PromoTheRobot Posted April 11, 2014 Share Posted April 11, 2014 500 miles you wouldn't be Ron L from the Albany area that used to hang with the old Prodigy gang would you? Nope, sorry. I come from So. NH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted April 11, 2014 Share Posted April 11, 2014 Nope, sorry. I come from So. NH. Thanks... trust me you would have fit in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted April 11, 2014 Share Posted April 11, 2014 He writes there is "some debate" if people from Buffalo would drive the 20 minutes to NF to see a Bills game. I drive 500 miles but that extra 15 minutes is a deal breaker for me! PTR Yea I had to smile at that one too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLFan Posted April 11, 2014 Share Posted April 11, 2014 @AndrewBucholtz Bills' Niagara Falls rumblings might serve as a compromise between Buffalo and Toronto: http://ow.ly/vHmP4 . H/T @john_wawrow. There does not need to be a compromise with Toronto. The idea of moving the Bills to Toronto is nothing but a pipe dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 11, 2014 Share Posted April 11, 2014 There does not need to be a compromise with Toronto. The idea of moving the Bills to Toronto is nothing but a pipe dream. I don't think that it is as much about Toronto as a threat as the new owner wanting to capitalizing on the progress made in Southern Ontario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 NF may not be the nicest place in the world (no offense to any of you that may live there) but its proximity to the Southern Ontario market is what makes it such a viable option. Every site presents issues. In addition, the stadium could be a catalyst to that area. An area that I am sure the state as well as a potential new owner would love to see resurrected. This is often cited by politicians as a rationale for squeezing more money out of taxpayers for stadiums. But it's just not true. There are very few examples where this has been true, and NF has none of the conditions for a significant positive impact. Also, not sure why a new owner would care if NF is resurrected---and it is clear that the state has abandoned NF. A billion over 10 years to pump some life into Buffalo is as far as they are going to go. My guess is that if Cuomo could give NF to Canada, he would in a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 This is often cited by politicians as a rationale for squeezing more money out of taxpayers for stadiums. But it's just not true. There are very few examples where this has been true, and NF has none of the conditions for a significant positive impact. Also, not sure why a new owner would care if NF is resurrected---and it is clear that the state has abandoned NF. A billion over 10 years to pump some life into Buffalo is as far as they are going to go. My guess is that if Cuomo could give NF to Canada, he would in a second. I agree that usually stadiums do not usually grow areas but I believe that NF could be an exception (as I believe Brooklyn has been). If the area was rebuilt and brought in even a quarter of the tourist money that NF Canada generates the state would be thrilled. New York has 1 of the 7 wonders of the world and the surrounding area is functionally (& literally) a toxic wasteland. It has potential to be a destination and not just for 8 games a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) I agree that usually stadiums do not usually grow areas but I believe that NF could be an exception (as I believe Brooklyn has been). If the area was rebuilt and brought in even a quarter of the tourist money that NF Canada generates the state would be thrilled. New York has 1 of the 7 wonders of the world and the surrounding area is functionally (& literally) a toxic wasteland. It has potential to be a destination and not just for 8 games a year. Brooklyn has 2.6 million people (and growing 3.5 % over 3 years) and has seen a steady increase in residential housing inventory and rocketing rents and per square foot residential sale prices--the highest in the city over the past year. If it was a separate city, it would be the 4th largest in the country. It is a burgeoning scene for rich folks, artists, nasty hipsters, immigrants.... Many Brooklynites strongly opposed the Barclays Center project. NF has lost 10% of its population between 2000 and 2010 and over 20% SINCE 1990. There are fewer than 50,000 souls left in that town. They city can't afford to demolish vacant buildings and the city is full of empty lots and structures. The Kentucky Fried Chicken couldn't stay open. It is run by amateur crooks and there is no tax base. The last large scale project, the Casino, did nothing to change the fate if NF. Having one of the Seven Wonders of the World was a big deal and a major draw for NF more than a generation ago. Not so much anymore. NF and Brooklyn could not be more different--they are opposites in every imaginable way. Edited April 12, 2014 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Brooklyn has 2.6 million people (and growing 3.5 % over 3 years) and has seen a steady increase in residential housing inventory and rocketing rents and per square foot residential sale prices--the highest in the city over the past year. If it was a separate city, it would be the 4th largest in the country. It is a burgeoning scene for rich folks, artists, nasty hipsters, immigrants.... Many Brooklynites strongly opposed the Barclays Center project. NF has lost 10% of its population between 2000 and 2010 and over 20% SINCE 1990. There are fewer than 50,000 souls left in that town. They city can't afford to demolish vacant buildings and the city is full of empty lots and structures. The Kentucky Fried Chicken couldn't stay open. It is run by amateur crooks and there is no tax base. The last large scale project, the Casino, did nothing to change the fate if NF. Having one of the Seven Wonders of the World was a big deal and a major draw for NF more than a generation ago. Not so much anymore. NF and Brooklyn could not be more different--they are opposites in every imaginable way. Not comparing the two, just saying that the Barclays Center (much like the Prudential Center) have revitalized neighborhoods. I am not saying that putting a stadium there fixes everything. I am saying that the state would and should have an interest in the area. You don't think that Donald Trump (for example) would have an interest in developing that place? I expect the state to be players in the new stadium more so than the county.. The bottom line is that being closer to Toronto will be important to a new ownership group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Not comparing the two, just saying that the Barclays Center (much like the Prudential Center) have revitalized neighborhoods. I am not saying that putting a stadium there fixes everything. I am saying that the state would and should have an interest in the area. You don't think that Donald Trump (for example) would have an interest in developing that place? I expect the state to be players in the new stadium more so than the county.. The bottom line is that being closer to Toronto will be important to a new ownership group. We'll have to disagree on Barclays. It wiped out a large neighborhood and residents fought its existence. Trump would never develop a loser like NF. The State, if it gives any more money for the Bills stadium, will not waste it on NF. It wouldn;t make sense. There isn't the population density there to sustain any tiny benefit of a few NFL games played there per year. If the next owner is that interested in Toronto, he will move the team there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) WEO is right on virtually all counts. NF will not get the Bills (thank God). Edited April 12, 2014 by Marauder'sMicro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Duck Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) We'll have to disagree on Barclays. It wiped out a large neighborhood and residents fought its existence. Trump would never develop a loser like NF. The State, if it gives any more money for the Bills stadium, will not waste it on NF. It wouldn;t make sense. There isn't the population density there to sustain any tiny benefit of a few NFL games played there per year. If the next owner is that interested in Toronto, he will move the team there. Niagara / Horse Shoe Falls are huge attractions, folks from all over the world come to see them, why would a smart land developer not want to use this to his advantage? 25 minutes from Buffalo, very close to our Canadian neighbors, (yes, within walking distance) If you take into consideration the sight seeing aspect of the location, the venue of different teams coming in to play, and the close proximity to Buffalo/Canada Its a win, win, win situation... Edited April 12, 2014 by dog14787 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Here's my vote. Roof! I don't need a retractable roof. That's a waste of money. It's the difference between a $500M and a $800M price tag. It"s a toy. Spare me the cold weather advantage line. No one actually likes cold games and the advantage for the Bills is a myth. A dome means December sellouts. Thank you! We've seen plenty of teams build them selves to have an advantage on turf under a roof... Home field conditions are only advantageous when you build a team in corresponding manner... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhg Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 What an incredibly monumental mistake that would be to put a new stadium up there. Any new stadium should be in the city of Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Niagara / Horse Shoe Falls are huge attractions, folks from all over the world come to see them, why would a smart land developer not want to use this to his advantage? 25 minutes from Buffalo, very close to our Canadian neighbors, (yes, within walking distance) If you take into consideration the sight seeing aspect of the location, the venue of different teams coming in to play, and the close proximity to Buffalo/Canada Its a win, win, win situation... If this was still true, NF wouldn't be the ghost town it now is. Site seeing does nothing for that city's fate---in fact the site see-ers do their seeing (and spending) from the Canadian side. How can anyone even argue this? And if it was such an attractive development site, any smart developer would have invested something in it long ago. It's radioactive. This whole issue makes little sense. If your goal is to fill the stadium (with Americans, Canadians, martians...) create a nicer---and slightly smaller venue than the Ralph and it will sell out regularly. The current stadium is 91% full on average. Downsize it and..there you go 100% full. All this "regionalization" has done nothing to bring in Canadian corporate support (big ad sales and, more importantly, luxury suite sales) so far. Building a stadium in a permanently blighted zone such as NF will not bring in the "whales" (they certainly won't "walk" there--a hilarious assumption). Look, jw took a single throw away comment by Duffy and stretched it into an AP article. But, come on..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I have no issue with it. When you Say Buffalo NY most people automatically think Niagra Falls. Also the weather just hasn't been the advantage the last few years as it has say back in the 90's. A domed stadium would be appealing to more fans esp later in the year when its harder to sell out tickets. There does not need to be a compromise with Toronto. The idea of moving the Bills to Toronto is nothing but a pipe dream. Have you sat down and convinced Goddell of that yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oman128 Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 With all the empty and torn down structures, there has to be a place in the downtown for a Stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 If this was still true, NF wouldn't be the ghost town it now is. Site seeing does nothing for that city's fate---in fact the site see-ers do their seeing (and spending) from the Canadian side. How can anyone even argue this? That's the whole point that I am trying to make. Do you think the state likes having 1/2 of Niagara Falls and 1/1,000,000,000th of the revenue spent there? People do come and spend in NF, Ontario. If there were any reason to spend any time in NF, NY people would. Right now, there is no reason to do so, but if a Patriot Place or LA Live type of complex was built there people would use it IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhg Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I have no issue with it. When you Say Buffalo NY most people automatically think Niagra Falls. Also the weather just hasn't been the advantage the last few years as it has say back in the 90's. A domed stadium would be appealing to more fans esp later in the year when its harder to sell out tickets. Have you sat down and convinced Goddell of that yet? They do? Please enlighten me on this statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 They do? Please enlighten me on this statement. Yeah, I've spent 10 years of my life living in different parts of the country, and all most people think of when you say, "I'm from Blahblah, NY," is New York City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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