Watch, Elway will find a QB

[MAJBobby]

Buffalo - 9th in pts/g

 

Denver - 21st in pts/g

In terms of QB he is better than ours.

 

It is nice that we get garbage time points and run up points in bad football teams

[klos63]

He tried. He drafted two (including one with his first pick, something the Bills have never done as a franchise). He also tried to re-sign Osweiler at a reasonable rate but the Texans handed him a ridiculous contract.

So he tried 3 times this season and failed, after successfully scouring the earth and finding Peyton?

Siemian actually isn't that bad.

 

I can say he has more 300 yards games than out game manager

We could probably get some 300 yard passing games if we stopped handing off to Shady and Gilislee so often.

[GunnerBill]

Just on the Seahawks / Wilson model.

 

Seattle when they drafted Wilson had the highest paid OLine in the league that year. This year I think they have the 31st most expensive or something. They had one of the highest paid RBs now they have one of the cheapest. It is the same plan I think the Bills were hoping to follow. While your QB develops you treat him as a complimentary offensive piece (not saying TT has ever been as accurate or as good as RW) you pay a top tier RB and you pay your linemen to keep him clean. As he develops you wean him off that support and put more directly on his plate. The difference between Buffalo and Seattle is the QB has gone backwards not forwards.

[MDH]

If you want to see how a real organization behaves - watch what John Elway does this offseason. I'll put my chips on the table that he goes out and finds a solid QB to leverage his historically great defense while their window to win stays open. He won't be content to hand the keys to Lynch or Siemian (though notice he drafted two last year, one first and one last). Be it Romo or Biridgewater or someone else, I'm guessing Elway recognizes you need a QB to win games and does what it takes to find one.

 

Wish Whaley would take the same approach...

 

The difference is he has players WILLING to go there. If Romo gets traded he'd love to land in Denver. He'd never agree to go to Buffalo and I don't see the Cowboys moving him somewhere he doesn't want to go.

 

People don't want to hear it but that helps a great deal. It's a cycle, once you become a successful franchise it's easier to get players to come to it.

[Beef Jerky]

If you want to see how a real organization behaves - watch what John Elway does this offseason. I'll put my chips on the table that he goes out and finds a solid QB to leverage his historically great defense while their window to win stays open. He won't be content to hand the keys to Lynch or Siemian (though notice he drafted two last year, one first and one last). Be it Romo or Biridgewater or someone else, I'm guessing Elway recognizes you need a QB to win games and does what it takes to find one.

 

Wish Whaley would take the same approach...

Wait so he whiffed on two QBs and yet you say he will find one?

 

Whaley was wrong about one and he is the guy getting **** on...

Edited December 19, 2016 by Beef Jerky

[BuffaloHokie13]

Just on the Seahawks / Wilson model.

 

Seattle when they drafted Wilson had the highest paid OLine in the league that year. This year I think they have the 31st most expensive or something. They had one of the highest paid RBs now they have one of the cheapest. It is the same plan I think the Bills were hoping to follow. While your QB develops you treat him as a complimentary offensive piece (not saying TT has ever been as accurate or as good as RW) you pay a top tier RB and you pay your linemen to keep him clean. As he develops you wean him off that support and put more directly on his plate. The difference between Buffalo and Seattle is the QB has gone backwards not forwards.

Not disagreeing with any of what you said, but the Defense has also been a pretty big difference between Seattle (when RW came in) and Buffalo. Winning breeds confidence.

[bobobonators]

Points don't actually SHOW A QB performance. Siemiens can't throw and catch the ball and the games I have seen the Denver WR had the dropsies. Add in a God awful O line and a league worse Run O and you get that Offense.

 

Oh and most Denver fans agree with me that it isn't the QB I would defer to their knowledge of their team.

Welcome to TSW where excuses are made for every QB in the NFL except our own. In one sentence you managed to give the guy 3 excuses. Fitting right in already.

In terms of QB he is better than ours.

 

It is nice that we get garbage time points and run up points in bad football teams

Keep telling yourself that. I guess we've been getting garbage time points for 2 years now bc we're top 10 for 2 seasons now in pts/game. How lucky of us.

[PatsFanNH]

Welcome to TSW where excuses are made for every QB in the NFL except our own. In one sentence you managed to give the guy 3 excuses. Fitting right in already.

 

Keep telling yourself that. I guess we've been getting garbage time points for 2 years now bc we're top 10 for 2 seasons now in pts/game. How lucky of us.

Hey I will defer to the Bronco fans, I say they know MORE about their team than either of us. Pretty much all of them find no fault with Siemien most hate on Thomas and the Oline and Kubiak a lot lol

[C.Biscuit97]

Good topic.

 

1) Elway hasn't been great at identify qb talent (of course who is except the hindsight crowd). He fell into an all time great qb who was only available because he had next surgery. He wanted to keep BO, who stinks. And Lynch looks shaky.

 

2) that said, he is constantly trying to upgrade the position, and I think that is the OP's point. And I definitely agree with that philosophy. You keep trying until you get lucky.

 

But then posters shouldn't cry about EJ because like him or not it's a shot. We need to take more of those and they did draft Jones last year while trying to see if Taylor could take the next step.

 

The next question has to be how long do you give a guy to learn on the job. I saw a stat that EJ and Carr had very similar stats through 16 games to start their career. But you also have to realize when to pull the plug. It's never easy with qbs.

 

But the Bills fail to take enough shots to get lucky. I have less patience for TT because he is an older player. There without a doubt should be an early round qb taken this year, regardless what they think about Jones.

[Beef Jerky]

Good topic.

 

1) Elway hasn't been great at identify qb talent (of course who is except the hindsight crowd). He fell into an all time great qb who was only available because he had next surgery. He wanted to keep BO, who stinks. And Lynch looks shaky.

 

2) that said, he is constantly trying to upgrade the position, and I think that is the OP's point. And I definitely agree with that philosophy. You keep trying until you get lucky.

 

But then posters shouldn't cry about EJ because like him or not it's a shot. We need to take more of those and they did draft Jones last year while trying to see if Taylor could take the next step.

 

The next question has to be how long do you give a guy to learn on the job. I saw a stat that EJ and Carr had very similar stats through 16 games to start their career. But you also have to realize when to pull the plug. It's never easy with qbs.

 

But the Bills fail to take enough shots to get lucky. I have less patience for TT because he is an older player. There without a doubt should be an early round qb taken this year, regardless what they think about Jones.

Bills have been doing the same as the Broncos. I don't doubt they draft another QB next year also.

[C.Biscuit97]

Hey I will defer to the Bronco fans, I say they know MORE about their team than either of us. Pretty much all of them find no fault with Siemien most hate on Thomas and the Oline and Kubiak a lot lol

As someone who had Thomas in all leagues, Siemen has killed his value. Thomas had some big drops but he was probably shocked they even threw the ball that far down the field.

 

Siemen has proven to be very serviceable, but he is the definition of a JAG.

[Coach Tuesday]

Good topic.

 

1) Elway hasn't been great at identify qb talent (of course who is except the hindsight crowd). He fell into an all time great qb who was only available because he had next surgery. He wanted to keep BO, who stinks. And Lynch looks shaky.

 

2) that said, he is constantly trying to upgrade the position, and I think that is the OP's point. And I definitely agree with that philosophy. You keep trying until you get lucky.

 

But then posters shouldn't cry about EJ because like him or not it's a shot. We need to take more of those and they did draft Jones last year while trying to see if Taylor could take the next step.

 

The next question has to be how long do you give a guy to learn on the job. I saw a stat that EJ and Carr had very similar stats through 16 games to start their career. But you also have to realize when to pull the plug. It's never easy with qbs.

 

But the Bills fail to take enough shots to get lucky. I have less patience for TT because he is an older player. There without a doubt should be an early round qb taken this year, regardless what they think about Jones.

 

Agree 100%. And thank you for accurately summarizing my point. I don't fault them for EJ. I fault them for passing on other QBs who they should've drafted despite having EJ.

[klos63]

Hey I will defer to the Bronco fans, I say they know MORE about their team than either of us. Pretty much all of them find no fault with Siemien most hate on Thomas and the Oline and Kubiak a lot lol

So the 'knowledgeable' Bronco fans already have it in for their Super Bowl winning coach, they sound as petty as any other fan base.

[C.Biscuit97]

 

Agree 100%. And thank you for accurately summarizing my point. I don't fault them for EJ. I fault them for passing on other QBs who they should've drafted despite having EJ.

But that's where it gets tricky in my eyes and a huge divide between Whaley and Marrone. How long do we let a young qb play through struggles? EJ and Carr had very similar stats through their first 16 starts. One got to to keep playing and one got pulled after a 2-2 record his 2nd year. It's not to say EJ would be Carr but who knows.

 

So how long do you commit to a guy before pulling them? But I have zero problem with drafting a couple guys this year, getting a journeyman, & Jones and having them battle it out.

[Coach Tuesday]

But that's where it gets tricky in my eyes and a huge divide between Whaley and Marrone. How long do we let a young qb play through struggles? EJ and Carr had very similar stats through their first 16 starts. One got to to keep playing and one got pulled after a 2-2 record his 2nd year. It's not to say EJ would be Carr but who knows.

 

So how long do you commit to a guy before pulling them? But I have zero problem with drafting a couple guys this year, getting a journeyman, & Jones and having them battle it out.

 

EJ simply cannot process what is going on around him quickly enough to (i) make the right decision and (ii) re-set his body to make an accurate throw to the proper location. Perhaps they should've known that when they scouted him but regardless, it became pretty apparent once he started playing. EJ is never going to become Carr.

[PatsFanNH]

So the 'knowledgeable' Bronco fans already have it in for their Super Bowl winning coach, they sound as petty as any other fan base.

Yup already a fire Kubiak thread and everything.

[yungmack]

There's not as much organisational chaos in Denver as there is in Buffalo. Elway has the freedom to do whatever he pleases and, when it comes to quarterbacks, who in that FO is going to tell John Elway that they know better?

 

I've made my frustration with Whaley known when it comes to QB but are we entirely sure he has enough power to get a controlling say? EJ may or may not have been his pick but he took ownership of it after the fact, poor pick. Rex comes in and pretty much demands Taylor, he's not worked out. If Rex has the same reporting authority to ownership as the GM does, who knows if Whaley is even truly in charge.

What organizational chaos are you talking about? Everything seems smooth, with everyone on the same page with a single exception, and that would be the head coach. There's nary a sign of disharmony otherwise. There's more disharmony around here on any single thread than in a year at OBD.

[yungmack]

Good topic.

1) Elway hasn't been great at identify qb talent (of course who is except the hindsight crowd). He fell into an all time great qb who was only available because he had next surgery. He wanted to keep BO, who stinks. And Lynch looks shaky.

2) that said, he is constantly trying to upgrade the position, and I think that is the OP's point. And I definitely agree with that philosophy. You keep trying until you get lucky.

But then posters shouldn't cry about EJ because like him or not it's a shot. We need to take more of those and they did draft Jones last year while trying to see if Taylor could take the next step.

The next question has to be how long do you give a guy to learn on the job. I saw a stat that EJ and Carr had very similar stats through 16 games to start their career. But you also have to realize when to pull the plug. It's never easy with qbs.

But the Bills fail to take enough shots to get lucky. I have less patience for TT because he is an older player. There without a doubt should be an early round qb taken this year, regardless what they think about Jones.

At the moment, the Bills have two QBs they drafted and the 3rd is the equivalent of a draft pick in that he wasn't a starter, much less a star, like Manning or others. He was something of shot in the dark like a draft pick. I think this pretty much undermines the false "fact" that the Bills under Whaley don't expend picks on QBs. Whaley's only had the reins for a couple of years; it isn't right to blame him for the previous 50 years.

[metzelaars_lives]

Lol except Denver problem isn't at QB. If you watched yesterday's game you saw Thomas drop 3-4 balls and an O line that just sucks beyond belief. I see Elway going out and stocking up on O lineman this offseason if he doesn't he could have the GOAT at QB and still lose.

Correct. I live in Denver. The Broncos have had a consistently bad offensive line his entire time there. The Bills have a top 5-10 offensive line in football when healthy. I guess Whaley's a genius at finding OL talent and Elway is clueless. Same with running backs. But Elway is a genius when it comes to bringing in top 3 all time QB's, a talent that Whaley just doesn't have. Edited December 19, 2016 by metzelaars_lives

[PolishDave]

Correct. I live in Denver. The Broncos have had a consistently bad offensive line his entire time there. The Bills have a top 5-10 offensive line in football when healthy. I guess Whaley's a genius at finding OL talent and Elway is clueless. Same with running backs. But Elway is a genius when it comes to bringing in top 3 all time QB's, a talent that Whaley just doesn't have.

 

Yeah, okay. Not even close when considering pass protection. They left side of the line is decent (still better at running than pass protection). The right side of the line flat out sucks. Top 5-10 my ass. healthy or not.