My goat of the game

[BADOLBILZ]

I am not about to give up on this team ever. I was wondering if anyone had called out Manny Lawson. He lost contain on two big TD plays. The 4th and 1 where Jamaal Charles got a TD and then later when Alex Smith ran for the TD. Both times he overpursued inside and gave up the edge. I think if anyone needs a negative mark in this game he has to be near the top of the list.

 

It was discussed after the game at our tailgate. It's my belief that the reserve DL were on the field too often and that it was because the coaches were trying to reduce the workload of the starters with a Thursday night game coming up. I don't want my LDE who is playing at a Pro Bowl level off the field when the opponent is in our territory. There were games earlier in the season when Lawson wasn't getting many snaps at all and he was on the field a ton yesterday. Half-steppin by a coaching staff that was playing not to lose and looking ahead to the next game at the same time, IMO.

Edited November 10, 2014 by BADOLBEELZ

[Pneumonic]

That was a horrible display of lacking the most basic of fundamentals. Almost inexcusable for a 9th year vet.

[34-78-83]

Manny is a Vet and has been a starter. He simply blew contain there... He knows (and should know) better and was not putting the team in a position where his game experience would have hindered the team on a 4th down play. He simply failed his responsibility. If Manny were a classic backup who never really sees the field without injury, I'd think differently of it. Manny was playing the right end for Hughes on the 4th down I believe...

[26CornerBlitz]

Manny is a Vet and has been a starter. He simply blew contain there... He knows (and should know) better and was not putting the team in a position where his game experience would have hindered the team on a 4th down play. He simply failed his responsibility. If Manny were a classic backup who never really sees the field without injury, I'd think differently of it. Manny was playing the right end for Hughes on the 4th down I believe...

 

Preston Brown said it was 100% his responsibility on the 4 and 1 Charles TD run.

Edited November 10, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz

[John from Riverside]

+1

 

They can't blame EJ for the red zone inadequacies now.

 

We should be saying something about his multiple passes that went nowhere but 2 feet in front of him!

 

Why is EJ even in this conversation

[34-78-83]

Preston Brown said it was 100% his responsibility on the 4 and 1 Charles TD run.

 

There were 2 gash runs. I believe Preston overshot his gap on the other one, but on the 40 yd TD the Qb read for the pitch was based on Manny and where he committed to. I don't see how Brown would be responsible for getting out to the edge.

[26CornerBlitz]

There were 2 gash runs. I believe Preston overshot his gap on the other one, but on the 40 yd TD the Qb read for the pitch was based on Manny and where he committed to. I don't see how Brown would be responsible for getting out to the edge.

Listen to what Preston Brown had to say:

 

Preston Brown: "That's a play we want to get back" (1:32)

[BADOLBILZ]

Preston Brown said it was 100% his responsibility on the 4 and 1 Charles TD run.

 

Capaccio noted that on the postgame as well. The question IMO is does your star DE make the play if he is in there? I get that you gotta give your starters some rest but the reserves are reserves for a reason. They may look good for a few snaps but the difference between the two becomes more clear with more PT. They appeared to play a lot yesterday. But in truth that whole drive was made possible by the play-not-to-lose approach of this staff. After the Bills went up 13-3 Schwartz had his CB's play off and let Smith steadily more the Chiefs down the field. If they had continued to play their style the Chiefs weren't getting into the endzone AT ALL yesterday against that D. Schwartz past as a loser HC was on display there. You can go 7-9 every year playing not to lose but if you want to win in the NFL you have to be aggressive.

[CardinalScotts]

Certainly we can blame Bryce/Leodis/Marrone for the loss, but my vote goes to Manny Lawson. He lost containment on 2 plays both leading to TDs. If he plays his position correctly on the Charles TD run, he may have stopped him for a loss and the Bills get the ball back-worst case here they get the first but not a long TD run. Also same mistake on the Alex Smith TD Run. Hopefully coaches show him and he learns

 

classic case of not really knowing what's going on and what the responsibilities are of each player, we do the same thing guessing on offense or Hacketts play calling. Does Marrone tell him what to run ? We don't know

[Big Gun]

Fully agree.

 

 

 

Disagree. The plays weren't there and needed to be killed. Good QBs do that to avoid sacks and/or turnovers by trying to force things.

 

 

Yep! +1

 

Pretty obvious the football IQ lacking argumentative vocal ones don't understand that.

[Big Turk]

 

 

Preston Brown said it was 100% his responsibility on the 4 and 1 Charles TD run.

 

Means Lawson was supposed to crash down and Brown was supposed to spill down the line to contain that play...which means Lawson did his job correctly

Edited November 11, 2014 by matter2003

[Agent 91]

 

 

Impossible to know if that was his responsibility...he might have been crashing down with one of the other LBs spilling out to the flat...unless they specifically said it was on him we can't be certain he didn't do what he was supposed to on that play

 

 

 

Ya, Orton was off after the first quarter...was frustrating to see how many easy throws he has been routinely making that he missed on..

 

On the Lawson point. I made reference to that in another thread. Maybe Lawson was the issue. BUT a smart gambling DC is gonna crash down on JAMAAL FREAKIN CHARLES. Who thought Smith would beat us with his legs. I get the gamble. Both times. I thought Bradham should have been there on the misdirection and Aaron Williams took a bad angle and got turned around on the charles touchdown. I just think I dont want to discredit Jamaal Charles and I dont want to paint the picture that Charles has no escapability. When Corey Graham made the open field tackle the announcers were all up in arms about the "great play". We need better contain but like you said... there is no way to know the responsibilities of players. Its not always what it seems

[Agent 91]

Obviously they have been talking to him about throwing the ball away instead of taking sacks. He did just that. Orton had an off day for sure, but we still win the game without those two fumbles. Period, McKelvin's was even more egregious than Brown's because it wasn't the defense making a play, it was just him being stupid. No way he should have fumbled that ball. He could have even fair caught it and we still win the game. Pathetic and he has been making boneheaded plays like this for years.

 

Under different circumstances yes. The fumble killed us. BUT in the case of we had a big MCKELVIN return to the 25 and more than 2 minutes to punch it in. Orton didnt get it done. It took me 4 games to look at him as a legit QB and not some outcast joke of a man. So im not going to act like he is trash because of this game. But when we needed something to happen. The offense... like the vast majority of the game let us down. Blame who you want. But lets make this what it is. We had bone head fumbles and butterfingers. But despite it all we had the chance to win. That O has to get better. EJ Orton or acquisition we need someone who can make a play. But it doesnt just fall on the players. We need smarter decisions by the sidelines.

 

 

 

There were 2 gash runs. I believe Preston overshot his gap on the other one, but on the 40 yd TD the Qb read for the pitch was based on Manny and where he committed to. I don't see how Brown would be responsible for getting out to the edge.

 

It wasnt really a read. It was a misdirection. Pitch. That was going charles the whole time

Edited November 11, 2014 by Agent 91

[34-78-83]

Under different circumstances yes. The fumble killed us. BUT in the case of we had a big MCKELVIN return to the 25 and more than 2 minutes to punch it in. Orton didnt get it done. It took me 4 games to look at him as a legit QB and not some outcast joke of a man. So im not going to act like he is trash because of this game. But when we needed something to happen. The offense... like the vast majority of the game let us down. Blame who you want. But lets make this what it is. We had bone head fumbles and butterfingers. But despite it all we had the chance to win. That O has to get better. EJ Orton or acquisition we need someone who can make a play. But it doesnt just fall on the players. We need smarter decisions by the sidelines.

 

 

 

It wasnt really a read. It was a misdirection. Pitch. That was going charles the whole time

ah , could well be... To me, Smith looked to have the option there to sneak for the yard if our look dictated it.

[3rdand12]

Impossible to know if that was his responsibility...he might have been crashing down with one of the other LBs spilling out to the flat...unless they specifically said it was on him we can't be certain he didn't do what he was supposed to on that play

 

 

 

Ya, Orton was off after the first quarter...was frustrating to see how many easy throws he has been routinely making that he missed on..

He should have set the edge. I thought it was obvious he cheated inside.

Then he got beat again for the same mistake.

I dont care what the play call is he should be smarter than that and seen the play coming his way at the snap.

Lawson is my goat by far . That play with Charles took the wind out of the Bills Sails.

sure mistakes are made and maybe thats on Jim S having no safety help. I dont know.

 

Leodis should not have been f'n around trying to make a play.

Chandler is excused. He is just not athletic enough to fall on the ball in that short space.

Brown lost discipline in his excitement.

Orton had a frustrating game . drops and poor passing late.

team loss.

better fix that red zone attack Doug. its sucks. Boobie and Summers. When ya get that working Bills will have something. Must be able to move the pile.

The only guy i am still pissed at is Manny. He is smarter than that , right ?

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

I agree Lawson over pursued both times and got caught. His job is contain outside and he didn't. What I fail to understand is why the second stringers always seem to be playing during critical moments

 

I agree Lawson over pursued both times and got caught. His job is contain outside and he didn't. What I fail to understand is why the second stringers always seem to be playing during critical moments

[26CornerBlitz]

I agree Lawson over pursued both times and got caught. His job is contain outside and he didn't. What I fail to understand is why the second stringers always seem to be playing during critical moments

 

I agree Lawson over pursued both times and got caught. His job is contain outside and he didn't. What I fail to understand is why the second stringers always seem to be playing during critical moments

 

You must have missed where Preston Brown said it was totally his responsibility for outside contain on the Charles TD run.

[3rdand12]

You must have missed where Preston Brown said it was totally his responsibility for outside contain on the Charles TD run.

I saw it. But Lawson did not react. Just because Brown is owning up does not make it a done deal. Lawson took the inside shoulder. He should have kept his man straight up at least with drive block and used his hands , he committed and lost any chance shed his guy and step outside . Brown could have filled the inside gap much easier and quicker . Some one needs to all- 22 two this sucker. I dont mind being wrong. If Jim called the wrong play than i can easily shift the blame !! Edited November 11, 2014 by 3rdand12

[Bills Fan of St Augustine]

I listened and it sounds to me like Brown is just not throwing Manny under the bus. I was at the game and Lawson cost us with two big misses in containment. Both were obvious and the guy ran right by him as he crashed inside with the fake. My goats go in order, Brown, McKelevin, Hackett and Lawson. Too many mistakes, too many poor calls...Orton should be expected not to loose games like EJ was, but to expect him to be the savior behind a marginal OL is asking too much for the journeyman QB he is. I thought the OL played pretty well and the D as a whole were lights out awesome! I had a lot of fun watching the first half when the Chefs had the ball. Great D performance wasted by too many mistakes and poor play selection. Freddy is a warrior and Watkins should get props for trying, but wasn't at full speed. Might have been better sitting him and playing Williams if Watkins can't go full tilt.

[26CornerBlitz]

I saw it. But Lawson did not react. Just because Brown is owning up does not make it a done deal. Lawson took the inside shoulder. He should have kept his man straight up at least with drive block and used his hands , he committed and lost any chance shed his guy and step outside . Brown could have filled the inside gap much easier and quicker . Some one needs to all- 22 two this sucker. I dont mind being wrong. If Jim called the wrong play than i can easily shift the blame !!

I listened and it sounds to me like Brown is just not throwing Manny under the bus. I was at the game and Lawson cost us with two big misses in containment. Both were obvious and the guy ran right by him as he crashed inside with the fake. My goats go in order, Brown, McKelevin, Hackett and Lawson. Too many mistakes, too many poor calls...Orton should be expected not to loose games like EJ was, but to expect him to be the savior behind a marginal OL is asking too much for the journeyman QB he is. I thought the OL played pretty well and the D as a whole were lights out awesome! I had a lot of fun watching the first half when the Chefs had the ball. Great D performance wasted by too many mistakes and poor play selection. Freddy is a warrior and Watkins should get props for trying, but wasn't at full speed. Might have been better sitting him and playing Williams if Watkins can't go full tilt.

 

You'll have to excuse me if I take his word over your collective interpretations.