Heitz Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I've been listening to Sirius the last couple days and Gannon had some thoughts on EJ: - Said that the time he missed during training camp and during the season was a BIG deal. He missed a lot of reps, throwing and building chemistry with the O. To me this is the #1 thing people are ignoring in EJs poor Pittsburgh performance... - Said (obviously) that his accuracy is off and that he has no chemistry with Stevie (keeping in mind SJ didn't practice last week) - Said that during the Steelers game, things were moving to fast, he was rushing throws and was poor with his footwork - Said that Hackett needs to get him out of the shotgun and under center. He said that would really help a young QB with this footwork, timing and would help hide looks in the running game. Not sure what it all adds up to, but I'm guessing its not just one thing with EJ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I apologize for not being on topic but I'm having a terrible time with positing on this site. My problem is that I can't move the cursor around when I hit enter or the tab key. It is impossible for me to start new paragraphs. Somehow I screwed the settings. If anyone has any suggestions to correct this problem I will appreciate it You can either post a recommendation or email me with your suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Your confusion is misplaced. Many people were forgiving of Manuel's play in the first part of the season. The troubling part is that he seems to be regressing as the season wears on. Part of it is that defenses have more tape on him, and part of it is that he has not elevated his game and in fact showed far worse tendencies against Pitt than he has in previous games. The Jets game will be a big test to see if the Pitt game was mostly jitters and timing from sitting out 4 weeks, or if it's a continuing pattern of him not getting the fundamentals. Exactly. I'm not looking for him to be like Andy Dalton vs the Jets (49 points!)...but he can't be the EJ we saw in Jets game #1 or Pittsburgh. That is Brian Brohm or Trent Edwards level right there. I'm giving him credit for Carolina but not without some critique over the crunch time turnovers. I was at the Baltimore game...i thought he was making progess (even tho still too many 3 and outs). He maybe had his best throw of the season in that game on an incompletion down the sidelines to Chandler because Scott couldn't keep his one foot in bounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Your confusion is misplaced. Many people were forgiving of Manuel's play in the first part of the season. The troubling part is that he seems to be regressing as the season wears on. Part of it is that defenses have more tape on him, and part of it is that he has not elevated his game and in fact showed far worse tendencies against Pitt than he has in previous games. The Jets game will be a big test to see if the Pitt game was mostly jitters and timing from sitting out 4 weeks, or if it's a continuing pattern of him not getting the fundamentals. No, he isn't. He had a bad game in his return to the field. He looked far better against both Baltimore and Cleveland (his last 2 games prior to Pittsburgh) than he did against the Jets, so the bold statement above is basically exclusive to the Pittsburgh game. Stating it as though it's a trend is patently incorrect. Your final statement is far more representative of a salient point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 Unless EJ really picks it up the rest of the season, you know what will happen next summer-he will be competing with Lewis for the starting job. Lewis did inject some life into the offense before he was injured, is more mobile than EJ, and seems to have an equal if not better arm. Even more impressive is that he played without having the benefit of being in camp and was only with the team for a week or two before starting. The Bills will not draft a QB early as it would mean the new regime admitting that they were wrong on EJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 The one thing about EJ is he appears to be mentally strong, so i wouldn't expect one bad game to snowball into more. Let's hope getting home and away from the Dick Lebeau defense will help him get back on track. I would think the Bills D will come out blazing in this one like they did vs. KC, especially after Geno kind of embarrassed them in game #1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsguy Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 There is little intangible that cannot be weighed or measured.....and I think EJ has it..... And I think he bounces back next week. My friends and family in Florida watched him play every game at Florida State. It was their unanimous opinion that he was the main reason holding the team back from being great. Now that he has left, Florida St. has achieved greatness. I don't know for sure, but I feel he might be one of those players who looks great on paper but never achieves it on the field. Does he have the intangibles and the natural instincts to be great? Based on what I have seen so far, the answer is no. (but it's still way too early to know) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 (edited) My friends and family in Florida watched him play every game at Florida State. It was their unanimous opinion that he was the main reason holding the team back from being great. Now that he has left, Florida St. has achieved greatness. I don't know for sure, but I feel he might be one of those players who looks great on paper but never achieves it on the field. Does he have the intangibles and the natural instincts to be great? Based on what I have seen so far, the answer is no. (but it's still way too early to know) I'm not going to comment on your "friends and family" critique of EJ "holding back greatness" for FSU other than to suggest you might want to consider the fact that program was already mired in a significant run of mediocrity prior to EJ's arrival. 8-5, 7-6, 7-6, 9-4 were the records for FSU from 2005-2008, and the program hadn't won 10 games since 2003 before a combination of Ponder and EJ led them to 10 wins in 2010. Just sayin'... Edited November 12, 2013 by eball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 My friends and family in Florida watched him play every game at Florida State. It was their unanimous opinion that he was the main reason holding the team back from being great. Now that he has left, Florida St. has achieved greatness. I don't know for sure, but I feel he might be one of those players who looks great on paper but never achieves it on the field. Does he have the intangibles and the natural instincts to be great? Based on what I have seen so far, the answer is no. (but it's still way too early to know) Your post reinforced suspicions I'd formed when gathering information about him. Almost nothing in his college highlight reel suggested greatness. Great physical tools, sure, but not great accuracy, nor great ability to read defenses, nor a great ability to throw into tight coverage. Going into the 2013 draft, the Bills were very strongly motivated to find their quarterback of the future. When they looked at Manuel, they saw what they wanted to see, not what was actually there. Your friends and family in Florida could watch him with more dispassion. No one was going to fire them from six figure jobs for failing to find a QB of the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 (edited) No, he isn't. He had a bad game in his return to the field. He looked far better against both Baltimore and Cleveland (his last 2 games prior to Pittsburgh) than he did against the Jets, so the bold statement above is basically exclusive to the Pittsburgh game. Stating it as though it's a trend is patently incorrect. Your final statement is far more representative of a salient point. Since games 1 and 2 (Pats and Panthers), his completion rate is 50.1 percent and he's averaging 5.6 ypa. He has definitely declined since the first two games. Edited November 12, 2013 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 (edited) My friends and family in Florida watched him play every game at Florida State. It was their unanimous opinion that he was the main reason holding the team back from being great. Now that he has left, Florida St. has achieved greatness. I don't know for sure, but I feel he might be one of those players who looks great on paper but never achieves it on the field. Does he have the intangibles and the natural instincts to be great? Based on what I have seen so far, the answer is no. (but it's still way too early to know) I watched him a ton in college & was never wowed by him. His accuracy stinks. Even Flordia State guys on this board(Ramius, a couple others) did not give him their full endorsement stating he had some short comings. Ramius oftened said it seems like Fisher is holding him back only using part of the play book. What is even more disturbing is seeing what Florida State is doing on offense this year. They have been unstoppable & Fisher seems like he has full confidence in Winston, confidence he never seemed to have in Manuel. It is still early in his career but the warning signs are there that he is going to be a bust. With that being said, let's see what he does the last 6 games. I hope Marrone/Hacket realizing the season is pretty much over open the playbook for EJ & let's see what he can do. With that being said, if the Bills land in the top 5 next year I would be very tempted to draft a QB. In gambling terms, don't look at it like they are giving up on EJ, just hedging their bets that he does not improve. Bridgewater, Boyd, Marrioto, Manzel, Hundley, one of those guys will be available when the bills pick & I would be tempted to pull the trigger. Edited November 12, 2013 by Gordio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 12, 2013 Author Share Posted November 12, 2013 Your confusion is misplaced. Many people were forgiving of Manuel's play in the first part of the season. The troubling part is that he seems to be regressing as the season wears on. Part of it is that defenses have more tape on him, and part of it is that he has not elevated his game and in fact showed far worse tendencies against Pitt than he has in previous games. The Jets game will be a big test to see if the Pitt game was mostly jitters and timing from sitting out 4 weeks, or if it's a continuing pattern of him not getting the fundamentals. Jesus....does the fact that he has been injured for 4 weeks come into play at all here? Improvement? How? Where are the reps....where is the chemistry with his targets.....a QB...especially a rookie NEEDS those things. Were really gonna make a evaluation on a rookie QB that hasnt been on the field for 4 weeks? I watched him a ton in college & was never wowed by him. His accuracy stinks. Even Flordia State guys on this board(Ramius, a couple others) did not give him their full endorsement stating he had some short comings. Ramius oftened said it seems like Fisher is holding him back only using part of the play book. What is even more disturbing is seeing what Florida State is doing on offense this year. They have been unstoppable & Fisher seems like he has full confidence in Winston, confidence he never seemed to have in Manuel. It is still early in his career but the warning signs are there that he is going to be a bust. With that being said, let's see what he does the last 6 games. I hope Marrone/Hacket realizing the season is pretty much over open the playbook for EJ & let's see what he can do. With that being said, if the Bills land in the top 5 next year I would be very tempted to draft a QB. In gambling terms, don't look at it like they are giving up on EJ, just hedging their bets that he does not improve. Bridgewater, Boyd, Marrioto, Manzel, Hundley, one of those guys will be available when the bills pick & I would be tempted to pull the trigger. If EJ didnt have a few "shortcomings" the guy would have been drafted by someone in the high first round based off physical talents. A winner in college.....huge body....huge arm...leader.....there HAD to be some things he needed to work on for him to even slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 You guys who are expecting big things from EJ against the Jets or at least better things against them, do realize who his starting receivers are likely to be? The starting WR's are probably TJ, Goodwin, and Hogan/Easley. I'm sure EJ will be lighting the place on fire Sunday with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
34-78-83 Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 You guys who are expecting big things from EJ against the Jets or at least better things against them, do realize who his starting receivers are likely to be? The starting WR's are probably TJ, Goodwin, and Hogan/Easley. I'm sure EJ will be lighting the place on fire Sunday with them. They'll pile on just the same, don't fret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 You guys who are expecting big things from EJ against the Jets or at least better things against them, do realize who his starting receivers are likely to be? The starting WR's are probably TJ, Goodwin, and Hogan/Easley. I'm sure EJ will be lighting the place on fire Sunday with them. Sobering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clippers of Nfl Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I still believe in Ej. I just wish they just let him launch it. The accuracy will improve. It did with Brady. Why can the denver broncos run wide receiver screens all day, just not us??? This is supposed to be a copycat league!!!! Marrone, hackett. What are you waiting for? Copy denver please!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp2Warlick Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 I'm not calling EJ a bust yet....but...he looks more bust right now than franchise. I'm afraid watching him trying to develop is going to be painful. I watched him play in college and he didn't impress me at all. I know Joe B. wasn't impressed either and he's a big FSU fan. He is a Bill,so I hoping he can become a good qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 12, 2013 Share Posted November 12, 2013 (edited) I'm not calling EJ a bust yet....but...he looks more bust right now than franchise. I'm afraid watching him trying to develop is going to be painful. I watched him play in college and he didn't impress me at all. I know Joe B. wasn't impressed either and he's a big FSU fan. He is a Bill,so I hoping he can become a good qb. I wasn't impressed with the following in college... Geno Smith (past his first 3 or 4 games of his senior year), Mike Glennon, Jake Locker, Tom Brady, Colin Kaepernick, Joe Flacco, Ponder, Pryor (and I am a Buckeye fan) ...need I go on? They are drafted on their potential to be franchise QBs in the NFL. The scouting report on EJ was that he was a project, he was erxpected to be developed and molded beyond the first season and ultimately be a better QB than the other 2 that were drafted in the first 3 rounds. They didn't project where they would be after 6 games, that would be comparable to now. Edited November 12, 2013 by YoloInTheBlo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 I'm not calling EJ a bust yet....but...he looks more bust right now than franchise. I'm afraid watching him trying to develop is going to be painful. I watched him play in college and he didn't impress me at all. I know Joe B. wasn't impressed either and he's a big FSU fan. He is a Bill,so I hoping he can become a good qb. That is a great point. Joe B who I think is pretty knowledgable & went to FSU has never gave Manuel a ringing endorsement. Ramius who is probably the biggest FSU fan on her & I believe still lives in Tallahassee, has never given him a ringing endorsement. Sure they will mention his skills, but if you watched Manuel in college something was missing from his game. I don't know if he is going to be a bust but the warning signs are there. Let's hedge our bet next year & draft another QB in the first round. If Manuel is going to be the franchise QB then he will beat whoever they bring in & we got a trade chip to recoupe that draft pick down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cash Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 You guys who are expecting big things from EJ against the Jets or at least better things against them, do realize who his starting receivers are likely to be? The starting WR's are probably TJ, Goodwin, and Hogan/Easley. I'm sure EJ will be lighting the place on fire Sunday with them. Geno Smith's starting WRs when he lit us up in week 3 were Stephen Hill, Jeremy Kerley, and a gimpy Santonio Holmes. I don't need EJ to light it up, but he needs to play better than he did last week. No excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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