metzelaars_lives Posted September 25, 2014 Author Share Posted September 25, 2014 he was 20-28. The whole team took turns throwing the ball? That is one biased post right there, IMO. Wow. He was missing his top 2 WRs in that game. I'm surprised it's gone this far but maybe I shouldn't be. Did you watch the Broncos-Seahawks game on Sunday? You could safely say, "wow Peyton Manning brought them back." He was the reason that game went into OT. As nice and neat a game EJ had against the Jets at home last year, they win that game with Travis Brown, Alex Van Pelt, et al at QB. I want to see the Bills win a game or even stay in a game (see Fitz at New England 2012) BECAUSE of EJ Manuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Did you watch the Broncos-Seahawks game on Sunday? You could safely say, "wow Peyton Manning brought them back." He was the reason that game went into OT. As nice and neat a game EJ had against the Jets at home last year, they win that game with Travis Brown, Alex Van Pelt, et al at QB. I want to see the Bills win a game or even stay in a game (see Fitz at New England 2012) BECAUSE of EJ Manuel. That's fair but that's not his role right now. Seattle and SF are similar with their QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 It's a sad statement when Fitzpatrick is a better option than EJ Manuel. Ouch! Only in the OP's mad mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 (edited) Did you watch the Broncos-Seahawks game on Sunday? You could safely say, "wow Peyton Manning brought them back." He was the reason that game went into OT. As nice and neat a game EJ had against the Jets at home last year, they win that game with Travis Brown, Alex Van Pelt, et al at QB. I want to see the Bills win a game or even stay in a game (see Fitz at New England 2012) BECAUSE of EJ Manuel. im not sure why you think Travis brown would have had the same performance. Honestly, this is funny. First you said "With possible exception of the Carolina game last year, give me one game where you said, "damn EJ looked good today." When provided with the example of a game like that, you refused to acknowledge it saying that it was a "team win." Sure, it was a team win. Does that mean he didn't look good that day? Why is it so hard to admit? Unless the whole team was taking the QB snaps that led to his 20-28, 245 yd, 2 TD, 0 INT 121.9 passer rating performance, I think you need to admit he looked good. But you won't. Funny. Edited September 25, 2014 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 He's not. He is right now, in my opinion. Smarter and tougher. Manuel has the stronger arm but isn't any more accurate. The plus for Manuel at the moment is that Fitz is what he is, with Manuel at least there is still the possibility that he will improve. Perhaps even greatly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 (edited) Did you watch the Broncos-Seahawks game on Sunday? You could safely say, "wow Peyton Manning brought them back." He was the reason that game went into OT. As nice and neat a game EJ had against the Jets at home last year, they win that game with Travis Brown, Alex Van Pelt, et al at QB. I want to see the Bills win a game or even stay in a game (see Fitz at New England 2012) BECAUSE of EJ Manuel. The bottom line is, there are about 4, arguably 5, QB in the league who can do what you say - carry a team on their shoulders and single-handedly bring them back. The most inarguable example of such a guy is Peyton Manning. Brees and Rodgers are arguably "that guy". Brady has been "that guy", but a list that is allegedly "this year, not lifetime" that has him as #2 is so biased it's silly - he has not played to that level yet this year so far or much last year, raising the question of how much was him, and how much was system, Welker, Hernandez and Gronk. So far this year, Rivers has raised his game to that level and Luck is arguably there. P Manning, Brees, Rodgers, Rivers, Luck, once-and-whoknows-maybe-future Brady. One can create an argument, quite a supported argument, that most of the other QB in the league have fatal gaps or are in "that place" where they can carry a team, keep the team in a game or bring the team back, only occasionally - maybe once or twice every 12-15 games or so. In which case if we don't see it out of EJ in 2-3 seasons you can argue it isn't there. Essentially, what a lot of the "EJ sucks" "not good enough" and so forth amount to, is saying EJ is not one of the 6 elite QB in the league. We note that the teams that have been playing in the Superbowl recently, are not necessarily those who have those super-elite QB, but those who have a multidimensional game - stout D, solid running game, and a QB who got hot when it counted with help from the right system. We also note that of those 5 super-elite QB, most of them didn't become elite immediately. They sat on the bench for a while and learned (Brady, Rodgers), or there was general disappointment "not quite quite" and then they developed (Brees, Rivers). Peyton Manning and Luck are two I can think of who looked hot right out of the box. There are also quite a number of QB who looked hotter right out of the box - Freeman, Newton, RGIII, Bradford, Stafford - and who are now either through, or languishing in "maybe kinda sorta possibly never" land. For whatever reason, they haven't fulfilled their initial promise. So where does that leave EJ? He's not Peyton Manning. He's not Andrew Luck. Could he become an Eli Manning or a Joe Flacco or a Kaepernick or a Wilson? I think the jury is out. Would that be good enough for some people here? I think not - they want an elite guy, a guy who can stand next to Kelly in fan memory, and the fact that 5/6 of the NFL teams don't have "that guy" and somehow manage to go to the playoffs and even win a superbowl without, well, don't hassle them with the facts. Edited September 25, 2014 by Hopeful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proteus Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 How many games before we can stop pretending EJ doesn't suck? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 (edited) Did you watch the Broncos-Seahawks game on Sunday? You could safely say, "wow Peyton Manning brought them back." He was the reason that game went into OT. As nice and neat a game EJ had against the Jets at home last year, they win that game with Travis Brown, Alex Van Pelt, et al at QB. I want to see the Bills win a game or even stay in a game (see Fitz at New England 2012) BECAUSE of EJ Manuel. One of the primary reasons the Broncos needed a comeback was Manning's poor play throughout the game. He needed to redeem himself for several uncharacteristically inaccurate throws earlier in the contest. It was not a good day for 18. Edited September 25, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 How many games before we can stop pretending EJ doesn't suck? This deserves a thread, man. Go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 He is right now, in my opinion. Smarter and tougher. Manuel has the stronger arm but isn't any more accurate. The plus for Manuel at the moment is that Fitz is what he is, with Manuel at least there is still the possibility that he will improve. Perhaps even greatly. Not in mine. Fitzpatrick's brain writes checks that his inadequate arm cannot cash. He's too mistake prone for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BfloBillsFan Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 What's the background on this "Whales Vagina" thing? From Anchorman Man Movie. Will Ferrell says something along the lines that San Diego, in German means "whale's vagina" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 You're probably a good guy and we appear to be two grammar snobs but you are clearly incapable of carrying on an objective dialogue regarding who is clearly your favorite player. The wounded duck to TJ Graham that he underthrew by 20 yards against the Jets? Give me a break. That was a team victory. Please let me know when he has a game where he gets the WR's involved, throws for 300, 3 TD's and carries his team to a victory. Please. Believe me, I want it to happen as much as you do. Dude, and I mean this in the nicest possible way, I don't think you should be trying to judge "objective dialogue" here. Your "list of who you'd want as your QB next Sunday" that has Brady as #2 speaks for itself, and not well of your objectivity. Brady? This year? Even most of last? C'mon man. So "objective dialogue", I'm not sure it means what you think it means. Most of the 24 QB you have on your list, have games where they throw for 300 yds 3 TDs and carry their teams to victory only occasionally. Every third season. One or two games a season. Think differently? Back it up with some stats. The historical exceptions P Manning, Brees, Rodgers, Brady now possibly subtract Brady and add Rivers and perhaps Luck (though as someone else noted, he throws a lot of INTs still). And yeah, we haven't seen a 300 yd 3 TD game out of EJ Manuel yet, last year's Carolina game with 39 pass attempts, 296 yds, 69 % completions, 7.6 YPA, a TD and and INT, was a pretty good game. The 2nd Jets game with 245 yds, 71% completions, 8.8 YPA, 2 TD and 0 INTs, was another very good game. The fact that you can't seem to acknowledge that, or that you have to diss those games off as "team wins" without acknowledging that perhaps you haven't looked under the hood and seen how much "team" was involved in similar games by most other QB, does not speak well, frankly, of your ability to dialogue objectively. In the end, all victories are team victories, even those QB'd by Peyton Manning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Decided to power rank the starting qb's in the NFL. Well I should clarify- the 23 guys I deemed legitimate NFL starters. And understand this is not where I am ranking these guys as all-time qb's but rather who I would want as my qb this weekend. Have at it: 1. Manning 2. Brady 3. Rodgers 4. Brees 5. Wilson 6. Rivers 7. Ryan 8. Luck 9. Foles 10. Newton 11. Stafford 12. Roethlisberger 13. Romo 14. Cutler 15. Flacco 16. Dalton 17. A. Smith 18. Kaepernick 19. Cousins 20. Palmer 21. Eli 22. Hoyer 23. Fitzpatrick Any list that has Hoyer and Fitzpatrick over EJ Manuel isnt even worth talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Did you watch the Broncos-Seahawks game on Sunday? You could safely say, "wow Peyton Manning brought them back." He was the reason that game went into OT. As nice and neat a game EJ had against the Jets at home last year, they win that game with Travis Brown, Alex Van Pelt, et al at QB. I want to see the Bills win a game or even stay in a game (see Fitz at New England 2012) BECAUSE of EJ Manuel. How about the Carolina game last year? Great drive by EJ to win the game.How about two game winning drives in the Atlanta game last year that were fumbled away by Stevie and Chandler. People seem to want to ignore or diminish any success EJ has had and exaggerate any perceived flaws or failures (for example the guys who say any completion he makes is because the receiver/RB made a miraculous stretch for a horribly thrown ball). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 You actually having the unmitigated gumption to call someone ignorant is the height of hilarity. Since you have alleged so many negative traits to EJ's game, you obviously have broken him down via the Game Rewind All-22 Coaches Film you obviously have access to. I defy you to show concrete examples of EJ's flaws that he demonstrates on a regular basis other than his erratic accuracy/ball location issue that I will stipulate to. WRT the former Bills QB who we'll see this Sunday, there's a reason why FitzPickSix is now on his fifth NFL team. Despite him being a great guy, he's extremely limited physically and all too often makes poor decisions that lead to soul crushing interceptions at the worst possible times. He's strictly a journeyman. You really should change your TSW name to old fool because you're talking out of your with no clue of what objective truth is. thanks for proving my point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 (edited) thanks for proving my point You are pointless. I'll be waiting for your all-22 film analysis of EJ, but I know better to not expect it because it's apparent you have no real analysis. Just simple minded, uninformed, parroted banter. Bye now! Edited September 25, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Thank you for the first type of response that I was intending to elicit. You know metz....my first response was a tad harsh and I do try to clarify when I think I might have responded inappropriately. To clarify....I think that with this list you are a. Inviting EJ debate because our starting QB is not on the list b. Maybe clarify that you are not looking at certain year players with the exception of guys like RGIII and luck (now...keep in mind RGIII for reasons that are not his fault will probably be on a different team soon. I would like to point out that there are outside influences that affect just how good the stats are of individual qbs....for instance. The bills employ a offensive gameplan that is HEAVY run game.....and have a overabundant supply of rb's to run it (we used a 4th round pick for a RB that isnt even dressing on Sundays in Bryce Brown....who I feel would be even BETTER in this scheme then Spiller but I digress) So when I saw QBs like Hoyer and Fitz on that list.......I immediately responded because I do NOT feel that those QBs are better then EJ Manuel.......they have had their share of stinkers.....they just have been in the league a lot longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 I don't get the Luck disrespect. He's a young QB, and is the only thing keeping Indy in the conversation for anything. On any given day Luck can beat you. Plain and simple. Sure he makes some mistakes, but the dude is a gamer. I'd but Luck probably just outside of the top 5. We will be losing some of the best QBs of all time in the next few years. There are at least 4 first ballot HoF'rs playing to date. Luck is the heir apparent to those roles. He may not turn into a forst ballot guy, but he is the only one with the moxy and actual QB skills to carry teams. It won't be Newton, Foles, Ryan, or Stafford by a long shot. Kaep is way over rated and over paid. Not even in the conversation. He will be good, never great. I'm also high on Rivers, and have been for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 People should give it a break. They've got too much time on their hands between the end of the fourth quarter and the next tailgate. My hope is the EJ bashers work themselves up into a foaming-at-the-mouth, wild-eyed hysteria that leaves them drooling and only able to utter incoherent babblings instead of complete sentences which leads to entering the same post multiple times within the same thread. That way we can easily identify them and avoid them. Oh wait. It seems we've already reached that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnwalter Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Based on their play so far this season... 1. Rivers 2. Ryan 3. Luck 4. Wilson 5. Roethlisberger 6. Manning 7. Rodgers 8. Brees 9. Brady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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