Tiberius Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: Please spare us all the plug on the virtues of socialism. People help others on their own. They don't need the government to tell them or force them to do it. They do it on their own. Voluntarily. As witnessed by many charities and other non-government sponsored ways citizens help other citizens. I know people in Texas and many with power and water are taking in friends and relatives that have neither. They didn't need some government official to advise or direct them to take action. It doesn't matter that the people they help are Democrats or Republicans or Liberals or Conservative. The core principles of Socialism are not about "helping people". Its been an abysmal failure everywhere. Socialism is an economic system that in theory seeks to divide the output of society in some "equitable" fashion. In practice its a two tiered system with "insiders" are more equally treated than outsiders. Outsiders being the common people not affiliated with the ruling class. In that respect its fundamentally the same as our current system where DC insiders set all the rules we rock and roll to without much input from the peasants. The failure of the socialist system eventually falls to a fundamental problem. While it focuses on an equitable distribution of consumption or rewards it avoids any mention of an equitable distribution of production and work. Which at some point raises the question, if I work hard and produce 20 units of output then why do I only get 2 units of consumption which is the same as the guy that products 1 unit of output and gets 2 units of consumption? Why am I working so hard for nothing? I'm going to dial back my work to 2 units of output. That way I get out what I put in. Pretty soon everyone that's productive gets the same idea and the whole thing goes to hell and people have to eat zoo animals and their pets like what went down in Venezuela. So if you're really into socialism don't forget to hang on to those grill Husky recipe ideas. In a couple years you'll need them.. In 1961 Ronald Reagan warned America that medicare would lead to socialist destruction of the country. Was he right? Medicare is pretty successful. So is SOCIALIST Security. Full blown socialism in dictatorships are a failure. But so is free market capitalism in dictatorships. We have socialist aspects of our system that work very well 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Tiberius said: Perfect Republican, just let people die. How is he any different from the rest? Tibs, do you say this kinda stuff to people in the real world? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Tenhigh said: Tibs, do you say this kinda stuff to people in the real world? Republicans called for herd immunity, that’s just let them die. Republicans are against government supported health care, just let them die, GOP is against common sense gun control , just let people get shot. Pollution, same. See a pattern here? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Tiberius said: Republicans called for herd immunity, that’s just let them die. Republicans are against government supported health care, just let them die, GOP is against common sense gun control , just let people get shot. Pollution, same. See a pattern here? It's a yes or no question. See a pattern here? I'm asking because I worry that if you act like this in public you're going to get yourself or someone else hurt. Maybe it's just because I learned to communicate before the internet, but I don't think it is. Try to listen instead of scream once in a while, you'll like it, I promise, and may find out the people you hate and thought are evil really aren't much different from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Tenhigh said: It's a yes or no question. See a pattern here? I'm asking because I worry that if you act like this in public you're going to get yourself or someone else hurt. Maybe it's just because I learned to communicate before the internet, but I don't think it is. Try to listen instead of scream once in a while, you'll like it, I promise, and may find out the people you hate and thought are evil really aren't much different from you. Why should you worry about me? Why are you asking that? Cant you stick to the topic being discussed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 13 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Why should you worry about me? Why are you asking that? Cant you stick to the topic being discussed? I was pretty clear about why I'm asking, I think, I'm hoping you're not walking around getting punched in the nose all day. Why not discuss this topic instead of insulting each other for a while? And you can't stop me from caring about you, unless you start rooting for the Patriots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 30 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Republicans called for herd immunity, that’s just let them die. Republicans are against government supported health care, just let them die, GOP is against common sense gun control , just let people get shot. Pollution, same. See a pattern here? I support all of the positions you outlined above. I'll let me die, if you'll do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 Just now, Tenhigh said: I was pretty clear about why I'm asking, I think, I'm hoping you're not walking around getting punched in the nose all day. Why not discuss this topic instead of insulting each other for a while? And you can't stop me from caring about you, unless you start rooting for the Patriots. Why make it personal? Seriously asking. Seems strange Just now, SoCal Deek said: I support all of the positions you outlined above. I'll let me die, if you'll do the same. As long as you go first, I promise I will too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Tiberius said: As long as you go first, I promise I will too. I'm pretty sure I will. I am way older than all of your Junior High School classmates. 😛 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 9 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Why make it personal? Seriously asking. Seems strange You really don't see how over the top your discussions are with people on this part of the board? I'm guessing some of it must be because I'm probably a bit older than you, and this is how your generation learned to converse, at least online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 Wind energy produces 20% of Texas's energy. This is just sad stupid propaganda for people who want to believe everything good is from the Republicans. https://www.texastribune.org/2021/02/16/texas-wind-turbines-frozen/ "Wind turbines — like natural gas plants — can be “winterized,” or modified to operate during very low temperatures. Experts say that many of Texas’ power generators have not made those investments necessary to prevent disruptions to equipment since the state does not regularly experience extreme winter storms." https://www.cbsnews.com/news/wind-power-turbine-texas-power-outage-winter-storm-electrical-grid/ "Experts say traditional energy sources, including coal and natural gas, performed below expectations, while wind power actually performed above expectations." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Brown Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, dpberr said: This is a warning shot across the bow of the country when it comes to not freezing to death. Regardless of which camp you sit in on climate change, you always need reliable standby fuel sources and *a lot* of it. Coal and nuclear power continue to save the day in the northeast and people don't even notice. When demand goes up, guess what fires up? Whatever coal plants and nuclear plants we have left when the natural gas pipelines can't generate the pressure. Pennsylvania contributes a significant amount of production towards the grid on the eastern seaboard. With each coal plant that closes and each generating station that gets decommissioned (Three Mile Island just closed), you lose that crucial standby energy for your cold snaps and heat waves. Natural gas, wind and solar can't do it and probably won't, even if you go to great lengths to winterize the infrastructure. I don't agree with Bill Gates on 99% of his opinions and projects but I do agree that the United States needs to design next generation nuclear power plants so that they could take the place of some of the coal plants. The Texans are paying the price of complacency and being cheap. ERCOT got lazy, fat and happy and wasn't doing nearly enough worrying as they should have been. They didn't think Texas could ever, ever get snow? Agreed for the most part (you could pry switch to nuclear energy only as a backup if you want to spend the dough). You also make a great case with ERCOT on the danger of too few government regulations. Edited February 17, 2021 by Doc Brown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 8 hours ago, Tiberius said: Lol, this is dumb. Actually, if the government doesn’t help, no one will I’d love to turn this into a poll to gauge the general surprise that Tibs made this statement above.. Government! Please help me! I can’t do anything without you telling me what to do or doing it for me! I’m incapable of doing anything myself! fortunately in many parts of the country, state, local, citizen organizations and even.., wait for it, businesses serving their customers make things happen, every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorin' Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 5 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: I’d love to turn this into a poll to gauge the general surprise that Tibs made this statement above.. Government! Please help me! I can’t do anything without you telling me what to do or doing it for me! I’m incapable of doing anything myself! fortunately in many parts of the country, state, local, citizen organizations and even.., wait for it, businesses serving their customers make things happen, every day. Are you really arguing that Texans without power pull themselves up by their boot straps and generate their own individual electrical power? Did you run your own electrical grid or do you really on the evils of commie government power? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 13 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: This is why I hate politics. People aren't that stupid to believe wind and solar are the reason Texas power failed. Politics will make people say and do anything to defend their party. Our useless governer (Abbott) was doing press earlier today, blaming the outages on freezing natural gas sources...but withing an hour or two, he got the talking points to blame it on the New Green Deal. 15 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: I’d love to turn this into a poll to gauge the general surprise that Tibs made this statement above.. Government! Please help me! I can’t do anything without you telling me what to do or doing it for me! I’m incapable of doing anything myself! fortunately in many parts of the country, state, local, citizen organizations and even.., wait for it, businesses serving their customers make things happen, every day. Not in this case buddy! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Buftex said: Our useless governer (Abbott) was doing press earlier today, blaming the outages on freezing natural gas sources...but withing an hour or two, he got the talking points to blame it on the New Green Deal. That’s pretty poor. I understand how the wind turbines and supporting batteries being hit much worse proportionately would lead to thinking if it was all wind it might have been a worse situation, but green new deal is irrelevant to the current grid. Too bad that was the message. Garbage. 24 minutes ago, Motorin' said: Are you really arguing that Texans without power pull themselves up by their boot straps and generate their own individual electrical power? Did you run your own electrical grid or do you really on the evils of commie government power? the feds don’t restore my power when it goes out, pepco does. Do people really not understand where their utility payments go? I cannot believe we live in a world where there are so many people so disconnected with reality they think the federal government provides or would actually be capable of providing their water, power, internet probably cell phone coverage. Please for the love of god... verify where you send your utility payments then look up those companies. Understand they do not all work directly for the president of the us. 😳 Edited February 18, 2021 by Over 29 years of fanhood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 25 minutes ago, Buftex said: Our useless governer (Abbott) was doing press earlier today, blaming the outages on freezing natural gas sources...but withing an hour or two, he got the talking points to blame it on the New Green Deal. Not in this case buddy! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 11 minutes ago, Wacka said: Got it chief! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorin' Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: That’s pretty poor. I understand how the wind turbines and supporting batteries being hit much worse proportionately would lead to thinking if it was all wind it might have been a worse situation, but green new deal is irrelevant to the current grid. Too bad that was the message. Garbage. the feds don’t restore my power when it goes out, pepco does. Do people really not understand where their utility payments go? I cannot believe we live in a world where there are so many people so disconnected with reality they think the federal government provides or would actually be capable of providing their water, power, internet probably cell phone coverage. Please for the love of god... verify where you send your utility payments then look up those companies. Understand they do not all work directly for the president of the us. 😳 You get your electricity from a federally regulated public utility. The power grid that spans the the Eastern half of the US which shares power across state lines is run by the Regional Transmission Organization enacted by the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission. So you might be getting your power from the plants that Excelon / Pepco owns. But they may be buying that power through the federal RTO when they can't meet their demand. It is true that over 70% of the power generated currently in the US is generated by corporations. But there are energy producers that are owned and operated by federal, state and local government, as well as co-op owned. Texas has opted out of the Federal Interstate RTO grid. So when they can't meet their demand they can't buy power from another source. And they have also chosen not to meet federal winterization standards, which would have prevented their current shortage. They are down 30% production in coal, gas and nuclear this week because they chose not to winterize. Wind is also down 30% due to lack of winterization, while solar is up 100%. But if they participated in the interstate grid they wouldn't be without power at all this week. In any event, read up on Roosevelt's New Deal sometime and let me know how much of the country the federal government is responsible for providing the electrical grid to. Edited February 18, 2021 by Motorin' 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 13 minutes ago, Motorin' said: In any event, read up on Roosevelt's New Deal sometime and let me know how much of the country the federal government is responsible for providing the electrical grid to. what are the learning objectives? I don’t blame Texas for isolating. This country is a shocking disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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