BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 (edited) http://buffalonews.com/2018/03/28/tim-graham-show-best-worst-bills-draft-picks-new-stadium-chatter-o-j-s-take-on-sam-darnold/ The crew over at The Buffalo News finally got their act together and started releasing The Tim Graham Show as a full podcast. In the past, for whatever reason, they'd only release a 20 minute segment and try to get people to watch on Facebook Live - which sucked. Anyway, ESPN's legendary beat reporter Mike Rodak said that he was writing a column - The Best and Worst Draft Picks in Bills History Over the past decade. He asked for listeners to call in and give him suggestions. I think maybe 2 people called in because as great at the show is, no one in Buffalo listens to that second rate radio station 1270 The Fan. As I have pointed out in my very popular "Hits and Misses" columns, the Bills have drafted very poorly. While many of you argued with me and would say that certain draft were actually good selection, I felt vindicated to know that professional journalists like Graham, Rodak, and Jerry Sullivan seemed to think along the same lines. Rodak is quick to point out that since 1991, only THREE Buffalo Bills draft picks have been named All-Pros. 1 of them wasn't even an All-Pro for the Bills: 1992 - Henry Jones 2011- Marcell Dareus 2012 - Marshawn Lynch (For Seattle) But the best and worst draft picks is an interesting topic because how the many ways that you can interpret those descriptors. Here are my choices: Worst Draft Picks 1. EJ Manuel - a tremendous miss by Buddy Nix. Never should have been selected with the #1 overall pick, however Nix has no one else to blame but himself for neglecting the position. This draft selection and the team's dedication to EJ really set the franchise back. That's why he is #1 - because the damage that this busted pick caused. 2. Sammy Watkins - this selection is not the worst draft pick from a talent standpoint, but the Bills paid waaaay too much for the return they receiver from Sammy. They gave up two #1 draft picks to again, prove that EJ Manuel could be a good QB. It was ill-advised in 2014 and it completely failed. 3. Aaron Maybin - A top 10 draft pick that records 0 sacks? Absolutely f'n dreadful. The make matters worse, Graham shared a story that Modrak told Dick Jauron he could choose from 3 LB's. Orapko, Cushing, and Maybin. 2 of those players were All-Pros. Guess which one Dick took? The only reason Maybin isn't higher on the list is because he selection didn't set the team back as much as EJ or Sammy. The Best Draft Picks 1 - Cordy Glenn - A 2nd round selection that turned out to be a cornerstone LT for the Bills. This was a very good pick for Buddy. Unfortunately, after he signed his contract injuries and other issues seemed to impact how available he was. When Cordy played at full health he was very good and is one of the better LT's in the league. 2 - Stephon Gilmore - You can't deny it - Gilmore played very well for the Bills. Yes was never on the level of a Reevis, Sherman or Talib but he did give up some big plays to average (and sometimes below average) wide receivers but overall he lived up to his high draft status. 3 - Stevie Johnson - 7th round draft pick that turned 3 straight 1,000 seasons and energized the fan base. This was a tremendous selection from GM Russ Brandon. * Marcel Dareus is a close call here because he had 3 very good seasons and then 3 underwhelming years after he signed his fat contract. He definitely deserves consideration So help out Mike - who are your picks for best and worst over the past decade. Edited March 30, 2018 by BuffaloRush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 umm how about Kyle !@#$ing Williams in the 5th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 Just now, Pete said: umm how about Kyle !@#$ing Williams in the 5th? The Best and Worst Bills Draft Picks Over The Past Decade He was no doubt a steal (Thank you Marv) but he falls outside of the timeframe being drafted in 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 2 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: The Best and Worst Bills Draft Picks Over The Past Decade He was no doubt a steal (Thank you Marv) but he falls outside of the timeframe being drafted in 2006 I quickly read that article and is said Jones, Marshawn, and Dareous were only probowlers. I guess it meant for 1st rounders Rodak is quick to point out that since 1991, only THREE Buffalo Bills draft picks have been named All-Pros. 1 of them wasn't even an All-Pro for the Bills: 1992 - Henry Jones 2011- Marcell Dareus 2012 - Marshawn Lynch (For Seattle) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 2 minutes ago, Pete said: I quickly read that article and is said Jones, Marshawn, and Dareous were only probowlers. I guess it meant for 1st rounders Rodak is quick to point out that since 1991, only THREE Buffalo Bills draft picks have been named All-Pros. 1 of them wasn't even an All-Pro for the Bills: 1992 - Henry Jones 2011- Marcell Dareus 2012 - Marshawn Lynch (For Seattle) Dude you really need to read closely - it says "All Pro" not "Pro Bowl" Big difference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: Dude you really need to read closely - it says "All Pro" not "Pro Bowl" Big difference 5 Pro Bowls and 2nd team All Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEBills Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Still think Maybin is a bigger bust than EJ. Drafted earlier in the draft order, never registered a sack as a Bill. Watkins is probably number 1 bc 2 first round picks even tho he was decent when healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, LEBills said: Still think Maybin is a bigger bust than EJ. Drafted earlier in the draft order, never registered a sack as a Bill. Watkins is probably number 1 bc 2 first round picks even tho he was decent when healthy. what makes Watkins #1 IMO is the trade. We could of had Aaron Donald, Mike Evans, Odell, Mack, Barr, Lewan, Ha Ha, Zack Martin, etc- that draft was so deep. We overpaid obviously and missed out on some HOF players potentially Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 7 minutes ago, Pete said: 5 Pro Bowls and 2nd team All Pro What are you arguing about? the stat is correct...3 All-Pro’s in 3 decades. That stat is correct 1 minute ago, Pete said: what makes Watkins #1 IMO is the trade. We could of had Aaron Donald, Mike Evans, Odell, Mack, Barr, Lewan, Ha Ha, Zack Martin, etc- that draft was so deep. We overpaid obviously and missed out on some HOF players potentially Torrell Troupe was a huge miss too take one pick before Rob Gronkowski. Shameful on Buddy Nix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Worst (there are a lot to choose from) 1) sammy watkins 2) Cyrus kuoandijo (2nd rounder and yet a bust from day 1) 3) Aaron maybin 4) James hardy best 1) Robert woods 2) eric wood 3) Andy levitre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 13 minutes ago, JR in Pittsburgh said: Worst (there are a lot to choose from) 1) sammy watkins 2) Cyrus kuoandijo (2nd rounder and yet a bust from day 1) 3) Aaron maybin 4) James hardy best 1) Robert woods 2) eric wood 3) Andy levitre Robert Woods was the best? He was a decent pick for the Bills but he has yet to even make 1 Pro Bowl. If he didn't have the season he had last year, I don't think we'd be having this discussion. Wood and Levitre were solid picks...not so sure they were the best. Wood's longevity certainly says something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakin Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Aaron Maybin was by far the worst. Its not even a competition... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another Fan Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 No love for Tre White? I know only one year but I was very impressed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Diver Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 When was Mike Williams drafted? Has it been over 10 years already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 (edited) Kyle Williams has been an all pro... not first team but an all pro... iirc i thought Mario also was a second team all pro Edited March 30, 2018 by Buffalo716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: Kyle Williams has been an all pro... not first team but an all pro... iirc i thought Mario also was a second team all pro People.... you need to read. Mario was not drafted by the Bills. Also I’m taking 1st team All-Pro. Not second team. Generally when someone talks about All Pro status, it’s forst teamers. Also Kyle Williams was drafted in 2006 6 hours ago, Sky Diver said: When was Mike Williams drafted? Has it been over 10 years already? 2002 - it’s been nearly 20 years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 (edited) I don't agree with EJ or with Sammy among the worst 3. You say EJ set the franchise back.... can I ask how? We went 6-10 his rookie year and since then have had 1 losing season out of 4..... if anything we have got better as a franchise since that pick (though obvioisly not because of it). Sammy I think the cost given up for 2 good but not great seasons was a lot and I do get that argument.... I just think there have been much, much worse picks. CJ Spiller, Terrell Troup, Cyrus Koundjio etc... Edited March 30, 2018 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 hours ago, ScottLaw said: I guess Sammy Watkins because they didn't commit to him. But I don't see how that was a bad pick, more a circumstance of a new regime wanting nothing to do with him and overvaluing their own guys.(former Panthers) Maybin was awful. That entire 2008 draft was awful. As was the 2010 draft. The drafts got better once everyone's whipping boy in Doug Whaley took over. This is inaccurate. In 3 drafts, Doug Whaley drafted 0 Pro Bowl talents. ZERO! Worst by a Bills GM in nearly 3 decades. Even worse than Russ or Marv Pro Bowl Selections By Bills GMs Tom Donahue - 4 Marv Levy - 4 Buddy Nix - 2 Russ Brandon - 2 DOUG WHALEY - 0.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Section242 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 10 hours ago, BuffaloRush said: http://buffalonews.com/2018/03/28/tim-graham-show-best-worst-bills-draft-picks-new-stadium-chatter-o-j-s-take-on-sam-darnold/ The crew over at The Buffalo News finally got their act together and started releasing The Tim Graham Show as a full podcast. In the past, for whatever reason, they'd only release a 20 minute segment and try to get people to watch on Facebook Live - which sucked. Anyway, ESPN's legendary beat reporter Mike Rodak said that he was writing a column - The Best and Worst Draft Picks in Bills History Over the past decade. He asked for listeners to call in and give him suggestions. I think maybe 2 people called in because as great at the show is, no one in Buffalo listens to that second rate radio station 1270 The Fan. As I have pointed out in my very popular "Hits and Misses" columns, the Bills have drafted very poorly. While many of you argued with me and would say that certain draft were actually good selection, I felt vindicated to know that professional journalists like Graham, Rodak, and Jerry Sullivan seemed to think along the same lines. Rodak is quick to point out that since 1991, only THREE Buffalo Bills draft picks have been named All-Pros. 1 of them wasn't even an All-Pro for the Bills: 1992 - Henry Jones 2011- Marcell Dareus 2012 - Marshawn Lynch (For Seattle) But the best and worst draft picks is an interesting topic because how the many ways that you can interpret those descriptors. Here are my choices: Worst Draft Picks 1. EJ Manuel - a tremendous miss by Buddy Nix. Never should have been selected with the #1 overall pick, however Nix has no one else to blame but himself for neglecting the position. This draft selection and the team's dedication to EJ really set the franchise back. That's why he is #1 - because the damage that this busted pick caused. 2. Sammy Watkins - this selection is not the worst draft pick from a talent standpoint, but the Bills paid waaaay too much for the return they receiver from Sammy. They gave up two #1 draft picks to again, prove that EJ Manuel could be a good QB. It was ill-advised in 2014 and it completely failed. 3. Aaron Maybin - A top 10 draft pick that records 0 sacks? Absolutely f'n dreadful. The make matters worse, Graham shared a story that Modrak told Dick Jauron he could choose from 3 LB's. Orapko, Cushing, and Maybin. 2 of those players were All-Pros. Guess which one Dick took? The only reason Maybin isn't higher on the list is because he selection didn't set the team back as much as EJ or Sammy. The Best Draft Picks 1 - Cordy Glenn - A 2nd round selection that turned out to be a cornerstone LT for the Bills. This was a very good pick for Buddy. Unfortunately, after he signed his contract injuries and other issues seemed to impact how available he was. When Cordy played at full health he was very good and is one of the better LT's in the league. 2 - Stephon Gilmore - You can't deny it - Gilmore played very well for the Bills. Yes was never on the level of a Reevis, Sherman or Talib but he did give up some big plays to average (and sometimes below average) wide receivers but overall he lived up to his high draft status. 3 - Stevie Johnson - 7th round draft pick that turned 3 straight 1,000 seasons and energized the fan base. This was a tremendous selection from GM Russ Brandon. * Marcel Dareus is a close call here because he had 3 very good seasons and then 3 underwhelming years after he signed his fat contract. He definitely deserves consideration So help out Mike - who are your picks for best and worst over the past decade. Maybin wasn't good enough to play special teams. He's by far the worst pick of the last decade. They missed on Manuel but how did it set the franchise back? They went with Orton for most of his 2nd season and then Tyrod. My top two misses are 1. Maybin and 2. T.J. Graham these two were both awful. The two best picks were 1. Stevie 2. Eric Wood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 9 hours ago, Another Fan said: No love for Tre White? I know only one year but I was very impressed Well it’s just one season. I think most people want to see how he develops over the course of a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 16 minutes ago, Section242 said: Maybin wasn't good enough to play special teams. He's by far the worst pick of the last decade. They missed on Manuel but how did it set the franchise back? They went with Orton for most of his 2nd season and then Tyrod. My top two misses are 1. Maybin and 2. T.J. Graham these two were both awful. The two best picks were 1. Stevie 2. Eric Wood. 3 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I don't agree with EJ or with Sammy among the worst 3. You say EJ set the franchise back.... can I ask how? We went 6-10 his rookie year and since then have had 1 losing season out of 4..... if anything we have got better as a franchise since that pick (though obvioisly not because of it). Sammy I think the cost given up for 2 good but not great seasons was a lot and I do get that argument.... I just think there have been much, much worse picks. CJ Spiller, Terrell Troup, Cyrus Koundjio etc... It set them back for nearly two years. First off the selection of EJ that high took the Bills out of contention for some quality talent at other positions in 2013. EJ was a 3rd To 4th round talent. The Bills took him 1st overall. Huge mistake. In EJ’s rookie season coaches were very concerned about his mindset and didn’t want want to bring in an established veteran. Even Kolb was a very weak signing. That’s why we ended up with Thad Lewis and Jeff Tuel as backup QB’s. The next season, Whaley and the Bills had to prove that EJ was the man. So he mortgaged the franchise and overspent on Sammy Watkins in a WR rich draft. This was a horrible pick. Of course in 2015, not having that 1st rounder hurt. so yeah to say EJ didn’t set the team back is not accurate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 I am sorry I don't agree. The 2013 draft was a shocking draft even aside from Quarterback. Yes there were some good players in it but they were few and far between. The Bills traded back picked up another valuable asset (so valuable it landed us an elite running back via trade) and while I totally agree EJ was a reach they limited the overall damage it did their draft class. As for holding them back 2 years... I just do not see how. You take a rookie you are going to get him on the field sooner or later and take your lumps. I don't really care who they brought in as competition in 2013 that was about seeing what they had in EJ. Then they did albeit belatedly bring in competition in 2014 and Orton got in after 4 games and led us to our first winning record in 10 years. EJ was a bad pick, yes. Mistake, unquestionably... but he did not set the team back overall. I think not taking shots at Quarterbacks in years previous set it back much, much further than missing on EJ Manuel. I think Kouandjio, Troup and Spiller were all worse selections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JXCOL3 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 A few good draft selections I can think of are Kiko Alonso : His rookie year a legend was born Tre' White Eric Wood Some big flops Manuel Torrell Troup CJ Spiller : This pick made zero sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Section242 said: Maybin wasn't good enough to play special teams. He's by far the worst pick of the last decade. They missed on Manuel but how did it set the franchise back? They went with Orton for most of his 2nd season and then Tyrod. My top two misses are 1. Maybin and 2. T.J. Graham these two were both awful. The two best picks were 1. Stevie 2. Eric Wood. TJ Graham was a very bad pick but only as a 3rd rounder. There have been far worse picks taken higher in the draft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Aaron Maybin is the #1 worst pick because all of the red flags were waving in hurricane force winds not to pick him with a high pick and we did it anyway. This list is an indictment of the Bills previous FO mindset on picking athletes over football players. Let's hope that is changing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 23 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I am sorry I don't agree. The 2013 draft was a shocking draft even aside from Quarterback. Yes there were some good players in it but they were few and far between. The Bills traded back picked up another valuable asset (so valuable it landed us an elite running back via trade) and while I totally agree EJ was a reach they limited the overall damage it did their draft class. As for holding them back 2 years... I just do not see how. You take a rookie you are going to get him on the field sooner or later and take your lumps. I don't really care who they brought in as competition in 2013 that was about seeing what they had in EJ. Then they did albeit belatedly bring in competition in 2014 and Orton got in after 4 games and led us to our first winning record in 10 years. EJ was a bad pick, yes. Mistake, unquestionably... but he did not set the team back overall. I think not taking shots at Quarterbacks in years previous set it back much, much further than missing on EJ Manuel. I think Kouandjio, Troup and Spiller were all worse selections. I see what you are saying and you do have a very good point. But I think that you have to connect the Sammy Watkins selection to EJ as well. After drafting Sammy they basically doubled down on EJ. The Bills basically spent nearly two seasons putting everything behind EJ, until realizing at the end of the preseason that he wasn’t the guy. That’s when they brought in Kyle Orton in a panic move. 7 minutes ago, dpberr said: Aaron Maybin is the #1 worst pick because all of the red flags were waving in hurricane force winds not to pick him with a high pick and we did it anyway. This list is an indictment of the Bills previous FO mindset on picking athletes over football players. Let's hope that is changing. Maybin is a very strong candidate for #1 worst for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 TJ Graham was the worst pick because the OBVIOUS pick at that slot was Russell Wilson. It was no brainer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 2 minutes ago, Shaw66 said: TJ Graham was the worst pick because the OBVIOUS pick at that slot was Russell Wilson. It was no brainer. Yep and if that’s how you define the worst pick, Torell Troupe can’t be far behind. He was taken one pick before Rob Gronkowski - a player with local connections that was on the Bills radar and would have made a ton of sense from a football standpoint. Buddy Nix, ladies and gentleman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 hour ago, BuffaloRush said: I see what you are saying and you do have a very good point. But I think that you have to connect the Sammy Watkins selection to EJ as well. After drafting Sammy they basically doubled down on EJ. The Bills basically spent nearly two seasons putting everything behind EJ, until realizing at the end of the preseason that he wasn’t the guy. That’s when they brought in Kyle Orton in a panic move. See I think they only put a single season into him. Orton started 12 games the following year. As for Sammy being a double down.... maybe but they also had a need at receiver. Mike Evans was actually my guy that year but they definitely had a need at the spot regardless of who the QB was. 38 minutes ago, Shaw66 said: TJ Graham was the worst pick because the OBVIOUS pick at that slot was Russell Wilson. It was no brainer. Yea. I fogrot that one. And TJ sucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 26 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: See I think they only put a single season into him. Orton started 12 games the following year. As for Sammy being a double down.... maybe but they also had a need at receiver. Mike Evans was actually my guy that year but they definitely had a need at the spot regardless of who the QB was. Yea. I fogrot that one. And TJ sucked. TJ was almost as bad as a pick as Bucky Brooks in round 2. I don't think he caught any passes during his career with the Bills. Terrible pick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 7 hours ago, BuffaloRush said: People.... you need to read. Mario was not drafted by the Bills. Also I’m taking 1st team All-Pro. Not second team. Generally when someone talks about All Pro status, it’s forst teamers. Also Kyle Williams was drafted in 2006 2002 - it’s been nearly 20 years! Well first I didn't see drafted by Bills. Second Rodak said since 91 only 3 all pros drafted by bills Being a second team all pro 100% counts and Kyle 100% qualifies as an all pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share Posted March 30, 2018 7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Well first I didn't see drafted by Bills. Second Rodak said since 91 only 3 all pros drafted by bills Being a second team all pro 100% counts and Kyle 100% qualifies as an all pro Fine, than he was referring to first team all pros. There are 3. Even if you include Kyle - 4 over the span of 3 decades is still not good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: Fine, than he was referring to first team all pros. There are 3. Even if you include Kyle - 4 over the span of 3 decades is still not good No it's horrifying... cant believe Kelly didn't 1st team all pro in 91, 92 or 93 scratch that... Kelly was 1st team all pro in 91 Edited March 30, 2018 by Buffalo716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 15 hours ago, LEBills said: Still think Maybin is a bigger bust than EJ. Drafted earlier in the draft order, never registered a sack as a Bill. Watkins is probably number 1 bc 2 first round picks even tho he was decent when healthy. still too soon for Maybin.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Diver Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 12 hours ago, BuffaloRush said: People.... you need to read. Mario was not drafted by the Bills. Also I’m taking 1st team All-Pro. Not second team. Generally when someone talks about All Pro status, it’s forst teamers. Also Kyle Williams was drafted in 2006 2002 - it’s been nearly 20 years! Time flies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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