Whitner arrested in Cleveland

[Lurker]

At exclusive establishments where celebrities and athletes hang out, it's not uncommon for them to have off-duty officers on security detail.

True. But in the heat of the moment, what obligation do they have to say 'I have a badge' as opposed to the typical nuckle dragger working security -- who without the tin is fair game, IMO, when push come to shove?.

[Kelly the Dog]

At exclusive establishments where celebrities and athletes hang out, it's not uncommon for them to have off-duty officers on security detail.

Very true. Although I don't know how "exclusive" one would call The House of Blues, unless the whole place was rented out for Ginn's birthday party and the general public wasn't allowed in.

 

That said, while I am not taking the cops or Whitner's side on this, professional football players who are used to violence do not take kindly to anyone grabbing them forcefully. Hell, any 23 year old doesn't. It could easily have been that Whitner was a punk and should never have been doing that. It could just as easily have been an off duty cop bear hugging him from behind and not allowing him to get to his friends who were in a fight and Whitner going ballistic because he was being manhandled. Chances are he didn't know it was a cop if the guy was off duty and just being a security guy.

 

A lot has to come out before we know whether he was stupid or REALLY stupid, aka criminally stupid.

[Williams+Williams+Williams]

Whitner will get 2 game suspension. Trade Whitner, Youboty, Peters and Juaron for coach Cowart

 

 

To who? ESPN?

[VOR]

Whitner's gonna sue

[VOR]

Not so fast.

 

http://www.buffalonews.com/home/story/636833.html

BFD. Given that the Commish doesn't care about domestic abuse or DUI's, disorderly conduct and resisting arrest should be child's play to him. Unless the rules are different for Bills players.

[Williams+Williams+Williams]

True. But in the heat of the moment, what obligation do they have to say 'I have a badge' as opposed to the typical nuckle dragger working security -- who without the tin is fair game, IMO, when push come to shove?.

 

 

Plain clothes is fair game. If someone in plain clothes at a bar tried to put me in a half-nelson, I would yoke them up. What do you think an NFL caliber athelete is going to do? We aren't talking about pencil-necked nerds that an off duty cop can scold into submission.

[markj]

It's not as though I assume NFL players are thugs. I assumed Whitner was a guy I wouldn't hear about in this way due to his leadership role on the team. Guys like that generally aren't assuming fighting stances at 3:00 AM. I'm surprised by this.

Don't taze me bro

[Steely Dan]

Here's more.

 

It was unclear why Whitner tried to leave the club and head for the melee, though he told officers, "My cousin's out there, and they've got guns," according to a police report, Stacho said.

 

That's a lot different than what has previously been mentioned.

[bisonbrigade]

Buffalo Bengals

[The Rev.Mattb74 ESQ.]

99.9%?

 

that's total pollyanna bull sh--. police work is thankless, low paying, and not very selective. you don't get graduates from top schools becoming cops. you don't get the best and brightest doing it. it doesn't pay much. it is shtty shtty work. as a cop you have to enforce plenty of stupid laws that exist as a cash grab (traffic tickets, parking crap) and victimless crimes (drugs, alcohol, prostitution).

 

do you really think that 99.9% of people who have that job are just saints? that's the only people who would do it without wanting to go on power trips, be crooked, or are action junkies. further more do you think that after a few years rolling in the much of the underclass of society a cop won't get jaded and angry?

 

sure there are good cops, but cops are selected from an above average or elite cut of society, and they don't exactly associate with the best and the brightest, so why do so many people assume that cops are better than average?

I am a member of law enforcement. They are very selective-the background check is hell, uncomfortable and usually takes 6 months to complete, and while the job wont make you rich 100 grand a year if you are willing to take overtime is very possible. Hell State Troopers start at 90 grand a year. While you wont find anyone who attended Harvard almost all hires in the past 6-8 years have atleast a two year degree.While it often can be crappy work environment a certain pride goes with it. I stand by my comment of 99.9 percent of cops being good. No they arent all saints, but they dont take advantage of their authority. Are there bad cops yes but it is a very low percentage.

[The Rev.Mattb74 ESQ.]

It's interesting that there were so many off duty officers involved in this 'melee,' including the guy who tasered Whitner. I wonder how many of them made it know they were sworn officers, as opposed to run of the mill bar security?

Alot of peace/police officers work security for bars/clubs and concerts. It is one of the perks, always a part time job.

[Booster4324]

I am a member of law enforcement. They are very selective-the background check is hell, uncomfortable and usually takes 6 months to complete, and while the job wont make you rich 100 grand a year if you are willing to take overtime is very possible. Hell State Troopers start at 90 grand a year. While you wont find anyone who attended Harvard almost all hires in the past 6-8 years have atleast a two year degree.While it often can be crappy work environment a certain pride goes with it. I stand by my comment of 99.9 percent of cops being good. No they arent all saints, but they dont take advantage of their authority. Are there bad cops yes but it is a very low percentage.

 

 

Odd, but regional difference may make a difference. I would say it was something like 60/70% good (factoring in general incompetence and corruption) cops in the Memphis/North MS area.

[extrahammer]

It's pointless for Whitner to sue. Cops will be lining up to testify against him. Not to mention a waste of money and time. Reward isn't that big. They would only compensate him with a win if he were somehow injured.

[Sig1Hunter]

Alot of peace/police officers work security for bars/clubs and concerts. It is one of the perks, always a part time job.

 

And usually in full uniform.

[generaLee83]

It's pointless for Whitner to sue. Cops will be lining up to testify against him. Not to mention a waste of money and time. Reward isn't that big. They would only compensate him with a win if he were somehow injured.

 

What I don't understand is how he allegedly threatened to sue when leaving jail but his official statement is apologetic and takes ownership over the event.

 

Which news source is correct?

[Lurker]

Alot of peace/police officers work security for bars/clubs and concerts. It is one of the perks, always a part time job.

Do they work in full uniform, or (in the case of bars) are they plain clothes? I'm interested in knowing how the public (in this case, Whitner, but it applies to anyone) is supposed to know a security guy is a sworn officer, and hence an 'untouchable,' if the guy doesn't happen to be in uniform.

[colin]

You sound pretty ignorant. Believe it or not having a degree from a "top university" is not a requirement for being a good person. Their are also lots of people in this country who are quite intelligent, who make less than what a cop makes. You act as though, only the best get to go to college. Talk about a warped sense of reality. I bet you think the military is only made up of mongoloids and losers of society. Why do some people associate intelligence and values, with degrees and paychecks? A cops job is to serve and protect. I'm sorry you think drug trafficking and prostitution are stupid. The main reason why being a cop is tough, is because people like you are constantly putting them down. What other low paying professions are made up of losers? What is the salary cutoff, where the average employee is intelligent? How much do I need to make, to know that my average co-worker isn't a scumbag? You know their are more people in this country who do shtty work, than not.

 

i am far from ignorant.

 

to explain simple logic and the english language to you: i didn't say one has to have a degree from a good school or make a large amount of money to be smart, but CLEARLY given a large group of people in a profession (like say police work) not attracting top graduates from top schools or paying high salaries will result in not employing the best qualified and ambitious people in large numbers. if you offer people a bad wage for hard work dealing with the bottom of society you will eliminate the vast majority of good candidates.

 

you just can't get over your homoerotic hero worship of men in uniform. cops are just people who have a particular job. so are soldiers. they aren't righteous or better than anyone just because they do a job that (when done right) is an important part of civil society, and they are likely to succumb to all the usual sins and temptations, and those are particularly likely to affect police who have to make difficult decisions in high risk situations.

 

these people are simply not the best and brightest. we live in a capitalist society and money and status count in a very very big way. and no sht more people than not do bad work, most people are below average and don't put the effort in, or have the acumen to succeed.

 

just look at how fat uneducated and lazy the average person around you is. if you have people that can't learn a foreign language or even speak their native one correctly, do you really think they will succeed in high pressure situations and not cut corners and skimp on due diligence?

[colin]

I am a member of law enforcement. They are very selective-the background check is hell, uncomfortable and usually takes 6 months to complete, and while the job wont make you rich 100 grand a year if you are willing to take overtime is very possible. Hell State Troopers start at 90 grand a year. While you wont find anyone who attended Harvard almost all hires in the past 6-8 years have atleast a two year degree.While it often can be crappy work environment a certain pride goes with it. I stand by my comment of 99.9 percent of cops being good. No they arent all saints, but they dont take advantage of their authority. Are there bad cops yes but it is a very low percentage.

 

 

you are aware that in some cities the desire to find police recruits outstrips those willing to do the job so they actually do have new cops who have criminal histories, correct?

 

http://www.policeone.com/legal/articles/17...r-new-recruits/

 

this is happening in a large number of american cities.

 

police are unionized civil servants and have a bunker mentality against anyone trying to discipline them or regulate their behavior. cops may join with the best of intentions, but years of dealing with societies run off will bring out the worst in most people.

[cåblelady]

Odd, but regional difference may make a difference. I would say it was something like 60/70% good

That sounds about right to me. I still have a problem with officers of the law being allowed to lie when questioning people. Is that standard operating procedure?

[generaLee83]

That sounds about right to me. I still have a problem with officers of the law being allowed to lie when questioning people. Is that standard operating procedure?

 

No it certainly isn't the standard but I will tell you that it's been used time and time again to get murderers and child rapists to admit the horrific acts that they have committed.

[PushthePile]

i am far from ignorant.

 

to explain simple logic and the english language to you: i didn't say one has to have a degree from a good school or make a large amount of money to be smart, but CLEARLY given a large group of people in a profession (like say police work) not attracting top graduates from top schools or paying high salaries will result in not employing the best qualified and ambitious people in large numbers. if you offer people a bad wage for hard work dealing with the bottom of society you will eliminate the vast majority of good candidates.

 

you just can't get over your homoerotic hero worship of men in uniform. cops are just people who have a particular job. so are soldiers. they aren't righteous or better than anyone just because they do a job that (when done right) is an important part of civil society, and they are likely to succumb to all the usual sins and temptations, and those are particularly likely to affect police who have to make difficult decisions in high risk situations.

 

these people are simply not the best and brightest. we live in a capitalist society and money and status count in a very very big way. and no sht more people than not do bad work, most people are below average and don't put the effort in, or have the acumen to succeed.

 

just look at how fat uneducated and lazy the average person around you is. if you have people that can't learn a foreign language or even speak their native one correctly, do you really think they will succeed in high pressure situations and not cut corners and skimp on due diligence?

Actually, you are extremely ignorant. You sound like a privledged azzclown. Since, when does having a college degree make you a better canidate to be a police officer? Nobody has said that cops and military are smarter or have better morals than the average citizen. Your the only one implying that they are at a different level. In fact you claim these people aren't the "best and the brightest". Wake up moron. Every society has the haves and the have nots. If your a have not and can't go to what you call a top university it doesn't make you any stupider than the guy that can. I know plenty of idiots who have college degrees. I know plenty of bad people who have college degrees. Get over yourself.

 

Obviously you must be making the big bucks, or think you will someday, but most police departments pay well above the average income. If you work overtime and move up in the department, you will be pulling in over 100 K a year. I guess by Colin's silver spoon measures thats chump change. Only scumbags who have no other outs, would be forced into that position. What about the cops who have degrees? You only count the ones from your "top universities"? What percentage of society gets to go to top universities? I guess that means at least 90% percent of society have a better chance of being "not the brightest or the best". Then you sprinkle in the gem, about not speaking the native language. Is intelligence measured by the language you speak? Is your work ethic and morals downgraded because somebody doesn't speak like Colin? Oh, right your not ignorant.

 

You also agree that most people work bad jobs and are below the average in work ethic and effort. Most people are below the AVERAGE? Nice work college boy! Look, their are alot of intelligent, hardworking, and upstanding people who don't go to "top universities". Their are alot of good people who don't have degrees. Like I said before, your ignorant. The "top universities" are great schools, that are filled with mostly well to do students. This does not make them super citizens or better employees. Outside of what they have studied, of course. When you start getting into calling your average person stupid or lazy, you sound fairly egotistical. Why, even bring up your feelings on people who don't know other languages? I think theirs a little more to this story, than your opinion of cops. Now, run along back to the frat house, and get back to fellating the new pledges.

[The Rev.Mattb74 ESQ.]

Do they work in full uniform, or (in the case of bars) are they plain clothes? I'm interested in knowing how the public (in this case, Whitner, but it applies to anyone) is supposed to know a security guy is a sworn officer, and hence an 'untouchable,' if the guy doesn't happen to be in uniform.

It depends from department to department, and what the rules are. However a peace/police officer is that 24 hours a day. Now if your worried that as you say you are fighting with an untouchable, the general rule of thumb is dont get into a bar fight, and if you find yourself in that predictment listen to security at wherever you are at. Listen in my younger days I couldnt stand the 20 year old college kid at the bar wearing the yellow T-Shirt that says security on it while he is doing his best Hans and Franz impersonation either. To me he seems pompus and arrogant, however it is his terriotory and if you want to be there listen to him. If you want a rule of thumb, when peace/police work these things chances are they will not be striking up conversation with the young blonde in the tight shirt (he is most likely that 20 yo college student) he or she would be the one by themselves trying to get an overview of the room, and more aware of his/her surroundings. I am sure everyone here sees someone at a concert working security the guy with the piercings probably not a cop, the guy with the high and tight standing straight up saying "step this way sir" might be. The cop will generally use some sort of force as a last resort the other may be more inclined to use it right away. Listen whoever is putting on these events has hired people to keep you safe, not be your friend. Listen and be agreeable, and make any complaints after the fact. What sounds like the case with Whitner(I dont know for sure) would be a out and out melee at the club. At that point getting control of a situation is more of a urgent problem, while to Donte him and his cousin where the center of what was going on to security it was ending the problem. Whoever tazed him was not thinking to themselves hey thats Donte Whitner, but was thinking deal with this guy in a fighting stance and move onto the next in a fighting stance. I hope this was of some help to you.

[The Rev.Mattb74 ESQ.]

you are aware that in some cities the desire to find police recruits outstrips those willing to do the job so they actually do have new cops who have criminal histories, correct?

 

http://www.policeone.com/legal/articles/17...r-new-recruits/

 

this is happening in a large number of american cities.

 

police are unionized civil servants and have a bunker mentality against anyone trying to discipline them or regulate their behavior. cops may join with the best of intentions, but years of dealing with societies run off will bring out the worst in most people.

While I am aware that certain area in the country have budget problems( the magazine Police Beat usually has lots of jobs listed), as a general rule of thumb the first rule to go is hiring people outside the city or county(usually one has to live in a certain area before being hired to work there). Due to state minimum staffing requirements and mandating the are forced to fill vacancies. While in LA and other major cities I cant speak for, rest assured that many places do not drop these standards. Also many places pay for college classes for officers once hired so they can get up to your high standards of education, however since I have been employed(about 5 and a half years) I do not know of anyone with less then a two year degree from a community college(sure it is not princeton). Base pay starts at about 25 to 30 an hour, and getting overtime is very easy and it is not uncommon to get a low six figure income, well above the national average.

[Beerball]

What I don't understand is how he allegedly threatened to sue when leaving jail but his official statement is apologetic and takes ownership over the event.

 

Which news source is correct?

Both. Whitner's words...not so apologetic.

 

Whitner's agent's words...apologetic.

 

link

[Bill from NYC]

No it certainly isn't the standard but I will tell you that it's been used time and time again to get murderers and child rapists to admit the horrific acts that they have committed.

 

Are you serious? It is used every day, and I am talking about every single day. For example, a detective might tell a guy wanted in a domestic assault to dome in so he can sign out a complaint against his wife, and lock him up upon arrival. It is called good police work if it works, and it can save lives.

 

I never got the memo where wnted criminals are owed the absolute truth by police. Not aimed at you, but do people think that police should be charged with being completely honest to a guy who raped his 8 year old daughter?

[NobesBLO13]

You sound pretty ignorant. Believe it or not having a degree from a "top university" is not a requirement for being a good person. Their are also lots of people in this country who are quite intelligent, who make less than what a cop makes. You act as though, only the best get to go to college. Talk about a warped sense of reality. I bet you think the military is only made up of mongoloids and losers of society. Why do some people associate intelligence and values, with degrees and paychecks? A cops job is to serve and protect. I'm sorry you think drug trafficking and prostitution are stupid. The main reason why being a cop is tough, is because people like you are constantly putting them down. What other low paying professions are made up of losers? What is the salary cutoff, where the average employee is intelligent? How much do I need to make, to know that my average co-worker isn't a scumbag? You know their are more people in this country who do shtty work, than not.

Amen Bro

[Kelly the Dog]

Here is Donte at the police station being interviewed. It means nothing but he appears pretty confident about it.

 

http://www.woio.com/global/video/flash/pop...mp;rnd=66197116

[bills44]

He doesn't seem to be hung over or under the influence.

[Endzone Animal]

Yet another unnecessary case of police brutality against an African American, and the 3rd Buffalo Bill to be railroaded in one year. Seems the police just love abusing NFL players for no reason. This did not have to happen, but as long as society enjoys singling these guys out the more the police will continue to abuse them.

[colin]

Actually, you are extremely ignorant. You sound like a privledged azzclown. Since, when does having a college degree make you a better canidate to be a police officer? Nobody has said that cops and military are smarter or have better morals than the average citizen. Your the only one implying that they are at a different level. In fact you claim these people aren't the "best and the brightest". Wake up moron. Every society has the haves and the have nots. If your a have not and can't go to what you call a top university it doesn't make you any stupider than the guy that can. I know plenty of idiots who have college degrees. I know plenty of bad people who have college degrees. Get over yourself.

 

Obviously you must be making the big bucks, or think you will someday, but most police departments pay well above the average income. If you work overtime and move up in the department, you will be pulling in over 100 K a year. I guess by Colin's silver spoon measures thats chump change. Only scumbags who have no other outs, would be forced into that position. What about the cops who have degrees? You only count the ones from your "top universities"? What percentage of society gets to go to top universities? I guess that means at least 90% percent of society have a better chance of being "not the brightest or the best". Then you sprinkle in the gem, about not speaking the native language. Is intelligence measured by the language you speak? Is your work ethic and morals downgraded because somebody doesn't speak like Colin? Oh, right your not ignorant.

 

You also agree that most people work bad jobs and are below the average in work ethic and effort. Most people are below the AVERAGE? Nice work college boy! Look, their are alot of intelligent, hardworking, and upstanding people who don't go to "top universities". Their are alot of good people who don't have degrees. Like I said before, your ignorant. The "top universities" are great schools, that are filled with mostly well to do students. This does not make them super citizens or better employees. Outside of what they have studied, of course. When you start getting into calling your average person stupid or lazy, you sound fairly egotistical. Why, even bring up your feelings on people who don't know other languages? I think theirs a little more to this story, than your opinion of cops. Now, run along back to the frat house, and get back to fellating the new pledges.

 

it's my fault. i gave you way way too much credit, assuming you could apply thought and simple logic.

 

i'm sorry, i've done a horrible thing.

 

you don't even know the difference between your and you're, or they're and their. it's sad and i've been mean to you.

 

how many times in your life have you typed "your ignorant"? you have to crawl before you can man up to a slow stroll and understand the very simple things i've put in front of you.

 

i'm sorry for hurting you little boy. tell you mom i'll be by later with the cop uniform to swing the baton.

[Gordio]

Odd, but regional difference may make a difference. I would say it was something like 60/70% good (factoring in general incompetence and corruption) cops in the Memphis/North MS area.

 

 

The police officer's in buffalo & the surrounding suburbs make very good money. Like the previous poster said, could make $100K + with overtime. But your right, it seems especially down south that these are low paying high risk jobs. The less compensate the police officer's my guess is the more bad/corrupt cops you get.

[Bill from NYC]

it's my fault. i gave you way way too much credit, assuming you could apply thought and simple logic.

 

i'm sorry, i've done a horrible thing.

 

you don't even know the difference between your and you're, or they're and their. it's sad and i've been mean to you.

 

how many times in your life have you typed "your ignorant"? you have to crawl before you can man up to a slow stroll and understand the very simple things i've put in front of you.

 

i'm sorry for hurting you little boy. tell you mom i'll be by later with the cop uniform to swing the baton.

 

Please, say what you will to a poster, but there is absolutely no reason to make disparaging remarks about his family member.

[Mr. WEO]

Yet another unnecessary case of police brutality against an African American, and the 3rd Buffalo Bill to be railroaded in one year. Seems the police just love abusing NFL players for no reason. This did not have to happen, but as long as society enjoys singling these guys out the more the police will continue to abuse them.

 

Yeah, really--they should focus on getting the necessary cases of brutality up a little more. They waste too much time on all this unnecessary brutality.

[Bill from NYC]

yeah, someone to provide a surge up the middle

 

The more I think about it, the more I am re volt ed by his conduct.

[PushthePile]

it's my fault. i gave you way way too much credit, assuming you could apply thought and simple logic.

 

i'm sorry, i've done a horrible thing.

 

you don't even know the difference between your and you're, or they're and their. it's sad and i've been mean to you.

 

how many times in your life have you typed "your ignorant"? you have to crawl before you can man up to a slow stroll and understand the very simple things i've put in front of you.

 

i'm sorry for hurting you little boy. tell you mom i'll be by later with the cop uniform to swing the baton.

I'll take this as your white flag. Your response offers nothing more than bad putdowns and critique of my grammar. Thanks for submitting so easily.