How Good was Diggs Really?

[Ethan in Cleveland]

44 minutes ago, ganesh said:

This is an insnae take.  Please check his stats in the playoffs...He did not have a single dominating game and disappeared during many parts of the game...May be if he was able to raise his game, we win all those games without 13 seconds mattering!

Stefon Diggs in 9 playoff games with the Bills had 47 (5.1/game) receptions for 600(66.7/game) yards and 2 TD. 

Andre Reed in 21 playoff games had 85(4.2/game) receptions for 1229 yards (58/game) and 3 TDs

 

So Diggs per playoff game stats are better in every category than the most productive WR in Bills history. Please go ahead and spin your narrative (different era, 80's teams had other options, Kelly not as good as Allen etc etc etc) to contradict my facts.

 

I have too much to do but I'm going to guess most great WRs have lesser stats in the playoffs when they are playing the best teams.

 

So yeah Diggs was absolutely amazing!  His tenure with the Bills is the best 3 seasons of WR play in franchise history. You can hate his personality but please do not diminish what he did on the field. 

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, ganesh said:

This is an insnae take.  Please check his stats in the playoffs...He did not have a single dominating game and disappeared during many parts of the game...May be if he was able to raise his game, we win all those games without 13 seconds mattering!

Not really arguing with this, but one thing that doesn't show up in the stat sheet was the insane two-point conversion catch he made to put the Bills up 29-26 in the 13 seconds game. Totally broken play and he just ad libbed his way to a circus catch. 

3 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Stefon Diggs in 9 playoff games with the Bills had 47 (5.1/game) receptions for 600(66.7/game) yards and 2 TD. 

Andre Reed in 21 playoff games had 85(4.2/game) receptions for 1229 yards (58/game) and 3 TDs

 

So Diggs per playoff game stats are better in every category than the most productive WR in Bills history. Please go ahead and spin your narrative (different era, 80's teams had other options, Kelly not as good as Allen etc etc etc) to contradict my facts.

 

I have too much to do but I'm going to guess most great WRs have lesser stats in the playoffs when they are playing the best teams.

 

So yeah Diggs was absolutely amazing!  His tenure with the Bills is the best 3 seasons of WR play in franchise history. You can hate his personality but please do not diminish what he did on the field. 

Good take, and with regard to the topic of "playoff Diggs", not mentioning the Minnesota Miracle is bad arguing. Sure, it wasn't the Bills, but it was an amazing play and totally clutch. 

Edited August 19 by dave mcbride

[GoBills808]

3 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Stefon Diggs in 9 playoff games with the Bills had 47 (5.1/game) receptions for 600(66.7/game) yards and 2 TD. 

Andre Reed in 21 playoff games had 85(4.2/game) receptions for 1229 yards (58/game) and 3 TDs

 

So Diggs per playoff game stats are better in every category than the most productive WR in Bills history. Please go ahead and spin your narrative (different era, 80's teams had other options, Kelly not as good as Allen etc etc etc) to contradict my facts.

 

I have too much to do but I'm going to guess most great WRs have lesser stats in the playoffs when they are playing the best teams.

 

So yeah Diggs was absolutely amazing!  His tenure with the Bills is the best 3 seasons of WR play in franchise history. You can hate his personality but please do not diminish what he did on the field. 

Gabe Davis averaged more ypg in the playoffs than diggs

[RoscoeParrish]

7 hours ago, Billl said:

He was the most important teammate of Josh’s career and helped push him from a player with immense talent into a perennial MVP candidate.  With the Bills, he was consistently a top 10 WR bordering on top 5 every year.  Don’t think he was ever a truly elite player, though.  His name will come up every year in HOF voting discussions, but I don’t see him getting in.  As 808 mentioned, there are just too many WRs in his era that had better overall careers than he did.  He’s also not going to have a fan base that is really pushing for him to get in.

He probably isn’t a HoF player.

 

when I say elite, I mean top 5 at your position. Diggs was top 5 for most of his time in Buffalo. But he was only here for 4 years, and not elite for all of them.

 

But he was elite here for a large part. I don’t consider him an all time great or HoF player and the acrimonious way it ended makes him not a Wall of Fame player either.

5 hours ago, Fleezoid said:

 

I agree with this. But I'd like to add one caveat......Allen is still great without Diggs, I don't think Diggs will be great without Allen. Good, just not great. 

Diggs is now past 30 and coming off an ACL. I think that’s harmed his ability to be elite far more than not playing with Allen anymore.

[Capco]

6 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Unfortunately, Moulds didn’t have a QB in the same stratosphere as Allen. I am 1000% positive he would’ve been a HOFer if he did. It’s just my preference for WRs. Always liked the big body TO, Moulds, Anquan Boldin types. 

Overall, Moulds was probably the most physically gifted WR that I've ever seen on the Bills.  Someone used the word "complete" earlier and that definitely comes to mind with guys like him.  

If I hear scouts or analysts say "a guy that big shouldn't be that fast", then those are my kinds of players regardless of position.  Not every guy with a rare combination of size and speed will put it together and dominate on the field... but the ones that do always become a kind of next-level dominant.  

[Ethan in Cleveland]

29 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Gabe Davis averaged more ypg in the playoffs than diggs

James Lofton YPG and TD/game was better than Reed's too. 8 TDs in only 9 Bills playoff games. 

Belichick specifically designed a defense to take away Reed. Probably lots of playoff defenses target the #1 WR. 

Doesn't mean Lofton was better than Reed or Davis was a better WR than Diggs. If anything it means Kelly and Allen were mostly ( Allen >>>> Kelly) willing to take what the defense was giving. 

 

1 minute ago, Capco said:

Overall, Moulds was probably the most physically gifted WR that I've ever seen on the Bills.  Someone used the word "complete" earlier and that definitely comes to mind with guys like him.  

If I hear scouts or analysts say "a guy that big shouldn't be that fast", then those are my kinds of players regardless of position.  Not every guy with a rare combination of size and speed will put it together and dominate on the field... but the ones that do always become a kind of next-level dominant.  

100% agree with this. If Moulds had Kelly or Allen for most of his career he would have been compared with TO. Both with great size and speed. 

 

In terms of WR skill, it is Moulds, Diggs, Reed, Lofton, Butler in that order for me. Obviously that is not production but if you asked who are the most skilled WRs to play on Bills. Im leaving TO off as he was only here a short time at end of career.

[GoBills808]

47 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

James Lofton YPG and TD/game was better than Reed's too. 8 TDs in only 9 Bills playoff games. 

Belichick specifically designed a defense to take away Reed. Probably lots of playoff defenses target the #1 WR. 

Doesn't mean Lofton was better than Reed or Davis was a better WR than Diggs. If anything it means Kelly and Allen were mostly ( Allen >>>> Kelly) willing to take what the defense was giving. 

 

100% agree with this. If Moulds had Kelly or Allen for most of his career he would have been compared with TO. Both with great size and speed. 

 

In terms of WR skill, it is Moulds, Diggs, Reed, Lofton, Butler in that order for me. Obviously that is not production but if you asked who are the most skilled WRs to play on Bills. Im leaving TO off as he was only here a short time at end of career.

Oh I agree

Just that playoff ypg isn't a reliable indicator of quality necessarily 

[Utah John]

Diggs alone, or Allen alone a few years ago, neither all that great.

 

Peanut butter and chocolate, same thing.  There's nothing like Reese's.  But after a while you realize chocolate is great all by itself.

[thewookie1]

A #1 receiver who was a Top 5 receiver while here and is still a solid receiver elsewhere. His biggest problem is with his ego and how it effectively killed his career with the Bills. 
 

Diggs wanted to say he created Allen when he was more akin to a “mentor” and fellow beneficiary for Allen. Allen blew up in part due to his talents added to Cole Beasley’s consistency. Allen then lifted all boats from there as he gained confidence in himself and his teammates being capable of great things. But unlike Allen, Diggs didn’t see it as a symbiotic relationship but as a crutch that would collapse without him. You even see him sort of realize that he was wrong after his injury and watching Allen again and his MVP campaign. 

Edited August 19 by thewookie1

[GoBills808]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Not really arguing with this, but one thing that doesn't show up in the stat sheet was the insane two-point conversion catch he made to put the Bills up 29-26 in the 13 seconds game. Totally broken play and he just ad libbed his way to a circus catch. 

Good take, and with regard to the topic of "playoff Diggs", not mentioning the Minnesota Miracle is bad arguing. Sure, it wasn't the Bills, but it was an amazing play and totally clutch. 

maybe im prejudiced because i can't stand diggs

 

but imo both those plays were more about players other than the wr...i mean allen made a throw on that 2pt play that zero other qbs make and the miracle in minneapolis miracle was the safety miraculously missing the tackle on diggs and simultaneously taking out the corner which allowed the td. i mean it was a memorable play but hardly amazing or clutch

[GASabresIUFan]

I hate to throw gas on the fire, but would the Bills have been better off keeping the pick and drafting Jefferson?

[BillsFanForever19]

10 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Unfortunately, Moulds didn’t have a QB in the same stratosphere as Allen. I am 1000% positive he would’ve been a HOFer if he did. It’s just my preference for WRs. Always liked the big body TO, Moulds, Anquan Boldin types. 
 

I am not a fan of Diggs disappearing in the playoffs and his attitude. Hes not likable at all. And talent-wise, I don’t think he’s quite as good as Moulds either. Statistically, they are almost even. Diggs only having 500 or so more total receiving yards so that’s not really an argument. 

 

Averaging 500 or so yards and 4 TD's more a year isn't really an argument? Like... what? That's a MASSIVE difference in annual production. On top of that Diggs' top years in production in Buffalo when it comes to yardage and TD's eclipses that of Moulds.

 

The argument about him disappearing in the Playoffs to me is dismissing the fact that the game plan in big Playoff games was to go to the guys who weren't facing the heavy coverage. Many of those games he was flat out used as a decoy. Why do you think he lost it in the Cincinnati game? Why do you think Gabe Davis had the game he had in Kansas City? Should he have come down with the ball against KC at the end of the game? Absolutely. But the "disappearing act" everyone likes to point to was largely scheme. They wouldn't even look in his direction bc of the rolling coverage and McDermott being too conservative in big games and it was infuriating to me.

 

I get not liking the guy. How he handled business. How things ended. His general Diva attitude. But to say Moulds was a better WR is just factually false. Stefon Diggs as a player will be remembered by fans of the NFL way more than Eric Moulds and no one but the most homer of Bills fans with an axe to grind would even try and make this argument.

Edited August 19 by BillsFanForever19

[RoscoeParrish]

17 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Averaging 500 or so yards and 4 TD's more a year isn't really an argument? Like... what? That's a MASSIVE difference in annual production. On top of that Diggs' top years in production in Buffalo when it comes to yardage and TD's eclipses that of Moulds.

 

The argument about him disappearing in the Playoffs to me is dismissing the fact that the game plan in big Playoff games was to go to the guys who weren't facing the heavy coverage. Many of those games he was flat out used as a decoy. Why do you think he lost it in the Cincinnati game? Why do you think Gabe Davis had the game he had in Kansas City? Should he have come down with the ball against KC at the end of the game? Absolutely. But the "disappearing act" everyone likes to point to was largely scheme. They wouldn't even look in his direction bc of the rolling coverage and McDermott being too conservative in big games and it was infuriating to me.

 

I get not liking the guy. How he handled business. How things ended. His general Diva attitude. But to say Moulds was a better WR is just factually false. Stefon Diggs as a player will be remembered by fans of the NFL way more than Eric Moulds and no one but the most homer of Bills fans with an axe to grind would even try and make this argument.

I’m not sure this is all true

 

My recollection of Diggs towards the end in 2023 was that they just put Sneed on him and erased him.

 

Back in the day, the gameplan used to be to put CB2 on WR1 with help and then leave CB1 on an island for WR2 IIRC.

 

Thats valuable if your QB and WR2 can make CB1 pay. 

[Buffalo Boy]

I feel he quietly got better 

[bigduke6]

46 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:

I hate to throw gas on the fire, but would the Bills have been better off keeping the pick and drafting Jefferson?

hard to say.  too many moving parts in the NFL.  

[BillsFanForever19]

6 minutes ago, RoscoeParrish said:

I’m not sure this is all true

 

My recollection of Diggs towards the end in 2023 was that they just put Sneed on him and erased him.

 

Back in the day, the gameplan used to be to put CB2 on WR1 with help and then leave CB1 on an island for WR2 IIRC.

 

Thats valuable if your QB and WR2 can make CB1 pay. 

 

That may be true of his last game with us. I'm not defending that game and him dropping the ball there at the end. There's no question there was a fall off in his play and/or disconnect with the team at that point. And again, that was inexcusable.

 

But the narrative of his Playoff "disappearing act" and my discussion of scheme is about much more than that game.

[RunTheBall]

4 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Stefon Diggs in 9 playoff games with the Bills had 47 (5.1/game) receptions for 600(66.7/game) yards and 2 TD. 

Andre Reed in 21 playoff games had 85(4.2/game) receptions for 1229 yards (58/game) and 3 TDs

 

So Diggs per playoff game stats are better in every category than the most productive WR in Bills history. Please go ahead and spin your narrative (different era, 80's teams had other options, Kelly not as good as Allen etc etc etc) to contradict my facts.

 

I have too much to do but I'm going to guess most great WRs have lesser stats in the playoffs when they are playing the best teams.

 

So yeah Diggs was absolutely amazing!  His tenure with the Bills is the best 3 seasons of WR play in franchise history. You can hate his personality but please do not diminish what he did on the field. 

Andre Reed is a Hall of Fame Wr. Diggs won’t sniff the Hall of Fame. So while your stats are nice, and you put he disclaimer of “different era of football” (which it was, and he had to share the targets with a HOF RB in Thurman) Diggs couldn’t sniff the jock of Andre. 

 

 

Edited August 19 by RunTheBall

[Flip Johnson]

20 hours ago, Kaenon said:

 

With Allen: 

5,319 total rec. yards

80.6 rec ypg 

0.56 TD per game 

 

Without Allen: 

4,623 total rec. yards 

59 rec ypg

0.42  TD per game

 

🤔

 

How good was Diggs?

 

This is a wild conversation. He was easily the best WR in Bills history over a 4yr stretch.  

[Bob in STL]

He was one of the best in the league when it was critical that Allen have someone very good.   He had a great run in Buffalo for awhile, but he decided to morph from a team leader to an awful pain in the locker room.   

 

He certainly is not  NFL HoF level considering all the great WRs in the league.   

 

He is probably not Bills Wall of Fame level either.   Time will tell.  

[RunTheBall]

I want to preface this by saying I love Diggs, I appreciate what he did for us, and I’m pissed he let his ego get in the way of what could have been a lifelong legacy as one of the best WRs in Buffalo. His name would have been on the Wall of Fame. 

 

He was the perfect WR at the right time for Josh to reach his potential. I don’t think for a second that Jefferson would have had the same impact on Josh’s development that Diggs had. 

 

Unfortunately, his window was short and he valued individual stats over team success and couldn’t handle the transition to Josh being the face of the franchise. He wasn’t willing to accept a smaller role as his skills diminished and forced himself off the team and hasn’t done jack sht since. If he would have bought into McD’s mantra that it’s the team before the individual, he’d have gone down as one of the greatest WRs in Bills history.

 

Anyone who tries to compare him to Andre Reed needs to seek mental help. Andre is a Hall of Fame WR, Diggs will never get consideration. Anyone who watched Eric Moulds and isn’t just looking at stats knows he was a significantly better WR than Diggs, although a different type of WR. Teams schemed to take Andre away in the playoffs, he still made plays. Diggs fell short. Sneed ERASED him in the playoffs one on one. That’s not an elite WR.

 

Diggs is just another of a long line of WRs who had a good few year stint then drifted off into obscurity. He could have cemented himself as a Buffalo legend but he chose to be a btch, force his way off the team, blow his ACL and now play for the Pats*.