Kelly the Dog Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 40 time relates to speed. His basic problem is that he is slow -- painfully slow. Speed is a fair indicator of an ability to not be slow. 10 and 20 yard times do for OL. Some OL cant runs 40s because they tire out and their last 10 yards are terrible. The first 10 are 100x more important than the last 10. The first 20 are 20x more important than the last 20. The start to the 40 is the thing that matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndirish1978 Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 One off negative Nancy-ism. That's all this OP has given us with the post. Let's just not mention Seantrel Henderson, a 7th round pick playing more like a 2nd rounder. What about Kyle Williams, a pro-bowler, selected in the 5th round? What about Preston Brown, a starter and also just a 3rd round pick? Most of the roster is 1st and 2nd round picks, which I wouldn't have assumed would be the case, but to focus on one guy is myopic. Myopic would be your choice to berate the OP for asking a legitimate question. Perhaps he was looking for an answer rather than a diss on his question. Urbick was benched for Richardson, an inferior player. Hairston, a decent tackle, was kept on the bench while Henderson struggled badly. Last year the coaches delayed replacing what may have been the worst guard in the league for half the season. Spiller, an extraordinary player under Chan, was mediocre under Hackett and Marrone, who also arguably did not use Watkins effectively, either (especially when I see how the Giants use Odell). My point is that there's good reason to suppose these coaches do not know how to work with players, so maybe Cujo--and EJ for that matter--might be better than is generally supposed. THIS. I find it worrisome that the coaching staff made our 2nd rounder sit on the bench and gain zero game experience all year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 He couldn't make it as a tackle so they moved him to guard...so now he guards the water bucket heyoooo He's here all week folks! CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 10 and 20 yard times do for OL. Some OL cant runs 40s because they tire out and their last 10 yards are terrible. The first 10 are 100x more important than the last 10. The first 20 are 20x more important than the last 20. The start to the 40 is the thing that matters. Don't disagree, but if you're the slowest guy among hundreds of people, that's bad. And 5.63 is incredibly slow. but speed for a tackle is rarely 40 yards straight line. he isnt running fly routes. i have no idea how his 10 yard split looked but that would be higher on my list, and foot speed to get set in his stance and move laterally is nothing to do with a 40 yard dash. True, but again, if you can't run 40 yards in under 5.5 seconds, you are slow by any definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Don't disagree, but if you're the slowest guy among hundreds of people, that's bad. And 5.63 is incredibly slow. True, but again, if you can't run 40 yards in under 5.5 seconds, you are slow by any definition. The guy who was just above Cyrus, Gabe Jackson, who was also 5.5+ was great this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 (edited) The guy who was just above Cyrus, Gabe Jackson, who was also 5.5+ was great this year. Interesting. Jackson also had the slowest 20 yard split at the combine too (3.28 seconds). Jackson, who is 6'3", played guard and has an ideal size for it. You can be less at athletic at that position as long as you can get leverage. CK is slow for a tackle and probably too tall for guard. Edited December 30, 2014 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Interesting. Jackson also had the slowest 20 yard split at the combine too (3.28 seconds). He has bad knees, so he may be an exception. But I would argue even the 20 times don't mean anything, just way more than 40 would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 I didnt like the pick then and I really dont like it now CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 I'll take the high road here and say we had enough problems already. I hope next year he's healthy, stronger, coached up and makes a big jump. I have hope for all 3 rookie oline men coming back healthy, stronger, coached up and making big jumps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookieG Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Quickness is far more important in an OL than speed. Show me his 5-yard, or 10-yard time. 1.91 for his 10 3.19 for his 20 By comparison, guys like Robinson, Lewan and Matthews had 10 yard splits around 1.7 and 20 yard splits in the low 2.8's. Henderson actually had similar numbers to them. At the combine, it was almost an eye opener to see how lumbering and lethargic he looked. That's why all of the questions about his knee came up. The Bills took a chance. He had/has trouble with speed rushers, but other than that..played like the All American he became. He could be dominant, especially in the run game. But he most definitely came with some red flags. He wasn't a "solid but unspectacular" type of prospect. More of a "he can be dominant if..." type of guy. Whether he'll ever be able to compensate for his lack of athleticism, or whether it improves, is anyone's guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalScotts Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 when he was drafted he was just 20....not a plug and play guy. Huge upside just bringing him along slowly again 20 playing against 27-32 year olds. He'll be fine in my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick the Greek Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 And to think about how mad he looked when he got picked by the Buffalo Bills. He probably got a nice 2nd round contract when in reality he shold be working at a gas station. What a load a BS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 1.91 for his 10 3.19 for his 20 By comparison, guys like Robinson, Lewan and Matthews had 10 yard splits around 1.7 and 20 yard splits in the low 2.8's. Henderson actually had similar numbers to them. At the combine, it was almost an eye opener to see how lumbering and lethargic he looked. That's why all of the questions about his knee came up. The Bills took a chance. He had/has trouble with speed rushers, but other than that..played like the All American he became. He could be dominant, especially in the run game. But he most definitely came with some red flags. He wasn't a "solid but unspectacular" type of prospect. More of a "he can be dominant if..." type of guy. Whether he'll ever be able to compensate for his lack of athleticism, or whether it improves, is anyone's guess. Thanks! Good info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper13 Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 2nd round pick, starting LT at Alabama and he was so bad that they moved him to guard and then he was inactive for every single game. Did not even trust him to back up for one meaningless game on what most people think is a below average OL. They had 5th and 7th round picks at OL starting most of the year. If he would have been a 4th round pick they would have just straight up cut him. Just can't miss that badly on a 2nd round pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Why not put him in at some point? Why did he even go pro? More "great drafting" by Whaley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Also, Kujo was roundly criticized for his performance at the combine, for being slow and out of shape. But pretty much all of the criticism said it knocked him out of the middle of the first round, or one of the top couple OTs taken, and would then go late in the first or even into the second round, which is where we took him. There were a couple reports of teams taking him off their draft board because of knee concerns and arthritis, but he was cleared by Dr. Joseph Andrews, who sent a letter to all 32 teams, and I believe that meant the first round, not that he was undraftable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 It's pathetic when your second round pick can't even get a single snap the entire season. + 1000 BINGO. What the hell is that all about??? With the O line being as BAD as it was... Maybe they didn't what his arthritic knee to flare up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 2nd round pick, starting LT at Alabama and he was so bad that they moved him to guard and then he was inactive for every single game. Did not even trust him to back up for one meaningless game on what most people think is a below average OL. They had 5th and 7th round picks at OL starting most of the year. If he would have been a 4th round pick they would have just straight up cut him. Just can't miss that badly on a 2nd round pick. Yep. The problem is not that he failed to earn stariting job or played poorly when he did play--CK was inactive for most games and I understand he got zero offensive snaps during the regular season, and this on a team with possibly the worst offensive line in the NFL. Those who saw him in training camp said he was absolutely pathetic. And remember, this was touted as the deepest draft in history, and CK started at left tackle on the SEC's most dominant offensive line. The guy should not be a "project" and was not sold as such. I understand that patience is required with draft picks, especially on the o-line, but this level of suckitude is deeply disappointing and speaks poorly for the Bills' ability to evaluate and draft offensive linemen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Interesting. Jackson also had the slowest 20 yard split at the combine too (3.28 seconds). Jackson, who is 6'3", played guard and has an ideal size for it. You can be less at athletic at that position as long as you can get leverage. CK is slow for a tackle and probably too tall for guard. Awesome selection with your 2nd overall pick, wouldn't you say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Why is it WR's DB's, and LB's can all rotate in throughout the season to get some playing time and see how they do. Hogan, Duke Williams, and a host of LB's did that this year. Why can't the same thing be done at OL? Why do the same 5 have to play the whole game? Why not rotate the guards and tackles for a couple of series a game? I think continuity is overrated. Yes if all five are good then by all means play all five. But you can argue three of the five were below average to awful all year long. No reason why CK could not have dressed for a couple of games and played a few series. No reason Richardson could not have gotten a few plays at RG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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