taterhill Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Bring Back the Yugo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Bring Back the Yugo Or this one!! http://allworldcars.com/wordpress/wp-conte...et-chevette.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 I want to see them in soup lines, then I will buy you argument. Show me the pain and I will feel sorry and help out. Are you really that dense? (Why am I even asking) Most of the jobs lost on Wall Street have not been by the highflyers, but by the support staff, secretaries and back office people. Way to only consider the unfortunate ones who command the kind-hearted press attention by lazy journalists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endzone Animal Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Yes, again. Blame the union. The unions cost the Big Three over $70/man hour, while Toyota and Honda employees cost $49/man hour. Greed is never good, whether it's the employee or the employer who's guilty of the vice. We need to stop calling this a bail out. It's a loan. No, a loan is contingent on the recipient demonstrating they have good credit, good debt-to-income ratios, and have a business model that convinces the lender that they will not default. In this case, none of the minimum criteria for a loan has been met. It is a bailout. And I think it's sad that republicans are so willing to break the unions that they will let this fail. Just goes to show that their states aren't effected as much. No, it shows that they understand the reason our country is in such bad shape right now is our lending institutions made a habit of giving out trillions of dollars in unsecured loans to those who had bad credit or no credit at all. To extend this bad policy to the unions would be fiscally irresponsible and have a devastating impact on our economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVUFootball29 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Teachers on Long Island earn $120,000 to work 7 or 8 months per year. Do you think that their paid 3 month summer vacation is "fair?" How about the week or more for Christmas, Easter, and the "Winter Recess," along with every holiday known to mankind? It seems that you merely choose to sympathize with a different set of featherbedders. Bill I think you are a bit misguided here, http://www.suffolkcountyny.gov/police/new/recruitment.htm http://www.police.nassaucountyny.gov/recruitment.htm These are the advertised rates on long island for police officers, on both pages they state salaries do not include overtime and other fringe benefits. Both average in the 90k range after 5 years not bad for a job you don't need much more education than 60 hours of undergrad which is cheap. Now lets look at the teachers who have to have at least a bachelors to start and a masters degree by their 5th year on the job: Their average salaries according to the school district are between 66-75k per year with an average tenure of 10-12 years in Nassau and Suffolk counties http://www.longislandschools.com/ I don't know, maybe I'm reading the numbers wrong but it doesn't look like the police are getting a lot less money... Oh before you guys call me a cop hater too, please remember I still do work as a police officer on the side here in WNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Are you really that dense? (Why am I even asking) Most of the jobs lost on Wall Street have not been by the highflyers, but by the support staff, secretaries and back office people. Way to only consider the unfortunate ones who command the kind-hearted press attention by lazy journalists. Yes. Sorry... I want to see the highflyers jump out of their high-risers... Have them lose their jobs and put in new highflyers... Somebody will step up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Again... I posted it several times... Can't we all learn from the parable of the vineyard workers. ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyT Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Again... I posted it several times... Can't we all learn from the parable of the vineyard workers. ?? From the parable..."Isn’t it lawful for me to do what I want to with what I own?" Answer: Of course (until you run out of money). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 From the parable..."Isn’t it lawful for me to do what I want to with what I own?" Answer: Of course (until you run out of money). The gov't doesn't seem to be short 15 million. Heck, skim it off the 700 billion. I am not sure what to say... But I am more apt to say what the heck and give the 15 million a whirl and see what happens... Heck, it can't be any more wasteful then firing bullets in Iraq... And if things don't work, you can all tell me: "I told you so." "Plese sir, may I have another... A crumb please." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 The gov't doesn't seem to be short 15 million. Heck, skim it off the 700 billion. I am not sure what to say... But I am more apt to say what the heck and give the 15 million a whirl and see what happens... Heck, it can't be any more wasteful then firing bullets in Iraq... And if things don't work, you can all tell me: "I told you so." "Plese sir, may I have another... A crumb please." The problem with the 15 billion is that it removes the incentive to change NOW. The longer GM and Chrysler dick around with changing (like cutting 50% of their dealerships), the less likely they will get a buying customer. Who wants to buy a car from a company that's going out of business? By doling out money in a small amount and making it harder to get, they will rush to change. Of course, a nice solution is a fast bankruptcy but that could end it all for the bankrupt company. No one will buy a car from a bankrupt company unless it shows signs that it can turn around and I don't think any American has faith in GM or Chrysler at this point...which is EXACTLY why we shouldn't give them money. I am against any long-term bailout. Giving them more than will get them through about February would be a crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 I want to see them in soup lines, then I will buy you argument. Show me the pain and I will feel sorry and help out. And they let you have a vote...at least there is an explanation for the sorry state this country is in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 And they let you have a vote...at least there is an explanation for the sorry state this country is in. Hey... You guys can begrudge... Why can't I? I am just trying to be like everybody else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 My post compared LI teachers and NYC cops. Master's degree? That is nice, but they don't stop bullets. Teachers should be working the summers to sharpen their skills. Or, do you think that 4 mos. & per year paid vacation is fair? Bill I think you are a bit misguided here, http://www.suffolkcountyny.gov/police/new/recruitment.htm http://www.police.nassaucountyny.gov/recruitment.htm These are the advertised rates on long island for police officers, on both pages they state salaries do not include overtime and other fringe benefits. Both average in the 90k range after 5 years not bad for a job you don't need much more education than 60 hours of undergrad which is cheap. Now lets look at the teachers who have to have at least a bachelors to start and a masters degree by their 5th year on the job: Their average salaries according to the school district are between 66-75k per year with an average tenure of 10-12 years in Nassau and Suffolk counties http://www.longislandschools.com/ I don't know, maybe I'm reading the numbers wrong but it doesn't look like the police are getting a lot less money... Oh before you guys call me a cop hater too, please remember I still do work as a police officer on the side here in WNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 My post compared LI teachers and NYC cops. Master's degree? That is nice, but they don't stop bullets. Teachers should be working the summers to sharpen their skills. Or, do you think that 4 mos. & per year paid vacation is fair? No offense, but the "vacation" you speak of is built in to their salary structure. I assure you that if they worked the traditional 12 months of the year they would be compensated for that additional time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tux of Borg Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Bill I think you are a bit misguided here, http://www.suffolkcountyny.gov/police/new/recruitment.htm http://www.police.nassaucountyny.gov/recruitment.htm These are the advertised rates on long island for police officers, on both pages they state salaries do not include overtime and other fringe benefits. Both average in the 90k range after 5 years not bad for a job you don't need much more education than 60 hours of undergrad which is cheap. Now lets look at the teachers who have to have at least a bachelors to start and a masters degree by their 5th year on the job: Their average salaries according to the school district are between 66-75k per year with an average tenure of 10-12 years in Nassau and Suffolk counties http://www.longislandschools.com/ I don't know, maybe I'm reading the numbers wrong but it doesn't look like the police are getting a lot less money... Oh before you guys call me a cop hater too, please remember I still do work as a police officer on the side here in WNY I wish i made $90,000 a year in Law Enforcement. Then again, we aren't unionized and don't have to deal with the problems caused by them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kegtapr Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 I wish i made $90,000 a year in Law Enforcement. Then again, we aren't unionized and don't have to deal with the problems caused by them. Like having to turn in all the drogas or not beating minorities? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 The UAW has already offered and ratified changes in their contract that will reduce pension plans, health care (retiree health care taken on by the UAW) and hourly wages (effective 2010). So for people to say greedy is ridiculous. They have done a ton to help the companies out. Hell just restructuring retiree health care saves billions. they dont have til 2010 though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 The problem with the 15 billion is that it removes the incentive to change NOW. The longer GM and Chrysler dick around with changing (like cutting 50% of their dealerships), the less likely they will get a buying customer. Who wants to buy a car from a company that's going out of business? By doling out money in a small amount and making it harder to get, they will rush to change. Of course, a nice solution is a fast bankruptcy but that could end it all for the bankrupt company. No one will buy a car from a bankrupt company unless it shows signs that it can turn around and I don't think any American has faith in GM or Chrysler at this point...which is EXACTLY why we shouldn't give them money. I am against any long-term bailout. Giving them more than will get them through about February would be a crime. people will be MORE likely to buy from a bankrupt car co because then they know the co can be viable in the future due to contract restructuring etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 So as I understand, the difference between UAW workers wage scale ($71/hr) and the non-union foreign workers here in the US ($49) is basically in benefits. Their actual "pay" is comparable. So if the insistence is the UAW drop the bennies, how about if our millions of civil servants do the same thing to level the playing field. God knows we could all use the tax relief. Or use that savings to bail-out even more businesses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEEDFREDJACKSONNOW Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Still here? Still failing to understand the difference between bankruptcy and liquidation? And of course, still refusing to answer the question ACor, me and others have been asking: Why do UAW workers deserve to earn $5 more per hour than non-UAW workers? What skills or qualifications do they have to justify the premium for their services? Have time for some research? http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/#28184396 The numbers given are bullc#$p. There are other factors involved in the misleading "wage discrepancy": http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/10/business...onhardt.html?em http://www.forbes.com/home/2008/12/04/detr..._1205union.html The inquity between the banker's bailout and the auto loan is enraging: http://washingtonindependent.com/19884/fra...come-inequality http://washingtonindependent.com/21380/aut...ase-for-bailout No one here has implicated the policies of the current administration as enabling bad business practices of the domestic auto companies. There have been huge tax credits for buying large SUVs for business purposes promoted by Bush's economic team. Since this administration laughed at the idea of improving fuel standards (which the Big 3 foolishly advocated against any increases in the CAFE standards). Why build economical cars here (even though they have been successful in Europe) when I can tell my workers to buy trucks with huge profit margins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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