ngbills

That is the point with the "eye test". It adjusts to whether they are currently a Bill or no longer a Bill. On the old message board I got into a ton of debates with folks because I said EJ sucks. Of course, now people will not admit or simply forgot about saying the same things. EJ has not had enough time, his coaches suck, his support system, excuses #1-100. I think Allen is a much better prospect. But he is a work in progress still. He is as bad as his stats show. His play will limit the Bills if he cannot improve.

Super Bowl QB #2 and #10 in ANY/A Conf Champ Losers #1 and #11 Div Round Losers #4, #7, #8 and #12 All 8 of the final teams playing in the playoffs were in the top #12 in ANY/A. ALL OF THEM. Looks like a good correlation to winning. Only 4 exceptions and one lost in the wild card game and other 3 were Dak in Dallas, Stafford in Det, and Carr in OAK. Wild Card Losers 3, 16, 17 and 23. Allen and the Bills were the lowest ANY/A QB to make the playoffs. Only 3 teams outside of the top 12 made it. Call it a franchise QB or simply what you need from your QB to win.

Manuel Year 2 5.54 ANY/A 3.8 TD%

ANY/A EJ Manuel 5.07 Josh Allen 5.16 TD% EJ Manuel 3.7 Josh Allen 3.8

And why does Josh get the "extra" but that does not apply to everyone else? Play this game with everyone and it pushes everyone's numbers up.

Well until there is a new season and Josh plays better the talking points are still valid. They dont go away because people want them to go away. They dont go away because we have Diggs. Not because its year 3. You have to play the games first.

But Jim Kelly, but Eli Manning, but Starr, Unitas, Namath. But but but. Oh jeez, maybe your right. Our offense was not good enough. Our QB was not good enough. As a traditional passer he was downright bad at times. He is going into his 3rd year. He is struggling at the things "coaches/scouts" expected. That is ok. But if people want to be protective of him and debate based on emotion that is fine. End of the day it is what it is. He does not improve, this front office seems to be thoughtful enough to not want to invest $100-200M in the kid.

I am with you on this. People confuse seeing his weaknesses with hating him or this team. Do you you think his coaches dont see his weaknesses? I can 100% guarantee you that his coaches and if you take any of the 32 teams coaches they would see the same thing. His #1 problem is accuracy/consistency and #2 is decision making. He has compensated for that with his athleticism but that is not a long term recipe for success as a QB. Those that really want to dig into to this - go watch every pass for the top 10 QB's in the league. Then watch the same for Josh Allen. If you still see him being just as accurate and only impacted by drops or taking more chances, etc then you are just not being real. We all know he can make all the throws but its consistency making them. He still has handfuls of balls a game that are just not at the level he needs to be at. This is not high school or college.

How many pro bowl OL do we have? Do we have cap space? Sign Warford and see if we can get a pick for Feliciano, Spain or whoever is odd man out. It’s an upgrade.

Gotta at least kick the tires.

Taking my boredom up a notch. Looking ahead at week 17. Hopefully Bills have the division locked after stomping the Pats the Monday before and are resting the starters vs MIA. Around the league some good match ups with play off spots on the line: CLE vs PIT HOU vs TEN SF vs SEA CHI vs GB AZ vs LAR DEN vs OAK (not saying LAV)

Bills v Niners on Sunday night game

Bills open season home vs Jets 11/1 the Pats in town 1/3 MIA in town

If they went up for sale today I would bet they still get the $5.5B or more. Its about future revenue not revenue today or even just next year. Which is my point. "IF" the teams say are cutting salaries by $120M next year then that is a money grab. Yes something needs to happen like a sharing of the losses over a number of years.

I know this can get to be a complicated situation. But owners do not give money to players at the same rate of increases in value so why do so on the downside? Values of teams have gone from $100M to billions. Jerry Jones bought the Cowboys for $140M and they are now worth $5.5B. Think about that. Can other businesses that have shut down now pay our employees half as much? Lets drop minimum wage in half to account for lost business. I dont have the answers but seems like a money grab by billionaire owners. If you want to treat the players this way trade some salary for ownership of the team.

No - They were 8th in points, 10th in yards and 7th in 1st downs. Even more they were 20th in turnovers. These numbers were all down from the year before - 4th in both points and yards, 5th in 1st downs and 9th in turnovers.

They were then 10-6 the next year. 1 game worse with Brady than Cassel. But it does not work that way. Can only look at the facts and not speculate what they would have done if.... They played without Brady and still went 11-5. In 2016 they went 3-1 without Brady. Until proven otherwise they have still won without Brady.

2008

Suggs ran a 4.8 - that is not bad. But for a top 5 pick on a edge guy you want a 4.6-4.7.

I was going to say in my OP that maybe he can be a Calais Campbell type. Wanted to include other names so was looking for other edge/DE guys with slow times and did not find too many... Not that simple. Lots of guys with good tape dont have the speed or other qualities to excel in the NFL game.

It is going to be a while before we see the new players hit the field. My biggest concern with AJ is his quickness and athleticism. Given that I would not be surprised to see him bumped inside more often than on the edge. End of the day it is about what he does on the field but for comparison purposes his times fit the DT mold more than DE. 40 time Epenesa: 5.04 Oliver: 4.73 Star: 5.41 H Phillips: 5.21 Taylor: 5.07 Murphy: 4.86 Addison: 4.70 Hughes: 4.65 Jefferson: 4.95 3 Cone Epenesa: 7.34 Oliver: 7.15 Star: 7.66 H Phillips: 7.28 Taylor: 7.58 Murphy: 6.78 Addison: 6.96 Hughes: 6.99 Jefferson: 7.95 (must have slipped) 20 yd shuttle Epenesa: 4.46 Oliver: 4.22 Star: 4.65 H Phillips: 4.50 Taylor: 4.59 Murphy: 4.20 Addison: 4.28 Jefferson: 4.95 Hughes: 4.15 Jefferson: 4.37

A) Fromm was never considered a top prospect. Has always been what he is - a game manager type and likely back up at best. B) Barkley is not paid that much. So no it was not some genius move to find a cheaper back up.

If Fromm beats out Allen that is not good. It means Allen is going the way of a Mariota and the likes and we are not getting any first rounders for him.

Exactly my point - he needs to ascend. He may ascend to elite status but not yet though many are referring to him as if he is.

I was going to say in my post - I know he was in a run heavy offense (though he received 149 targets one year) and had a Thielen. But he will have Brown in BUF. And I dont think you can say if this he would have done that. Does not work that way. You could do that exercise for many players in the league. Fact check - he has only caught for 100 rec in one season not seasons Fact check again - he had a 17.9 ypc once. It has been 10-13 in all other years. Again, I think he is really good. Hopefully even better with the Bills. Just not on elite status yet until he proves it. He is what the Bills needed a very good #1 WR. But we did not just get the most elite WR in the game.