Ken Whisenhunt for HC?

[stinky finger]

I think Whizzy should be at the top of the Bills list along with Smith. There are, oh, a bagillion examples coaches having success in the NFL once they get a good QB, and not that many examples of coaches doing well w/o one. With Chan you had someone who coached scared and made mind-numbing in-game decisions. KW appears to be a good football mind and game manager, and someone who actually succeeded when he had a good QB, so we know he can do it if he has the tools. Hire him, get him a QB and we'll be good to go.

 

This pretty much sums it up for me.

 

Good post!

[QCity]

Because this is not good enough:

Ken Whisenhunt

Season Team Record

2012 Arizona Cardinals 5-11

2011 Arizona Cardinals 8-8

2010 Arizona Cardinals 5-11

2009 Arizona Cardinals 10-6

2008 Arizona Cardinals 9-7

2007 Arizona Cardinals 8-8

 

Are there people out there that actually believe there are coaches with 14-2, 13-3, 15-1 records just waiting to come here? Seriously, are you waiting for a coach who went 14-2 last year to come to Buffalo? I got bad news for you.

 

You can't just look at a record, you have to look at what that coach had to work with. As I said earlier, you could make the argument that there isn't a team in the NFL right now with less talent than AZ. I been watching football since they were the St Louis Cardinals, and let me tell you they have been one of the worst run organizations in the history of the NFL. You think our 13 year playoff drought is bad? This is a organization that went 30 years without a double-digit win season. They were that insignificant. I never thought I would see a Cardinal team anywhere near the Superbowl, but there they were. You can sit here and discount it all you want - they played in a weak division, they had a HOF QB, etc, etc, but the fact is they were one play away from winning The Big One, and Whis was the guy on the sidelines.

 

I don't personally think he is the best choice for us, but he's hardly as bad as some people are making him out to be.

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

Are there people out there that actually believe there are coaches with 14-2, 13-3, 15-1 records just waiting to come here? Seriously, are you waiting for a coach who went 14-2 last year to come to Buffalo? I got bad news for you.

 

You can't just look at a record, you have to look at what that coach had to work with. As I said earlier, you could make the argument that there isn't a team in the NFL right now with less talent than AZ. I been watching football since they were the St Louis Cardinals, and let me tell you they have been one of the worst run organizations in the history of the NFL. You think our 13 year playoff drought is bad? This is a organization that went 30 years without a double-digit win season. They were that insignificant. I never thought I would see a Cardinal team anywhere near the Superbowl, but there they were. You can sit here and discount it all you want - they played in a weak division, they had a HOF QB, etc, etc, but the fact is they were one play away from winning The Big One, and Whis was the guy on the sidelines.

 

I don't personally think he is the best choice for us, but he's hardly as bad as some people are making him out to be.

Bills are a thoroughly dysfunctional organization as well. KW may be a better coach than his record indicates, but if he couldn't help the Cards more than a season or two, he can't help the Bills become a perrenial playoff contender.

I would go with Lovie.

[voodoo poonani]

Are there people out there that actually believe there are coaches with 14-2, 13-3, 15-1 records just waiting to come here? Seriously, are you waiting for a coach who went 14-2 last year to come to Buffalo? I got bad news for you.

 

You can't just look at a record, you have to look at what that coach had to work with. As I said earlier, you could make the argument that there isn't a team in the NFL right now with less talent than AZ. I been watching football since they were the St Louis Cardinals, and let me tell you they have been one of the worst run organizations in the history of the NFL. You think our 13 year playoff drought is bad? This is a organization that went 30 years without a double-digit win season. They were that insignificant. I never thought I would see a Cardinal team anywhere near the Superbowl, but there they were. You can sit here and discount it all you want - they played in a weak division, they had a HOF QB, etc, etc, but the fact is they were one play away from winning The Big One, and Whis was the guy on the sidelines.

 

I don't personally think he is the best choice for us, but he's hardly as bad as some people are making him out to be.

 

Well looking at their records, Chip Kelly, Andy Reid, and Lovie Look pretty good. Gruden ended just above .500, but has an SB to his name.

 

I like Lovie Smith, he's had 5 winning seasons out of 9 (one even, three losing). He's won 3 NFC North titles. He's had a SB appearance. He's done all this with 11 QBs who's stats don't even come near Fitzpatricks (although I didn't look at Cutler's latest season). [disclaimer: I am NOT advocating for Fitz, I want him replaced with a draft prospect].

 

Lovie Smith

Season Team Record

2012 Chicago Bears 10-6

2011 Chicago Bears 8-8

2010 Chicago Bears 11-5

2009 Chicago Bears 7-9

2008 Chicago Bears 9-7

2007 Chicago Bears 7-9

2006 Chicago Bears 13-3

2005 Chicago Bears 11-5

2004 Chicago Bears 5-11

 

Chip Kelly

Season Team Record

2012 Oregon Ducks 11-1

2011 Oregon Ducks 12-2

2010 Oregon Ducks 12-1

2009 Oregon Ducks 10-3

 

Doug Marrone

Season Team Record

2012 Syracuse Orange 8-5

2011 Syracuse Orange 5-7

2010 Syracuse Orange 8-5

2009 Syracuse Orange 4-8

 

Ken Whisenhunt

Season Team Record

2012 Arizona Cardinals 5-11

2011 Arizona Cardinals 8-8

2010 Arizona Cardinals 5-11

2009 Arizona Cardinals 10-6

2008 Arizona Cardinals 9-7

2007 Arizona Cardinals 8-8

 

Andy Reid

Season Team Record

2012 Philadelphia Eagles 4-12

2011 Philadelphia Eagles 8-8

2010 Philadelphia Eagles 10-6

2009 Philadelphia Eagles 11-5

2008 Philadelphia Eagles 9-6-1

2007 Philadelphia Eagles 8-8

2006 Philadelphia Eagles 10-6

2005 Philadelphia Eagles 6-10

2004 Philadelphia Eagles 13-3

2003 Philadelphia Eagles 12-4

2002 Philadelphia Eagles 12-4

2001 Philadelphia Eagles 11-5

2000 Philadelphia Eagles 11-5

1999 Philadelphia Eagles 5-11

 

Jon Gruden

Season Team Record

2008 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 9-7

2007 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 9-7

2006 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 4-12

2005 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 11-5

2004 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 5-11

2003 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 7-9

2002 Tampa Bay Buccaneers 12-4

2001 Oakland Raiders 10-6

2000 Oakland Raiders 12-4

1999 Oakland Raiders 8-8

1998 Oakland Raiders 8-8

 

Hue Jackson

Season Team Record

2011 Oakland Raiders 8-8

[QCity]

Just for the heck of it, here's one more:

 

Bill Belichick

Season Team Record

1991 Cleveland Browns 6-10

1992 Cleveland Browns 7-9

1993 Cleveland Browns 7-9

1994 Cleveland Browns 11-5

1995 Cleveland Browns 5-11

 

That looks like a head coaching career that's DOOMED to a bunch of 6-10 seasons...

[symbiant]

Whisenhunt is the perfect example of why coaching in the NFL is overrated.

 

The guy nearly wins the Super Bowl when he has HOF QB Kurt Warner playing, and then can't put together a decent season without him.

 

Any semi-competent coach can win in the NFL with a great QB.

 

But everyone in the league thought Warner was done after his season with the Giants... and he was the backup initially.

[Nuncha]

We need to be whise n our hunt for a new coach..............

[RealityCheck]

Just for the heck of it, here's one more:

 

Bill Belichick

Season Team Record

1991 Cleveland Browns 6-10

1992 Cleveland Browns 7-9

1993 Cleveland Browns 7-9

1994 Cleveland Browns 11-5

1995 Cleveland Browns 5-11

 

That looks like a head coaching career that's DOOMED to a bunch of 6-10 seasons...

On that note...

[7boogiewoogie]

I think what people are failing to mention is that Whisenhunt was playing the hand he was dealt. His GM could not keep his quality talent (nucleus) in place and Ken did the best with what he was dealt. When he had talent he took them as far as he could go, and his quarterback in Kurt Warner is a prime example of how far you can go in this league when you have a franchise quarterback. Bottom line is when you have talent you will advance. Players performance will always out way coaching, unless the play calling is so far outside the players talent box that the coach completely ignores his players strengths. In other words if we do not draft/acquire a franchise quarterback then we will not succeed no matter who our coach is. All you need to do is look at Jimmy Johnson's tenure in Miami, he took Dallas to the Super Bowl twice with TALENT and won, when he went to Miami he did not have the same talent and he did not get to the same level with that squad. Players will always win championships, period.

[PastaJoe]

It's really sad how some fans are so desperate for good news that they try to justify the mediocre hirings the Bills make. It's like battered wife syndrome. Hiring another losing team's castoff is pathetic. We deserve better after putting up with the past 13 years. Unless they hire a proven winner with a solid track record, it will be another 3-5 years of rinse and repeat.

[gumby]

Just for the heck of it, here's one more:

 

Bill Belichick

Season Team Record

1991 Cleveland Browns 6-10

1992 Cleveland Browns 7-9

1993 Cleveland Browns 7-9

1994 Cleveland Browns 11-5

1995 Cleveland Browns 5-11

 

That looks like a head coaching career that's DOOMED to a bunch of 6-10 seasons...

 

Thanks for the info. Also it can be noted that Marv Levy had a .425 winning % in KC before the Bills hired that retread.

[7boogiewoogie]

Exactly my point Marv had talent with the Bills and not so much with the Cheifs

[Buftex]

 

Jason La Canfora ‏@JasonLaCanfora

I'd be surprised if the Bills don't take a run at Ken Whisenhunt among their head coaching options. He has some ties there.

 

PTR

 

Funny...but a few weeks before the season ended, I had a subconscious feeling that Ken Whisenthunt would end up being the Bills head coach....

 

Forgive me if this was posted elsewhere in this monster thread..but here are some opinions from Cardinal fans...while I don't think many are sad to see him go, there seems to be some respect for him:

 

http://www.revengeofthebirds.com/2013/1/2/3827220/bills-fan-looking-for-info-on-whisenhunt#comments

 

I think what people are failing to mention is that Whisenhunt was playing the hand he was dealt. His GM could not keep his quality talent (nucleus) in place and Ken did the best with what he was dealt. When he had talent he took them as far as he could go, and his quarterback in Kurt Warner is a prime example of how far you can go in this league when you have a franchise quarterback. Bottom line is when you have talent you will advance. Players performance will always out way coaching, unless the play calling is so far outside the players talent box that the coach completely ignores his players strengths. In other words if we do not draft/acquire a franchise quarterback then we will not succeed no matter who our coach is. All you need to do is look at Jimmy Johnson's tenure in Miami, he took Dallas to the Super Bowl twice with TALENT and won, when he went to Miami he did not have the same talent and he did not get to the same level with that squad. Players will always win championships, period.

 

While I am not super familiar with the day to days of Whisenhunts' tenure in Arizona, one of the biggest critiques amongst Card fans seems to be that he got "too involved" in personnel decisions...he was very much behind the move to trade for Kolb.

[NoSaint]

I want Lovie, but I think we're gonna get Whisenhunt. Because Whaley knows him (and that's so important, you know, like Levy knew Jauron).

This from Whaley:

"We go way back. We won some Super Bowls together so I have high regard for his coaching acumen" said Whaley. "Personally I know him and we'll see what happens. I know he's got a lot of opportunities. We haven't decided. We still have to figure out what we're going to do, but I can provide some insight on how he performed when I was with him."

 

His record does not impress me. Had two good (improving) years w the Cards, other than that, it's a lot like the Bills (sad and uninspiring).

2007 8-8

2008 9-7

2009 10-6

2010 5-11

2011 8-8

2012 5-11

 

If we end up w Whisenhunt, I'll be sick - would rather have stayed w Gailey and that ain't saying much.

 

Playoffs 4-2?

[San Jose Bills Fan]

While I am not super familiar with the day to days of Whisenhunts' tenure in Arizona, one of the biggest critiques amongst Card fans seems to be that he got "too involved" in personnel decisions...he was very much behind the move to trade for Kolb.

 

Similar criticism of a lot of coaches who have success early in their tenures: they gain more control and then don't put that control to good use. Sacto just offered a similar criticism of Lovie Smith.

 

One of the issues that's not being talked about a lot is what kind of Coach-GM dynamic will exist, ie- how much say will the new HC have in personnel decisions and how much should he have.

[QCity]

It's really sad how some fans are so desperate for good news that they try to justify the mediocre hirings the Bills make. It's like battered wife syndrome. Hiring another losing team's castoff is pathetic. We deserve better after putting up with the past 13 years. Unless they hire a proven winner with a solid track record, it will be another 3-5 years of rinse and repeat.

 

Well tell us PastaJoe, who is this proven winner with a solid track record that isn't another losing team's castoff? We're all ears. And if you are delusional enough to dare say Cowher, you may as well just go post in the "Jim Kelly/Thurman Thomas are buying the team" thread.

[Buftex]

It's really sad how some fans are so desperate for good news that they try to justify the mediocre hirings the Bills make. It's like battered wife syndrome. Hiring another losing team's castoff is pathetic. We deserve better after putting up with the past 13 years. Unless they hire a proven winner with a solid track record, it will be another 3-5 years of rinse and repeat.

 

While there may be some truth to what you are saying, what are your alternatives? There are only so many "proven winners" available...and lets face it, most of them aren't dying to come to Buffalo right now. Hiring Whisenhunt, IMO, isn't as puzzling or controversial as hiring Chan Gailey was. I am not saying I am all in for Whisenhunt, but I don't think he is the worst candidate name being mentioned right now. A lot will come down to what sort of staff he can put together...not everything will be exactly the same for him in Buffalo, as it was in Arizona (assuming he is hired)...it is a game of variables...he wasn't a complete disaster in Arizona, and is credited by many there with "changing the losing culture" in Arizona... sure a great amount of that success came with Kurt Warner, but you have to start somewhere...hopefully he learns from mistakes. He has never had the running back tandem that the Bills would have, at his disposal, and Larry Fitzgerald might not look too bad, winding down his career in the red, white, and blue!

[reddogblitz]

For all the talk of no retreads, has anyone noticed that the top 2 seeds in the AFC are coached by retreads as well as Seattle and Washington in the NFC?

[ganesh]

I would like the Whisenhunt hire.

First of all if he is hired you have to think it is because Whaley wants to work with him.

I like the fact that he has been to the Super Bowl. Whisenhunt saw first hand you need a qb. He also learned this leason over the past couple of seasons with the situation he had in Arizona. I am sure if he was hired he would be on board with making QB a priority from the start.

To me Whisenhunt is exactly the type of guy who would get the respect from the players Chan could not get. Other then Whisenhunt i would like to see Lovie brought in for the same reasons as above.

 

There is no published information anywhere to indicate that Chan did not have his players respect. The only time I saw any discontent was SJ mouthing off after the play call to throw to TJ Graham against the Patriots and he apologized later.

[26CornerBlitz]

@billsdaily

The Bills aren't the only ones interested in Whisenhunt. The Browns have interviewed him as well.

 

There's the man for the Browns!!!