet last night: six months after reading the script, and he still doesn't know who got killed. (Though I'd guess then that it wasn't Carl, since they probably would have told Riggs he wouldn't be back next season.) But if the actors who were in the scene don't even know...

 

But at least we're still one-up on Tara. She still doesn't know here girlfriend's dead.

And even saying that they were careful won't stop people from dissecting the whole scene. Even the audio doesn't mean much of anything. Since they distorted that, it's like any of that sound didn't really happen at all. They can change the group reaction at will when they do decide to film the actual scene since we heard absolutely nothing. Any of those slowed down clips could be nothing more than random noises they threw in to have some fun (well that and the human brain can make you think you heard whatever you want to hear).

 

I'd have to go back and watch it again, but I seem to remember them switching from person to person in their point of view of Negan standing in front of them, to really give a roulette feel to the whole thing. The only people you could even consider ruling out (other than worthless Aaron) would be whoever is on the left end if Negan walked from the person's left before introducing them to Lucille. I don't remember how he approached the final person.

 

 

And speaking of the Tara/Heath run, I really wish we could get a map of where all of this is happening. Which way did they head off so that they avoided Survivors (if they did)? Which direction is the Hilltop? Which direction are the Saviors? And that other group? Given what happened last night, I have a hard time seeing any of these groups moving around without Negan knowing it. I seem to remember Morgan saying that Carol went off in the opposite direction from the Saviors, but then again, she did run into one of their trucks on the road.

 

Just about the only direction where I assume none of these other groups come from is the South.

Edited April 4, 2016 by shrader

[dpberr]

I'm with many that didn't find the cliffhanger the best approach.

 

I like that the show is moving away from the walkers as a major threat and getting into the more sustainable storylines of civil war in the post-Apocalyptic United States.

 

Years after the outbreak, the majority of walkers aren't going to be around due to decomposition and survivors know how to kill any would-be walkers.

[FireChan]

Probably the best build-up and tension filled episode TWD has ever created. Then they ruined it. I will never understand the idea of having this awesome build-up and not having anything happen, besides a money grab. Artistically, it makes no sense. It's not even a mystery-type cliffhanger, with wild theories.

 

Now either the season 7 premiere will open cold with the victim, then be boring for 40 minutes comparatively, or they will do a flashback and wait 40 minutes for the reveal. Either way, all the tension they built up in the season finale will be forgotten. So much potential, wasted.

[ricojes]

Probably the best build-up and tension filled episode TWD has ever created. Then they ruined it. I will never understand the idea of having this awesome build-up and not having anything happen, besides a money grab. Artistically, it makes no sense. It's not even a mystery-type cliffhanger, with wild theories.

 

Now either the season 7 premiere will open cold with the victim, then be boring for 40 minutes comparatively, or they will do a flashback and wait 40 minutes for the reveal. Either way, all the tension they built up in the season finale will be forgotten. So much potential, wasted.

A great ending would have been the reaction of all of Rick's crew, and leaving out the carnage until October...Would have been an easy process of elimination and probably more effective than showing the actual person getting whacked...

 

good article, semi-spoiler form the comic with the characters Morgan and Carol meet, but nothing big:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2016/04/04/the-walking-dead-finale-ruined-negans-debut-with-its-worst-cliffhanger-to-date/#2f9273a63d6f

Edited April 4, 2016 by ricojes

[FireChan]

A great ending would have been the reaction of all of Rick's crew, leaving out the carnage until October...Would have been an easy process of elimination and probably more effective than showing the actual person getting whacked...

Anything but what they did, honestly. Especially after the Glenn hijinks earlier this season. Tricks like cliffhangers only work when the audience doesn't feel like they are being cheated and it actually sets something new up. Case in point, season 5 cliffhanger in the box car. That was done right. Good dialogue, new situation, new characters coming together and all getting captured. And all of their arcs in the season were resolved at the end, ready to start a new arc together. What arc has ended in Season 6? None, until the first 5 minutes of season 7. When someone binge watches the show in 2 years, it will seem fine. To anyone who watches it on TV regularly, it seems stupid.

[4merper4mer]

Probably the best build-up and tension filled episode TWD has ever created. Then they ruined it. I will never understand the idea of having this awesome build-up and not having anything happen, besides a money grab. Artistically, it makes no sense. It's not even a mystery-type cliffhanger, with wild theories.

 

Now either the season 7 premiere will open cold with the victim, then be boring for 40 minutes comparatively, or they will do a flashback and wait 40 minutes for the reveal. Either way, all the tension they built up in the season finale will be forgotten. So much potential, wasted.

 

 

I'm not even sure they'll do the reveal in episode 1. They could build in some sort of small time skip and have no conversation about the missing person or vague conversations. Maggie could be at the Hilltop, Glenn and/or Daryl could be on a run. Carl could simply be unmentioned for a while like has taken place in the past. They would have to show a few characters but could get by for a week with just Rick, Tara, Heath, Morgan, Carol, Enid, Spencer, Gabe etc. not to mention the possibility of doing some sort of Saviors back story. I don't think they set themselves up well at all. I get what they said about this being the end of the story and next season being the new story but if nobody knows what happened at the end of the story, is the story really over?

 

I'm convinced it is Glenn personally. The comment about the impact on "all the other characters" fits better with Glenn than anyone else. He had in depth interaction and story lines with more than anyone....even Rick. Off the top of my head i can think of: Rick, Maggie, Tara, Heath, Daryl, Rosita, Enid, Abraham, Eugene, Michonne, Carol. I don't remember anything too special with Carl or Morgan but that's about all. Even long dead characters like Dale, Andrea and to an extent Lori had major story lines threaded through Glenn. If you take Rick off of the table, nobody else has that kind of impact across that many other characters. And he was youthful and until very recently innocent. I just think it almost has to be him.

Edited April 4, 2016 by 4merper4mer

[FireChan]

 

 

I'm not even sure they'll do the reveal in episode 1. They could build in some sort of small time skip and have no conversation about the missing person or vague conversations. Maggie could be at the Hilltop, Glenn and/or Daryl could be on a run. Carl could simply be unmentioned for a while like has taken place in the past. They would have to show a few characters but could get by for a week with just Rick, Tara, Heath, Morgan, Carol, Enid, Spencer, Gabe etc. not to mention the possibility of doing some sort of Saviors back story. I don't think they set themselves up well at all. I get what they said about this being the end of the story and next season being the new story but if nobody knows what happened at the end of the story, is the story really over.

 

I'm convinced it is Glenn personally. The comment about the impact on "all the other characters" fits better with Glenn than anyone else. He had in depth interaction and story lines with more than anyone....even Rick. Off the top of my head i can think of: Rick, Maggie, Tara, Heath, Daryl, Rosita, Enid, Abraham, Eugene, Michonne, Carol. I don't remember anything too special with Carl or Morgan but that's about all. Even long dead characters like Dale, Andrea and to an extent Lori had major story lines threaded through Glenn. If you take Rick off of the table, nobody else has that kind of impact across that many other characters. And he was youthful and until very recently innocent. I just think it almost has to be him.

Exactly!

 

I think it's Glenn too. He's one of the few major characters with moral fiber, and he's not the only one in a relationship now. His death allows Maggie to grow past the character she's been for about 4 season straight. Which makes their BS dumpster nonsense from earlier even more egregious. You don't fake a character's death in the same season you kill that character.

 

I like TWD and it's a solid 7/10 or 8/10 show, but I can't help but think they shoot themselves in the foot so much. It's a show with too many good moments and not enough great ones, IMO and it could've been so much more.

 

Hats off to Andrew Lincoln's acting once again. He had a rocky start but now he's phenomenal.

Edited April 4, 2016 by FireChan

[Canadian Bills Fan]

Exactly!

 

I think it's Glenn too. He's one of the few major characters with moral fiber, and he's not the only one in a relationship now. His death allows Maggie to grow past the character she's been for about 4 season straight. Which makes their BS dumpster nonsense from earlier even more egregious. You don't fake a character's death in the same season you kill that character.

 

I like TWD and it's a solid 7/10 or 8/10 show, but I can't help but think they shoot themselves in the foot so much. It's a show with too many good moments and not enough great ones, IMO and it could've been so much more.

 

Hats off to Andrew Lincoln's acting once again. He had a rocky start but now he's phenomenal.

 

 

Agreed.

 

I dont think I have ever seen him look so terrified as he did in last nights finale.

 

 

Great acting

 

 

 

 

CBF

[ricojes]

 

 

Agreed.

 

I dont think I have ever seen him look so terrified as he did in last nights finale.

 

 

Great acting

 

 

 

 

CBF

He nailed the "holy st, I just got my whole crew, including the remaining at Alexandria, killed, which include my children" helpless look and feel, that's for sure.

Edited April 4, 2016 by ricojes

[QuoteTheRaven83]

It SAYS in my audio Glenn. Not much to think about. Dam people

[DC Tom]

Exactly!

 

I think it's Glenn too. He's one of the few major characters with moral fiber, and he's not the only one in a relationship now. His death allows Maggie to grow past the character she's been for about 4 season straight.

 

That's the primary reason I hope it's Glenn. It leaves a lot more room for character development (not just Maggie's...but everyone's. As 4mer pointed out, he had a lot of interaction with everyone.)

 

The episode was generally well-acted all around, but Lincoln's performance was awesome. Not just at the end...but you could see Rick coming to the gradual realization that he's not in control of the situation, and "he's screwing with the wrong people." Great directing by Nicotero, too. It'd be a great episode if not for the cliffhanger...but even then, I'm not sure Scott Gimple's rationale is entirely wrong. I don't agree with him, but there's certainly a case to be made that the story of Rick and the group being humbled ends with Negan swinging the bat, and who isn't important to that ending, but instead the who kicks off the beginning of the next story of the group having to come to terms and deal with Negan somehow. It's less a "mistake" to me than an interesting point of discussion on the nature of narrative.

It SAYS in my audio Glenn. Not much to think about. Dam people

 

You must have a different audio. I've been over it multiple times, and there's nothing unambiguous.

[FireChan]

 

That's the primary reason I hope it's Glenn. It leaves a lot more room for character development (not just Maggie's...but everyone's. As 4mer pointed out, he had a lot of interaction with everyone.)

 

The episode was generally well-acted all around, but Lincoln's performance was awesome. Not just at the end...but you could see Rick coming to the gradual realization that he's not in control of the situation, and "he's screwing with the wrong people." Great directing by Nicotero, too. It'd be a great episode if not for the cliffhanger...but even then, I'm not sure Scott Gimple's rationale is entirely wrong. I don't agree with him, but there's certainly a case to be made that the story of Rick and the group being humbled ends with Negan swinging the bat, and who isn't important to that ending, but instead the who kicks off the beginning of the next story of the group having to come to terms and deal with Negan somehow. It's less a "mistake" to me than an interesting point of discussion on the nature of narrative.

 

You must have a different audio. I've been over it multiple times, and there's nothing unambiguous.

But I think it is. Because if Aaron is the one beat to death in front of everyone (I highly doubt it, but it's absolutely possible) it's just another redshirt dying. Like the redshirt who got shot in the eye last week. It's not humbling.

 

If they had cut down the group to Rick, Carl, Michonne, Glenn and Daryl, I could see his point. Because then you know someone major died. Someone who mattered. Someone who we had watched for years evade death over and over. That would be humbling. By leaving the possibility of it being a secondary character, they cheapened it.

 

The more likely explanation IMO is that they thought the cliff-hanger would build a ton of buzz and concocted an explanation for it.

[QuoteTheRaven83]

 

That's the primary reason I hope it's Glenn. It leaves a lot more room for character development (not just Maggie's...but everyone's. As 4mer pointed out, he had a lot of interaction with everyone.)

 

The episode was generally well-acted all around, but Lincoln's performance was awesome. Not just at the end...but you could see Rick coming to the gradual realization that he's not in control of the situation, and "he's screwing with the wrong people." Great directing by Nicotero, too. It'd be a great episode if not for the cliffhanger...but even then, I'm not sure Scott Gimple's rationale is entirely wrong. I don't agree with him, but there's certainly a case to be made that the story of Rick and the group being humbled ends with Negan swinging the bat, and who isn't important to that ending, but instead the who kicks off the beginning of the next story of the group having to come to terms and deal with Negan somehow. It's less a "mistake" to me than an interesting point of discussion on the nature of narrative.

 

You must have a different audio. I've been over it multiple times, and there's nothing unambiguous.

 

 

I'd get a hearing aid if I were you.

 

1. If you read the graphic novel, you'd notice that Neagan's dialogue within the last 10 minutes of the episode is EXACTLY like the book with the exception of a word or 2. Almost word for word. This was done on purpose to show that they probably won't change this part of the comic.

 

2. Glenn holding the baseball bat in season 5 before they hose down the walkers on the firetruck.

http://www.wetpaint.com/steven-yeun-glenn-bat-foreshadowing-1397876/

 

 

3. Glenn was the one that was supposed to be hit with the baseball bat before Carol came to the rescue at Terminus.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/walking-dead-season-five-negan-722002

 

4. Audio in soundcloud clearly shows Maggie's scream as being the loudest and yelling GLENN.

 

5. Book, Maggie cuts her hair to show sorrow after Glenn's death. She doesn't do this without a reason.

 

How many more signs do you need?

Edited April 4, 2016 by QuoteTheRaven83

[DC Tom]

 

 

I'd get a hearing aid if I were you.

 

1. If you read the graphic novel, you'd notice that Neagan's dialogue is EXACTLY like the book with the exception of a word or 2. This was done on purpose to show that they probably won't change this part of the comic.

 

2. Glenn holding the baseball bat in season 5 before they hose down the walkers on the firetruck.

http://www.wetpaint.com/steven-yeun-glenn-bat-foreshadowing-1397876/

 

 

3. Glenn was the one that was supposed to be hit with the baseball bat before Carol came to the rescue at Terminus.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/walking-dead-season-five-negan-722002

 

4. Audio in soundcloud clearly shows Maggie's scream as being the loudest and yelling GLENN.

 

5. Book, Maggie cuts her hair to show sorry after Glenn's death. She doesn't do this without a reason.

 

How many more signs do you need?

 

I'd settle for A sign, instead of your rambling musings based on unsupported assumptions of what the producers and writers will and will not do.

[QuoteTheRaven83]

 

I'd settle for A sign, instead of your rambling musings based on unsupported assumptions of what the producers and writers will and will not do.

 

Unsupported assumptions? Read the book and then come back to me. LOL.

 

Listen to the audio and tell me people aren't screaming Glenn.