Richard Noggin

1st round pick Q Johnston? (I know he looked lost as a rookie, and carries that dreaded "contested catch" college reputation...)

NHL playoffs annually is a great example of this relentless, selfless approach to team sports that works especially well when even the most talented guys buy in. It's a winning approach. Talent can still tip the balance, of course. Those Cowboys teams in the 90s, for example. The Eagles right now. Etc.

Totally fair. Just saying that his '24 production should be asterisked. Ladd definitely showed he's got legit chops. But Roman has a slanted track record with respect to passing volume/production.

This hurts so good.

I don't think Goff's documented production or his tape supports such a dismissive assessment of his ability. "A less talented Kirk Cousins" is a crazy claim. #1 overall pick with a better athletic profile and college pedigree who's had SO MUCH more NFL success...it's just not close. I get that they're both pocket guys who throw a nice intermediate in-breaker, but come on!

One cannot summarily dismiss the impact of Greg Roman's arrival on Palmer's 2024 production.

I suspect I'll never be able to quit watching, unless the Bills leave WNY. But I'll be fine watching from the comfort of my couch or my buddy's garage rather than at the stadium, if/when that time comes.

Despite the "30 year" PSLs we've almost paid off already for our 2 seats in the new stadium, I can't envision us keeping up with these recurring obligations more than a few years from now. My ticket partner is my 73 year-old mother (I'm almost 47), who first attended home games at The Rockpile in the mid-'60s with her Italian father despite my Sicilian grandmother's fatalistic/racist objections. So...when Allen eventually retires, hopefully not for 8-10 years, but possibly sooner...will I still be accompanying my mom to the games? Could depend on their championship outcomes between now and...then. A Superbowl victory at any point would essentially release me from our expensive and laborious season ticket ritual, whereby my decade-long duty as her gameday chaperone would be allowed to end. I'm counting on the Bills finally winning it all in this final season at the current stadium, thereby making all the inaugural 2026 home games in the new stadium even more impactful for both orgs/fanbases involved. Until they win a Superbowl, though, we're locked into expensively suffering alongside them. Can't quit it before they finally hit it. Family season ticket rules. Reeaally hope they find a way to finish the job.

Does it change your argument a little if Duke Williams was a playoff starter for the Bills? Or if Davis was a starter for way too many postseasons? I totally agree that none of those listed rag-tag boundary options were ever meant to be the team's best option at the position, but that we ended up there nonetheless.

With respect to outside WRs, Beane has shown a persistent affinity for every draftnik's most dreaded profile: the long, strong, physical, contested catch guy. Kelvin Benjamin, Andre Holmes, Duke Williams, Gabe Davis, Justin Shorter, Mack Hollins, Keon Coleman, etc. There is a role for these guys, but with the Bills, it's such an obvious role of motioning inside to run block or run a slant, fade, or maybe a shallow crosser/intermediate flag a la mesh concept... Offense seemed to SHINE with smaller, faster, better separators (and different OC). Maybe that was a specific "era" in the NFL, but Allen sure seemed to flourish with guys who got OPEN. Imagine that lol.

Not knowing what a PRIVATE trainer is putting in your own body is an absolutely INSANE claim for a professional athlete to make. Maybe 30 years ago that could hold water. Then again, didn't Ohtani make this same scapegoat scenario work for him? Even with some super bizarre/contradictory messaging out there initially.

Gotta admit how cool that reads. Impact S concussed by a monster QB who then goes on to have a legendary game.

I believe I've just been insulted, sir.

You've NEVER made fun of Kelce's lazy physique as his on-field production diminishes? Try it out. Super fun.

Don't think anyone could reasonably disagree with this perspective. Only thing is that each NFL season is so variable and who really knows what's beneficial or not until after things play out.

You don't think the general angst surrounding the value expended on acquiring Kincaid, compared to the ROI, is at all warranted? I'm not at all suggesting he's already a bust, but it IS perfectly rational to see the trade up to draft him as largely unrewarded, to date. Kincaid could step up in year 3 and become a reliable weapon for Allen, but it hasn't happened yet. Something that doesn't help his cause with fans: he doesn't look like a guy DEVOTED to maximizing his time in the weight room. I've certainly enjoyed ridiculing Travis Kelce's body composition in recent years.

The fact that this does NOT exist is just pure greed. Like the broadcast contracts would be SO much worse with ONE week to fill with something other than NFL games. The NFL is on a trajectory that can only ADD days/weeks to the content schedule. It cannot SUBTRACT at this point.

Focus on technique. The fundamentals.

Wasn't he just OWNING his former college teammate, Mike Hughes?

Agreed for that game, and the playoffs at home in general. Regular season is a different animal, however.

Does this suggest the Bills home opener will be "well attended" by Ravens fans? Sucks each time those North division teams' (both NFC and AFC) fans establish a visible and audible presence in Orchard Park. On one hand, I cannot blame any season ticket holder who is able to sell 2 single game tickets for over $1k. Goes a long way towards paying for the rest of the games. Especially now that we're paying PSLs to a billionaire. However, I will always resent any Bills season ticket holder who resells to visiting team fans, even though I empathize. All the North division team fans have traveled well to WNY in recent years. Eff that noise.

I find it really difficult to predict what's reasonable for the Pats. The AFCE has recently been rife with "offseason ascensions" that fell short of their optimistic projections, and sure, the Pats are broadly seen as this year's contender. Could be the case. But there is too much projection in that narrative to have much confidence in it to date. (I'm privately impressed with their moves since the season ended. Not convinced their OL is up to par, however.)

Awesome thread overall. Just look at the magnificently nerdy nonsense right above me on my screen as I type out this reply: People can approach these ranked analytics from so many directions, and employ so many different analytical tools, as well as so many different philosophical/evaluative perspectives. Personally I think it's true that fans (of teams who didn't just win SBs) overvalue their own org's FA and draft MISSES. And probably aren't nearly as aware of the frequency or impact of other good orgs' misses. Grass is always greener cliche. But the truth is that if Beane and Co had actually locked down just a couple more hits amongst the misses, especially near the top of the draft, then maybe the Bills would have a 'Ship already. Or maybe if coaching was just a little more ahead of the curve. Or maybe if good players just made one more play... You see how insanely interrelated football is. Nothing can truly be analyzed or judged in a vacuum.

Pro Football Reference has 2024 Bills 9th in passing yards (also 9th in rushing yards). Where are you looking? And either way, being ahead of the Bills in that category doesn't exactly correlate with season success. Not a GREAT indicator imho.