Is fitz an "elite" QB?

[Billsguy]

No, not by any stretch of the imagination.

 

Agreed 100%.

 

The bigger question is: "What is the point of the question anyway?"

 

Here is my finger pointing priority:

 

1. Ralph Wilson

2. Ralph Wilson

3. Ralph Wilson

4. Bills management hired by Ralph Wilson including general manager

5. Bills head coach

6. Bills coaching staff

7. Bills scouting and player evaluation dept.

8. Bills players including Fitzpatrick

 

Let's focus on the important issues first. Once the first seven priorities are addressed successfully, the 8th priority will be moot.

[1billsfan]

Yes he's having a horrible YEAR. He's referring to past years. I thought that was obvious. As far as the texans...you think they're scoring because of Arian foster? Sure, he's a great back, but Ben Tate was putting up similar numbers. They have a great Oline and run scheme. Having Arian helps, but he isn't the reason.

 

 

 

It's a poll on a message board. How can it be "unfair"? It's a simple question. Easy answer. I wanted to see how many clueless people we had on this board. Read the entire thread. Not just the op. sure, fitz is good enough to win the SB with the dilfers ravens defense, Johnson's buccs defense, McMahon bears defense or bradshaws steelers defense. That's about it in my book. Good luck building that defense

 

You don't have to go that far back. Ben Rothlesburger and Eli Manning had very good defenses and neither are on the Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Aaron Rogers level. They're the in between of the silly extremes you've outlined over and over and over again in this thread.

 

Of course Ryan Fitzpatrick still has more to go to prove that he's as good as Ben or Eli, but the Raider and Patriot games this year were proof that he does have that potential.

 

It's funny how good Fitzpatrick looked when he was given a healthy dose of short fields off of turnovers. Same thing with Ben and Eli, their teams were not asking them to start every drive at the 20 yard line.

 

This team needs to build a good defense, plain and simple.

Edited December 8, 2011 by 1billsfan

[T master]

I don't know that this is a fair post !! It should read Can Fitz be a elite QB or passer & with that i answer yes !!

 

He will never be a Peyton Manning , Drew Breeze , Dan Marino , Jim Kelly , John Elway , elite QB . These guys are all HOF legendary elite QB's but given a healthy O line , & receivers that can catch a ball that's dropped in their hands when thrown to them along with a legit deep threat I think that Fitz can be a pro bowl caliber QB which would rank him in the elite among Playing NFL - QB's ..

 

He has already proved that in the beginning of this year & if his O line stayed healthy meaning Wood & Bell he would still be up there although loosing Parrish & i think Easley hurt him A LOT as far as really seeing what he would be able to do with a line up like that .

 

Easley , Parrish , Johnson , Nelson , Chandler , & now Smith the potential was unreal & if when they put Easley on IR if they would have kept Evans which i was all for getting rid of him & have since realized just how foolish that really was this offense could have been along with Fitz being it's leader something pretty special !!

[Astrojanitor]

SI kind of addressed this today:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/jim_trotter/12/07/quarterback.ratings/index.html?xid=cnnbin

 

Fitz is listed as #16 in the league. Right behind Matt Ryan and before Andy Dalton.

[Realist]

Is this thread because we are an elite QB away from going to the Superbowl?

 

 

Personally, I'd rather have an elite pass rusher than a qb. I was pissed we didn't even sniff around Peppers when he was available.

[Mr. WEO]

You don't have to go that far back. Ben Rothlesburger and Eli Manning had very good defenses and neither are on the Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Aaron Rogers level. They're the in between of the silly extremes you've outlined over and over and over again in this thread.

 

Of course Ryan Fitzpatrick still has more to go to prove that he's as good as Ben or Eli, but the Raider and Patriot games this year were proof that he does have that potential.

It's funny how good Fitzpatrick looked when he was given a healthy dose of short fields off of turnovers. Same thing with Ben and Eli, their teams were not asking them to start every drive at the 20 yard line.This team needs to build a good defense, plain and simple.

 

The Steelers have a measley 9 TO on defense this year--amongst the league's worst. The Giants are somelwaht better at 16. Compare this to the Bills at 22.

 

So I'm not sure how you're concluding that Ben benefits from short fields off of turnovers. We do need a good defense. Maybe a nother draft or three picking players will find a few decent starters.

[mountainwampus]

This thread reminds me of something Fox News would do. They love to ask ridiculous questions for polls to reinforce thier narrow-minded conclusions with lopsided results...

 

...Is Fitz a terrorist? That beard looks VERY Al-Qaeda. Was he born in Kenya??

Edited December 8, 2011 by mountainwampus

[K-9]

This thread reminds me of something Fox News news would do. They love to ask ridiculous questions for polls to reinforce thier narrow-minded conclusions with lopsided results...

 

...Is Fitz a terrorist? That beard looks VERY Al-Qaeda. Was he born in Kenya??

 

Fox News would couch it with "Some people say" Fitz is a terrorist. "Some people say" his beard may mean he's a radical Muslim. "Some people say" Fitz is a bad QB.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[PDaDdy]

If you don't know what an elite QB is, vote for that option. If you vote yes or no, explain why you feel that way.

 

Maybe you should start with a definition of what an elite QB is and how many of them you think are currently playing in the league and why? I have argued for hours with people over whether WR "X" is a #1 or not only to find out that we have MUCH different definitions of what a #1 WR was. The data and opinions you are trying to gather will be worthless without and agreed upon measurement system.

 

QBR?

QB Rating?

TD/INT?

Team wins and losses?

Accuracy?

 

How do you define an elite QB?

[I hate the Bills !]

Brady, Manning, Breeze, Rothesburger are Elite.

 

Fitz is a 60 million dollar guy that isnt as good as Jim Kelly,on 2/3 of the NFL teams he would be the Backup !

 

Its just that the expectations are so low in the Buffalo, that anyone better than Trent, JP or Kelly Holcomb or Billy Jo Hobert are considered Elite.

 

FItz is solid, Frank Reich Solid, you can win with him, but not every week and he needs lots of help from the rest of the team, he isnt gonna win you games by himself.

Edited December 8, 2011 by Wood is Good

[PDaDdy]

Brady, Manning, Breeze, Rothesburger are Elite.

 

Fitz is a 60 million dollar guy that isnt as good as Jim Kelly,on 2/3 of the NFL teams he would be the Backup !

 

Its just that the expectations are so low in the Buffalo, that anyone better than Trent, JP or Kelly Holcomb or Billy Jo Hobert are considered Elite.

 

FItz is solid, Frank Reich Solid, you can win with him, but not every week and he needs lots of help from the rest of the team, he isnt gonna win you games by himself.

 

Look at the collection of slow moving crap that he has to work with at WR. Seriously! With the way those guys have been dropping like flies and getting traded away it's got to be nearly impossible to develop a little thing called chemistry. I think Fitz is just fine and easily a top 10 QB in this league when his #2, #3, #4 #5 WRs weren't traded away or on IR currently. (Evans, Easely, Parrish, Jones) How can you expect him to excel with the crap we have at WR? I love David Nelson but come on man! He was #6 on the depth chart in preseason.

 

That being said I do agree that there are only 4 elite QBs in the whole league. I would of course include Aaron Rodgers but not Ben Roethlisberger. They are TRULY elite. That being said there are another 6 guys of which Fitz is included who are pretty damn good that I would be glad to have calling the signals for us.

[WindWalker]

A serviceable QB at most.

[Just in Atlanta]

This thread reminds me of something Fox News would do. They love to ask ridiculous questions for polls to reinforce thier narrow-minded conclusions with lopsided results...

 

Ugh. Unlike MSNBC. And every poll outfit around.

 

:thumbdown: :thumbdown:

[deep2evans]

Look at the collection of slow moving crap that he has to work with at WR. Seriously! With the way those guys have been dropping like flies and getting traded away it's got to be nearly impossible to develop a little thing called chemistry. I think Fitz is just fine and easily a top 10 QB in this league when his #2, #3, #4 #5 WRs weren't traded away or on IR currently. (Evans, Easely, Parrish, Jones) How can you expect him to excel with the crap we have at WR? I love David Nelson but come on man! He was #6 on the depth chart in preseason.

 

That being said I do agree that there are only 4 elite QBs in the whole league. I would of course include Aaron Rodgers but not Ben Roethlisberger. They are TRULY elite. That being said there are another 6 guys of which Fitz is included who are pretty damn good that I would be glad to have calling the signals for us.

 

easily a top 10 QB... truly unbelievable

 

Manning 1, Manning 2, Brees, Big Ben, Rodgers, Brady, Romo, Schaub, Stafford, Rivers, Newton, Ryan. there's 12 no-brainers right there before you even get into the debatable ones.

 

Then you have a group of guys who are either A. playing better than Fitz, or B. have 1000x more potential, to the point in which 32 of 32 GMs would take said player over Fitz. Cutler, Alex Smith, Flacco, Dalton, Freeman.

 

i mean, holy ****, are we that stupid as a fanbase to trick ourselves into thinking we have the answer here at QB??? Where is this delusional crap coming from? The guy is the epitome of average.

Edited December 8, 2011 by deep2evans

[todd]

He's a middle of the road starting QB, and he's paid exactly like one. If he was elite, he'd be paid like one. You people are insane.

[K-9]

We're talking "Crazy Eddie" insane.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[bobobonators]

Well, if you looked it up, you would see that Rivers threw for 3700 yards--without Gates and Jackson (who combined for another 1000 yards).

 

He was able to make due with guys like Legedu Naanee, Malcom Floyd, Patrick Crayton, Seyi Ajirotutu, Craig Davis and tiny Darren Sproles.

 

It can be done. As someone else pointed out, Houston is still scoring points, essentially without a QB.

 

The "very little talent" surrounding Fitz at receiver hasn't changed much (except for Jones) since week 3 (or opening day for that matter)--Stevie, Nelson and Chandler have been our top receivers all year and are still active.

 

 

How about, Stevie, Nelson, Chandler have been our top receivers because they're the only ones who have remained HEALTHY? They're our leading receivers by default, not necessarily by choice.

 

Regarding your Rivers argument..what EXACTLY are we arguing here, i want to make sure we're crystal clear, because if i use stats to point out that Fitz is having, statistically speaking, a "good" year this year, people complain that it's "not about stats"...but then, using the grass is greeener syndrome, the same people use Rivers "stats" to show how "good" he did last season.."why can't Fitz throw for so many yards!?" but at the same time, due to the grass is greener syndrome, fail to point out that Rivers did not make the playoffs last season out of the afc West for crying out loud. point that stat out.

 

Fitz is on pace to be in the top 10 in every statistically significant category for a QB in this league. End of story.

 

So ya, Rivers put up great stats last year w/o much around him, if you want to argue that, and those stats at the end of the day got him and SD nowhere..but Rivers is outstanding regardless. Fitz is having a very good season statistically speaking, with not much at all around him, and like Rivers, Fitz and the Bills will end up nowhere...but of course, Fitz sucks. Right.

[Tcali]

If you don't know what an elite QB is, vote for that option. If you vote yes or no, explain why you feel that way.

f no

[bobobonators]

easily a top 10 QB... truly unbelievable

 

Manning 1, Manning 2, Brees, Big Ben, Rodgers, Brady, Romo, Schaub, Stafford, Rivers, Newton, Ryan. there's 12 no-brainers right there before you even get into the debatable ones.

 

Then you have a group of guys who are either A. playing better than Fitz, or B. have 1000x more potential, to the point in which 32 of 32 GMs would take said player over Fitz. Cutler, Alex Smith, Flacco, Dalton, Freeman.

 

i mean, holy ****, are we that stupid as a fanbase to trick ourselves into thinking we have the answer here at QB??? Where is this delusional crap coming from? The guy is the epitome of average.

 

You're a lost cause. "average," based on what? Stats? We already listed them for you, and the STATS clearly indicate that he's producing at rate that is WELL above average.

 

Furthermore, why don't you go back to the games he played last season and include those stats with this year's stats, to give you an even greater body of work to play with. But you won't do that of course b/c you're a blind fool, so I'll do it for you:

 

25 games started for the Bills:

 

856 attempts; 43td's; 60% completion percentage; 5,837yds; 83qb rating

 

 

 

last 25 games started for following QB's:

 

Eli Manning:

 

879 attempts; 49td's; 62% completion %; 6897yds; approx 90qb rating

 

Big Ben (*last 24 games):

 

797 attempts; 36td's; 62% completion ; 6,446yds; 95 qb rating

 

Matt Ryan:

 

760 attempts; 33td's; approx 61% completion; 5,464yds; approx 88qb rating

 

Mark Sanchez:

 

833 attempts; 30td's; approx 55% completion; 5,419yds; approx 77qb rating

 

Matt Schaub:

 

849 attempts; 38td's; approx 62% completion; 6,742yds; approx 94qb rating

 

Joe Flacco:

 

815 attempts; 34td's; approx 58% completion; 5,853 yds; ; approx 86 qb rating

 

Josh Freeman:

 

857 attempts; 35td's; approx 61% completion; 5,984 yds; approx 86 qb rating

 

Rivers:

 

867 attempts; 42td's; approx 64% completion; 7,128yds; approx 94qb rating

 

 

Do you guys want me to continue? because it's truly pointless to do so. Aside from the ELITE QB'S (BREES/RODGERS/MANNING)which is pointless to even compare, Fitzpatrick last 25 starts with the Buffalo Bills, stack up against ANY OF THE QB'S you fools wish we had/assume are better.

 

For fools, the grass is always greener. So PLEASE, do me and the rest of us a favor and analyze those numbers above; analyze them, digest them and for once and for all, STFU.

 

GO FITZ!

Edited December 9, 2011 by bobobonators

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Brady, Manning, Breeze, Rothesburger are Elite.

 

This just goes to show how subjective this whole thing is.

 

I would class Rothlisberger as a solid,quality QB - not in the same class as Brady, Manning, Brees and RODGERS.

 

Fitz is a 60 million dollar guy that isnt as good as Jim Kelly,on 2/3 of the NFL teams he would be the Backup !

 

Interesting - would you mind naming those 21 teams on which Fitz would be the backup?

Feel free to give two lists - one for the current QB status and one for the status when the normal starter is healthy.

 

I look forward to your response with eager anticipation.