OCinBuffalo Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 LOL, once again hitting on some cylinders on your soft points but missing on the objective ones entirely. Tell me, what was the extent of the analysis that I ran since I did not specify? You obviously know, I'm just curious as to how. Did you hack my PC, the one that the analysis is on? This post, in general, is the opposite of right. Therefore it is funny, to an extent. Speaking of extent... The extent of your analysis is meaningless, if your method is taking 3 different teams each year, comparing them to the AFCE, and assuming that this is going to generate a meaningful statistic, when it comes to "toughness of division". Comparison of divisions does that, not comparison of teams, some teams, some times. Otherwise, quite right, and in terms of playoff futility, the AFCE after the Pats ranks the worst in the league during the Brady era. That easy task you can go handle yourself. Compare the playoff relevance of the Jets, Fins, and Bills to the worst three teams in any other division, and you'll see a big part of exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah, I'll get right on handling tasks...that are? If I believed you did something that was "mathematically proven"(incidentally, I don't, not even a little bit) I believe you would have stumbled upon the reality that it is the AFC West who is the worst at wildcard playoff appeareances, since 2000, by doing nothing more than: counting. Yes, that great and ancient mathematic technique that can be done...on one's fingers and toes. So, how can the AFC East be the worst...when amazingly, even with losing to the Pats as much as you say they have, they've still found a way to qualify for the playoffs more times than the AFC West has, since 2000? Logic is a pain, isn't it? It destroys both mathematically proven, and, magically proven things, as if they were no different. But, logic isn't done with you yet: How can the AFC South the same # of wildcard playoff apperances as the AFC East, since 2000, if the AFC East is as horrible as you claim? Hey dammit! I thought this was all mathematically proven! What is happening here? (The AFC North has 10. Now we're talking right? )Wrong. NFC West 4 NFC South 5 NFC North 11 NFC East 10 So, a random list of which the AFC East is at neither the top, nor the bottom of, and this....is mathematically proving what? Otherwise, in another part of that, put the Pats in another division and then subtract 2 wins per season and see if they still look as impressive. Honestly, am I really arguing this with you. "Subtract 2 wins per season"? What do we add in their place? Losses? Passes? In wonder, if we put the Texans in the AFC North, and the subtracted 2 wins...what would happen. How about we put the Ravens in the AFC South and do the same. This is just hilarious now. This is no longer about making a case for the AFCE...this is now about making a case for affordable mental health services, whereas before it was about adult literacy. Perhaps both....as long as it can be mathematically proven, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChevyVanMiller Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 So glad someone posted this article. I read it yesterday and thought that if nothing else the team has a vision - probably for the first time since the Polian/Butler era. It might not amount to anything, but I think we've all seen what having no team vision has amounted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I'm sure Russ Brandons public opinion for the last 13 years has been that the coach of the day was going to make the team winners. He wants to sell tickets, particularly seasons for gods sake. Do you really expect him to say that the Bills are going to suck this season so you are better off holding onto your money for a couple more years? When knowledgeable people who have no stake in the Bills organization say that kind of stuff it has some meaning. But even that isn't guaranteed to be correct, I refer you to last season as an example. The season isn't very far off now. In just a few weeks we will begin to know what this season will look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 My original hunch of it not being more than half of that is correct. OK, since 2000, meaning since Williams took over followed by Mularkey, Jauron, and Gailey, under Donahoe, Levy, and Nix ... Of the 192 games they've played, 96 (exactly half) have been against teams with winning records. The Bills are 14-82 (.146) against those teams. 6 of those 14 wins were against teams that finished 9-7 10 of those 14 wins were against teams that finished 9-7 or 10-6 Only 4 of those wins were against teams that finished 11-5 or better. Of those 4 wins, one was against Indy in week 17 when they were playing scrubs led by Painter for half the game. Another was that 2003 win over the Pats 31-0 to start the season before losing to them by the same score in week 17 and finishing 6-10, and another was also over the Pats in 2011. Outside the division they were 5-47 (.096) against teams with winning records. They beat the 9-7 Seahawks in '04 and 9-7 Skins in '07, the 10-6 Chiefs in '05, and the 11-5 Bengals in '05 besides the aforementioned week 17 game vs. the Colts. Over those 12 years they're 23-51 (.311) in the divsion and 51-67 (.432) outside the division. They're 3-32 (.086) against teams outside the division that were 10-6 or better. Within the division they were 9-36 (.200) against teams with winning records. Against teams that were 6-10 or worse the Bills are 43-17 (.717) Against teams that were 4-12 or worse they were 24-5 (.828) FWIW Thanks for the research. Terrific effort. I can't say that it is surprisingly bad because it isn't a surprise to me. The Bills have been such long-term losers that not only have they become irrelevant but they also became the invisible franchise in a high profile sport. Sad, very sad. One frequent poster believes that this descent into gut wrenching mediocrity is the fans fault. LOL There are a number of Wilson apologists who believe that he has been an enlightened owner for this bad luck franchise. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 not for nothing....but let's win a few games before we get all happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 not for nothing....but let's win a few games before we get all happy. I don't believe that this season the Bills are going to win more games than they lose. That doesn't mean that they can't have a successful season. If the rookie qb demonstrates that he is a legitimate franchise qb and the young players, mostly this years rookie class, play well then I will be more than satisfied. The issue isn't one of lowering one's standards so much as doing things right and moving forward. There are a lot of prior personnel mistakes that need to be addressed. This year's team can be better yet still not have it reflected by its record because of the tougher schedule. But starting the process of getting better is more encouraging than meandering back and forth and going nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 This trainwreck of a thread exemplifies everything that is wrong with the "realists" who frequent TSW. They don't even understand the point of the article. This isn't a piece about Brandon trying to market his team and sell hope; the author isn't a Bills fan and has no dog in the fight. It's a discussion about the behind-the-scenes efforts the Bills' front office has made to change the way they do things since Ralph officially relinquished power. Everyone can draw his or her own conclusions about whether they'll be successful, but it's not even any fun to read through the thread because of how ridiculous it has become. It's also incredibly ironic, because the "realists" claim they are beaten down whenever they make a negative comment, yet those same realists jump all over themselves to post negative comments in threads that don't warrant them. There should be two ongoing pinned threads on this board entitled, "front office decisions you like" and "front office decisions you don't like" so the "realists" and "homers" alike can argue to their hearts' content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I don't believe that this season the Bills are going to win more games than they lose. That doesn't mean that they can't have a successful season. If the rookie qb demonstrates that he is a legitimate franchise qb and the young players, mostly this years rookie class, play well then I will be more than satisfied. The issue isn't one of lowering one's standards so much as doing things right and moving forward. There are a lot of prior personnel mistakes that need to be addressed. This year's team can be better yet still not have it reflected by its record because of the tougher schedule. But starting the process of getting better is more encouraging than meandering back and forth and going nowhere. Excellent post. I couldn't agree more. I could see Manuel getting better, the line jelling, the defense getting better over time and we still get six or seven wins. I'd be okay with that. I'm just saying I want to see performance on the field, from the players AND from the coaches. I'd love to see a winning season, and am not ruling that out...but I'll be happy with significant improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 This trainwreck of a thread exemplifies everything that is wrong with the "realists" who frequent TSW. They don't even understand the point of the article. This isn't a piece about Brandon trying to market his team and sell hope; the author isn't a Bills fan and has no dog in the fight. It's a discussion about the behind-the-scenes efforts the Bills' front office has made to change the way they do things since Ralph officially relinquished power. Everyone can draw his or her own conclusions about whether they'll be successful, but it's not even any fun to read through the thread because of how ridiculous it has become. It's also incredibly ironic, because the "realists" claim they are beaten down whenever they make a negative comment, yet those same realists jump all over themselves to post negative comments in threads that don't warrant them. There should be two ongoing pinned threads on this board entitled, "front office decisions you like" and "front office decisions you don't like" so the "realists" and "homers" alike can argue to their hearts' content. Actually, the realists fully understand the point of the piece, which was orchestrated by the Bills PR department. I'm sure you would have the same opinion if the article was penned by Scott Berchtold and not Les Carpenter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCinBuffalo Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Actually, the realists fully understand the point of the piece, which was orchestrated by the Bills PR department. I'm sure you would have the same opinion if the article was penned by Scott Berchtold and not Les Carpenter. Dude...what "realists" are you referring to, in this thread, that would have the abstract thinking skills necessary to figure that out? Perhaps some of the less boisterous? Maybe. But, given what I've seen thus far? I'm pretty sure you have the wrong reading group here. You might want to try the group that doesn't have the picture of the bear and the piglet on their books. That's the other thread, 2 doors down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Dude...what "realists" are you referring to, in this thread, that would have the abstract thinking skills necessary to figure that out? Perhaps some of the less boisterous? Maybe. But, given what I've seen thus far? I'm pretty sure you have the wrong reading group here. You might want to try the group that doesn't have the picture of the bear and the piglet on their books. That's the other thread, 2 doors down. What are you babbling about now? I was referring to the realists eball was calling out in his post. Ask him what he meant by realists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HankBulloughMellencamp Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 So glad someone posted this article. I read it yesterday and thought that if nothing else the team has a vision - probably for the first time since the Polian/Butler era. It might not amount to anything, but I think we've all seen what having no team vision has amounted to. I am also quite glad to see this article ... some real nice tidbits about the coaching search and how we got Pettine to come here. Funny that this very interesting article comes to most of us by way of Yahoo from a guy that I was previously unfamiliar with (but will now be sure to follow on twitter). All we get from the mostly boxed-out TBN crew (except beat guy Mark Gaughan, with whom I have no issue) is another rehash of Mario and the 'drama' he has created. Keen observers of Sully's tactics also surely noticed that he was careful to add in the convenient little hedge to his bet by slipping in a line to the effect of "he might even produce double digit sacks again" ... but whine, whine, whine. And Mario is the drama queen? This is why I have grown to love twitter ... customize your feed, find guys like Les Carpenter, and filter out or ignore the nonsense with no problem whatsoever. If you are active on twitter, and don't follow at least three of four hundred interesting accounts, I think you are squandering one of the most powerful tools of the 21st century - an instant source of worldwide news information. It is also probably TBN's worst nightmare going forward, especially since it seems like many of their ace writers enjoy acting like total douchebags on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCinBuffalo Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 What are you babbling about now? I was referring to the realists eball was calling out in his post. Ask him what he meant by realists. Dude, you show up half-cocked in the middle of this thread, not realizing that we've already established who the "realists" are here, and I'm babbling? You're out of context, sir. I refuse to ask eball anything, until you agree to mathematically prove something. Something that looks nice, and is not too expensive. Then, you will prove something else mathematically, and place it next to the other one, only slightly higher so you get the 2-level effect, with a little path running down the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 (edited) Maybe this is how Bills news should go? BUFFALO (AP) - Doug Marrone announced that he is giving up on the 2013 season of the Buffalo Bills only two weeks into his first training camp. Marrone said he came to his decision after reading a fan website called "Two Bills Drive" and several columns written by Jerry Sullivan. "If I knew the Bills haven't made the playoffs for 13 straight seasons I never would have took this job" said Marrone. "This franchise is doomed." Marrone explained his oversight on the fact he never paid attention to the Bills before. Like most NFL fans, Marrone had no idea how bad the Bills were. "I mean 13 years, jeez...that's a long time to suck" said Marrone, adding that once a team is bad that long there is no hope of improving. Marrone started reading Two Bills Drive to get a feel for what Bills fans were thinking. While the site is usually filled with mindless Pollyanna rantings from posters drunk on Kool-aid, Marrone did manage to find some astute "realists" who knew the awful truth. "I'm like the fifth coach they've had here and nothing ever changes. That's spooky. It's like the team is cursed or something." Marrone added that those harsh posters on Two Bills Drive woke him up to the cold hard truth that it's better to give up than to fight fate with the Bills. "I told the players to grab their crap and go home. Hug your kids or something. Get drunk. That's what me and the coaches plan to do." Bills CEO Russ Brandon admitted that he never told Marrone about the 13 year playoff drought during their conversations in January. "I'm just trying to keep a team on the field until the old man kicks off" said Brandon. "Then it's HELLO HOLLYWOOD!" PTR Edited August 5, 2013 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Finally got a chance to read the article. I was struck by how much Russ Brandon sounds like Ted Black when he describes his and Pegula's philosophy. So I'll steal a line from Black and say, after reading that article, Marrone doesn't do push-ups; he pulls the earth towards him. GO BILLS!!! Maybe this is how Bills news should go? PTR Outstanding! This could serve as the manifesto for Team Storm Cloud. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I refuse to ask eball anything, until you agree to mathematically prove something. Something that looks nice, and is not too expensive. Then, you will prove something else mathematically, and place it next to the other one, only slightly higher so you get the 2-level effect, with a little path running down the middle. This is how you prove that you're not babbling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCinBuffalo Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 This is how you prove that you're not babbling? Yes. That is precisely how. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Maybe this is how Bills news should go? PTR Someone get this man a Pulitzer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony P Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I'm not through the thread yet, but I don't see any attacks. If you feel that you or someone else is being attacked please use the report function. http://forums.twobil...r-game-face-on/ http://forums.twobil...r-game-face-on/ http://forums.twobil...r-game-face-on/ What is that you are you implying sir? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I don't believe that this season the Bills are going to win more games than they lose. Nor do I. What is that you are you implying sir? That's pretty obvious, isn't it? We've bashed the media up one side and down the other in thread after thread. That has gotten old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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