Will Kevin McCarthy Be The Speaker Of The House? Or Mitch Senate Majority Leader?

[reddogblitz]

18 hours ago, Tiberius said:

 

 

People over politics.  OK.  Sure.

 

He's campaigning. This will work great when he runs for President in 2024.

[sherpa]

12 hours ago, redtail hawk said:

Fully agree and yet it's of no concern to some here.  I can't understand or rationalize that.  The only group I see proposing changing that is the left.

......  Those are the extremes that need to be adjusted by tax policies imo.  Just so happens, that's what Bernie proposes.

 

Is this serious?

The recent performance of our "lawmakers" screams to limit their power, not advance it.

The recent 1.7 trillion omnibus appropriations bill is absolute proof that the single greatest path to fiscal tragedy is to allow them more power to decide how people's earnings are "distributed."

 

I have a hard time believing anybody would support such a scheme, not that we haven't been warned.

 

"“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.”
― Alexis de Tocqueville

 

[Orlando Buffalo]

13 hours ago, redtail hawk said:

Fully agree and yet it's of no concern to some here.  I can't understand or rationalize that.  The only group I see proposing changing that is the left.

 

Re standard of living, I grew up in a single earner professional household in the 60's and 70's.  We had 1 car which until I was in my teens was used, our house was about 1800 sq feet, we went on 1 vacation a year driving to Canada and we ate out occasionally.  We ate well.  No cell phones but we did have cable and a decent stereo.  Most of my friends growing up were in similar situations.  And yet we were better off than most.  I have peers that went into the same profession and now live much more luxurious lifestyles.  I would categorize both instances as upper middle class.  I truly believe 2 earner middle class families often have significantly better lifestyles than 1 earner families or even 2 earner families ( women were paid very poorly, in general)) back then.  The poor are just as poor now.  And the rich are richer.  Those are the extremes that need to be adjusted by tax policies imo.  Just so happens, that's what Bernie proposes.

The poor are not the same kind of poor now as previously. I used to have a job that would cause me to have to enter people's homes and people that lived on welfare would have multiple tvs, multiple video game systems, plenty of clothes and food. Now if your point is that since the government has taken over as our primary charity distributor that some people can live very well on welfare while others can't even get housing, you are correct but government is much more the cause than the solution.

[Tiberius]

10 minutes ago, Orlando Tim said:

The poor are not the same kind of poor now as previously. I used to have a job that would cause me to have to enter people's homes and people that lived on welfare would have multiple tvs, multiple video game systems, plenty of clothes and food. Now if your point is that since the government has taken over as our primary charity distributor that some people can live very well on welfare while others can't even get housing, you are correct but government is much more the cause than the solution.

The governmnet is the cause of what? Poverty? 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

12 minutes ago, Orlando Tim said:

The poor are not the same kind of poor now as previously. I used to have a job that would cause me to have to enter people's homes and people that lived on welfare would have multiple tvs, multiple video game systems, plenty of clothes and food. Now if your point is that since the government has taken over as our primary charity distributor that some people can live very well on welfare while others can't even get housing, you are correct but government is much more the cause than the solution.

Ever worked at a food bank and watched the people file in?  Ever packed backpacks for school kids to ensure they get a meal that day?  Visit Appalachia.  See the old, rusty, drafty trailers. Actually, just go to a trailer park near you.  Check out one of these sometime and watch people queue to have teeth pulled. https://www.ramusa.org.  There are "real" poor.

Edited January 8, 2023 by redtail hawk

[SoCal Deek]

37 minutes ago, redtail hawk said:

Ever worked at a food bank and watched the people file in?  Ever packed backpacks for school kids to ensure they get a meal that day?  Visit Appalachia.  See the old, rusty, drafty trailers. Actually, just go to a trailer park near you.  Check out one of these sometime and watch people queue to have teeth pulled. https://www.ramusa.org.  There are "real" poor.

This is an age old debate. It is not the government’s job to eliminate poverty. It’s the government’s job to ensure that there aren’t state regulated systems in place that prevent upward mobility. (Which by the way is different from people not taking advantage of opportunities that exist.)

[BillsFanNC]

The same people who tried to tell you what a disaster and embarrassment it was for "our democracy" that it took several days to elect a new speaker also told you that it's perfectly normal to take weeks to count votes to determine election winners.

[SoCal Deek]

3 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said:

The same people who tried to tell you what a disaster and embarrassment it was for "our democracy" that it took several days to elect a new speaker also told you that it's perfectly normal to take weeks to count votes to determine election winners.

They’re also the same people who applauded the week long pressure/bribery of a certain West Virginia senator to pass a recent spending boondoggle. 

[B-Man]

 

 

Will Kevin McCarthy Be The Speaker Of The House?  --  Yes

 

Or Mitch Senate Majority Leader?  ---  No

 

 

 

End thread.

 

.

[Doc]

41 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said:

The same people who tried to tell you what a disaster and embarrassment it was for "our democracy" that it took several days to elect a new speaker also told you that it's perfectly normal to take weeks to count votes to determine election winners.

 

36 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

They’re also the same people who applauded the week long pressure/bribery of a certain West Virginia senator to pass a recent spending boondoggle. 

 

Just remember, their beliefs on election process, denials, conspiracy theories and strong-arming to get votes are more important than yours.

[Joe Ferguson forever]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

This is an age old debate. It is not the government’s job to eliminate poverty. It’s the government’s job to ensure that there aren’t state regulated systems in place that prevent upward mobility. (Which by the way is different from people not taking advantage of opportunities that exist.)

My post was to dispel the notion that there aren't poor people in the US.  This https://confrontingpoverty.org/poverty-facts-and-myths/americas-poor-are-worse-off-than-elsewhere/ should make anyone with a conscience want to change things. US is 26th out of 26 in this analysis.  We can do much better.  We are still the richest country in the World  (for those that aren't poor).  You can judge a society by how the weakest are treated.

Edited January 8, 2023 by redtail hawk

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, redtail hawk said:

My post was to dispel the idea that there aren't poor peopled in the US.  This https://confrontingpoverty.org/poverty-facts-and-myths/americas-poor-are-worse-off-than-elsewhere/ should make anyone with a conscience want to change things. US is 26th out of 26 in this analysis.  We can do much better.  We are still the richest country in the World  (for those that aren't poor).  You can judge a society by how the weakest are treated.

The weakest? I like to judge a society on how much opportunity is provided and I’d suggest that we wouldn’t see millions of people willing to break our laws just to get into America year after year if they didn’t believe we indeed still provide that opportunity. 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

10 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The weakest? I like to judge a society on how much opportunity is provided and I’d suggest that we wouldn’t see millions of people willing to break our laws just to get into America year after year if they didn’t believe we indeed still provide that opportunity. 

Yeah, there aren't many refugees from the collective 25 industrialized nations above us.  Are there poorer countries?  Of course.  So what?  It's not something to take pride in.  Do you think opportunities don't exist in Switzerland for example?  Go to Davos sometime and see what you think.  It's not either/or.  It can be both.

Edited January 8, 2023 by redtail hawk

[SoCal Deek]

3 minutes ago, redtail hawk said:

Yeah, there aren't many refugees from the collective 25 industrialized nations above us.  Are there poorer countries?  Of course.  So what?  It's not something to take pride in.  Do you think opportunities don't exist in Switzerland for example?  Go to Davos sometime and see what you think.

I have literally no idea where you’re going with any of this anymore. This conversation has gone off the rails. 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

I have literally no idea where you’re going with any of this anymore. This conversation has gone off the rails. 

sad but unsurprising

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, redtail hawk said:

sad but unsurprising

Sure…whatever

Keep pushing for your all encompassing utopian safety net. It’s worked really well so far. 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

Sure…whatever

Keep pushing for your all encompassing utopian safety net. It’s worked really well so far. 

I don't believe the Swiss live in Utopia but I'd rather be closer to their standards than further away from them than Mexico.  someone asked what I liked about Bernie.  Much of it has to do with the above.  I'm not  naive.  I don't see Bernie ever becoming president.  But he is the Socratic gadfly that moves us further towards humanism and compassion.

[Joe Ferguson forever]

34 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

 

Just remember, their beliefs on election process, denials, conspiracy theories and strong-arming to get votes are more important than yours.

stealing someone else's response here....Are you serious?

[Buffarukus]

3 minutes ago, redtail hawk said:

I don't believe the Swiss live in Utopia but I'd rather be closer to their standards than further away from them than Mexico.  someone asked what I liked about Bernie.  Much of it has to do with the above.  I'm not  naive.  I don't see Bernie ever becoming president.  But he is the Socratic gadfly that moves us further towards humanism and compassion.

 

not to jump in but reading your posts you seem to always go with the most extreme circumstance. 

 

socal talks about how the "poor" seem to maintain a very high standard of living and you talk about the truley poor and humanism and compassion.

 

i think there is a middle ground ignored by the bernies/ progressives of the world. wherever there is compassion and empathy there are people more then willing to exploit it. in this aspect i think charity should be individualized not stolen against ones will by force.

 

 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

2 minutes ago, Buffarukus said:

 

not to jump in but reading your posts you seem to always go with the most extreme circumstance. 

 

socal talks about how the "poor" seem to maintain a very high standard of living and you talk about the truley poor and humanism and compassion.

 

i think there is a middle ground ignored by the bernies/ progressives of the world. wherever there is compassion and empathy there are people more then willing to exploit it. in this aspect i think charity should be individualized not stolen against ones will by force.

 

 

Well if Socal got his way there would be far fewer donations to charity because he wants to take away tax deductions for them.  I guess it wouldn't matter to the trumps of the world but it would matter

Edited January 8, 2023 by redtail hawk