ngbills

Well we all have different definitions of elite. In my view elite is the top 3-5 guys at a position. Top 20 is good. If your saying he is top 3-5 in the league why has he had only 2 1000 yard seasons? Never caught 10+ TD's? On his career thus far he averages about 5 rec for 65 yds and under .5 TD per game. Very good but not elite...yet.

This is where I am at. Some people seem like they want to have the parade before we actually start beating the Pats. I do think we will take over the division but its not time to celebrate because we look better on paper. May want to check 2008 out...

5 picks in 3 games against them. Completed 50% or less in all three games. 0-3. Why should he be impressed or scared?

Cant go wrong with Kelly, Bruce or Thurman. Kelly for his perseverance and toughness. Bruce was just a beast and dominated people. Thurman so fun to watch. Other favorites over the years. Marshawn because I grew up in Oakland and was coaching at Cal when he was there. Such a good guy and misunderstood by Bills fans. Flutie - Just for that one year. Takeo Spikes, but it was more about being excited when we signed him. Sure I am missing some others but these come top of mind.

This 1 million percent. I know I should just ignore the so much of it but its hard not to get into it. Barkley and Fromm are way better than Cam or Winston would be as backups. Diggs is better than DeAndre Hopkins or drafting any of the WR's in this years draft. We trade a draft pick and the player we got is way better than any pick. We dont trade for a guy and its we value draft picks or its a strong draft class. Our 7th round guy pick is a steal and will be starting in a few years. Meanwhile every player another team gets is not a good fit, sucks and we did not want them. On and on. And I would bet my house that Allen as a Jet would be destroyed on these boards.

He led the team to a 15-1 record. They were the top scoring team in the league. He was the league MVP. Scored 31 and 49 points in the playoffs en route to the Super Bowl. As Bills fans, if you were around for the 4 losses I think you would understand how things can go south in the big game. Heck Josh Allen in the biggest game of his career thus far was bad. Some horrible decisions and one of the biggest reasons we lost. So dont know how you can call Cam a loser and that he is not worthy of even being our backup to Allen. Allen is 0-1 and was bad in the spot light and I would include those Pats games as well as big games in which he was really bad.

From year one his numbers have been better. And basically every year. I would speculate that Winston as our QB we win more games last year. I am not saying I would want him over Allen but you lose credibility if you say he is awful and no teams want him. He is better than Allen at this point in their careers. Allen hopefully has a higher ceiling if he can get there. Fans are biased by their player - hence obviously Allen is amazing and Winston or Newton suck. Barkley is a great backup on the Bills, as any other teams back up he is a joke. As for the playoffs, TB defense was awful since Winston got there. If the Bills had TB Defense no way they make the playoffs last year. We had arguably 1-3 best D in the league and lost in the 1st round as the 5th seed. Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD TD% Int Int% 1D Lng Y/A AY/A Y/C Y/G Rate QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV 2015* 21 TAM QB 3 16 16 6-10-0 312 535 58.3 4042 22 4.1 15 2.8 201 68 7.6 7.1 13.0 252.6 84.2 61.1 27 190 6.85 6.44 4.8 2 3 13 2016 22 TAM QB 3 16 16 9-7-0 345 567 60.8 4090 28 4.9 18 3.2 216 45 7.2 6.8 11.9 255.6 86.1 59.7 35 239 6.40 5.98 5.8 1 3 12 2017 23 TAM QB 3 13 13 3-10-0 282 442 63.8 3504 19 4.3 11 2.5 185 70 7.9 7.7 12.4 269.5 92.2 54.0 33 207 6.94 6.70 6.9 2 2 10 2018 24 TAM QB 3 11 9 3-6-0 244 378 64.6 2992 19 5.0 14 3.7 152 64 7.9 7.3 12.3 272.0 90.2 69.7 27 157 7.00 6.38 6.7 0 1 9 2019 25 TAM QB 3 16 16 7-9-0 380 626 60.7 5109 33 5.3 30 4.8 243 71 8.2 7.1 13.4 319.3 84.3 47 282 7.17 6.15 7.0 2 2 Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD TD% Int Int% 1D Lng Y/A AY/A Y/C Y/G Rate QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV 2018 22 BUF QB 17 12 11 5-6-0 169 320 52.8 2074 10 3.1 12 3.8 89 75 6.5 5.4 12.3 172.8 67.9 49.8 28 213 5.35 4.37 8.0 2 3 6 2019 23 BUF QB 17 16 16 10-6-0 271 461 58.8 3089 20 4.3 9 2.0 146 53 6.7 6.7 11.4 193.1 85.3 38 237 5.72 5.71 7.6 4 5

My point is we would be talking about how great he was with the 5000 yards and 33TD's and that he just needs to get the int's in check. We would be talking about him despite his int's like he is the best QB in the league. Allen's numbers pale in comparison to Winston. Derek Anderson says hi. So does AJ McCarron. Cam Newton is only a year older than Barkley.

And 5000 yards and 33 TD's. If Josh Allen put up his numbers last year this board would be going nuts saying he will be MVP this next year.

I would think it makes sense to Cam and Buffalo. Look at Tannehill - he took $2M to go to TENN and turned that into a $120M deal. Cam should look at the Bills and think Josh needs to have a good year. If he struggles the Bills turn to Cam and he gets his big deal next year. If Allen does not, he can get some good press as being a mentor and sign a decent deal to start somewhere the following year.

If he wants to play I think he is looking at something like that.

Winston signed for $1M

Duke Williams Combine Auburn receiver Duke Williams responds to a question during a news conference at the NFL football scouting combine Thursday, Feb. 25, 2016, in Indianapolis. (AP Photo/Darron Cummings) D'haquille Williams' draft status is in limbo. The receiver many considered to be a first- or second-round prospect a year ago is suddenly persona non grata for many. It's possible the former Auburn receiver could fall out of the draft because of his off-the-field antics that led to his dismissal in October. Williams faced the media and NFL personnel Thursday at the NFL Combine. He was reflective, he openly shared his regrets, apologized about his past and promised he is working to become a better man. "I'm a first-round pick no matter what, but off the field I'm a seventh-round pick," Williams said. "My character is a seventh-round pick."

I have said I dont mind the picks. Just have modest expectations and feel they could have no impact this year or ever. I am speaking more to the reaction to the pick. How much better they are than our current guys. In reality they may not be better than them. Still worth taking a look to see if they are. But if we had jumped up and got one of the top 5 guys that would be a different story. From the tape, reports, combine, etc there is not a lot that screams these guys are better. Which is why they were drafted in the 4th and 6th.

And the year before we could do better than the year before and the year before was the same and on and on. It is always - this new guy has to be better than this old guy.

Exactly. Most people knew nothing about Jefferson, Butler, Addison before we signed them. On another team we would not be talking about them being the best DL. They come hear and clearly they are awesome. It is the nature of being a fan.

The Bills DL and much of its roster are really an example of depth vs star power. A group of players that the talent level doesn't drop much but also does not have the elite level player either. I think the positional groups are all impacted differently here. If I am building a team I want an elite pass rusher and elite WR. The rest of the roster I want the depth approach. Well QB obviously I take the elite QB vs mediocre depth. But OL I want depth and ability to plug and play as they really depend on the unit as a whole. I would make the same argument with the secondary as they must work together and the sum can be better than the parts. LB's I want as many capable bodies as I can find. RB by committee as shown to work. QB, WR and Edge Rusher are much about isolation and winning one on one battles. So 5 Cole Beasley's vs 1 Michael Thomas and a Cole Beasley with a Robert Foster and a Duke Williams wins.

Well you somewhat prove my point in saying "Nobody drafted at 54 or after would be > Diggs, Brown Beasley" We drafted a couple guys that could make the team or could not beat out the likes of Duke, McK, Foster, Roberts. We may not carry 6 WR's if we carry 3 TE's so could end up being Diggs, Brown, Beasley, and only two of Duke, McK, Foster, Roberts, Davis, Hodgins. Duke Williams - He was the Bills most targeted WR in the playoff game. The staff must have some faith in him. Numbers were not off the board but he was still on par with John Brown and better than Beasley in that game. Not sure I would write him off that easily. McD values special teams which is why Roberts stays on this roster. He is the quasi 6th WR. McK is Daboll's gadget guy and #5 WR at this point. Who knows if they keep him. Foster is probably gone regardless of if they drafted anyone. But he did put up good numbers and showed promise. He could wind up elsewhere and find his success again. Who, knows. I do find it funny that when I criticize the Bills WR's the response in the past was how clueless I am and Foster is awesome, Duke is going to be a pro bowler or McD disagrees with you. Now that I say our drafted buys may not beat them out it is those guys suck and no question our 4th and 6th round picks are better.

I agree. I also think these draft picks are easily replaceable. Its funny - I can guarantee that if the Bills did not draft any WR's I would be hearing " relax, we have Duke, Foster, McKenzie, Roberts, Ray Ray and none of the guys available in the draft after the 3rd round were better".

Diggs, Brown, Beasley have had production for multiple years in NFL Roberts and McK both played a a key role on the team for multiple years Foster had 500 yds as a rookie Duke showed flashes and played well in a playoff game That is 7 guys that have legitimately played in the NFL. Only Easley and McCloud fall in the little or no production group. Davis and Hodgins are battling it out with Roberts, McK, Foster, Duke for the final 2-3 sports. With a short training camp it could be an uphill battle. Yes it was a very rich WR draft. That does not mean it trickles down to every single player. The difference was and as we saw there were 5-6 guys worthy of a 1st rounder and another 6-8 worthy of 2nd round picks. Typically there are 2-3 first rounders and maybe another 5-8 worthy of 2nd's. So loaded was in the sense of lots early talent, that does not mean even the 6-7th rounders were better. In total 35 WR were drafted. In 2019 there was 28, in 2018 there was 34, in 2017 it was 32 anke keep going and it has been in the 30+ range for years.

Or they dont make the team and in a year people need to look up their names to remember who those two late round WR's were. Isn't Duke sold as the go get the ball guy? Generally speaking the higher your drafted at any position, the better the player. Obviously doesn't always go that way. But the odds of a 1-3rd rounder making it vs a 4-7th rounder are vastly different. People here about the few late rounders that do well and think its the norm and forget the fact there 10-15 guys that never make it.

Yes - because that is the price paid to get them. How else would I base it? If they took a WR in the 2nd that is them taking a bigger bet on the player. I would call that doubling down. What they did is what teams do in and out every year. WR was one of the weaker units on the team. Everyone single draft "expert" expected the Bills to draft WR's.

Potential weaknesses: QB - Need more from Allen OL - Need better than last year LB - As good as the D was the LB crew is the biggest weakness K - Could be better maybe or maybe not.

I dont think it is that simple. Zay Jones had 399 NCAA receptions - more than that entire list combined. R Foster caught for over 500 yds as an undrafted rookie including 3 100 yd games. Duke was supposedly all world if not for off the field issues. You can dice it up at many ways. At the end of the day I dont think it is unreasonable to call this what it is. Davis and Hodgins are your typical 4-7 round prospects that may or may not have careers in this league.

What makes him better? All of those guys have shown they can be a capable 4th or 5th WR. Not saying they are amazing by any means but just saying Davis is not in the same discussion had we drafted one of the top 5 WR's in the draft and even a step down from a Pittman/Shenault/Higgins caliber player. Something the Bills and teams do in many many drafts. Take a shot at a WR in the 4-7th round.