WNY Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Tired of seeing screen grabs like this one: Do you or anybody else know when this play took place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 23, 2014 Author Share Posted December 23, 2014 9:17 to go in the third. Down 16-10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Show me the passing lanes to ANY of those open receivers. (Not that he had one to...whoever that is at the top of the pic, I can't tell.) I never thought Orton was any good, but it's the line that's the real problem. And if he'd passed it to the wide-open Lee, you'd just be bitching about him dumping it off. Good question. And another case of selective posting. A picture may be worth a 1,000 words only if there aren't other pictures taken a split second before and a split second after that tell another story. Wonder if the Cat will bring that into evidence. I've watched this play right now, and let's just say it's not as cut and dried as the offending picture leads one to believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Good question. And another case of selective posting. A picture may be worth a 1,000 words only if there aren't other pictures taken a split second before and a split second after that tell another story. Wonder if the Cat will bring that into evidence. I've watched this play right now, and let's just say it's not as cut and dried as the offending picture leads one to believe. Woods is running full speed. He will cover 6-7 yards in one full second. But apparently a Raider DB who is 4 yards away from him and watching Orton all the way, couldn't have covered him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Woods is running full speed. He will cover 6-7 yards in one full second. But apparently a Raider DB who is 4 yards away from him and watching Orton all the way, couldn't have covered him. Realistically, outside Woods Orton's only option was Gray. The red circles around Watkins & Smith are false flags. No way would he be able to complete the pass to either, despite them being open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Realistically, outside Woods Orton's only option was Gray. The red circles around Watkins & Smith are false flags. No way would he be able to complete the pass to either, despite them being open. Watkins isn't open whatsoever there. And if Orton suddenly stopped and turned and threw back to Smith (which is criminal to begin with), it's an easy pick six. It's actually a great shot of the Raiders defense who are all looking at the QB's eyes and are in position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juice_32 Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Tired of seeing screen grabs like this one: its all the o-lines fault! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Looks like a horrendous decision. But he's already in his throwing motion. The defender at the 38 has already has already let the Bills player at the 40 or so who is wide open go. I would imagine he was right on him a half second ago. The player wide open, Lee Smith, on the other side of the field likely would have been an INT if Orton turned to him, or a 5 yard gain. There is a Raider looking at Orton right there. The bad decision, obviously, is starting the pass with the Raider right on the guy he was throwing too. But the Bills who look wide open on plays like that are usually not wide open a second before when the QB is still looking. He's already starting his motion. Defenders watch QBs and leave their man as soon as they know it isn't coming to them. Terrible decision by Orton though. Also, looking up the center of the field from the QB perspective, there are 2 300 lb guys coming right at him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Also, looking up the center of the field from the QB perspective, there are 2 300 lb guys coming right at him. Yup, that's why there's no way he could have made a throw to any of the guys to his left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Yup, that's why there's no way he could have made a throw to any of the guys to his left. The picture is worth 1000 words, but about 950 of them are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNY Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 9:17 to go in the third. Down 16-10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 The picture is worth 1000 words, but about 950 of them are wrong. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Yup, that's why there's no way he could have made a throw to any of the guys to his left. Didn't I already point out all this ****? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 They're in a Cover 1 on 1st down because they have absolutely zero fear of the Bills hurting them downfield. Orton has two primary reads here, the first is the one he actually took up the right sideline; the other is waiting for Watkins to come clean on the drag route, but only if he's willing to wait on it. He's clearly not willing to wait on it (possibly for good reason) so he went with the default option of the outside throw against that defense. If he is stupid enough to throw the post against a Cover 1 like The Big Clueless wants him to, its an automatic pick unless the WR makes a great defensive play. Didn't I already point out all this ****? Yeah, but we still have 840 words to play with..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 he's trying to improve his QBR rating by taking the higher degree of difficulty option throwing to the only guy covered. anybody can hit a wide open reciever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 anybody can hit a wide open reciever. Not Geno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Not up the middle (where there's a jail break) or to the left (where there's a pending jail break), which is where the open receivers are. And this isn't to defend Orton. It's to point out that hating on Orton blinds everyone to the fact that there's serious dysfunction ALL over the field. and its a screen shot after he started his throw, so the safety already broke outside and didnt crash down on the other receivers which makes it look worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 What was the outcome of the play? What is the context of the play? Like down and distance? What time during the game? How long was Orton standing in the pocket before this decision is made? And can we see a screen shot from 1 second before this one (at the time when the decision was made to throw the football). This photo makes it look like a really bad decision, and it may well have been a terrible decision. Wish I knew those other factors though. Without them, this photo could be quite misleading. I have beeing arguing something similar to this for a while now. I think people are looking at the wrong frames in the all-22 videos. Passing lanes are one thing people miss a lot. Also, the wind up for the throw, once the defense knows where the QB is going with the ball, the pull off their coverage, and suddenly everybody looks open. In real time it is tough to distinguish, when the decision is made and when a receiver is open. I though the Houston game was a prime example. Guys were not running around open all game, in fact coverage was pretty good. This screen shot needs to be one second sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 They're in a Cover 1 on 1st down because they have absolutely zero fear of the Bills hurting them downfield. Orton has two primary reads here, the first is the one he actually took up the right sideline; the other is waiting for Watkins to come clean on the drag route, but only if he's willing to wait on it. He's clearly not willing to wait on it (possibly for good reason) so he went with the default option of the outside throw against that defense. If he is stupid enough to throw the post against a Cover 1 like The Big Clueless wants him to, its an automatic pick unless the WR makes a great defensive play. Yeah, but we still have 840 words to play with..... If he waits for the play to progress for Watkins to be in a position to make the catch, Mack is in the passing lane and ready to unload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNY Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Good thing they abandoned the run game by then. Maybe their thought of 13 total rushing yards was a success. Passing the ball almost 50 times a game (Especially with this OL) will result in poor QB decision making from time to time. I believe its a culmination of issues, but the OL is the main culprit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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