Dr. Who

I think this is true, but it's also true he held the ball too long quite a bit. He needs to improve reading the field like any young qb. I'm confident he'll get there.

Some things don't reduce to a number. Folks know what he means, though those who think Josh won't earn a second contract will act like it is a meaningless emotive comment I guess.

Ice cream

Not enough, Pseudo-Jesus.

He's not. He's a Chief's fan who isn't satisfied with a Super Bowl and Mahomes. He wants to come here and troll folks who are optimistic about Allen.

Be sure to bring a big sign saying Pipe Dream so we'll recognize you if the camera pans your way.

I haven't specifically been paying attention to comments on the Jets' draft, but my sense is that most folks on this board think the new Jets' GM has done a pretty good job. So I'm not sure where you're getting the belief that their draft is strongly ridiculed. And I think you mistake natural enthusiasm for new toys for arrogant certitude regarding our own draft. Both teams had good drafts, I think, but no one will know for sure, obviously, for a number of years. My own guess is that Moss is going to have the most immediate impact. I also think most on this board believe Darnold is fairly good; a few prefer him to Allen. So, if you believe both are bad (though apparently Allen is abysmal) in the end it's a wash, because many here think both are good. (I am one of those. I just think you are way off on Allen, though I am not ready to proclaim him a lock franchise qb.) My surmise on the wr corps is that folks think DIggs is a genuine #1 which allows Brown and Beasley to properly slot in as the #2 and #3. It becomes a geometric rather than an arithmetically incremental addition. The rookies have a chance to fill out the bottom of the depth chart and offer some red zone potential. Seems to me wr drops were a problem, so we differ again. You did not mention coaching. I think the Gase factor is real. Fella just isn't good at head coach and I surmise that is a real edge for Buffalo. In general, however, I think we have a stronger roster. I agree with those who believe we are and should be the favorite to take the division. I have been a fan for nearly fifty years. Dennis Shaw was the qb when I first remember watching with any degree of intelligence. Frankly, this current roster is easily one of the best we've had in twenty-five years. Of course, that's not saying much perhaps and if you think the qb is trash, the overall quality is severely downgraded given the importance of the position.

Still think they should have signed a punter, but I guess they like the competition already on the roster.

Just relating that fans' particular take. I think Allen likely will be a franchise qb. I'm a UGA fan, so I like Fromm, but I don't think he's in the same talent category as Allen. He is bright and a natural leader.

Unfortunately, Twistoffate is a Bills fan. His only silver lining is that Fromm is supposedly the perfect qb for Daboll's system, so when Allen is exposed as awful qb, the season is not quite wrecked. Most of the Allen haters (er, skeptics) were pretty quiet when the NFL schedule seemed to indicate that Bills are viewed as exciting, up-and-coming team.

Yes, but this fella is convinced Allen is a disaster, so if you factor that presupposition into his analysis, you'll see why he thinks the Jets are a formidable challenge for the Bills.

Living the pipedream.

Nah, they're evil like they always are only this year they're going to lose a lot as well.

So, pretty much the opposite of playing the entire NFC West to start.

Good point. They've also signed a number of free agents already familiar with McD's system. (Well, posted at same time as Warcodered. Hence, the echo, but it's still a relevant observation.)

I think we're comparing to the 2020 team, no? Hence, fair amount of projection both in terms of what players and positional groups will accomplish and in terms of how posters consistently evaluate particular players in terms of both accomplishment and likely development or lack thereof. In short, its even more speculative than taking two finished seasons as the basis for comparison.

Some of them are made of orange chocolate.

Last line of defense for some folks.

Well, excuses are always legitimate reasons for folks on the other side of the argument. I do think Allen gets more negative coverage because of initial convictions when originally drafted. This is more true nationally than in terms of Bills' fans and its been mitigated now because its evident to most that he has a chance to be good. (There are still some including a few here who don't see it.)

Well done.

Yeah, well live with it dude. Don't really care what your analytics say, I watched the games and I know I saw Allen lead numerous fourth qtr comebacks. Skepticism that likes to shoot down every good thing the fella does starts to seem like an agenda, even if it's "realism."

You know, they're both Buffalo Bills now. It's possible to root for both of them to do well. I've got an Allen jersey. I think he's likely to be very good. Still, wouldn't it be better for the team if Fromm turns out to be good at NFL qb, at least an upgrade to Barkley? (I know lots of folks think that is his ceiling and Epenesa is Shaq redux, etc. Maybe let's see how they play before deciding.) And Fromm is not a bum. He's bright, talented, and to some degree was held back by loss of talent, a defensive minded conservative head coach, and an OC that lasted one year.

UGA fan. I think Fromm can be good. I like the pick. But as others have pointed out, arm strength is more an issue when it comes to mid-range outs and the like. Fella like Allen can zip them in and Fromm can't do that. He'll kill you with anticipation and reading the field. Personally, I think there's a fairly good chance both work out. For a fifth round pick, Fromm is a steal.

2018 he was supposed to sit. He had a terrible o-line, very little in the way of playmakers, and was about as raw a prospect as there is. If you're not just looking at statistics, he willed that team to victories and definitely improved in games coming back from injury. 2019 showed marked improvement on short and medium range passes. Long ball is an issue. Still don't see him as a "game manager." Game managers don't lead multiple fourth quarter comebacks. If you don't think Allen has frequently demonstrated the clutch gene or converted numerous 3rd and long situations that never occur with mere game managers, I believe you are failing to account for the positives. The fella is inconsistent, reads the field too slow, doesn't take advantage of "move the chains" opportunities because he too often fixates on the big play. He has to make another leap. I think he probably will, but right now his floor is too inconsistent to be franchise qb. Imo, a lot of the "game manager" impression has to do with playcalling. When you have a good defense, there's a tendency to avoid mistakes, but Allen needs to be allowed to play with more daring if he's going to reach his potential. He still may not, but I think the safe strategy doesn't help him.

Don't know a lot about horse racing, but Secretariat's win at Belmont is one of the enduring memories from my childhood. Everyone thought the horse had lost the race by going out too fast and then the lead kept increasing. Check out YouTube if you haven't seen it.