OldTimeAFLGuy Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 No, Whaley was done once McDermott was hired. Sean demanded full control to take the job. When Sean says the Pegulas fired Whaley and the scouts after the draft and they decided that morning he is lying. ....just give it up...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 (edited) No, Whaley wanted Mahomes. No, Whaley was done once McDermott was hired. Sean demanded full control to take the job. When Sean says the Pegulas fired Whaley and the scouts after the draft and they decided that morning he is lying. Do you have any links to this stuff? I'd be interested to read em. Thanks. Edited May 21, 2017 by BillsFan4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Do you have any links to this stuff? I'd be interested to read em. Thanks. I've heard/read conflicting reports about this. I believe Leroi said that Whaley was high on Mahomes and McD wasn't. Then there are articles that say that the Pegulas were the ones that were high on Mahomes and Whaley trading back was the last straw (even though reports were coming out that the scouting staff knew they were getting fired a week before the draft). Based on how the draft went and the speculation that McD was running the draft, I feel like what Leroi said was more true than the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I dont know what games you are looking at the the pass protection has been excellent. Tyrod just holds onto the ball far too long. On order to hold on the ball far to long you have to have that time and the Billls OL has given him that protection in most games in 2016 http://www.nfl.com/stats/ngs/timetothrow I don't know what ones you were watching. We had one of the worst right side pass protection in the league. You post a stat. That stat includes scramble time behind the LoS which he did often. No, Whaley wanted Mahomes. You shouldn't speak in facts when you have no idea if he did or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 TT is capable of throwing from the pocket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 TT is capable of throwing from the pocketI want to believe this. I have seen little evidence that supports it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I've heard/read conflicting reports about this. I believe Leroi said that Whaley was high on Mahomes and McD wasn't. Then there are articles that say that the Pegulas were the ones that were high on Mahomes and Whaley trading back was the last straw (even though reports were coming out that the scouting staff knew they were getting fired a week before the draft). Based on how the draft went and the speculation that McD was running the draft, I feel like what Leroi said was more true than the latter. I hadn't heard/read anything on Whaley being high on Mahomes. The only thing I read about him was that he was "in love" with Watson and knowing the QBs Whaley drafted (or had interest in) in the past I felt him loving Watson was pretty believable. Ma homes just doesn't seem like the type of QB Whaley would be high on, but who knows. That'd definitely be interesting if true, which is why I was so interested to read it for myself. I did read about Pegula liking Mahomes though, which I could buy. and also that thing about Whaley trading back being the last straw (which I did not believe either, it seemed like total BS to me). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 In order to throw from the pocket and have success doing so, there has to be one to throw from. The Bills in the last several seasons have not done all that well protecting their QBs. They seem to have gotten run blocking mastered, but pass plays remain adventurous undertakings for our QBs because of the OL's inconsistency. The pocket is there most times, Tyrod is very skittish and likes to pull it down and run many times instead of standing there and delivering the ball on time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I want to believe this. I have seen little evidence that supports it. I've never watched Taylor and thought to myself that this guy is a passer. He always to me seemed to be a gimmick QB that looks to make plays rather then read the field and make the correct throw. It's either try to make a play or check down...there is no real middle ground. Standing in the pocket and making tough throws is simply something TT does not be able to appear very capable of. Taylor is on borrowed time if the GM is looking for a true pocket passer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 (edited) I dont know what games you are looking at the the pass protection has been excellent. Tyrod just holds onto the ball far too long. On order to hold on the ball far to long you have to have that time and the Billls OL has given him that protection in most games in 2016 http://www.nfl.com/stats/ngs/timetothrow Did you watch the games? It's not about statistics! It's about effective plays. Good pass protection means that a QB consistently has time to throw the ball when the defense knows he's going to throw ...just like good run blocking doesn't mean occasionally breaking a 20 yarder but that the OL enables the RBs, even journeymen, to make first downs on thirds and short. The pocket is there most times, Tyrod is very skittish and likes to pull it down and run many times instead of standing there and delivering the ball on time. The pocket was seldom there long enough for Taylor to throw first downs on thirds and long, and often it wasn't there for him to throw downfield at all because receivers need time to get open. Apparently, some people's standards are much lower than others. Brady consistently has "excellent" pass protection. You don't see him getting knocked on his butt every other play ... and when he does, the Pats struggle. Taylor has never had Brady's level of protection, especially last season. The Bills' pass protection resembled Pitt's the year that Roethlisberger got all beat to hell trying to stay in the pocket ... and the next season, the Stillers seriously shored up that OL so that their QB would survive. Taylor runs because he can ... Roethlisberger's too slow so he couldn't escape and got beaten up for his trouble ... The Bills need to improve their pass protection. Claiming it was "excellent" or "was there most times" is not only being in denial but it's scapegoating Taylor, the favorite past time of some Bills fans. Taylor is a decent enough QB if given some protection and some targets. Coming out of Baltimore, do you really think he doesn't know how to throw from the pocket? The last time I looked, nobody would confuse Joe Flacco with Cam Newton. Edited May 21, 2017 by SoTier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I hadn't heard/read anything on Whaley being high on Mahomes. The only thing I read about him was that he was "in love" with Watson and knowing the QBs Whaley drafted (or had interest in) in the past I felt him loving Watson was pretty believable. Ma homes just doesn't seem like the type of QB Whaley would be high on, but who knows. That'd definitely be interesting if true, which is why I was so interested to read it for myself. I did read about Pegula liking Mahomes though, which I could buy. and also that thing about Whaley trading back being the last straw (which I did not believe either, it seemed like total BS to me). It's possible you are correct about Whaley on watson and not mahomes. Just going by memory of the shoutbox. Everything else you said lines up with my thoughts as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRUSHx Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Beane is looking for a QB who can make it happen in the pocket? No surprise there.Sadly for Tyrod that is exactly where teams learned to stop him. Make him be a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Sadly for Tyrod that is exactly where teams learned to stop him. Make him be a QB.Did they though? His 29th and most recent start was by far the best of his career. He was 26 of 39 for 329 and 3 TDs. How do you explain that if he has been figured out? It actually supports the exact opposite of your claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Did they though? His 29th and most recent start was by far the best of his career. He was 26 of 39 for 329 and 3 TDs. How do you explain that if he has been figured out? It actually supports the exact opposite of your claim. And it was the best start of his career and one of the few times he looked like a franchise qb (Miami was 29th in defense, Buffalo was 19th). But how many of those starts has he had? Miami and Seattle are 2 main examples I can think of that it didn't look like we weren't like a college option team. If those Miami and Seattle games happend more frequently, Tyrod would be the future. But there are far too many games where we struggle to get to 150 or 200 yards passing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 And it was the best start of his career and one of the few times he looked like a franchise qb (Miami was 29th in defense, Buffalo was 19th). But how many of those starts has he had? Miami and Seattle are 2 main examples I can think of that it didn't look like we weren't like a college option team. If those Miami and Seattle games happend more frequently, Tyrod would be the future. But there are far too many games where we struggle to get to 150 or 200 yards passing. I don't disagree at all. I was disputing "they figured him out." I don't disagree that he has been inconsistent. By the nature of "figured out" your best game can't be your most recent. Take Trent Edwards as an example, there was a clear and defining point where he was done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I don't disagree at all. I was disputing "they figured him out." I don't disagree that he has been inconsistent. By the nature of "figured out" your best game can't be your most recent. Take Trent Edwards as an example, there was a clear and defining point where he was done. ....doesn't "figured HIM out" put the onus more on him versus play calling?.....or even coaching?......isn't is more incumbent on quality coaching (COUGH) to curtail his propensity to take off scrambling prematurely as well as a game plan employing quicker reads/outs if that is where he struggles?..."stuck in cement coaching & game planning" are the bigger culprits versus him PERSONALLY being "figured out"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 ....doesn't "figured HIM out" put the onus more on him versus play calling?.....or even coaching?......isn't is more incumbent on quality coaching (COUGH) to curtail his propensity to take off scrambling prematurely as well as a game plan employing quicker reads/outs if that is where he struggles?..."stuck in cement coaching & game planning" are the bigger culprits versus him PERSONALLY being "figured out"... I think we are going to look back at what Roman did with Tyrod his first season and have a new appreciation for him. It's like Fairchild and Losman. Both OCs made flawed qbs able to help win some games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 ....doesn't "figured HIM out" put the onus more on him versus play calling?.....or even coaching?......isn't is more incumbent on quality coaching (COUGH) to curtail his propensity to take off scrambling prematurely as well as a game plan employing quicker reads/outs if that is where he struggles?..."stuck in cement coaching & game planning" are the bigger culprits versus him PERSONALLY being "figured out"...I think that they tried to put Tyrod in position to do what he did best. At the same time the design of the passing game was pretty poor and probably hurt him some. It's a little bit of both imo. I think I'm some ways they helped him and in others hurt him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I think that they tried to put Tyrod in position to do what he did best. At the same time the design of the passing game was pretty poor and probably hurt him some. It's a little bit of both imo. I think I'm some ways they helped him and in others hurt him. Was it poor or was it because of what Tyrod can do? I think that is the big question. Guys got open last year and were missed. Everyone hates Roman but have Kaepernick or Smith proven to be much better passers without him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I think we are going to look back at what Roman did with Tyrod his first season and have a new appreciation for him. It's like Fairchild and Losman. Both OCs made flawed qbs able to help win some games. ...not 100% convinced bud....I know Roman went ballistic internally when Cassel was traded......so I'm not sure how much he was enamored with being fed TT as his "second fiddle" and we'll NEVER know...Fairchild and Losman was a marriage made in hell....re-read the 2004 draft prognostications citing Losman as the "heir apparent gunslinger to Favre" with pundits saying he would go to the Pack,, but Donohole jumped them....Losman publicly said, "wait until you see when we open this thing up" and Fairchild did the exact opposite....maybe why he ended up at Colorado State and was then canned, never to return to NFL...Dennison & TT did work together with Ravens, so maybe that pays off in the long run....stay tuned........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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