Quarterback Career Comparison Allen vs Lamar

[Buffalo Junction]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

While I wouldn't argue the defense played well in this most recent AFCCG.... it did "hold up" and make a couple of plays when it needed to in order to give the offense the ball and a chance to win the game. They couldn't get it done. It is not as simple as "improve the defense" to me. They still need a game breaker in the pass game for those situations. And they haven't. 

They also need one to emerge on the defensive side of the ball. If we’re really lucky Bosa & Milano roll into the playoffs healthy, and one of these rookies proves to be a big game big moment guy. 

[ganesh]

Just win the Super Bowl....all these comparisons will go out the window...

 

Statistically Mahomes has had a much poor numbers compared to Allen and Jackson...However, he is the only one that is representing the AFC in the Super bowl. 

[BillytheKid]

2 hours ago, ganesh said:

Just win the Super Bowl....all these comparisons will go out the window...

 

Statistically Mahomes has had a much poor numbers compared to Allen and Jackson...However, he is the only one that is representing the AFC in the Super bowl. 

Career wise Mahomes has better numbers than both Allen and Jackson and everyone else ever. If you do regular season by itself and then regular season plus playoffs, Mahomes is the best. 
 

Just playoffs then Josh has him beat in total yards per game and touchdowns per game. Mahomes has the 4 Superbowls though. 
 

Regular season though career wise Mahomes out does everyone in most categories. 

[transplantbillsfan]

On 7/16/2025 at 10:15 PM, GunnerBill said:

I think career stat comparisons overstate the gap. Because Lamar is worlds better as a Quarterback now than he was even 2 or 3 years ago. They were both raw coming out but Josh got to elite more quickly. 

 

I still think it is Pat and Josh 1A and 1B in some order with Lamar and Joe both in the elite tier but at #s 3 and 4 respectively.

 

Josh got to Elite more quickly? Lamar won MVP in his first full year as a starter

[GunnerBill]

22 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Josh got to Elite more quickly? Lamar won MVP in his first full year as a starter

 

Yea I don't think he was an elite QB when he won the first MVP. I am not saying it was a fluke season, but it was a freak season.

[SirAndrew]

48 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea I don't think he was an elite QB when he won the first MVP. I am not saying it was a fluke season, but it was a freak season.

His stats from the second year and MVP season look quite elite. I’m not sure I understand this argument, unless you’re stating that becoming elite requires seniority. Jackson definitely had shortcomings as a passer in his second season, but I still think he does. He’s just such an amazing athlete that people have now overlooked those shortcomings. 

[Doc Brown]

38 minutes ago, SirAndrew said:

His stats from the second year and MVP season look quite elite. I’m not sure I understand this argument, unless you’re stating that becoming elite requires seniority. Jackson definitely had shortcomings as a passer in his second season, but I still think he does. He’s just such an amazing athlete that people have now overlooked those shortcomings. 

I don't quite get the argument either unless he's arguing that he's a much more complete player now.  Which he is.  He's answered all the critics who've questioned his passing prowess.  He's improved at reading defenses, manipulating the pocket, his short and long yardage accuracy, and throwing the ball effectively outside the numbers.  He's just got to do what Allen has to do and win a Super Bowl.

[GunnerBill]

7 hours ago, SirAndrew said:

His stats from the second year and MVP season look quite elite. I’m not sure I understand this argument, unless you’re stating that becoming elite requires seniority. Jackson definitely had shortcomings as a passer in his second season, but I still think he does. He’s just such an amazing athlete that people have now overlooked those shortcomings. 

 

The shortcomings as a passer are waaaaaay fewer now than they were when he won his first MVP. He won that first MVP basically throwing only between the hashes and as a low volume passer. Last year was the first year Jackson went for over 4,000 yards as a passer. Allen has four of those seasons. 

 

That is the distinction I am making. Lamar has always been an exceptional athlete and that kept him in the top half dozen Quarterbacks even when as a passer he was pretty unrefined. He is now legitimately elite as a passer too. That is the gap that has closed.

[BillytheKid]

The main reason Lamar passing numbers looked better last year were because he had Henry in the backfield and that gave him the most wide open receivers in the league.

 

That has already been shown with advanced stats.

 

If you take Henry away Lamar will go back to the passer he was before Henry and his numbers won’t look near as good.

 

I would say if you gave Burrow, Mahomes or Allen , Henry in the backfield all 3 of them would throw for more yards and TD’s then Lamar did. 

Edited July 20 by BillytheKid

[finn]

I think people will look back at Allen and Mahomes being the superstars of this era, with Lamar, Stafford, and Burrows in the next tier down, much like how Cunningham, Moon, and Bledsoe in the 1990s are now considered a level below Kelly, Marino, Elway, and Favre. 

[Delete_Delete_Delete]

On 7/16/2025 at 10:00 PM, SoonerBillsFan said:

Allen superbowl wins: 0

Jackson superbowl wins: 0

So apparently Nick Foles > Josh Allen? 

[DCofNC]

Both are great, Allen is the better passer, Jackson is maybe the best runner we have ever seen at QB and is a good passer at this point.  The biggest difference is Allen is a finisher and Jackson hasn’t proved he can do it on the big stage.  I’d take Allen all day, everyday, but some of that is simply bias.  
 

Both are HOF bound, both are game changers, both have had mediocre receiving and mediocre offensive coaches, both have carried their teams as far as one guy can.   I’m happy as can be with Allen, but if the Bills had taken Jackson, 95% of the people here claiming Allen is clearly better, would be making the opposite claim if Jackson were a Bill.  They impact the game in slightly different ways, but the stats don’t lie (too much), they are pretty even overall.  
 

Jackson gets more “easy” passes due to the scheme and the threat of him running past you if you don’t contain him.  He’s also a more accurate deep ball passer and I don’t care who wants to argue that, just go watch him.  When a guy is running open, Jackson puts it on them, Josh is not a great deep ball passer, even though he can probably throw the ball 75 yards falling backwards, his touch isn’t great.. actually it’s not even good. 
 

Allen is an absolute Brute FORCE, you can’t tackle the guy with anyone less than a lineman 1 on 1 and 99.9% of linemen can’t catch him.  He gets a lot of short rushing TDs bc of this.  His scramble game might be the best ever (Mahomes is stupid good too), he can make throws that only 1% of people to ever play in the NFL can make.  Most importantly, with the game on the line, there’s nobody in the league I’d trade him for. 

[Gregg]

I think Allen is a better QB than Jackson. But I would bet on Lamar winning a Super Bowl before Allen. Ravens have a better roster than the Bills. They will be the favorite to represent the AFC in the Super Bowl this year. IMHO.

[BillytheKid]

6 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

Both are great, Allen is the better passer, Jackson is maybe the best runner we have ever seen at QB and is a good passer at this point.  The biggest difference is Allen is a finisher and Jackson hasn’t proved he can do it on the big stage.  I’d take Allen all day, everyday, but some of that is simply bias.  
 

Both are HOF bound, both are game changers, both have had mediocre receiving and mediocre offensive coaches, both have carried their teams as far as one guy can.   I’m happy as can be with Allen, but if the Bills had taken Jackson, 95% of the people here claiming Allen is clearly better, would be making the opposite claim if Jackson were a Bill.  They impact the game in slightly different ways, but the stats don’t lie (too much), they are pretty even overall.  
 

Jackson gets more “easy” passes due to the scheme and the threat of him running past you if you don’t contain him.  He’s also a more accurate deep ball passer and I don’t care who wants to argue that, just go watch him.  When a guy is running open, Jackson puts it on them, Josh is not a great deep ball passer, even though he can probably throw the ball 75 yards falling backwards, his touch isn’t great.. actually it’s not even good. 
 

Allen is an absolute Brute FORCE, you can’t tackle the guy with anyone less than a lineman 1 on 1 and 99.9% of linemen can’t catch him.  He gets a lot of short rushing TDs bc of this.  His scramble game might be the best ever (Mahomes is stupid good too), he can make throws that only 1% of people to ever play in the NFL can make.  Most importantly, with the game on the line, there’s nobody in the league I’d trade him for. 

 

There is no bias in the stats. They are what they are. 
 

Allen leads in 31 stats and 7 for Lamar.

 

Allen leads in 11 per game stats 

Lamar leads in 4 per game stats. 
(I counted completion percentage in per game stats and Lamar got that one as one of his 4 even though it’s close)

 

Josh Allen has the most big time throws in the league over the last few years including last year. So saying Lamar is better than Allen at deep throws it isn’t correct. 

(How Big-Time Throws Differ from Other Passes: 

While many passes are considered routine, big-time throws stand out due to their combination of difficulty and potential impact. They are not simply based on completion percentage but also take into account the context of the throw and the potential consequences of success or failure. For example, a 50-yard completion into a tight window is more likely to be considered a big-time throw than a 5-yard completion with a wide-open receiver.)

 

In the 2024-25 NFL season, Josh Allen of the Buffalo Bills led the league in Big Time Throws, according to Pro Football Focus (PFF). He had 43 big-time throws, six more than the second-place player, according to PFF

 

So if you are mean what people are saying in here is Bias, maybe , but no bias in the stats, they are what they are. 

 

 

[foreboding]

63 less TD's for Lamar, even though he started his career much hotter than Josh.

[The Jokeman]

On 7/19/2025 at 4:11 PM, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Josh got to Elite more quickly? Lamar won MVP in his first full year as a starter

and Lamar fell down a few pegs in 2020-2022 when Josh was ascending to be in the top 2-3.

[RoscoeParrish]

2 hours ago, BillytheKid said:

How Big-Time Throws Differ from Other Passes: 

While many passes are considered routine, big-time throws stand out due to their combination of difficulty and potential impact. They are not simply based on completion percentage but also take into account the context of the throw and the potential consequences of success or failure. For example, a 50-yard completion into a tight window is more likely to be considered a big-time throw than a 5-yard completion with a wide-open receiver.)

 

In the 2024-25 NFL season, Josh Allen of the Buffalo Bills led the league in Big Time Throws, according to Pro Football Focus (PFF). He had 43 big-time throws, six more than the second-place player, according to PFF

 

So if you are mean what people are saying in here is Bias, maybe , but no bias in the stats, they are what they are

Not all big time throws are deep throws.

 

i don’t think it’s unfair to say that Lamar has a bit better deep ball touch.

[BillytheKid]

3 hours ago, RoscoeParrish said:

Not all big time throws are deep throws.

 

i don’t think it’s unfair to say that Lamar has a bit better deep ball touch.

Most big time throws are over 20 yards or on deep balls and also tight windows. 
 

It’s easy to throw the ball to the most wide open receivers in the league also like Lamar had.
 

Not saying Lamar doesn’t have nice touch but some people in here don’t know enough about advanced stats and think completion percentage on throws is what makes someone have the best deep ball accuracy and that is the farthest thing from the truth. 

[RoscoeParrish]

36 minutes ago, BillytheKid said:

Most big time throws are over 20 yards or on deep balls and also tight windows. 
 

It’s easy to throw the ball to the most wide open receivers in the league also like Lamar had.
 

Not saying Lamar doesn’t have nice touch but some people in here don’t know enough about advanced stats and think completion percentage on throws is what makes someone have the best deep ball accuracy and that is the farthest thing from the truth. 

I don’t know what you are trying to say here.

 

i think most unbiased folks would agree that Lamar has better touch on deep passes, which is the point you tried to dispute. And that has nothing to do with advanced stats or completion percentage.

 

and that also has nothing to do with who is the best QB. Brady famously had just average arm strength. It would be just wrong to say he had the best arm in football because he was the best.

[DCofNC]

10 hours ago, BillytheKid said:

 

There is no bias in the stats. They are what they are. 
 

Allen leads in 31 stats and 7 for Lamar.

 

Allen leads in 11 per game stats 

Lamar leads in 4 per game stats. 
(I counted completion percentage in per game stats and Lamar got that one as one of his 4 even though it’s close)

 

Josh Allen has the most big time throws in the league over the last few years including last year. So saying Lamar is better than Allen at deep throws it isn’t correct. 

(How Big-Time Throws Differ from Other Passes: 

While many passes are considered routine, big-time throws stand out due to their combination of difficulty and potential impact. They are not simply based on completion percentage but also take into account the context of the throw and the potential consequences of success or failure. For example, a 50-yard completion into a tight window is more likely to be considered a big-time throw than a 5-yard completion with a wide-open receiver.)

 

In the 2024-25 NFL season, Josh Allen of the Buffalo Bills led the league in Big Time Throws, according to Pro Football Focus (PFF). He had 43 big-time throws, six more than the second-place player, according to PFF

 

So if you are mean what people are saying in here is Bias, maybe , but no bias in the stats, they are what they are. 

 

 

I am saying the fans of both teams are biased towards their own guy.  
 

I agree Allen is the better passer, and I’ll stand on the soap box all day that Lamar is a far better long ball passer, he has touch that Allen simply does not.  Allen misses a LOT of deep shots, so much so that that basically took it out of the playbook.  That doesn’t mean he can’t throw a 35 yard dime into and impossible window from his back foot and a guy hanging in his waste, he absolutely can.   But given a chance to throw the nice arching bomb to a spot down field for a WR to catch in stride, he’s not very good at all.  He’s unquestionably the worst of the best QBs at it.   He’s great, but touch is still not his best attribute.  Lamar, for all his lesser abilities in the passing game throws a much better deep ball.   
 

I think you are confusing “big time throws” with deep ball.  Not the same thing.