John from Riverside Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Not just "draft a QB and a LT" To me there appears to be 3 real needs going into the next offseason: LT - I am hoping this drops off the list as D. Bell gets more playing time....still very raw....still needs work on his strength.....but I am basing it on NO improvement from what we are seeing now.....I think the interior linemen are set and I think either Meradith improves or Butler returns to fill the RT spot. QB - If anything has been shown to me over the past two games is that Edwards is either not the answer because he never had it or because he has been ruined by our coaching staff......regardless you see things from Fitz that you hope you would see with a more talented QB at that spot......not only the willingness to throw downfield but the smarts of when to do so and the accuracy to make it happen. And keep in mind in all of this that we are woefully needing another DT to pair up with Stroud.....but our defense is playing heads and shoulders above our offense right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan74 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 My hope is that Bell develops so we don't need to draft that position. QB I think Vick is a real possibility, I know most don't want him but where else can you get a former pro bowl QB for almost nothing? Plus he is a good fit for our lack of O-line. I would look to draft Reesing or another Sr with 23 wins with a strong arm etc..(parcells method) not in the first round. At DT I would try and trade for Corey Williams from Clev (5th rounder?) and hope Suh or Cody are there when we pick in Rd1. Maybe that helps. We also need LB's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kota Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Get different coaching staff. DONE. The Bills don't have a talent issue. Getting a different QB or LT won't make a world of difference with DJ and his merry band from screwing it all up. Do you really think Jarius Byrd is as good as he is because of our coaching staff? The answer is no because he has been coached by his father for years. Fitz is not any better than Edwards. He is actually worse. Fitz's only advantage over Edwards is that he has been on other teams with different coaches. He had pass happy Mike Martz for a coach for awhile. He was also on a team with OchoCinco and TJ which was the strength of that team for years. The last two scores the Bills had were on field goals. Both times when the Bills got within the 20 yard line they did the same kind of plays. Run up the middle, Toss sweep left, an dthen another short pass to the right hash mark or run up the middle. Both times DJ was setting the team up for a field goal. He put the ball on the left hash mark which is good for a right legged kicker. Bottom line is that DJ coaches scared. He coaches not to lose. He doesn't coach to WIN. He doesn't have a killer instinct. His mentally slips to the rest of the players and they play conservative. I wish TO would open his mouth because i bet he would say the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I don't think this organization knows how to develop QBs period. It precedes the present or any coaching staff I can remember with the exception of maybe Ted Marchibroda. Kelly to some extent was "ready" when he came to Buffalo. So I would try to trade maybe even give up a 2nd rounder or some combo thereof for a promising backup QB ala Schaub or God willing Favre all those years ago. We just don't have what it takes to "bake from scratch" at that particular position. I'm not sure who that would be. I'd have to closely examine the roster of the 32 teams. Maybe it's Chris Simms, but kinda would be nervous to trade for him. As for OL, I think Bell is gonna get someone killed. I haven't seen anything from this guy except "I'll Stand In Your Way" - he just doesn't have the mindset. I'll defer to you John since you've played the position. But I just don't think he has anything except natural athleticism. I think we need to draft a blue chip LT ala Wood and Levitre next year. That or a big strong DE in the first round. C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 26, 2009 Author Share Posted October 26, 2009 I don't think this organization knows how to develop QBs period. It precedes the present or any coaching staff I can remember with the exception of maybe Ted Marchibroda. Kelly to some extent was "ready" when he came to Buffalo. So I would try to trade maybe even give up a 2nd rounder or some combo thereof for a promising backup QB ala Schaub or God willing Favre all those years ago. We just don't have what it takes to "bake from scratch" at that particular position. I'm not sure who that would be. I'd have to closely examine the roster of the 32 teams. Maybe it's Chris Simms, but kinda would be nervous to trade for him. As for OL, I think Bell is gonna get someone killed. I haven't seen anything from this guy except "I'll Stand In Your Way" - he just doesn't have the mindset. I'll defer to you John since you've played the position. But I just don't think he has anything except natural athleticism. I think we need to draft a blue chip LT ala Wood and Levitre next year. That or a big strong DE in the first round. C Cale, Right now I am concerned about his natural strength and lack of agression. I just dont see Bell attacking DEs and trying to finish them.....he is trying to "Wall off" too much" a lot of that has to do with the fact that he is more of an "athlete" then a "football player" at this point. But the tools are there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haven Moses Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 If we hire Gruden, we could afford to get a QB off the junkpile like he did with Brad Johnson and Gannon. For OT, free agancy doesn't work. We'll have to draft one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Draft Locker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Fix the LT with a new 'strength and conditioning' coach Fix the QB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Get different coaching staff. DONE. The Bills don't have a talent issue. Getting a different QB or LT won't make a world of difference with DJ and his merry band from screwing it all up. Do you really think Jarius Byrd is as good as he is because of our coaching staff? The answer is no because he has been coached by his father for years. Fitz is not any better than Edwards. He is actually worse. Fitz's only advantage over Edwards is that he has been on other teams with different coaches. He had pass happy Mike Martz for a coach for awhile. He was also on a team with OchoCinco and TJ which was the strength of that team for years. Fitzpatrick saw limited duty with STL, kota... http://www.nfl.com/players/ryanfitzpatrick...le?id=FIT792915 And CIN was riddled with injuries - most in the league (including, eventually, 3 OL's) when Fitzpatrick was starting for Palmer. Their D was also whacked hard. Ocho Dinko was in Year #2 of his moping and crying, too. Since he realized that he wasn't being traded, Illl say that he wasn't doing his best for their replacement QB. Far from it. Remember the last CIN-BUF game, with Dinko short-arming to the point where TJ Housh got into face? - followed by Whitner cheap-shotting him as he was stretched out and falling? He got hauled out on the cart, went to a hospital but...somehow...recovered and caught the plane home... Dinko is tough as nails - I've seen him take very, very hard (and cheap) hits through his years. He was dogging it last season. Evidently, he's a new man this year. (BTW, the local chit-chat was that he had a serious $ problem). Fitzpatrick may well not be the *answer*, but I think that most folks see that he's giving all he's got. He's an improbable 2 and 0. The team is 3 - 4, and still in the race. You can't ask more than that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 If we hire Gruden, we could afford to get a QB off the junkpile like he did with Brad Johnson and Gannon. For OT, free agancy doesn't work. We'll have to draft one. Love the Gruden idea. He can take any QB and make them sing. Problem: he ain't comin' to the B-Lo in a hundred years. Buffalo has a big time image problem... its not a place most people want to be, certainly not in-their-prime rock star NFL free agent coaches and players who can go anywhere they want... big problem.. not getting solved anytime soon... so you get your TEs and DJs until ralph is gone, fresh, long term ownership and $$ come in and the franchise moves.... it is what it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Fitzpatrick saw limited duty with STL, kota... http://www.nfl.com/players/ryanfitzpatrick...le?id=FIT792915 And CIN was riddled with injuries - most in the league (including, eventually, 3 OL's) when Fitzpatrick was starting for Palmer. Their D was also whacked hard. Ocho Dinko was in Year #2 of his moping and crying, too. Since he realized that he wasn't being traded, Illl say that he wasn't doing his best for their replacement QB. Far from it. Remember the last CIN-BUF game, with Dinko short-arming to the point where TJ Housh got into face? - followed by Whitner cheap-shotting him as he was stretched out and falling? He got hauled out on the cart, went to a hospital but...somehow...recovered and caught the plane home... Dinko is tough as nails - I've seen him take very, very hard (and cheap) hits through his years. He was dogging it last season. Evidently, he's a new man this year. (BTW, the local chit-chat was that he had a serious $ problem). Fitzpatrick may well not be the *answer*, but I think that most folks see that he's giving all he's got. He's an improbable 2 and 0. The team is 3 - 4, and still in the race. You can't ask more than that... can't ask for more than 3-4? you sound just like a bills fan. 3-4 is lousy.especially the way they lose..and win. they are barely beating teams with QBs who repeatedly throw the ball directly to them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kota Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Fitzpatrick saw limited duty with STL, kota... http://www.nfl.com/players/ryanfitzpatrick...le?id=FIT792915 And CIN was riddled with injuries - most in the league (including, eventually, 3 OL's) when Fitzpatrick was starting for Palmer. Their D was also whacked hard. Ocho Dinko was in Year #2 of his moping and crying, too. Since he realized that he wasn't being traded, Illl say that he wasn't doing his best for their replacement QB. Far from it. Remember the last CIN-BUF game, with Dinko short-arming to the point where TJ Housh got into face? - followed by Whitner cheap-shotting him as he was stretched out and falling? He got hauled out on the cart, went to a hospital but...somehow...recovered and caught the plane home... Dinko is tough as nails - I've seen him take very, very hard (and cheap) hits through his years. He was dogging it last season. Evidently, he's a new man this year. (BTW, the local chit-chat was that he had a serious $ problem). Fitzpatrick may well not be the *answer*, but I think that most folks see that he's giving all he's got. He's an improbable 2 and 0. The team is 3 - 4, and still in the race. You can't ask more than that... I wasn't talking about the quality of the teams he was on or even how much playtime he got. I was speaking to the fact that he has had the privilege of being coached by people outside the Bills Organization. The only coaching staff Edwards knows is the Bills staff and it's stunting his growth as a QB. Fitz has been lucky to be in two games where the defense pulled down 9 turnovers. Take those turnovers away and the Bills lose both games. The offense can barely get to the 50 yard line most times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan_in_raleigh Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 John Great questions however I do not watch alot of college football to help with the answers. Butler returning and staying healthy at RT seems like a good choice. Problem is we need to draft a great LT as well as a franchise QB. How do you make both happen in same draft especially since we wont be drafting in top 5. I would like us to maybe go OT with first pick, grab a qb in the second and shore up DT and LBS with draft and FA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Not just "draft a QB and a LT" To me there appears to be 3 real needs going into the next offseason: LT - I am hoping this drops off the list as D. Bell gets more playing time....still very raw....still needs work on his strength.....but I am basing it on NO improvement from what we are seeing now.....I think the interior linemen are set and I think either Meradith improves or Butler returns to fill the RT spot. QB - If anything has been shown to me over the past two games is that Edwards is either not the answer because he never had it or because he has been ruined by our coaching staff......regardless you see things from Fitz that you hope you would see with a more talented QB at that spot......not only the willingness to throw downfield but the smarts of when to do so and the accuracy to make it happen. And keep in mind in all of this that we are woefully needing another DT to pair up with Stroud.....but our defense is playing heads and shoulders above our offense right now. I am with you, John; I believe (hope) that D. Bell can make some strides in the off-season, so I am honestly willing to stand pat on him. Up until yesterday, I seriously would have take a look at how cheaply we could get Smith away from San Francisco... ...yeah, that's not happening now. SO much for me being ahead of the curve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ishouldbegm Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Draft bradford or trade for DA sign mcneil from SD to play lt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 If only it was as easy as writing down what we wanted: I think that we should hire Cowher as the head coach with Mike Holmgren as the offensive coordinator, Mike Shanahan as the QB coach and Jon Gruden as the receivers coach. We could take Tony Dungy as the new defensive coordinator with Marty Shottenheimer as the linebackers coach. I think that they're all available. Then we can trade for Peyton Manning... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garbag3man Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Draft bradford or trade for DA sign mcneil from SD to play lt I would be worried about Bradford, would rather have Max Hall from BYU, or Tony Pike. We need a tough cold weather QB for once. Plus they both seem more NFL ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I would be worried about Bradford, would rather have Max Hall from BYU, or Tony Pike. I don't pretend to know much about college QBs, or how success at that level translates to the NFL...but to me Pike is the risk. "Same" injury twice, slight build. Nothing much happened on the play where he was reinjured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kota Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Give the team a real coach and we are in the playoffs. Shanahan, Holmgren, or Cowher and we are in the playoffs first year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I don't pretend to know much about college QBs, or how success at that level translates to the NFL...but to me Pike is the risk. "Same" injury twice, slight build. Nothing much happened on the play where he was reinjured. I agree on Pike. I think I could break his arm by bumping into him. That said, I think he's a player (can we build him a robotic left arm?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 If only it was as easy as writing down what we wanted: I think that we should hire Cowher as the head coach with Mike Holmgren as the offensive coordinator, Mike Shanahan as the QB coach and Jon Gruden as the receivers coach. We could take Tony Dungy as the new defensive coordinator with Marty Shottenheimer as the linebackers coach. I think that they're all available. Then we can trade for Peyton Manning... Why would we need to trade? In this scenario i think we get the Manning brothers off of waivers. While we are at it Bring back HOUSE BALLARD. Now thats a tackle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I hope McNeil has such a stronge desire to play in Buffalo he refuses to sign with SD and takes a discount to play here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ishouldbegm Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I would be worried about Bradford, would rather have Max Hall from BYU, or Tony Pike. We need a tough cold weather QB for once. Plus they both seem more NFL ready. brees had surgery on his throwing shoulder and the phins stayed away, lets not make the same mistake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ishouldbegm Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I hope McNeil has such a stronge desire to play in Buffalo he refuses to sign with SD and takes a discount to play here. there are some solid cheap options Jermon Bushrod Jared Gaither Jeremy Trueblood i dont want to draft a lt tho...there are alot of good teams without great lts if bradford is there when we pick you take him if he isnt you take a dominant dt, preferably cody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurlyBurly51 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 My guess is that Bell was actually graded out very well by the coaches from yesterday's game. I re-watched every single offensive snap again on DVR, specifically focusing only on Bell. He made 3 mistakes. The rest of the snaps he seemed to be doing his job. Not perfect, but not too bad for his 6th NFL start. Some are already running him out of town, but I say please watch and evaluate an entire game performance. He was far from the problem on the OL yesterday. Some who are infatuated with the interior may want to take a closer look there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 It depends on who's available. If Claussen is on the board when we pick rd 1 it seems like a no brainer. In the 2nd round in this scenario I'm looking at Corey Wootton the DE from Northwestern. Then if need be trading back up into the 2nd to grab Jason Fox the OT from miami. Or conversely go best DT available rd 1 whether its Suh,McCoy,or Cody. Rd 2 grabbing a guy like Fox once again,and then Rd 3 Max Hall QB BYU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharper802 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Biggest need is OLB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Biggest need is OLB The FA LB class is deep potentially deep this year. You have guys like D'Meco Ryans'Karlos Dansby,Thomas Howard and Thomas Jones who could all potentially be FA's this year. So IMO it's not really something we need to worry about to much in the draft which is why I didnt really adress it in my scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Sign Noodlearm Pennington to a 2 year contract Draft: RD 1: OT Charles Brown, USC RD 2: OT Ciron Black, LSU RD 3: QB Dan LeFevour, Central Michigan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLflutie7 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I think the Bills need to sign a QB who has a stronger arm. Edwards can't make all the throws. I think Tyler Thigpen is the best choice of any QB in the NFL right now, but it's too late to trade for him. Maybe this offseason, trade with Miami. If Jake Delhomme falls out of favor in Carolina, I'd give him a look. His repaired elbow seems to have given him some problems (he's lost some accuracy) but I still think he's got some milelage left and he's been to the Superbowl and several playoffs. His TD to Int ratio is pretty good over the length of his career and he loves the game and he'll play on any team in the NFL. In the short term, Jeff George wouldn't be a bad option. Although he lacks some arm strength, Jeff Garcia would also be a good choice. He's a gamer. Andrew Walter could be had off the street and he's got great physical prowess to throw a ball. He's only started like 12-16 games and there's plenty of upside. Barring all the above, I think it's time to look to the draft an keep an eye on the UFL, CFL etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Sign Noodlearm Pennington to a 2 year contract Draft: RD 1: OT Charles Brown, USC RD 2: OT Ciron Black, LSU RD 3: QB Dan LeFevour, Central Michigan In this situation how do you plan on adressing our needs along the D line,and the LB corp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 In this situation how do you plan on adressing our needs along the D line,and the LB corp? The title of this thread is: I would like folks opinion on how we fix LT and QB So this situation only addresses those positions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 The title of this thread is: I would like folks opinion on how we fix LT and QB So this situation only addresses those positions Unfortunately though we have about 4 equally pressing needs so my question to you personally was how would you adress them if we drafted 2 OT's and a QB with our first 3 picks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Unfortunately though we have about 4 equally pressing needs so my question to you personally was how would you adress them if we drafted 2 OT's and a QB with our first 3 picks? I agree we have many pressing needs. But again I refer you back to the thread title: I would like folks opinion on how we fix LT and QB Now I did go overboard with 2 OTs. But that would solve both the LT and RT problem Do I think the Bills should go with that draft scenario? No, like you said this team has more problems than T and QB. I was just answering the question posed in the thread title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Hahaha yea I got the title of the thread. I was just wondering out of idle curiosity as to how you would adress our other needs n this hypothetical situation. (Even though I'm not totally sold on LeFevour as a QB prospect myself.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
playman Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 send a 4th to the browns 4 quinn. lock bell in the gym. sign cowher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Cale, Right now I am concerned about his natural strength and lack of agression. I just dont see Bell attacking DEs and trying to finish them.....he is trying to "Wall off" too much" a lot of that has to do with the fact that he is more of an "athlete" then a "football player" at this point. But the tools are there. Yeah, John, thanks for articulating what I was trying to say. I think that LT position is not a finesse position. It's an attitude position. Right now the gym can fix his strength. I'm concerned that even coaching won't be able to fix his lack of "aggression." Which is why Peters was so great there. He was that way as a "tight end" ! Dumb as a box of rocks - but you weren't getting past him. Bell to me doesn't (perhaps "yet") have "it." C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 I would like to see the bills trade for Rogers to fill the DT void..... I think that Rogers and Stroud next to each other would fix any interior running problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 I would like to see the bills trade for Rogers to fill the DT void..... I think that Rogers and Stroud next to each other would fix any interior running problems I honestly think that our run defense problem is more a matter of lack of talent at LB and scheme. Stroud, Williams, Schobel, Kelsay are all strong against the run. I wouldn't mind though going 3-4, so long as Williams and Stroud could play ends in such a scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 There's nothing wrong with Bell that a little more functional strength and a little better technique wouldn't cure- of course him getting either of those things with the Bills are a big if- I remember a couple years ago when I was happy because Duke Prestion put on about 20 pounds then I saw him and it was twenty pounds of fat- I would really like to see where our players come in weight/body fat wise and where they are 1,2,3, years out- strength, speed, endurance, lean body mass are all measurable and the strength conditioning staff should be held accountable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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