Orton's Arm Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) I agree with the posting that the end times must be here .... such utter insanity! And, who ever said that Tuel was part of a "fair fight?" The quarterback competition to become the BILLS's starting quarterback has always been EJ versus Kolb ... end of discussion. What is with this small club of EJ haters that is making the rounds of GR call-in shows, the post game show (that was painful to listen to the first few callers who clearly will never support EJ as the Bills' quarterback (Mmm, I wonder if there is an underlying reason for their immediate dislike of him being the team's leader other than his use of initials for his first name?), and now here on this board. It's as if the bile has been accumulating since draft day and we now have found a nice plain bread kind of guy in Tuel who shines in a preseason game and the practice immediately following the game. I will admit, I am excited about Tuel's upside as our #2 quarterback (Maybe not this year but for years to come.). I can envision a Manuel-Tuel quarterback combo along the lines of Kelly and Reich. But, since camp opened Tuel has had some serious issues from all of the reports I have read and he does not have the skill set of EJ. I want him to do well but I want the quarterback of our future, EJ, to get all the reps he needs now so that when the season arrives he is ready for the real game! If the Bill's become a point producing machine with a defense that shuts down opponents then Tuel Time can be a reality too. GO EJ ... GO BILLS! > It's as if the bile has been accumulating since draft day . . . Most of the bile I've seen in this thread has been directed against those who see starting potential in Tuel. I've seen links to sites which had indicated--pre-draft--that Tuel has the potential to become a solid starter. We are not idiots, trolls, or "lacking in football knowledge" just because we think those sites might be right. Conversely, there was considerable pre-draft dissension about Manuel. Some experts believed he deserved to be the top-rated QB; others had him as fourth- or fifth-best. Prior to the draft, a poll was conducted on this site to see which QB fans favored. Manuel garnered maybe the 3rd or 4th most votes. But then after the draft, many fans changed their vote to Manuel, on the theory that the Bills' front office knows best. (Despite over a decade of proof to the contrary.) No one is asking the Bills to write Manuel off. We are merely asking for Tuel to be given a fair opportunity to compete for the starting position. The plan all along had been for Manuel and Kolb to compete to be the starter, so why not give Tuel some or all of the reps which would otherwise have gone to Kolb? There are those in this thread who seem to think Tuel must not be given any reps with the starters. And that the Bills should write off or heavily discount anything he does accomplish; on the theory that it was only done against second or third stringers. Edited August 13, 2013 by Edwards' Arm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 TC and preseason is alway a hoot on any message board. EJ will start, Kolb will back up. If for someone crazy reason Teul come in as a 3rd QB and never returns to a bench and becomes the 15 years all pro starter suprise story, then lucky us- I'd love for someone to emerge as the Bills Tom Brady as much as the next guy, but right now the reality is Tuel is a longshot prospect. He is third guy and developmental as of August 2013- that doesn't mean he is isn't talented or not going to be successful, but lets the professional hired to put a winig team on the field make the big decisions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 > It's as if the bile has been accumulating since draft day . . . Most of the bile I've seen in this thread has been directed against those who see starting potential in Tuel. I've seen links to sites which had indicated--pre-draft--that Tuel has the potential to become a solid starter. We are not idiots, trolls, or "lacking in football knowledge" just because we think those sites might be right. Conversely, there was considerable pre-draft dissension about Manuel. Some experts believed he deserved to be the top-rated QB; others had him as fourth- or fifth-best. Prior to the draft, a poll was conducted on this site to see which QB fans favored. Manuel garnered maybe the 3rd or 4th most votes. But then after the draft, many fans changed their vote to Manuel, on the theory that the Bills' front office knows best. (Despite over a decade of proof to the contrary.) No one is asking the Bills to write Manuel off. We are merely asking for Tuel to be given a fair opportunity to compete for the starting position. The plan all along had been for Manuel and Kolb to compete to be the starter, so why not give Tuel some or all of the reps which would otherwise have gone to Kolb? Because you're wasting reps for your franchise, 1st round QB to give to a guy who couldn't even shine at WSU. And because he light up players who won't be in the NFL. Also, Tuel didn't get breathe on. There is no comparison between a starting NFL defense and 3rd and 4th stringers. There is less than a 1% chance Jeff Tuel is a Brady or Warner. Manuel needs all the reps he can get. Wasting them on Tuel because of a half of preseason game at this point is just foolish. TC and preseason is alway a hoot on any message board. EJ will start, Kolb will back up. If for someone crazy reason Teul come in as a 3rd QB and never returns to a bench and becomes the 15 years all pro starter suprise story, then lucky us- I'd love for someone to emerge as the Bills Tom Brady as much as the next guy, but right now the reality is Tuel is a longshot prospect. He is third guy and developmental as of August 2013- that doesn't mean he is isn't talented or not going to be successful, but lets the professional hired to put a winig team on the field make the big decisions Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Because you're wasting reps for your franchise, 1st round QB to give to a guy who couldn't even shine at WSU. And because he light up players who won't be in the NFL. Also, Tuel didn't get breathe on. There is no comparison between a starting NFL defense and 3rd and 4th stringers. There is less than a 1% chance Jeff Tuel is a Brady or Warner. Manuel needs all the reps he can get. Wasting them on Tuel because of a half of preseason game at this point is just foolish. Well said. this reminds me of when Broncos fans were all full of piss an vinegar when Bradley Van Pelt had a nice half in Denver a few years back... yeah, he wasn't very good in reality. There's typically a good reason why you get drafted late or not at all, and 90% of the GM's and scouts are right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) > It's as if the bile has been accumulating since draft day . . . Most of the bile I've seen in this thread has been directed against those who see starting potential in Tuel. I've seen links to sites which had indicated--pre-draft--that Tuel has the potential to become a solid starter. We are not idiots, trolls, or "lacking in football knowledge" just because we think those sites might be right. Conversely, there was considerable pre-draft dissension about Manuel. Some experts believed he deserved to be the top-rated QB; others had him as fourth- or fifth-best. Prior to the draft, a poll was conducted on this site to see which QB fans favored. Manuel garnered maybe the 3rd or 4th most votes. But then after the draft, many fans changed their vote to Manuel, on the theory that the Bills' front office knows best. (Despite over a decade of proof to the contrary.) No one is asking the Bills to write Manuel off. We are merely asking for Tuel to be given a fair opportunity to compete for the starting position. The plan all along had been for Manuel and Kolb to compete to be the starter, so why not give Tuel some or all of the reps which would otherwise have gone to Kolb? There are those in this thread who seem to think Tuel must not be given any reps with the starters. And that the Bills should write off or heavily discount anything he does accomplish; on the theory that it was only done against second or third stringers. The Bills have no time to flock around with Tuel getting any 1st team reps. They have to get EJ prepared to be the starting QB for the opener. It's already a big enough challenge to get a rookie QB ready for the rigors of playing successfully in the regular season. Now some people want to mess around with another rookie based on on half of pre-season football? The Bills brass has had the opportunity to evaluate all QBs on the roster in OTAs, TC, and now one exhibition game. I'll trust Marrone and Hackett over TSW posters as this juncture. This is Madness! Edited August 13, 2013 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 > It's as if the bile has been accumulating since draft day . . . Most of the bile I've seen in this thread has been directed against those who see starting potential in Tuel. I've seen links to sites which had indicated--pre-draft--that Tuel has the potential to become a solid starter. We are not idiots, trolls, or "lacking in football knowledge" just because we think those sites might be right. Conversely, there was considerable pre-draft dissension about Manuel. Some experts believed he deserved to be the top-rated QB; others had him as fourth- or fifth-best. Prior to the draft, a poll was conducted on this site to see which QB fans favored. Manuel garnered maybe the 3rd or 4th most votes. But then after the draft, many fans changed their vote to Manuel, on the theory that the Bills' front office knows best. (Despite over a decade of proof to the contrary.) No one is asking the Bills to write Manuel off. We are merely asking for Tuel to be given a fair opportunity to compete for the starting position. The plan all along had been for Manuel and Kolb to compete to be the starter, so why not give Tuel some or all of the reps which would otherwise have gone to Kolb? Why is it that the Bills must not give Tuel any reps with the starters; and then write off whatever he does accomplish, on the theory that it was only achieved against third stringers? 1. I believe (if I'm reading the training camp reports correctly) that Tuel is getting reps with the 1st stringers since Kolb tripped up. 2. Why should the coaching staff start anyone just to appease the opinions of a few fans on a message board? Are we so conceited that we think our opinion is THAT important? Tuel was undrafted for a reason. The fact that he's even likely to make a team, let alone be considered for the #2 spot is more than I'm sure he would have even expected. At some point, I think people need to realize we're not coaches and talent scouts for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 this reminds me of when Broncos fans were all full of piss an vinegar when Bradley Van Pelt had a nice half in Denver a few years back... yeah, he wasn't very good in reality. There's typically a good reason why you get drafted late or not at all, and 90% of the GM's and scouts are right. It's crazy right. I hope Manuel turns out to be Big Ben (without the raping) & Tuel turns out to be Brady or Warner. It'd be a nice problem to have. But I'd bet a lot of money it ain't happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jo39416 Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 It's "happening on this forum as well" because it's happening on the field. That's the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 And for the record, it's not a fair fight. There's a reason why one guy was drafted high & was a 4 year starter at one of the best programs in the country, and the other guy could barely start for one of the worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Best thing the Bills can hope for is- EJ proves he is the starter and will be a very good to great QB. Tuel beats out Kolb and makes him expendable. Not that i do not like Kolb, but i think the league has an opinion on him. Tuel gets to play some here and there for some reason and shows himself to be capable of leading an offense. Tuel keeps the Bills playing good if EJ goes down to injury. At some point over the next couple years the Bills are able to trade Tuel for some draft picks. ALA what Washington will do with Kirk Cousins and what the Falcons did with Matt Schaub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrobot Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Manuel is making 3rd reads now against our first-string starters who are an unpredictable Mike Pettine defense. If you haven't already, read my notes about today's practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 It's crazy right. I hope Manuel turns out to be Big Ben (without the raping) & Tuel turns out to be Brady or Warner. It'd be a nice problem to have. But I'd bet a lot of money it ain't happening. That would be amazing. Right now, I'd be extremely happy with Tuel continuing to look good when he plays garbage minutes in preseason games the next 2-3 years getting a chance to play in A real game over that same time period and then dumping him like the FLA teams dumped Mitchell and Johnson. Tuel looked good in 1 appearance. Keep giving him opportunities to look good in garbage time this preseason; builds his confidence and maybe long run builds his trade value. Maybe he even becomes a useful #2 for the Bills down the line. All of it's good, none of it's a given. Give EJ the bulk of the #1 reps and get him ready for the opener. If they can't get him ready to start the opener, which would be somewhat surprising the way he looked in the 1st outing, then throw Kolb to the wolves. Right now the odds are strongly indicating that EJ's the QB of the future. Why screw around with that by giving the guy that was only supposed to be camp fodder #1 reps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 If only Tuel would change his first name to Gibran... I miss that guy he was a high motor sideline guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) This thread is a riot. OP has trolled you all. Too easy, I say. Edited August 13, 2013 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homey D. Clown Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 > It's as if the bile has been accumulating since draft day . . . Most of the bile I've seen in this thread has been directed against those who see starting potential in Tuel. I've seen links to sites which had indicated--pre-draft--that Tuel has the potential to become a solid starter. We are not idiots, trolls, or "lacking in football knowledge" just because we think those sites might be right. Conversely, there was considerable pre-draft dissension about Manuel. Some experts believed he deserved to be the top-rated QB; others had him as fourth- or fifth-best. Prior to the draft, a poll was conducted on this site to see which QB fans favored. Manuel garnered maybe the 3rd or 4th most votes. But then after the draft, many fans changed their vote to Manuel, on the theory that the Bills' front office knows best. (Despite over a decade of proof to the contrary.) No one is asking the Bills to write Manuel off. We are merely asking for Tuel to be given a fair opportunity to compete for the starting position. The plan all along had been for Manuel and Kolb to compete to be the starter, so why not give Tuel some or all of the reps which would otherwise have gone to Kolb? There are those in this thread who seem to think Tuel must not be given any reps with the starters. And that the Bills should write off or heavily discount anything he does accomplish; on the theory that it was only done against second or third stringers. It's been my experience that if you write a well thought out idea that might oppose common opinion around here, you'll get flamed. I agree with you 100% on what you wrote, but people will bash you anyway. I was under the impression that a lucid, well thought out debate topic could be discussed around here, but I was wrong more often than not, so I learned to speak internet-bully sarcasm so i didn't stand out so much, and adopted the phrase: "Homey don't Play 'dat"!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Manuel is making 3rd reads now against our first-string starters who are an unpredictable Mike Pettine defense. If you haven't already, read my notes about today's practice. Wait a second? Our young 1st round Qb is progressing against an aggressive defense? Quick, lets cut his reps!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Notice how 90% of the posters who spew this nonsense on a daily basis have about 100 posts to their credit? Newbs. One preseason half does not erase the fact that EJ, by almost all accounts, has been outplaying Tuel all training camp. It's as if EJ didn't play a very good game himself on Sunday. I don't get it. I have about the same number of posts as you so let me say it: Tuel should be the st..................... I just can't do it. I really can't. At least not yet. I'm going to go out on a limb here and make the big assumption that Marrone and Hackett know more about Tuel's abilities than the posters advocating for him. Most of us fans have seen him play one half of preseason NFL ball. Hell, I've seen Rob Johnson, Trent Edwards and J.P. Losman play good entire regular season games. That doesn't mean any of them deserve to be Buffalo Bills starters. Until Marrone proves himself incompetent as a talent evaluator and head coach, I'll be content with his decision. If Tuel eventually proves to the coaching staff that he gives the team the best chance of winning, I won't care. I just want to win. One half of preseason ball against scrubs is nice but proves nothing. UDFAs like Tuel and journeymen like Kolb have low success rates. Even 1st rounders like EJ have a fairly low success rate. I don't care which one beats the odds as long as one of them does. I think its great both rooks did well against the Colts. That may mean we have one good QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Based on the totality of OTAs, Training Camp, and the 1st Per-season game, Tuel is not winning according to every single report that I have heard or seen. Let it go! Yup. They are not going to take snaps from Manuel based on 1 game, they are looking at the sum of the OTAs, training camp, etc... to make a decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 It's crazy right. I hope Manuel turns out to be Big Ben (without the raping) & Tuel turns out to be Brady or Warner. It'd be a nice problem to have. But I'd bet a lot of money it ain't happening. LOL... yes, sans Rape of course.... Yeah, I'd **** if we had two high quality starters on this rosters at QB, so we had an option to trade one for more picks or an impact player. But lets be honest... we'd take just one 15 year starter right now..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alias Posted August 13, 2013 Author Share Posted August 13, 2013 Coach Marrone was emphatic about letting the results determine who starts. Right now, if we knew nothing about draft position, veteran experience, and all that blah-blah, then Tuel is ahead in this fight. If the argument against Tuel is, "But he's playing against third stringers," then let him start against the first stringers and let us see what we shall see... "Fair" should be fair. Well, I must say it's been fun! I'd heard that Bills QB Jeff Tuel has the highest QB rating in the league at this moment in time, and I wanted to know if that would stand up against the same conditions Kolb and Manuel must face. Despite being called stupid, a troll, and a closet racist, I still want to know. It's called the scientific method: you put the variables (Kolb, Manuel, Tuel) in the same beaker with the constants (first-string opposition) and see who does and doesn't blow up when conditions are replicated for each. By the way, to the poster who implied racism, my question from the start (see "veteran experience" above) was always about three contestants, two of whom were not black. To him I say that it takes a dirty little mind to find anything nefarious in the question I posed. Shame on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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